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Old April 08, 2020, 22:52   #1
rpk74dr
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BHP malfunction help needed

BHP Competion model having FTE issues every single shot both partial and not at all in some cases. Sometimes partial jamming on the nest round going into battery. Out of the 60+ rounds fired two pistol extracted fine.

Tried different brands of ammo even a few +P+. Tried different magazines no results.

Any Ideas of what is causing the malfunction and remedies?

TIA
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Old April 09, 2020, 09:06   #2
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Is FTE Failure to EXTRACT or failure to EJECT?

Is your recoil spring on backwards?
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Old April 09, 2020, 09:55   #3
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[QUOTE=gunplumber;

Is your recoil spring on backwards?[/QUOTE]


Nailed It !!

If one puts the Spring and tube in upside down it gets even Worse
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Old April 09, 2020, 17:40   #4
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Is FTE Failure to EXTRACT or failure to EJECT?

Is your recoil spring on backwards?
Both

Failure to extract, slide moves 1/4" to the rear empty still in chamber then jams.

Failure to spent brass jams in between the slide and fresh round going into battery.

I was not aware the recoil spring was directional.
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Old April 09, 2020, 18:06   #5
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yeah - the tight end of the spring can drag on the guide if it's in backwards.
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Old April 09, 2020, 18:12   #6
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yeah - the tight end of the spring can drag on the guide if it's in backwards.
Would there be more felt resistance when charging the slide if that was the case?

Tight end of the spring goes on the guide first?

Last edited by rpk74dr; April 09, 2020 at 18:33.
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Old April 09, 2020, 18:54   #7
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Would there be more felt resistance when charging the slide if that was the case?

Tight end of the spring goes on the guide first?
Yes, tight end on the guide. And yes, it should feel gritty.

Is it still a problem after reversing the spring?
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Old April 09, 2020, 19:13   #8
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I have a BHP Practical model that had issues after I replaced the original barrel with an aftermarket Barstow barrel thinking that I could improve on the pistol's accuracy.
The barrel was fitted and installed at Cylinder and Slide and it would jam up once every other mag or so. A local gunsmith friend of mine, Benny Hill finally took pity on me and discovered that the barrel had a tight chamber and after he reamed it out just a wee bit my BHP was back in business. I later changed back to the original barrel as there wasn't any difference in accuracy.
Don't know how many rounds you've put through it , but maybe a good cleaning of the chamber might help.
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Old April 09, 2020, 19:24   #9
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Yes, tight end on the guide. And yes, it should feel gritty.

Is it still a problem after reversing the spring?



yup that was it I own a few HP and completely paid no mind.

where I do I send funds for the advise? once we can roam free again can't wait to get to the range as this models always intrigued me.

Thank you soo much
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Old April 09, 2020, 21:41   #10
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Get a recoil spring from BHSS. They're not directional. I guess I replaced all the FN recoil springs on my Hi-powers many years ago, because I never even heard of this problem until now. What a bs concern to have, the pistol, not the OP.

Last edited by M90A1; April 09, 2020 at 22:50.
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Old April 09, 2020, 22:46   #11
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yup that was it I own a few HP and completely paid no mind.

where I do I send funds for the advise? once we can roam free again can't wait to get to the range as this models always intrigued me.

Thank you soo much
+1
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Old April 10, 2020, 02:56   #12
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Well hell,,better check all of mine.
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Old April 10, 2020, 23:45   #13
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Every one of my FAL load bearing kits (mostly British Osprey 4 and Kestrel rifle armor) has a Hi Power on board paired with the FALs. Inglis models for the inch rifles and Belgians or Portuguese for the metrics. Currently have a Portuguese paired with my G1 but would really like to find a German Nazi made at fair price to pair with the G1. Only part ever had fail was operator error when missed the hole in the recoil spring guide with the slide stop and mashed the eye closed. Yes, I felt really dumb but at least it was a modern model and not a vintage numbers matching gun. I dislike 9mm pistols but love Hi Powers.
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Old April 11, 2020, 09:30   #14
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Well, Walter Mitty is on my ignore, but I'm going to make a prediction

