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Updated 6/13/24 (new stuff) From the Bench,,,,,,,,,,(How to) all in one running thread/

yellowhand

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Thank you. As far as screw length it’s a screw I pulled out of a green plastic what I believe to be imbel stock. I’ve used that same screw to threat multiple holes. I do believe my main issue is to small of a pilot hole. That and this particular piece of wood has been a Can’t Understand Normal Thinking from the start.

Pilot hole diameter and depth are what causes most of these problems.

In dense walnut, shorter screws are fine, and in say coach wood, Aussi wood, longer for the softer wood is indicated.
 

yellowhand

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Thank you. As far as screw length it’s a screw I pulled out of a green plastic what I believe to be imbel stock. I’ve used that same screw to threat multiple holes. I do believe my main issue is to small of a pilot hole. That and this particular piece of wood has been a Can’t Understand Normal Thinking from the start.
Forgot;

When you go to plug it, after drilling out, measure the depth, and cut your plug a little shallow of the hole to be filled, then when you hammer/glue it in flush to surface, no need to trim it down.
Sometimes I forget, and once that plug is glued and pounded in, it ain't coming out, and being in a depression, a pain to trim flush!
Rough up the surface of the plug, catches the glue, acts like rebar in concrete, ain't never coming out!
 

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IMG_0475.jpeg
Turned a dowel out of scrap I had and ruffed it up.
IMG_0477.jpeg
End result is I tapped it down too deep. I don’t think it will matter. However next free time I will recut the pocket to help fix other mistakes. It’s really not to difficult for anyone who need to try this. Thank you
 

yellowhand

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View attachment 403676 Turned a dowel out of scrap I had and ruffed it up. View attachment 403677 End result is I tapped it down too deep. I don’t think it will matter. However next free time I will recut the pocket to help fix other mistakes. It’s really not to difficult for anyone who need to try this. Thank you

Outstanding!

If ya got a left over piece of the dowel you made, you can trim off a thin slice and glue it right down on top of the main one in place if you want to bring it up even to the surface.

You're going to "compress" the swivel down with the screws, so, it would never come out.

Some of this work is extremely "delicate", but as you said, not very difficult.

The hard part for me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,fix one little spot, of several, clamp and wait 24 hours, before tackling the next little spot, and on and on.

Waiting for glue to dry,,,,,,ugh!:)LOL

Well done Sir...
 

Bowpoopers

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Outstanding!

If ya got a left over piece of the dowel you made, you can trim off a thin slice and glue it right down on top of the main one in place if you want to bring it up even to the surface.

You're going to "compress" the swivel down with the screws, so, it would never come out.

Some of this work is extremely "delicate", but as you said, not very difficult.

The hard part for me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,fix one little spot, of several, clamp and wait 24 hours, before tackling the next little spot, and on and on.

Waiting for glue to dry,,,,,,ugh!:)LOL

Well done Sir...
I’m a little shallow on one side of pocket cut. So I will use one mistake to fix another per say. Waiting for glue to dry is easy just need children and ten other projects while it drys.
 

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Love this thread! I am an amateur woodworker (amateur at repairs at least) but I always struggle with the finish. BLO and other oils are foolproof but anytime I try to stain it turns out horribly wrong. Either the color is way off or I get streaking.

That being said, I have some stripped g3 wood I need to refinish and any tips or tricks to staining would be super helpful. I believe they are made of birch. I love some dark wood any tips on getting a nice dark
 

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I dye most of the wood I work on with powdered dye activated with denatured alcohol.
So, no streaking with that method.
Stains will streak, almost always require two light coats to balance the wood.

To go dark,,,start with a medium brown, and add small amounts of black to the mix until you get the darkness you desire.

You do this with dye, powdered or wet, or with stains.

Start far lighter than what you want for an end result, and work up slowly to the desired color and shade.
 

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Just catching up on this thread.

In dense walnut, shorter screws are fine, and in say coach wood, Aussi wood, longer for the softer wood is indicated.
This is very interesting, good to know. I recently had pulled a tang screw out of a stock and noticed it was quite larger. Thought someone just threw in whatever they had but seems that's not the case. I believe i put it back in its proper stock, had a few apart at once, will double check tonight.
 

yellowhand

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Just catching up on this thread.


This is very interesting, good to know. I recently had pulled a tang screw out of a stock and noticed it was quite larger. Thought someone just threw in whatever they had but seems that's not the case. I believe i put it back in its proper stock, had a few apart at once, will double check tonight.

Course thread vs fine thread, thickness, length, all considerations for engineers/designers with screws,,,,,of course, sometimes,,,you see something that simply does not make a lick of sense at all, at least to normal people!:)LOL

Thanks for pulling this up,,,I've got to match a new made one piece hand guard, with a 60 year old original finish butt stock, and it keeps me from searching back to locate it.

Should make an interesting how to,,I hope,,,,time to "muddy up" some nice new wood once I hit the shop today....
 

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This is the stock that I need to match up with a new made hand guard!

1715027915817.jpeg


1715027956312.jpeg


This below is what I got to match to the butt stock above,,,,,and these first pictures, show my base color applied a couple of days ago.

