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Old December 20, 2017, 21:35   #1
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Is there a......

Im looking for a 1911A1 clone, basic GI parkerized, non enlarged ejection port, basic rollmarks, non logo.
And NOT series 80!
I looked at the Auto Ordinance, and the Inland, but those are both series 80.
Im not looking at a colt reissue, as thats a collector piece that costs as much as an original.
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Old December 20, 2017, 21:42   #2
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Remington or Rock Island?
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Old December 20, 2017, 22:36   #3
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Remington or Rock Island?
Remington has the huge hideous branding,also hear bad things quality wise. Rock island has the lowered/beveled ejection port, and the new angle to the RI bevel looks really out of place.
It just seems so counterintuitive to make a 1911A1 GI issue replica as a series 80.
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Old December 20, 2017, 23:02   #4
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The base Remington is actually good. I was suprised with how well I shot it compared to my edc 1911. The Roll mark is hideous. I was unaware there were quality issues. The way I feel about 1911s and what you are looking for? Colt has been making them forever. You can find a decent used pre 80 series basic government model or remove the plunger from the slide on an 80 series gun and remove the "finger" from the frame. I guess people know I shoot 1911s and own a few so they get offered to me a bit. I seem to find good used Colts in the 6 to 7 hundred dollar range for a basic Government 1911 used not abused. A good shooter. Look around for awhile. That is my opinion.

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Old December 20, 2017, 23:41   #5
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I had a Rock Island and it was flawless in operation.

However, you might want to wait and see what the CMP is going to charge for their GI 1911's when they start to sell them. I guarantee you'll need to have a trigger job done but you'll have a true GI 1911.

I agree on the series 80. I hated the design and construction with that stupid plunger.

I've also had good luck with a GSG 1911 I picked up a few years ago on a whim.
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Old December 20, 2017, 23:50   #6
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I had a Rock Island and it was flawless in operation.

However, you might want to wait and see what the CMP is going to charge for their GI 1911's when they start to sell them. I guarantee you'll need to have a trigger job done but you'll have a true GI 1911.

I agree on the series 80. I hated the design and construction with that stupid plunger.

I've also had good luck with a GSG 1911 I picked up a few years ago on a whim.
Rock Island makes a good 1911 for the money. The CMP guns are going to start at $1,100 for a well worn and used mix master. The way the prices are on the old GI war horses are crazy though. They will sell them all in no time. It's worth grabbing one or two and sticking them in the safe.
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Old December 20, 2017, 23:53   #7
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I dont have any faith in the CMP system in place for the 1911s.
People around here think there old 1911s are gold, i could be into a new prodution Colt series 70 govt for what they want. And i have considered a new series 70, but its a little to rich and id like park, not blue.
Guess I might be too picky. You just wouldnt think it would be that hard to get a clone right, found out the Auto ordinance has a full length guide rod too.
The Inland is tempting but for some unfathomable reason they made it a series 80.
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Old December 21, 2017, 00:09   #8
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I’ve heard that the laundry list of hoops you’ll have to jump thru to acquire a CMP 1911 is a mile long to boot (mich more involved than their other firearms).
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Old December 21, 2017, 00:20   #9
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I’ve heard that the laundry list of hoops you’ll have to jump thru to acquire a CMP 1911 is a mile long to boot (mich more involved than their other firearms).
You have to jump through a few hoops for sure. I saw the list and it isn't like clicking a buy it now button and going to an FFL.
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Old December 21, 2017, 21:41   #10
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Find a Springfield Armory basic parkerized GI model from a few years ago,
my understanding is that they are forged, mil-spec pistols which for a time were made by Imbel in Brazil.
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Old December 21, 2017, 21:53   #11
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Kahr has exactly what you're looking for.