"I have a 27 hi powers, all custom ninja tactical, and I leave one in every drawer of every room with 50 magazines each to round out the 13 sets of load bearing gear and armor and 6 other rifles (in each room) so when the zombies attack I can leap into battle "


------------

I'm assuming it was so the spring doesn't launch in field stripping. Like the original 1911 has the recoil spring plug captive on the open end of the spring. Kindof suck to launch it in the jungle while cleaning it.
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Old April 11, 2020, 10:23   #15
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I'm assuming it was so the spring doesn't launch in field stripping. Like the original 1911 has the recoil spring plug captive on the open end of the spring. Kindof suck to launch it in the jungle while cleaning it.
Interestingly enough there are a number of auto pistols with directional recoil springs, the tighter end going on the barrel first. I just always assumed it was for the reason you mention here, preventing loss...

For example (without checking, I'll probably pick at least one where it isn't true ), the Mauser HSc, Astra Constable, Bersa blowbacks (.380 and .22), among others...

I didn't remember that about the BHP (never had that problem, so I assume I just automatically installed it right after all those years of use). I'll have to pull it out later and check since I'm from Missouri (well, not really, but you know...).

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Old April 11, 2020, 10:33   #16
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Well, Walter Mitty is on my ignore, but I'm going to make a prediction

"I have a 27 hi powers, all custom ninja tactical, and I leave one in every drawer of every room with 50 magazines each to round out the 13 sets of load bearing gear and armor and 6 other rifles (in each room) so when the zombies attack I can leap into battle "
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Old April 11, 2020, 10:59   #17
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.....
------------

I'm assuming it was so the spring doesn't launch in field stripping. Like the original 1911 has the recoil spring plug captive on the open end of the spring. Kindof suck to launch it in the jungle while cleaning it.
A former "associate" made certain that everything was GTG on his 1911 the night before the first stages @ SOF in 1991.

Everything except the firing pin spring was on backwards.

Yup...

.. first round fires

slide retracts,

firing pin stop falls out,

firing pin flies past his head.....


..........
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Old April 11, 2020, 12:52   #18
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If I am on your ignore list then how did you comment on my post immediately and without anyone quoting it? Hmm... Wish I had 27 as would sell a few but have my fair share. Over the years have picked up as many variants as could when find at decent prices. Have Mk 1, Mk II and Mk III models. Have a nice shooter grade Belgian and a keep in vault only handle to wipe with oily rag Belgian. Had one Inglis and was happy to have it when they were more rare. When the Canadian government decided to surplus a bunch on U.S. civilian market added more as market was low on them. Have a couple made in Belgium assembled in Portugal models and Argentine. Have none of the DA, DAO, DA/DAO models. If found one cheap would add, have no non 9mm models but would like a 40 Smith though wont seek one out, has to cross my path at attractive price.

Actual count can't be exact off top of the head but 11 to 15 would cover actual count if carried my log in work trucks. If not a John Browning design and really first and only reliable high capacity semi auto would possibly own none. Like Glocks, don't own one nor have I ever. The the chunky lookimg plastic 9mm did nothing for me then saw reloaders blowing up Gen 1 models using full power loads in unsupported chambers but would buy a current model but won't till the M25 and M28 is available to the public and not LEO only. The high capacity 380s would be perfect for the wife. All they would have to do is leave the adjustable sights on them are imported with, which when they replace with fixed sights to become LEO only by BATFE rules once in USA.

