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Old September 03, 2015, 00:59   #1
gates
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How to get a PMR-30 over the FTF hump...

Without sending it back to Kel-tec...

I bot a brand new one last week from SGC - at retail (they have two more in stock if interested).

Winchester Dynapoint 40gr. is my test bed round because KT specifically says not to use it, I did, and it did jam (FTF), about every 5-10 rds. I took a few FTF live rds home for inspection, it was obvious the feed ramp/BBL mouth geometry was just slightly off (cases showed minor deformation).

I took my Dremel with a SMALL diameter stone, at a LOW setting, and broke the edge of the chamber at 6 o'clock on the BBL, you don't need to do anything more than break the sharp edge. Then I polished the feed ramp, the area that was ground and the 12 o'clock area inside the chamber.

Took it to the range tonight:-) it feeds EVERYTHING - plinker to high end SD. Takes about 10 minutes to make this gun run 100% - I have NO idea why KT sends these pistols out this way and suffers the negative reviews much less the returns - if a tech spent 10 minutes per pistol doing what I outlined they would have very few issues, but they restrict supply so people put up with it...
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Old September 03, 2015, 01:03   #2
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Forgot to mention - if you totally screw the pooch with the dremel a new BBL is $67.
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Old September 04, 2015, 16:18   #3
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Do you load the mag carefully and it feeds or can you now randomly fill the mag and she is good to go? I like the KT products and have considered the PMR30.
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Old September 04, 2015, 16:37   #4
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Yes you have to load it in a specific manner to avoid rim lock - just like a 7.62R rifle round.. There are strange key holing issues with certain grain weight/CCI offerings out of my pistol but the FTF issue has been resolved and the hot 30gr works very very well. It's still a rimfire and it gets dirty after a few hundred rounds which may cause issues but I have not experienced that (stopped to clean at the 300rd mark).

REALLY fun little pistol.
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Old September 04, 2015, 23:20   #5
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So basically you chamfered the chamber which was a similar issue on the Stoeger Luger back in the day. I don't know why they don't buy a chamfering reamer from Clymer and just take a minute to do it right but companies do strange things and feed you a line of horsepucky like you should take it.
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Old September 05, 2015, 00:08   #6
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Yep - and it now runs like a raped ape:-) SO easy to fix if you know basic WESCOG... less than 5 minutes.

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Old September 05, 2015, 00:15   #7
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The one that I have has worked just fine out of the box using the Winchester Super-X 40gr JHP...

For what little it's worth...

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Old September 05, 2015, 01:17   #8
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"The one that I have has worked just fine out of the box using the Winchester Super-X 40gr JHP..."


I tried the suggested CCI ammo and some worked, some did not prior to the modification.

Last edited by gates; September 05, 2015 at 13:52.
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Old September 05, 2015, 18:49   #9
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when in doubt, PLR 16 with a 44round pile of mags.

Still the PMR 30 would be fun, would I trust my life to it? Only if I had to. PLR, any time.
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Old September 05, 2015, 19:59   #10
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Originally Posted by gates View Post
"The one that I have has worked just fine out of the box using the Winchester Super-X 40gr JHP..."

I tried the suggested CCI ammo and some worked, some did not prior to the modification.
I see that you've edited your original somewhat snide comment about 50 rds just being a break-in when I mentioned nothing about rounds fired. I'm not quite sure what that snappy comment was about, but whatever... 50 rds fired with no problems would constitute a good break-in of sorts.

In fact, now that I have a couple of minutes to respond, I admit that I haven't put that many rounds through the PMR-30. The total count is only 200 rds, 50rds of the Winchester Super-X 40gr FMC and 150 rds of the Winchester Super-X 40gr JHP. Not a bobble with any of those...

I also have an old Grendel P-30 that is sitting at many more rounds right now, mostly the same ammo, with only a couple of bobbles over the years.

We all have our preferences about ammo and reasons behind those preferences (whether the reasons are good or not). Personally, although I shoot quite a bit of CCI .22LR ammo, I don't do CCI .22WMR ammo. I don't like the simple plated bullet that CCI uses in the .22WMR, much preferring a real jacketed bullet like the one that Win. uses in the 40gr JHP Super-X load (or the Armscor and PMC stuff made by Armscor in the Philippines used).

Yes, I know what Kel-Tec says about foreign ammo in the PMR-30 and what they recommend. I haven't shot any of the Armscor or PMC stuff yet, but will eventually.

I'm glad that 'breaking' the sharp edge on the bottom of the chamber fixed your problem.