http://irunguns.com/product.aut-1911bkow-45acp-5-7rd-25
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Old December 21, 2017, 22:33   #12
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Are you sure you want a GI pistol? I can shoot them fairly well but nothing like I can shoot a newer 1911 like. The sights are the biggest draw back. Better sights, a good match barrel, a tight barrel bushing, light sear fluff and buff and fitting the trigger into the frame and I can print quarter sized groups. Of course I shoot pistols religiously twice a week and see my groups open up if I go on vacation and don't shoot for a couple weeks.
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Old December 22, 2017, 16:42   #13
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I wanted the same thing and bought the Springfield Armory gun. Changed the grips, safety, slide stop and backstrap (lanyard loop) to get a convincing WWII looking gun. Worked well. The ejection port is correct unlike most all other guns.
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Old December 22, 2017, 19:51   #14
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I thought Springfield used the lowered ejection port.
Today i went to the gunshop and loked at the old colt trade ins.
I was thinking of picking up a cosmetically rough government model,and converting it to A1 specs. That wont work as even the rough bubba'd ones were over $700
I can get a new series 70 government for a tad over $800. I'd hate to parkerize one though.
Checked out an Auto ordinance clone. It was nice, except its an 80, and the checkering is reversed like a negitive on some parts like the mag release. It is a proper short guide though, not a full length like had read. Trigger was crisp but very heavy.
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I wanted the same thing and bought the Springfield Armory gun. Changed the grips, safety, slide stop and backstrap (lanyard loop) to get a convincing WWII looking gun. Worked well. The ejection port is correct unlike most all other guns.
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Old December 23, 2017, 00:26   #15
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Is there a downside to current production Colt series 70 Government models? Aside from being blued (downside for my application any way).
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Old December 23, 2017, 12:06   #16
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Check out this page - good background on the older Springfield Armory 1911s.

https://www.m1911.org/prodte30.htm
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Old December 23, 2017, 13:42   #17
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Find an old Norinco. Not sure what series
they were patterned after.
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Old December 23, 2017, 15:36   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MajHenryWest View Post
Find a Springfield Armory basic parkerized GI model from a few years ago,
my understanding is that they are forged, mil-spec pistols which for a time were made by Imbel in Brazil.
I bought one maybe 10 years ago and it's been a great pistol. Accurate and reliable too. My deal was $357 "out the door" back then. I've only changed the grips; once to walnut (too thick) and then to black plastic.
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Old December 25, 2017, 22:01   #19
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The khar/Auto Ordinance is what started this up. I had been looking at a retro to complement some of my other guns.
Got the Auto ordinance as a gift for my father, that reignited the desire. For general shooting I'd go SA Range officer.
After looking at the old colts at my local ffl, they were all beat, and bubbad in some way, and were close enough to the cost of a new series 70 Colt that they weren't worth looking at.
Right now im kinda looking at just giving in and getting the Auto ordinance, or paying almost twice as much for a colt 70. Neither is exactly what I m after, but the Colts seem to hold their value, exept i will shoot i and bluing isnt the look im after and wears easily.
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Old January 12, 2018, 12:34   #20
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Maybe

Spend some time looking in Pawn shops????
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Old January 12, 2018, 14:49   #21
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Might try the online auction sites, most things are found there. Make take a bit of time. There are just a couple worth looking at, and I think you can leave search and notify request on both.
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Old January 13, 2018, 09:38   #22
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For all the 80 series haters......why do you hate them?

I want to hear your reasons for hating 80 series 1911's. If your only answer is it can be a pain to reassemble, I get that and agree. But it in NO way effects operation of the pistol.
If your reason is people say you can't get a good trigger pull with a series 80, then you don't know how to tune a 1911.

Before you answer, let me tell you I'm a 1911 pistolsmith, trained by Bill Laughridge at Cylinder & Slide, so no BS. I'll see right through it.

The reason for my post is maybe I can convince you that just because a 1911 is series 80 doesn't mean it isn't a good choice. I own probably 20-some 1911's and some are 80 series. I can guarantee if I were to hand one after another to you and let you fire them, you could NOT tell which was which.
In fact, two of my 1911's are 70 series National Match pistols that have never been touched inside...never tuned, and my series 80 pistols have MUCH better trigger pulls then they have.
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Old January 13, 2018, 11:53   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idsubgun View Post
For all the 80 series haters......why do you hate them?

I want to hear your reasons for hating 80 series 1911's. If your only answer is it can be a pain to reassemble, I get that and agree. But it in NO way effects operation of the pistol.
If your reason is people say you can't get a good trigger pull with a series 80, then you don't know how to tune a 1911.

Before you answer, let me tell you I'm a 1911 pistolsmith, trained by Bill Laughridge at Cylinder & Slide, so no BS. I'll see right through it.

