NEW GUIDELINES FOR THE MARKETPLACE

[tac-40]

After much consideration, some guidelines have been established for the buyers and sellers using the Marketplace. The existing rules concerning the Marketplace, vendors, and advertisements have not changed.

Marketplace Guidelines

1. Each for sale ad must have a price listed.
2. If the item is cross-listed in another sale site, this must be included in the ad.
3. Accepted payment type must be included in the ad, ie, No PayPal, USPS MO, Cash, check, etc.
4. Payment restrictions must also be included in the ad, such as, item will not be shipped until check clears the bank.
5. Shipping fees (including insurance) must be included in the ad. However, the ad may state that the buyer will pay actual shipping fees to be determined. In this case, the buyer should give an example - shipping to zip code 62959 will be $XXXX. Expected shipping date should also be included - "shipped in 5 working days". Tracking numbers are the responsibility of the seller but are not required.
6. I'll Take It is the accepted way of stating the desire to purchase an item. "I'll take it if..." or adding other contingencies is not acceptable as closing the deal.
7. Seller must post a description of the item. However, the buyer must understand that all transactions will be considered "AS IS". All sales should be considered final unless specified in the ad.
8. Sale of an item through another site must be noted in an update to the ad.
9. The ad must be updated with a notation similar to "SOLD Pending Payment" once a deal has been made.
10. It is the responsibility of the buyer and seller to conduct the transaction in a manner that is open and above board.
11. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
DEADLINE FOR RECEIPT OF FUNDS: Seller should specify deadline for receipt of funds by buyer. The default deadline if not specified is seven calendar days.
12. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
INSURANCE: It is understood that the seller will provide no insurance for the shipment unless the buyer specifically requests insurance, and the buyer also pays all added fees for such insurance.
13. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
RESPONSIBILITY FOR LOSSES DURING SHIPPING:
In today's internet-commerce society, many buyers assume that the seller is resposible for any losses prior to the item actually arriving at the buyer's destination. This creates particular peril for hobbyist sellers shipping valuable items through common carriers. For this reason, the seller should specify which party will bear financial responsibility for any loss during shipping. This principle is known in commercial shipping as "F.O.B. - Free On Board" - see generally https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FOB_(shipping).
Example: "F.O.B. at time of delivery to USPS" means if the thing goes missing after seller delivers the thing to USPS, the loss falls on the BUYER. Frankly, I use the term "Responsibility for losses during shipping" as the sub-caption, as I think it causes laypersons way too much confusion to expect them to grasp the jargon of "F.O.B."
Here is a boilerplate term I use in my auctions:
Responsibility for Losses During Shipping: <br>
Buyer accepts responsibility for any loss, damage, or seizure, commencing at the<br>
time seller places the package in custody of the carrier.<br>
Seller will cooperate in every reasonable manner in the event of any incident<br>
that may require submission of an insurance claim associated with shipping.<br>
<br>

 

[mpnv]

Tac, Perhaps, a "I'll take it" "Posted to this board". It may cause less confusion with PM's and who is first in line.
Also, perhaps when something is sold, the seller Edits the add, "SPF" instead of a new post. It would help other adds from going further down the list.

Just an idea.

 

[tac-40]

These are guidelines to help out the buyer and seller. If the seller wants to place a special restriction of the notificatation, they have that option. The "I'll take it" is the accepted way of letting others know you intend to go through with the transaction. Too many times in the past someone has posted I'll take it if it is a Mk1 Mod 2 widget. Another buyer may back out because of that post, causing the seller to lose out since the widget is a generic one with no special markings.

The same holds true for cross-posting the item on other sites. This keeps the hard feelings to a minimum if somebody here says they want it but the seller say sorry it is already gone. We are not trying to say that a member here should get preference over someone else. Many sellers here will often give File members a first chance before posting it elsewhere.

 

[Roadmarker]

Bravo, at least now it's on paper.
Why even allow cross listing? If you want to sell here, sell here. If it doesn't sell then go ahead and try somewhere else. If an item is on GB, there is nothing wrong with mentioning it, but if you want it, bid for it on GB. This alone would "stop" what many believe are shady deals. It seems like 90% of the problems are caused by 2% of "cross listed" items.