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Old September 05, 2015, 21:37   #11
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Yeah I reread what I wrote and it was dickish so I removed it. Took it to the range again this afternoon, fed the cheap ammo fine with one FTE but the guy I let shoot it limp wristed it on that shot and it worked flawlessly once I told him to hang onto the pistol. The cheap stuff is dirty though and probably not conducive to a trouble free extended shooting session without a cleaning.

Last edited by gates; September 05, 2015 at 21:43.
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Old September 05, 2015, 21:50   #12
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Yeah I reread what I wrote and it was dickish so I removed it. Took it to the range again this afternoon, fed the cheap ammo fine with one FTE but the guy I let shoot it limp wristed it on that shot and it worked flawlessly once I told him to hang onto the pistol. The cheap stuff is dirty though and probably not conducive to a trouble free extended shooting session without a cleaning.
The gun is so light that limp-wristing can be a real problem...

But you have to love the flame-thrower aspects of the PMR-30...

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Old September 05, 2015, 22:01   #13
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It IS a fun little pistol
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Old September 05, 2015, 22:11   #14
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A couple of quick additional comments about the PMR-30...

In true KelTec fashion (being quick to come up with innovative products but producing almost nothing), I tried to get a PMR-30 for years before I could actually find one available.

I bought a couple dozen mags several years ago (that has some significance for me since the 30rd mag is now illegal to buy in CO after 01JUL2013), long before I was able to pick up the gun (in Feb of 2013). While I was hoping for a black one, I finally ended up with a tan one (regardless of whatever stupid incorrect name their advertising boys call it (the color)).

Although I had to wait years for the gun, a call to KelTec got me a bunch of spare parts for it almost overnight. I haven't needed any parts, but the plastic buffer looks 'fragile.' I'm just commenting on the time disconnect between finding a gun and getting parts (and I ordered a majority of the parts that make up the whole gun). Kudos to KelTec for having parts immediately available, but damning that they don't put the parts together to have guns to sell.

I have a friend who has two of the PMR-30s, a black and a green. That leads me to a potential 'problem' with the gun. We were out shooting them one day and he complained to me that the trigger was very inconsistent, sometimes really light and sometimes a little heavier (although, having said that, the PMR-30 has a decent trigger out of the box). As I watched him shoot it, I noticed that he was milking the trigger. In other words, he was trying to take all the slack out of the trigger before it's final release. While I've never been a fan of milking triggers, it can work OK on some guns. It does not work on the PMR-30, since the milking is causing the sear to creep up to it's hammer release point resulting in inconsistent trigger pulls.

Just a word to the wise, don't milk the trigger of the PMR-30...

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Old May 28, 2019, 08:14   #15
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Friend has a PMR30. It had a couple FTFs but I'm confident that this can be overcome. They are an interesting pistol. 30 rounds of 22 mag is certainly noteworthy.

I'm kinda, sorta, looking for one but I haven't fully committed because I'm at the getting rid of stuff stage instead of acquiring stage. But if one were to pop up at a good price I may jump.

I'd like to get one and slim it down as much as possible. Lots of plastic there to debulkize.
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Old May 28, 2019, 08:31   #16
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I bought the CMR first, and had about 1-2 FTF with every mag. I made sure to load them just as the manual described. I then bought a nesting loader for it on amazon, and all the malfunctions went away. I bought a PMR not too long after. Not a single FTF in 1000 rounds with it.

I exclusively use CCI 40gr Gamepoints in it.
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Old June 01, 2019, 13:55   #17
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I can't imagine why anyone would design a semi-auto firearm to shoot .22WMR these days, and I applaud anyone attempting to do so.

I am a big fan of the .22WMR cartridge, but there have been dramatic shifts in it's velocity (probably mostly due to lawyers) over the years.

I'm also not a big fan of CCI .22WMR ammo, mostly due to their use of a plated bullet vs a real jacketed bullet. That's a personal OCD problem since most of their ammo seems to work just fine. I just don't like TMJ bullets vs FMJ bullets. So sue me...

I have two of the CMR-30 carbines and one PMR-30 (as noted earlier in this thread). I also have one of the very old Grendel P-30 pistols.

What I have noticed over the years is that all the ammo makers have downloaded the .22WMR cartridge (again, probably due to potential 'liability' problems, what I prefer to refer to as the lawyerification of America (where, last I checked, one in 80 Americans was a lawyer, and it's probably even worse now)).

For example, in 1983, I bought several bricks of RWS 40gr JHP .22WMR ammo. It chronographed at 2116fps out of the 16in barrel of an Anschutz Woodchucker. Winchester 40gr JHP Super-X chronographed just short of 2000fps then.

Currently, most manufacturers advertise 40gr bullets under 1900fps (I haven't chronographed any recently, but I'm guessing (from past experience) that most clock under what the advertising hype says)...