The reason for my post is maybe I can convince you that just because a 1911 is series 80 doesn't mean it isn't a good choice. I own probably 20-some 1911's and some are 80 series. I can guarantee if I were to hand one after another to you and let you fire them, you could NOT tell which was which.
In fact, two of my 1911's are 70 series National Match pistols that have never been touched inside...never tuned, and my series 80 pistols have MUCH better trigger pulls then they have.
Because it ain't righteous!
Colt's 1911 was invented by JOHN MOSES BROWNING, don't be fuggin with that.

OK, so I bought a Colt 1911 ASE series 80 last year and I have as yet found anything to find fault with including the trigger. It is much better fitted and has better sights and accuracy than my 1970's Gov't model 70. The 70 was polished and blued prettier.
I do not think the series 80 needed the contraption they put in it, but it's a non issue with me now.
If I had to choose between my 70 and 80 series, I'd sure miss that nice old 70 Colt.

Sorry, no argument here.
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Old January 13, 2018, 12:59   #24
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Because it ain't righteous!
Colt's 1911 was invented by JOHN MOSES BROWNING, don't be fuggin with that.
Well, then we would have to remove ALL changes for an original, i.e. arched mainspring housings, collet barrel bushings, etc. We couldn't have 1911A1's either.

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OK, so I bought a Colt 1911 ASE series 80 last year and I have as yet found anything to find fault with including the trigger. It is much better fitted and has better sights and accuracy than my 1970's Gov't model 70. The 70 was polished and blued prettier.
I do not think the series 80 needed the contraption they put in it, but it's a non issue with me now.
If I had to choose between my 70 and 80 series, I'd sure miss that nice old 70 Colt.

Sorry, no argument here.
Kinda my point. I do agree it wasn't needed, and I would bet it gets phased out.
The main reason people don't like the Series 80 pistol is because of apparent bad triggers, or people can't "tune" these pistols. Not true....it's internet BS.
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Old January 13, 2018, 18:10   #25
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Ya know that I was just jerking your chain a bit, but "arched" Mainspring Housings don't work for me and I have replaced collet bushings after having one lock up a friends Colt at the range one day. Not a big deal, but with no tools to get the jammed slide off, it wasted my friend's range trip with his newly acquired used 1911 and he shot up all my Browning HP ammo.

I'm all in favor of many new innovations that we see on "Old Slabsides" these days, lowered ejection port, better sights, longer trigger, beveled mag well, throated barrels and Beavertail grip safeties with raised pad. Still undecided on Full Length Recoil Guide Rods, have used both the old and new with little trouble from either.
I don't have much use for front Slide serrations, would rather have them on the Front Grip Strap. Also don't care for extended Thumb Safeties or Slide releases.
That's the great thing about today's 1911, everyone can "have it their way".

Quote;
"Kinda my point. I do agree it wasn't needed, and I would bet it gets phased out.
The main reason people don't like the Series 80 pistol is because of apparent bad triggers, or people can't "tune" these pistols. Not true....it's internet BS."

I well remember the howls of protest and gnashing of teeth with the Series 80 when it came out. It did seem that there must be something wrong according to the 1911 fans. At the time I was not in a position to acquire anything with Colt on it unless it was used and cheap. I started reading about how to do a trigger job or remove the 80's parts to "improve" the crappy new Colt, but it was a long time before I came up with enough dollars to join the new gun crowd.
Now, I wonder what all the uproar was about.

A kind gentleman allowed me to run several mags thru his custom built C&S Colt Commander back in the 90's. Damn fine pistol.
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Old January 13, 2018, 18:45   #26
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Ya know that I was just jerking your chain a bit, but "arched" Mainspring Housings don't work for me and I have replaced collet bushings after having one lock up a friends Colt at the range one day. Not a big deal, but with no tools to get the jammed slide off, it wasted my friend's range trip with his newly acquired used 1911 and he shot up all my Browning HP ammo.
I knew you were jerking my chain. Didn't think any other way.

I don't care for arched mainspring housings either. I had Carpal Tunnel surgery done a few decades ago and the arched housing rests right on the scar. I always change to flat housings except for more "collectible" 1911's.

Yeah, collet bushings need to be tossed! Just fit a standard bushing and the pistol will shoot better, and probably more accurate!