 

[tac-40]

Why even allow cross listing? If you want to sell here, sell here. If it doesn't sell then go ahead and try somewhere else.

This has been discussed before and the the results have been the same. The FalFiles has a limited viewership (read small market) and discerning buyers. If a seller has a rare, unique, or special item, he often can get his asking price here on the Files. But, the average run-of-the-mill item may not draw top dollar. By allowing cross-listing the seller is given the opportunity to sell his item at a price he feels comfortable with. By not allowing crosslisting, the seller would post the for sale in another market, possibly preventing someone on the Files from having a chance at it. That is a Lose-Lose situation for all involved. By noting the cross-listing in the Files ad, the buyers are made aware and can make a decision based on this.

As far as unscrupulous and under-the-table deals, the last guideline (#10) reminds all parties that their reputation and word are at stake. Failure of either has a permanent effect on future dealings on the Files. Members have a long memory and don't take kindly to those whose reputation is tarnished. Just do a search for GOUGER to see this in action.

 

[sparkeyboaz]

Thank You!

Thank you to all who have helped encourage this change.
I'm sure I'm not alone in my belief that this has been needed for some time.
Hopefully the people who are buying and selling in the marketplace will realize the benefits of having some more specific rules and guidelines in place.
Too many times I've seen ads that hadn't been updated or deals went terribly wrong!
The only thing I would ask the Moderators to consider adding in the "Guidelines" would be to spell out some sort of consequences for members who post an "I'll take It" and then welch or never follow up on the deal.
A short, temporary suspension from the Marketplace would be fitting!!!
When someone welches on a deal, not only does it hurt the seller but also the sincere buyer who would of claimed it and followed through.
BTW posting a "seconds on it if the claimer back out" only encourages someone to "welch"
While most don't like to be welched on, it hasn't stopped many from posting "Seconds if..."
This needs a little consideration too.
I've had a certain member welch on one of my ads once but others seem to have it happen more often. My only recourse has been to exclude "w/o mention of naming the culprit" said culprit from ever claiming anything I post in the marketplace. While this has worked for me, it didn't stop the culprit. I've seen the same culprit welch on others here.
Just venting a little but mostly trying to show some gratitude for these changes now in place!
Thanks again, Sparkeyboaz

 

[LaConservationist]

I guess it's cool "having it in writing" BUT for the MOST PART of the active hardcore falfliers we all stick together and know and understand old "HANDSHAKE RULE" we have integrity and conduct business with class and dignity......but of course there are always some noob and or members from the very early days that hasn't posted in years that decides he should jump back on line and try and gouge some prices or just come around and cause some havoc, tuck tail and disappear again.... I guess there are good and bad to this as well.....we all know sometimes the guys from OLD DAYS do have some awesome parts pieces we would ALL enjoy to claim, BUT I think this should be conducted with at least some amount of class and dignity!

And just a side warning.....like mentioned before, you must be quick on the trigger for many items in the marketplace, BUT you also must be willing to take a chance either on the item being as described or take the chance by trying to contact seller about said item and someone else grabbing it with an unconditional "I'LL take it" as the old saying goes.....TRUST BUT VERIFY! Know who YOU are doing business with!!

That's my take......

LaC

 

[tac-40]

Sparky, there are two ways to handle your situation. First is to post negative feedback. Most of us do look at feedback, and the seller can too. If you have a guy with neg fb for not following through, the seller is not obligated to sell to him. You can then make an entry in the ad that the item is still for sale. You could also make it a condition of the sale to not have more than XX negative feedback ratings in a certain time frame (like this year).

The second is it to let the moderators know what is happening. If it is a guy that has screwed with other buyers, then we can take some action. But only if we are notified.

The second is not the preferred method needed at first. Do the feedback then let the mods know. They both really go hand in hand.

As I said and others have expounded on, your reputation on the Files is the only thing you have. Good or bad, it is what everybody else relies on when dealing with you.