I find that the CMR-30 carbines are much more accurate than you'd think. I also found that they aren't completely reliable with current Winchester .22WMR 40gr JHP Super-X (purchased late last year (2018) at Sportsman's Warehouse). About 5% fail to pick up the next round from the magazine while still ejecting the fired case (a sure sign of ammo just on the edge of being 'powerful enough'). Both CMR-30 are identical in this...

Winchester 40gr JHP and FMJ .22WMR purchased decades ago are 100% in the CMR-30 carbines, as is Philippines manufactured Armscor and PMC.

I really like the CMR-30 carbines (so light you forget you're carrying them), and I really like the PMR-30 too (which is also extremely light).

My point is mostly that, no matter what the diversity of 'new' .22WMR ammo (in many bullet weights and whatever) and the advertising hype from manufacturers that promotes it, it mostly sucks compared to older production.

But maybe that's just me...

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Old June 09, 2019, 21:25   #18
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Wall of text warning:
Pre-ordered a Grendel P30 when read the original pre-release report. Was first polymer frame pistol ever bought and remained that till began laying SIG polymer frame pistols back. The first production run didn't have fluted chambers and were misery to try and make run 100%. They worked out the fluted chamber which made them near 100% reliable with mix of ammo and 100% reliable with ammo know they like. I actually purchased a NIB fluted chamber while sent the first one back for the "free barrel upgrade".

Having 30 rounds of 22 magnum in small of back and two spare mags in left rear pocket gave a person enough ammo in a small easy to carry package to shoot everyone in a crowded bar at least once if not twice and could be used to cut a trail out of crowded concert. Have not been to a concert other than a special performance of Indigo Girls with the Atlanta Ballet in over 30 years. Do go twice a year to some older popular regional bands annual reunion but now can carry in a bar on your GWL/CCW.

For decades a Georgia GWL didn't cover carrying in place that served adult beverages. It did reduce getting caught to a misdemeanor wifh $50 fine which was overweighed the risk of not carrying. Even with no spare magazine 30 rounds of 22 magnum was a lot of firepower in your pocket. Once had a pair of reliable Grendels, when they folded were "not to be sold" pistols. Have purchased one of the PMR-30's and will add another or three as find a good clean used ones.

Am running the PMR-30 in one of my overt armor kits as with pistol and total of 150 rounds of ammo with rail mounted night vision compatable laser. It takes up little room and if hit the point run my primary rifle dry along with all its magazines number of rounds from then on may be way more important than major power factor. In a fight gone really bad where all the mags for the rifle are empty in drop bag or laying on ground would rather have 150 rounds of 22 mag for backup pistol than under 50 of 9mm or 45 acp. Most of my overt kits have SIG 2022's as their backup pistol in case rifle fails or runs dry. If found a bargain on a PMR-30 tomorrow would add it and four spare mags to replace the SIG on another of the overt kits.

After what all I did trying to get the original Grendel P30 to run, the tad of work on the second generation P-30 to run. Only modification made to the PMR-30 was a few turns of a PTG hand reamer in chamber. More rounds put through it and more rounds it sees the slicker it gets and like my Taurus 992 Tracker wheel gun in 22 magnum they keep me buying 22 mag ammo buy the case more often than ever thought I would shoot 22 mag. In rifles between 22 LR and 22 Hornet have little use for 22 mag but between the Tracker plus the Grendel/Kel-Tec pistols now shoot more magnum rim fire in a year than ever thought would per decade.

On a side note both have considered being possibly the best option to build a pistol with no ferrous. Use PEI resin or titanium for all springs. Could use ceramic or titanium for a one off barrel along with few other exotic materials here and there as the low pressure of a rim fire cartridge, especially in a fluted barrel design to start with and walking through metal detectors would become easy. The Israelis have at least ten guns made with no metal they openly discuss without mentioning firearms the Mossad are using as well a U.S., Russian and other countries spies and super discrete operators that may need to be armed just in case need before get to their gear cache.

My left leg has an 18" titanium rod from knee to ankle along with three plates and 13 screws. It has never set off a metal detector. Know there are higher tech devices for spotting metal and/or firearms but has to be dozens of ways around what TSA has access to if have DARPA money to make it dissappear or appear as something totally different. Know that was a Segway but the high capacity, fairly deadly potential of better 22 magnum ammo combined with simple blowback design of the PMR-30 a few parts machined and 3D printed swapped in and walking through metal detector at courthouse or similar would be simple.