I started buying centerfold pistols and rifles at age 13, dad had already given me a few guns beginning at 11, first car at 12 which I commuted to guy who taught me to reload with, first press at age 13 as well. Worked for dad from elementary school, got first real job at age 12 and spent my money on guns. Did all through college then after gave that up lived with parents 2.5 years buying guns and saving money so able to buy nice furniture, have money in savings and vault full of guns before moved out. Except to pay some medical bills that piled up when broke neck, thoracic and lumbar spine in three accidents plus missed a lot of work over first two years of recovery have never made a habit of selling guns. Have sold a total of one in past eight to nine years but buy build monthly.

Sorry if that upsets folks but I enjoy collecting and likely spend less on guns than most do on eating out, alcohol and entertainment. If average person totalled up what they spent per year on alcohol, eating in restaurants (especially picking up tab for a family), movies, premium cable t.v., then espcially cost of raisimg kids then grandkids, multiply those numbers by decades and it would equal a big pile of firearms. I would rather have a new gun than a month of eating two meals per day out or a new reloading or gun building tool for cost of a single trip to Longhorns/Red Lobster. It also keeps me from getting fat, amazing how many calories are in alcohol and restaurant meals. That's a choice so rather than a septic tank filled with expensive turds and recycled beer, a passel of kids which last I noticed even retarded people can procreate, I fill vaults with guns. Big stinking deal, can't take none of it with me to the afterlife. If nobody quotes this then effectively there is no way GP can respond to the post.
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Old April 11, 2020, 14:24   #19
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Maybe cause your every post for the last 5yrs is along the same narcissist lines and you really are that predictable,,,,,but Im just guessing....
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Old April 11, 2020, 14:58   #20
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Maybe cause your every post for the last 5yrs is along the same narcissist lines and you really are that predictable
Guessing I nailed it!
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Old April 11, 2020, 18:16   #21
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Maybe cause your every post for the last 5yrs is along the same narcissist lines and you really are that predictable,,,,,but Im just guessing....


Forrest
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Old April 11, 2020, 18:22   #22
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Interestingly enough there are a number of auto pistols with directional recoil springs, the tighter end going on the barrel first. I just always assumed it was for the reason you mention here, preventing loss...

For example (without checking, I'll probably pick at least one where it isn't true ), the Mauser HSc, Astra Constable, Bersa blowbacks (.380 and .22), among others...

I didn't remember that about the BHP (never had that problem, so I assume I just automatically installed it right after all those years of use). I'll have to pull it out later and check since I'm from Missouri (well, not really, but you know...).
I finally got around to pulling out a FEG P9R and P9RK (since they are DA/SA semi-clones of the BHP with the same under-barrel recoil spring type assembly) and, low and behold, exactly the same as the BHP (tight end on first). Surprise...Surprise...Surprise...

(I thought that I'd mention them especially because the examples I mentioned above all have the recoil spring around the barrel and are, perhaps, not good examples of what we were discussing...)

Forrest
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Old April 11, 2020, 18:35   #23
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I miss my HP...!!!! Still my favourite handgun but I went "Glock"
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Old April 11, 2020, 19:13   #24
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I miss my HP...!!!! Still my favourite handgun but I went "Glock"
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Old April 11, 2020, 19:21   #25
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LMAO!!! yes, a common mistake. I at times loan one of mine out to a relative and they clean it and reassemble the spring upside down and it jams good. All I can do is show them and the next time they borrow one they do the same thing all over again. No biggie ... it just naturally looks like it should be assembled one way (the wrong way) and so it goes. Heck, even done it myself in the distant past.
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Old April 11, 2020, 22:40   #26
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All this grief over a damn recoil spring. Just get one from BHSS that can go in in either direction and be done with it. They don't cost a fortune.