002.JPG


003.JPG


Now, these below, show where I started, testing the color and oil I mixed up, on the inside of the guard,,,,,just checking to see what it looked like, without getting it on the outside wood, in case it sucked,,,which it didn't!:)LOL

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006.JPG


And these below, show what the application of the color and oil mix looks like on the outside,,,,,

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009.JPG




011.JPG
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As for application of the oil and color mix,,,,I glove up, and finger paint it all on,,,,,,using my fingers to follow along with the natural grain lines, and just "muddying the waters" on the overall finish.

Let it set up for five minutes, then I take an old cut up bath towel, and blotch the hell out of everything,,, all while wet!

Now,,,,,,,,,,,,,tomorrow,,,,will begin to add some blemishes, spots that appear as if, dents were steamed out, but left those darker spots, might add a natural defect or two,,,,like a worm hole trail, swirls etc,

I left the dark oil dye mix heavy in some of the grooves,,,,wiped out others,,,,,,


The goal is to "age" the new wood, so when mounted with the old butt above,,,,,on a rifle,,,,,,the colors just flow from one piece to the other, and nothing "jumps out at you" for not belonging.....

Dents, blemishes, more color, tomorrow, and once that's done, a little lite sanding, got to have "worn" spots/areas,,,,then finish it up by placing final oiling coats over everything.....

I hope!:)LOL
 

TerryN

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RE: Streaking when staining. Several years ago, I began using pre-stain wood conditioner on wooden stocks - especially beech, birch, maple, etc. It works well for me. I mentioned this on another forum, and you'd have thought that I showed up to church drunk, with a hooker on each arm! I was severely chastised, to put it mildly. I don't recall the reasons given, or mostly just alluded to. Guess what? It still works for me, and I don't get streaking when staining stocks. I also copied and pasted a long thread that a guy on another forum put up about finishing hardwood stocks. He used Rit fabric dye and some other type of stain - I'd have to dredge the article up to recall just what. Anyhow, I posted that on Rimfire Central, and was essentially called a dirty rotten SOB for advocating using Rit dye! Supposedly, it contains salt and will cause rust. I dunno; I just emailed them and asked. We'll see what they say.

RE: Oven Cleaner. In the C&R firearms world, it used to be commonly recommended to strip gun stocks with oven cleaner. Right up until someone claimed that doing so will irrevocably damage the wood fibers in the stock due to the lye content. I only ever stripped one rifle stock with it, and it was in extremely poor condition to begin with. The oven cleaner didn't seem to hurt it any, although I didn't hang onto it for very long. I use gentler products these days - after I got out of the Aircraft Paint Stripper phase. That stuff will even remove parkerizing if you leave it on long enough!
 

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RE: Streaking when staining. Several years ago, I began using pre-stain wood conditioner on wooden stocks - especially beech, birch, maple, etc. It works well for me. I mentioned this on another forum, and you'd have thought that I showed up to church drunk, with a hooker on each arm! I was severely chastised, to put it mildly. I don't recall the reasons given, or mostly just alluded to. Guess what? It still works for me, and I don't get streaking when staining stocks. I also copied and pasted a long thread that a guy on another forum put up about finishing hardwood stocks. He used Rit fabric dye and some other type of stain - I'd have to dredge the article up to recall just what. Anyhow, I posted that on Rimfire Central, and was essentially called a dirty rotten SOB for advocating using Rit dye! Supposedly, it contains salt and will cause rust. I dunno; I just emailed them and asked. We'll see what they say.

RE: Oven Cleaner. In the C&R firearms world, it used to be commonly recommended to strip gun stocks with oven cleaner. Right up until someone claimed that doing so will irrevocably damage the wood fibers in the stock due to the lye content. I only ever stripped one rifle stock with it, and it was in extremely poor condition to begin with. The oven cleaner didn't seem to hurt it any, although I didn't hang onto it for very long. I use gentler products these days - after I got out of the Aircraft Paint Stripper phase. That stuff will even remove parkerizing if you leave it on long enough!



Anything that works, is fine with me. (y)

I've seen about everything used to color wood!:)LOL

The trick is to use stuff that plays well together, my stripper does not effect the dye used, and the dye does not do weird stuff to the oils I use.

I've never used oven cleaner, but a lot of people do.

For me,,,,,,,,oven cleaner does not play well with the chemicals, dyes, oils, I use on wood, so, I avoid it inside the shop.

When a piece shows up cleaned in oven cleaner,,,,,,I re-strip it all again,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, but outside.
 

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Okay, RE: Salt in Rit dye: "Water and salt make up the majority of the ingredients. Our dyes contain surfactants and detergents that are also found in things like laundry soap, as well as an anti-foaming agent used to prevent the dye from foaming over when shaken. Our dyes also contain cellulose to thicken the formula.

The process works through absorption. Once the color molecules have been absorbed by the fibers, the dye/water mixture is completely washed off with a thorough rinse under a faucet or hose. Technically, the salt should wash out and if you seal the wood once everything has thoroughly dried, you will add another layer of protection.

Unfortunately, we cannot offer any guarantees that you will not experience salt efflorescence. There are too many variables we cannot know or predict.