Almost 40 years ago was going through TSA with a friend on a mountaineering trip (had already checked our carry guns at Delta desk coming in) watched as he emptied pockets in the bowl they give you for keys, change, etc. Emptied pocket one then two, three and four. As dropped contents of pocket two in bowl I noticed a NAA 22 mag wheel gun along with five extra rounds in a spare cylinder that were mixed in with his pocket change from first dump. I kept mouth shut till we got into rental car and he told me had been doing it for years and never had anyone notice. He is an amateur magician and it's always amazing some things he does in plain view that only a magician or someone like me who knew him well would notice.

We went in a venue where security guards were using wands to detect metal as didn't have resources for real detectors at event that large and as we approached the guards with wands he sat a 5" blade Spyderco on top of his head and walked through and stopped to let them scan his pockets, belt line and basically everything from chest to feet. I have learned how to carry a laptop case through TSA with enough offensive and defensive tools to ruin someone with a box cutters day in a hurry. I was unpacking gear in Peru once to discover a NAA Holster Grip 22 mag from last trip had made just weeks before to Wyoming. Had no idea what to do so removed, grips, cylinder and lockwork then mailed home in four of six packages over next five weeks. That was just an oops.

Just over last holiday weekend friends wife forgot had her Kimber Micro 9 in purse till TSA x-ray machine operator saw it. In Georgia can carry to TSA line but not through. If have a GWL/CCW law is written to give those who forget an option to take pistol to vehicle or ticket counter to check in. They were early so she carried it back to car. I know others that carry their most discrete pistol every time get on a plane mixed in carry on. More get through without it noticed than don't. Still want a total non ferrous firearm though. The PMR-30 would be a fine choice. Odds of more than ten zombies on a single commercial flight seem small so would have ability to double tap each and have ten rounds left for surprise or one that didn't want to die from two rounds of 22 magnum.

Still think they should offer a program for people who can pass a very strict shooting test plus background check and if pass let them carry on planes, in court houses, etc. How many of us have been carrying for 30 to 50 years and could not miss even a fast moving human size target at aircraft cabin distances? Listening to local news been a shooting with multiple victims in restaurant or bar every weekend in Atlanta past seven weeks in a row. One there were five shooters thus I consider people that regularly go out drinking asking to get shot. With five shooters in a bar and your PMR-30 could triple tap each perp, swap in fresh magazine while wait on cops in case it flares back up and still have 45 rounds just carrying a single spare mag. When figure weight, size, accuracy and deadlyness the PMR-30 may be among top pistols for overall package size to killing ratio. I think I need three or four more....
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Old June 15, 2019, 05:38   #19
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Howdy Huey.

I can agree with most that you wrote except you did Not say that the Key to the 30PMR is in the Loading of the magazine, smoothing a ramp carefully is fine but loading the Mag so that the next top round the rim of the case is forward of the last round IS KEY, so do Not tap to seat against the back of the mag. (as I do with my Ruger).

Later on Gent's.
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Old June 25, 2019, 09:15   #20
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PMR30 shooting 22LR from CP33 MAGS

I'm just wondering, since the Keltec pmr30 and the cp33 mags are basically the same, one being 22wmr & one being 22lr, if the cp33 22lr could be fired in the pmr30?

I have both guns and the pmr30 will cycle (by hand) the 22lr's from the cp33 mag. I haven't tried firing it yet though. Just wondering what your thoughts are.

LotsaTiques

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Old June 27, 2019, 12:48   #21
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Quote:
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I can agree with most that you wrote except you did Not say that the Key to the 30PMR is in the Loading of the magazine, smoothing a ramp carefully is fine but loading the Mag so that the next top round the rim of the case is forward of the last round IS KEY, so do Not tap to seat against the back of the mag. (as I do with my Ruger).

Later on Gent's.
Never thought of trying to stack the rims of 30 rounds. That would create a situation where loaded rounds from bottom to top would be double hinkey where bottom rounds would be angled up and upper rounds would be nose diving down. I normally load and let them "settle" as want as shove them in and don't try to force any forward or rearward. seem to lay as should and don't have problems.I don't tap my magazines for my Ruger single stack rimfire pistols so rounds all go to rear. Except for a few precision built Mk1/2/3/4's I shove rounds in and fire.

Yesterday my wife gave me the inquisition about the two new thumbhole stock builds. The flat green finish was what caught her attention along with a pair of new rim fire suppressors. I was home most of the day and using them to zap the new crop of ground hog puppies like it was free.The month been shooting odd squirerel she didn't seem to notice the new "Buck Rodgers Ray Gun" builds but yesterday they caught her attention and knows if I built it, parts bill was likely high. Am really liking the Ruger 15 round mags as don't hang down as low as the 25's but allow a fair amount of killing before reloads.
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