 

[sparkeyboaz]

Thanks

Tac-40.
Thanks for your notice and the ideas.
I really appreciate that you are aware of the problems that sometimes crop up in dealing with the marketplace.
Even though I may sound dissapointed w/ the probs, mostly I've had favorable dealings with the majority of the FalFiles members.
This is still by far the best crowd of people to deal with and I couldn't of learned what I have without all of you!
Thanks again to everyone.
Sincerely, Sparkeyboaz

 

[MK ULTRA]

Sparky, there are two ways to handle your situation. First is to post negative feedback. Most of us do look at feedback, and the seller can too. If you have a guy with neg fb for not following through, the seller is not obligated to sell to him. You can then make an entry in the ad that the item is still for sale. You could also make it a condition of the sale to not have more than XX negative feedback ratings in a certain time frame (like this year).

The second is it to let the moderators know what is happening. If it is a guy that has screwed with other buyers, then we can take some action. But only if we are notified.

The second is not the preferred method needed at first. Do the feedback then let the mods know. They both really go hand in hand.

As I said and others have expounded on, your reputation on the Files is the only thing you have. Good or bad, it is what everybody else relies on when dealing with you.

Posting negative feedback doesn't work it only get you negative feedback in return.

You need to look into that and how to keep revenge feedback from happening. That's how I got my one negative feedabck. from a guy that was real hard to deal with and < 300 posts and 4 feedbacks. I gave him one he gave me one. That was Sept 2012 He hasn't Posted since.

anyway thanks for doing what you do.

 

[W.E.G.]

Bravo, at least now it's on paper.
Why even allow cross listing?

I'm issuing infractions to sellers who fail to disclose cross-postings if a buyer here says "I'll take it" after the thing already sold elsewhere.

I expect buyers here to issue negative feedback to sellers who pull that shit.

 

[starbuck]

Let me preface by saying I love the falfiles marketplace, the falfiles in general because I don't have to worry about libtard mods. I think the importance of these rules is mostly for the guys at the gun show door offering $100 on any gun coming in.

 

[2barearms]

I'm issuing infractions to sellers who fail to disclose cross-postings if a buyer here says "I'll take it" after the thing already sold elsewhere.

I expect buyers here to issue negative feedback to sellers who pull that shit.

So you will delete retaliatory feedback from a vindictive seller?

 

[idsubgun]

I think it's time that the FAL Files Marketplace make it a requirement to use WTS, WTB, WTT, etc., in the Title. Many other sites do this and it makes scanning the Marketplace easier and faster.

It seems a common courtesy and isn't difficult to do.

 

[W.E.G.]

THREE NEW MARKETPLACE GUIDELINES

I added three more guidelines to TAC-40's post at http://falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=359625

11. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
DEADLINE FOR RECEIPT OF FUNDS: Seller should specify deadline for receipt of funds by buyer. The default deadline if not specified is seven calendar days.
12. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
INSURANCE: It is understood that the seller will provide no insurance for the shipment unless the buyer specifically requests insurance, and the buyer also pays all added fees for such insurance.
13. (added 3/13/2019 by W.E.G. - FAL Files Administrator)
RESPONSIBILITY FOR LOSSES DURING SHIPPING:
In today's internet-commerce society, many buyers assume that the seller is resposible for any losses prior to the item actually arriving at the buyer's destination. This creates particular peril for hobbyist sellers shipping valuable items through common carriers. For this reason, the seller should specify which party will bear financial responsibility for any loss during shipping. This principle is known in commercial shipping as "F.O.B. - Free On Board" - see generally https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FOB_(shipping).
Example: "F.O.B. at time of delivery to USPS" means if the thing goes missing after seller delivers the thing to USPS, the loss falls on the BUYER. Frankly, I use the term "Responsibility for losses during shipping" as the sub-caption, as I think it causes laypersons way too much confusion to expect them to grasp the jargon of "F.O.B."
Here is a boilerplate term I use in my auctions:
Responsibility for Losses During Shipping: <br>
Buyer accepts responsibility for any loss, damage, or seizure, commencing at the<br>
time seller places the package in custody of the carrier.<br>
Seller will cooperate in every reasonable manner in the event of any incident<br>
that may require submission of an insurance claim associated with shipping.<br>
<br>