Best regards,

XX"

So yes, Rit dye contains salt as a major component. You're supposed to rinse whatever you dye thoroughly with water, which may or may not rinse off the remaining salt. And that **SHOULD** make it okay to use for dying rifle stocks. But... adding a finish/sealer to the wood is recommended. Your stock will likely warp from the water, and you may well be fooked. And I learned a new word today: efflorescence. From Merriam Webster:


1: to burst forth : BLOOM

2
a: to change to a powder from loss of water of crystallization
b: to form or become covered with a powdery crust
bricks may effloresce owing to the deposition of soluble salts

In other words, your shit might turn into a crusty white lump of salt covered rust. So, no Rit dye on gunstocks for me.
 

yellowhand

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Okay, RE: Salt in Rit dye: "Water and salt make up the majority of the ingredients. Our dyes contain surfactants and detergents that are also found in things like laundry soap, as well as an anti-foaming agent used to prevent the dye from foaming over when shaken. Our dyes also contain cellulose to thicken the formula.

The process works through absorption. Once the color molecules have been absorbed by the fibers, the dye/water mixture is completely washed off with a thorough rinse under a faucet or hose. Technically, the salt should wash out and if you seal the wood once everything has thoroughly dried, you will add another layer of protection.

Unfortunately, we cannot offer any guarantees that you will not experience salt efflorescence. There are too many variables we cannot know or predict.

Best regards,

XX"

So yes, Rit dye contains salt as a major component. You're supposed to rinse whatever you dye thoroughly with water, which may or may not rinse off the remaining salt. And that **SHOULD** make it okay to use for dying rifle stocks. But... adding a finish/sealer to the wood is recommended. Your stock will likely warp from the water, and you may well be fooked. And I learned a new word today: efflorescence. From Merriam Webster:


1: to burst forth : BLOOM

2
a: to change to a powder from loss of water of crystallization
b: to form or become covered with a powdery crust
bricks may effloresce owing to the deposition of soluble salts

In other words, your shit might turn into a crusty white lump of salt covered rust. So, no Rit dye on gunstocks for me.

People try some wild stuff with finishing....
 

TerryN

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I will pass along a tip that I read in an old gunsmiffing book reference finishing stocks. If you ever experience an oil finish that won't set up, cover it with a coat of grease and let it sit overnight. When you wipe off the grease, the finish will have set up/dried/cured/whatever. BTDT, it works. It sounds crazy, but it works!
 

yellowhand

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Anyone ever seen or know about some country placing metal sleeves inside the recoil tube hole??????

004.JPG
005.JPG
006.JPG
007.JPG
008.JPG
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Have never seen this before with the metal sleeve.

The owner bought it this way, had never fit it to a rifle.

Did not want to fit,, so cleaned out the recoil tube hole from the rear up to the metal, and then it fit properly.

The hand guard is interesting,,,for repairs;

Had a good crack on one end, through the ring and into the body, of course these will not close with pressure, guard would crumble, so, ended up placing three brass rods.
1st one in the thick portion behind the ring
2nd one, a 1/16th rod, through the actual ring portion of the guard,,,,,small area, small rod
3rd,,,,,went to the back end of the crack, and drilled a hole near through the guard, and pegged it with another 1/16th inch brass rod to keep it from running any further, about like you drill a hole in concrete, to stop a crack from running.

Once rod in place, added a little CA glue over the crack, and sanded the area, filling the crack with saw dust, all done,,,,then just did the color and began oiling as normal...

The butt also had an old repair, where the heel broke off, it was still nice and tight, so ran some threaded rod in from under the butt plate location across both side of the cracks, so, should be good to go...

Last pictures, with first coat of oil on both....
 

Adhoc

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Anyone ever seen or know about some country placing metal sleeves inside the recoil tube hole??????

View attachment 411107 View attachment 411108 View attachment 411109 View attachment 411110 View attachment 411111 View attachment 411112 View attachment 411113 View attachment 411114 View attachment 411115


Have never seen this before with the metal sleeve.

The owner bought it this way, had never fit it to a rifle.

Did not want to fit,, so cleaned out the recoil tube hole from the rear up to the metal, and then it fit properly.

The hand guard is interesting,,,for repairs;

Had a good crack on one end, through the ring and into the body, of course these will not close with pressure, guard would crumble, so, ended up placing three brass rods.
1st one in the thick portion behind the ring
2nd one, a 1/16th rod, through the actual ring portion of the guard,,,,,small area, small rod
3rd,,,,,went to the back end of the crack, and drilled a hole near through the guard, and pegged it with another 1/16th inch brass rod to keep it from running any further, about like you drill a hole in concrete, to stop a crack from running.

Once rod in place, added a little CA glue over the crack, and sanded the area, filling the crack with saw dust, all done,,,,then just did the color and began oiling as normal...

The butt also had an old repair, where the heel broke off, it was still nice and tight, so ran some threaded rod in from under the butt plate location across both side of the cracks, so, should be good to go...

Last pictures, with first coat of oil on both....
Reminiscent of the SAFN cleaning kit tube. Whatever was kept in there would slide smoothly in/out.
 
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