(Disclaimer: I have no ties to the BHSS company, except for being an immensely satisfied customer.)
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Old April 12, 2020, 09:13   #27
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All this grief over a damn recoil spring. Just get one from BHSS that can go in in either direction and be done with it. They don't cost a fortune.
Why is buying a different part easier than assembling the gun correctly?
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Old April 12, 2020, 09:35   #28
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Why is buying a different part easier than assembling the gun correctly?
Because, evidently people can't remember, or even know, the correct way to install the spring, or even give any thought to the procedure. Not everyone is a gunsmith who works with these things all the time.
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Old April 12, 2020, 09:59   #29
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Because, evidently people can't remember, or even know, the correct way to install the spring, or even give any thought to the procedure. Not everyone is a gunsmith who works with these things all the time.
I'm not a gunsmith, nor do I play one on TV (I did stay at a Holiday Inn once) I looked up how to disassemble/assemble one and never had a problem doing so.
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Old April 12, 2020, 10:12   #30
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Because, evidently people can't remember, or even know, the correct way to install the spring, or even give any thought to the procedure. Not everyone is a gunsmith who works with these things all the time.
Not sure one needs to be a gunsmith to field strip and correctly reassemble their gun. We're talking about operator level maintenance, not a complete break down. Somehow, millions of 18 year old recruits have managed it just fine for a hundred years.

But now it's a "problem" in need of a mechanical solution?
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Old April 12, 2020, 10:29   #31
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Its a damn sight better, and far easier on a fellow, to learn to take care of whatever weapon they have in their hands for use to defend themselves/others,,,than learn first hand,,if I, or people like me,,paid complete attention in class on how to plug up bullet holes in their hides.
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Old April 12, 2020, 10:54   #32
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Now that the pissing contest is over I have a story about carrying a BHP I love to tell.

I used to shoot IPSC a great deal but found myself to be an average shooter with no great talent compared to the best men. While I shot the 1911 in competition I carried the BHP because it held more rounds and I traveled with my work a lot.

So the nephews and their friends got into the black plastic gun craze and their weapon of choice was the H&K compact in 40 cal. They would even use the advertising of the HK line that "when it really matters" you choose HK. They chided me about my old gun model from 1935 and gave me crap for not picking something new and better.

This went on too long so I took them out to the club for a contest. Everyone warmed up with their gun and their draw then the contest began.

15 yards a man sized IPSC target in front of each of us. Gun in holster concealed the way you carry it and hands at your side not touching you gun. Your shirt covers your gun so you have to move it to draw.

The young men are all faster than I am and they shoot good yet the pressure of a contest makes the body work differently. Lined up someone yelled go and I put two shots dead center touching each other in the target. On fellow fumbled the draw and the other pushed down on the safety of his HK and only got one shot off. Well after I pulled the trigger.

So they went into a fit and demanded to try again and I said no, you are both dead and there are no reshoots by dead people. They said I wasn't being fair but that's life and them being in their 30s they should know what life is.

I still have that BHP but don't carry it because it's too big and heavy but I won't sell it. It made an old fat man the winner against two young fast men that knew everything and had the best equipment they could find. Love them High Powers.
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Old April 12, 2020, 11:00   #33
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" no reshoots by dead people"




I'm gonna steal that one, Jim !


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Old April 12, 2020, 11:01   #34
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Well, I guess, once again, do these lessons ever end? I just checked the BHSS spring in my pistol and it has a tight coil on one end just like a standard Browning spring. It must be designed to be installed the same way, even though nothing is stated so with the spring package. I don't remember ever paying any attention to how I installed the spring, so the chance of doing it wrong was 50-50. Either I got lucky or assumed the tight end should go on the guide rod. Either way, I've managed to place both feet firmly in mouth, again. My apologies.

