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Refurb L1A1 shooting

Thundermaker

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We're bantering about MOA at this point because the man in the video did something that many people here consider to be absolutely impossible. Even after seeing it, many still maintain that position, dismissing the evidence as fakery rather than consider the possibility that they might be wrong.

As for the Garands, AKs, K98s, etc., the minimum accuracy standard is the worst accuracy a gun can have and still be fielded. That doesn't mean that none of them did better. It certainly doesn't indicate that the design isn't capable of better. The minimum accuracy standard for M4s is either 3 or 4 MOA. I don't remember which. I don't think anyone here will argue that the AR design isn't capable of better than that.

A lot of those old K98s, Enfields, etc. are still able to measure up to minimum standards or better, despite being 80+ years old with god knows how many rounds through them.

I will agree that, in practical shooting scenarios, none of us will notice a difference between a 1MOA gun and a 2MOA gun.
 
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otis61

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We're bantering because we're old, and bored, and can't sleep at night. Leave us alone.

Oh. Well it does a appear that you're bantering also. Never mind. Carrie on.
 

crashmaniac

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Im happy with my eyes anymore if I can do what your average US Marine is supposed to ,...I said supposed to ,be able to do with his personal weapon be it carbine or rifle at 100 meters, and thats put 10 rounds in a 19” x 19” square that is supposed to represent the average torso of an asshole to verify his ( or her or its, we have to cover everything one may “identify as” ) BZO.

This is with a $1700 trijicon 4x32 optic on top of their little , mostly FN made now, pop gun. Of course they are required to do all manner of fancy things aftet ,and after they have zero’d , bettween 25 and 5 yd lines on combat marksmanship course, But the 100m shoot is just to confirm everything is right and they smacked the sight corrections into their ACOGs and all that sontheir BDC is set.

So Since I know mine are zero’d , no reason to waste ammo on that I just plink along at 100m sometimes I get randy and shoot at 200m but its pretty far to walk to swap targets, not that i cant handle that, I walk alll the time, but it holds everyone else on range up cause I sure as shit aint running. Those days are over, well Im sure I could be convinced if someone could find a jihadist to shot at my heels. Point is if you can shoot what we all know as Minute of A$&hole at 100m your fine and its best I can do because my eyes focus is slowly leaving me , because unless you are setup to be a DM or Sniper 100m is probably gonna be the furthest your gonna shoot for self defense or whatever scenario your thinking in your head. Not saying you shouldnt have something for shooting at 200 plus but not your normal everyday grunts piece.

Anyway is what this guy did possible, I guess so, could he have been filming the range plotter of the guy next to him with a Glassed Remington 700 yeah maybe that too who knows.
 

Andy the Aussie

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Not sure how to embed but here he is shooting an M16A1 at 300m:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYfvL-mYLdw

He says he got about 4moa out of it.

If he's trying to mislead us as to his marksmanship prowess, as some suggest, he seems to be doing so very conservatively.
.....I literally watched that video last night (new unfired M16A1 !!) and was going to land here and post it as I thought this gave a better indication of the range he is using.
 

Vulcanator

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Watched the AR video, and I'm pretty sure he made an unintentional mistake when he said in his previous video his L1A1 shot 1 2/3 MOA. When you compare the 5 shot SLR group on the the video at 2:07, then compare it to the M16A1 video at 2:47, you see the M16 did a little better. His 4+- MOA group (4:07 on the video) was a 10 shot group. I think he meant to say the L1A1 shot 2-3 MOA which makes more sense to me.
 

crashmaniac

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^^^Makes more sense to me guy doesnt really strike me as a braggart or anything, I was a little mean I suppose on my earlier post. The M16 is def more capable with right shooter of 1”+/- MOA groups. Maybe just language barrier translation, missed context whatever.
 

Austrian

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These L1A1 rifles were refurbished by the Royal and Electrical Mechanical Engineers (R.E.M.E.) and then sold in Europe, I have 2 of them. Come in great condition, many with matching serials. They sell for 2000€ here.

The Swiss guy uses a SIUS electronic scoring system on the range which is really neat. Our military shooting ranges in Austria have those as well and it's great to shoot 200-300m on them. Really expensive stuff though, never seen one on a private range here.
 

Impala_Guy

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Except for the excellent drum sight on Canadian rifles the rear sight on the FAL is mediocre for accuracy....at best. The shot to shot wobble on most FAL rear sights is probably more than 1 MOA....even more so on that stalky SLR sight. I'll jam a sliver of a matchstick into the crack of my Argentines rear sight and with some lots of South African ammo I've shot enough 3in groups to believe that 2in is possible with 5 shot groups and a solid scope setup. At least until the barrel heats up.
 
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Armsdad

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Idk how many people Ive heard say they can hit a man size target at 600 yds with iron sights. I tell em thats awesome. Come out to my house. We can shoot out to 600 yds in the top hayfield . Ya get 1 round. And I better see a hole in the man size torso or ya owe me 20 bux. Nobody ever takes me up..
 

Hebrew Battle Rifle

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Idk how many people Ive heard say they can hit a man size target at 600 yds with iron sights. I tell em thats awesome. Come out to my house. We can shoot out to 600 yds in the top hayfield . Ya get 1 round. And I better see a hole in the man size torso or ya owe me 20 bux. Nobody ever takes me up..
What would I get when I did it?
 

Austrian

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I have no doubt that what the Swiss guy did (2-3 MOA) is possible with an L1A1 if you manage to get a good rifle and matching ammo. Accuracy seems to vary considerably between those refurbished ones. They look great but many don't shoot so great from what I've heard. Unfortunately that's also true for mine.

I'm just at the beginning of getting familiar with my two L1A1s and only have cheap 147gr GGG ammo at the moment but even with a scope mount I don't get below 5 MOA with the better of the 2 rifles. But I'm certain there's still lots of room for improvement.
 

Armsdad

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Im not that good..I think if I can hit a man size target with any rifle with iron sights at 300 yds. Consistantly..That be good for me. Im talkin about a battle rifle. Not some super tuned pro shooter outfit. A few expert shooters mite be able to do it at 600yds. Still Id give em 20bux to see it..I like guns and good shots.
 
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