I just checked the spring in one of my Hi-powers and the spring was in 'backwards". When I last fired it, a week ago, it performed perfectly. That was with an 18.5 lb spring firing 115gr. Wolf ammo. So, maybe the part about the BHSS spring working either way wasn't completely wrong. Maybe has something to do with both ends of the spring having closed coils.
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Old April 12, 2020, 13:17   #35
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Small end of spring if there is a smaller end into the slide and assemble in this manner with figure 16 showing correct orentation

IMG_3563 (1).jpg
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Old April 12, 2020, 13:47   #36
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Well, I guess, once again, do these lessons ever end? I just checked the BHSS spring in my pistol and it has a tight coil on one end just like a standard Browning spring. It must be designed to be installed the same way, even though nothing is stated so with the spring package. I don't remember ever paying any attention to how I installed the spring, so the chance of doing it wrong was 50-50. Either I got lucky or assumed the tight end should go on the guide rod. Either way, I've managed to place both feet firmly in mouth, again. My apologies.

I just checked the spring in one of my Hi-powers and the spring was in 'backwards". When I last fired it, a week ago, it performed perfectly. That was with an 18.5 lb spring firing 115gr. Wolf ammo. So, maybe the part about the BHSS spring working either way wasn't completely wrong. Maybe has something to do with both ends of the spring having closed coils.
Would you be willing to bet your life on that?
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Old April 12, 2020, 17:09   #37
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Would you be willing to bet your life on that?
Yep, it's been that way for years and never malfunctioned once. Both ends of the BHSS spring are a snug fit on the guide rod, though one end is a little tighter, so maybe it doesn't make any difference which end goes on. I have sent an email to the company and asked. When I receive a reply, I'll supply their answer.
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Old April 12, 2020, 17:13   #38
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Glocks were made simple,,, for simple people????
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Old April 12, 2020, 17:20   #39
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Glocks were made simple,,, for simple people????
...... I resemble that remark
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Old April 12, 2020, 17:30   #40
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...... I resemble that remark
As do I...

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Old April 12, 2020, 17:50   #41
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Most guns are simple if you take the time to learn about them.
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Old April 12, 2020, 19:34   #42
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Glocks were made simple,,, for simple people????
Carried one on and off duty for 29 years and was a Glock Armorer for longer than that. After all that practice, I still have trouble getting the things stripped to clean. My BHP takes me about 15-20 seconds to strip and a little longer than that to put the BHP back together (I take the time to make sure I orient the spring and spring guide correctly).
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Old April 12, 2020, 19:49   #43
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Carried one on and off duty for 29 years and was a Glock Armorer for longer than that. After all that practice, I still have trouble getting the things stripped to clean. My BHP takes me about 15-20 seconds to strip and a little longer than that to put the BHP back together (I take the time to make sure I orient the spring and spring guide correctly).
For my carry/work guns,,,must admit,,am in the,,wipe down the outside,,add a drop of oil here and there,,swab out the barrel every now and then,,but not to often,, and just ride'em hard.

My poor little Ruger Mk1 bull,,bless its heart,,its had a very hard life,,K's upon K's of rounds,,can hardly see the trigger and such,,from the gunk build up down in there.
But once it stops working,,,will clean it real good,,,one of these decades.
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Old April 13, 2020, 11:51   #44
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I'll bet these guys are glad they're still getting the laughs.
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Old April 13, 2020, 11:55   #45
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" no reshoots by dead people"




I'm gonna steal that one, Jim !


.................
I like that, too.

I'm gonna use it on Jonathan as often as I can.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old April 13, 2020, 21:24   #46
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LMAO!!! yes, a common mistake. I at times loan one of mine out to a relative and they clean it and reassemble the spring upside down and it jams good. All I can do is show them and the next time they borrow one they do the same thing all over again. No biggie ... it just naturally looks like it should be assembled one way (the wrong way) and so it goes. Heck, even done it myself in the distant past.
Learned too many hard lessons about loaning guns. I have the remains of two of three loaned that can never be repaired and those are my loaners now. People will ask if they can borrow a deer rifle that will for sure anchor the trophy buck keep seeing in back yard and will politely hand them a Remington 700 Classic in 350 Rem Mag (one year limited run model) loaned to my brother who loaned it to his brother in law. While deer hunting it was in trunk of car and when car owner made a beer run, wrecked, flipped car and it burned. Melted Burris scope out of the steel rings, nothing left of stock and trigger mechanism is a mess of melted parts. Been tryimg for decades to get bolt out of action wirh no luck. Should see the look on folks face when hand them the remains as after it burned was sprayed with ABC dry chemical fire extinguisher thinking they were saving all the guns. I tell them it's the last rifle loaned and to return it when finished.

Have a Smith M19 loaned and was left under seat of a pickup which had a super size Coca-Cola spilled between seat and console. Owner of truck thought nothing about the pistol laying in three to four inches of cola till I finally asked for it back. Left side of gun from cylinder to high side of barrel looks like it was suspended sideways in salt water for years. Action is locked, yoke is frozen shut but the right side looks new if square that side. Third gun loaned was a Ruger Blackhawk to guy whose gun froze at an IHMSA match so loaned him the Blackhawk to finish the match (local so no hard rule about gun swap in mid match) and guy who had not missed a match in two seasons left before final stage of rams and never showed up for a match anywhere in N.E. Georgia area again. Wonder if missing all that fun was worth a Blackhawk? If asked would have let him finish season with it or till got his gun fixed.

Back when post certification was not required in hick towns was a reserve deputy in home town. (early/mid 1980s) One of the three paid deputies always carried a BHP loaded with military ball. He swore by his Hi Power and trash talked 1911s non stop. One day ran into him in a local diner and face was black and blue, eye swollen half shut, weak arm all bandaged and had a 1911 in holster. Asked what happened. During "routine stop" driver of car pulled a knife. As perp closed toward him put two rounds center mass and third into forehead when guy got to him. Ended up dropping gun in close quarters knife fight and used his five cell Maglight to finally put the per down.

At hospital tuned out per soaked up two good center mass hits, one through lung and other just under the left shoulder high on chest just missing bone and tearing through a lot of muscle. Shot to forehead entered above eye and exited out rear of head but was no skull or brain damage. Bullet hit just far enough off center it tracked around skull like a circle track car between skull and skin then exited out rear. Looked like he was shot straight through head and still walking/talking/fighting. Took doctors a while to figure out how guy had entrance hole in forehead, exit rear of head looking like straight through shot but unharmed except for some minor bleeding.

That deputy carried a 1911 rest of his career. Big difference in 70s/80s 9mm ammo and current technology. Never said "told you so" about his "women's gun" but had it been me as the perp, bullet would have splattered brains all over the ground as blew out back of skull. That said deputy felt first round through chest/lung should have dropped the perp and turned to the dark side of the force. A modern Hornady 9mm Critical Duty or Critical Defense would have anchored the guy first shot as well as many other rounds.
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Old April 13, 2020, 22:06   #47
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I'm beginning to wonder just exactly what's being discussed here, the orientation of the spring, or the proper orientation of the guide rod when being mounted to the barrel. It seems like both subjects are being covered as if they were the same.
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Old April 14, 2020, 08:03   #48
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I'm beginning to wonder just exactly what's being discussed here, the orientation of the spring, or the proper orientation of the guide rod when being mounted to the barrel. It seems like both subjects are being covered as if they were the same.
Ya and nobody covered the other possibilities like limp wristing or a weak magazine spring. Once god speaks it can only be what he says.
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Old April 15, 2020, 11:24   #49
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I'm beginning to wonder just exactly what's being discussed here, the orientation of the spring, or the proper orientation of the guide rod when being mounted to the barrel. It seems like both subjects are being covered as if they were the same.
I know I've installed the spring 'backwards' from time to time and never had an issue. I've done the same thing on a 1911 and they run just the same. The guide rod OTOH is directional. If you put it in up side down nothing works.
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Old April 15, 2020, 11:51   #50
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Ya and nobody covered the other possibilities like limp wristing or a weak magazine spring. Once god speaks it can only be what he says.
Probably could have done without that one, Jim...

Step back and take a couple of breaths...

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