Quote:
Originally Posted by MAINER View Post
I'm all in favor of many new innovations that we see on "Old Slabsides" these days, lowered ejection port, better sights, longer trigger, beveled mag well, throated barrels and Beavertail grip safeties with raised pad. Still undecided on Full Length Recoil Guide Rods, have used both the old and new with little trouble from either.
I don't have much use for front Slide serrations, would rather have them on the Front Grip Strap. Also don't care for extended Thumb Safeties or Slide releases.
That's the great thing about today's 1911, everyone can "have it their way".
Yep, lots of options.

As for full length guide rods, they are only needed if you have weight hanging on the end of the barrel. If you have a compensator, or a suppressor, etc., you should have a full length guide rod. I have pistols with them, some I added, others factory, but if I built one for myself tomorrow, it wouldn't have one.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MAINER View Post
Quote;
"Kinda my point. I do agree it wasn't needed, and I would bet it gets phased out.
The main reason people don't like the Series 80 pistol is because of apparent bad triggers, or people can't "tune" these pistols. Not true....it's internet BS."

I well remember the howls of protest and gnashing of teeth with the Series 80 when it came out. It did seem that there must be something wrong according to the 1911 fans. At the time I was not in a position to acquire anything with Colt on it unless it was used and cheap. I started reading about how to do a trigger job or remove the 80's parts to "improve" the crappy new Colt, but it was a long time before I came up with enough dollars to join the new gun crowd.
Now, I wonder what all the uproar was about.

A kind gentleman allowed me to run several mags thru his custom built C&S Colt Commander back in the 90's. Damn fine pistol.
1911 guys are some of the most stubborn gun guys out there! LOL They don't like change even though the 1911 has evolved over time.
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Old January 13, 2018, 20:16   #27
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1911 guys are some of the most stubborn gun guys out there! LOL They don't like change even though the 1911 has evolved over time.
Wutjutokinbowt ???
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Old January 14, 2018, 23:56   #28
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Find a Springfield Armory basic parkerized GI model from a few years ago,
my understanding is that they are forged, mil-spec pistols which for a time were made by Imbel in Brazil.
The page you quoted is not quite true. The NM serial numbered pistols are Imbel forged frames. The others are not, and no, NM does not stand for national match! It was just their serial numbering process.

I have 2 SA NM serialized pistols that I would put up against any Colt, and they are heads and shoulders above a RI.
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Old January 15, 2018, 09:07   #29
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My Springfield WWII GI model has a serial that starts with WW prefix. It's stamped IMBEL BRAZIL on the bottom of the dust cover.
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Old January 17, 2018, 23:45   #30
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So, about series 80, and the 1911A1: Its not a 1911A1 clone if its series 80. Simple as that. If some one is buying a WW2-vietnam replica, to get a feel for how it was, you dont get that by having "modern" guts. Some will say, " well its not a Colt, singer, Remington rand ie. either. " but that misses the point. If you copy is close in detail, you can get a feel for it.
Now having said that, my brothers and I got one of the Auto ordinance "clones" as a gift for my father. It was very nicely done, except; the checker ing was inverted on the slide stop, and some other parts, giving them away as cast. The plastic used for the grips didnt have the same hard plastic feel. The trigger was very heavy, but also crisp. The fitment was good all around and it did feel very nice.
I ended up going in a very different direction for my self. Currently I'm gathering up every thing for s BM59 build.
I'll revisit the 1911A1 clone after Im done investing myself in the BM59.
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Old January 18, 2018, 07:51   #31
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I just go for the real thing, not a copy.

My Remington Rand........

But then, I didn't buy it, my grandfather did for $17 which included shipping, in 1962 from the NRA. It is an unissued pistol, made in 1945. It's still a solid 90-95%, even after my younger years of carrying it all across the Idaho desert.

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Old January 18, 2018, 08:44   #32
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Idsubgun, that is a nice pistol!
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Old March 22, 2019, 19:49   #33
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Late long follow up. I just picked up a new Colt "series 70" today. its actually pretty nice. I have a mainspring housing with lanyard loop for it that I haven't fitted yet, and Turbull makes reproduction old style thumb safety and wide hammers, both in the future for this gun I think. Its been raining a lot so a range trip will have to wait


Oh and after a couple boxes of ammo in the Auto Ordnance (series 80) 1911A1, the trigger lightened up very nicely, and it shoots very well. I feel bad hoping my Colt will shoot as nice as the cheap Auto Ordnance.

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Old March 23, 2019, 10:01   #34
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Real nice looking Punkin Ball chucker you got there Ghost!!

The slightly bigger sights are some I could live with, originals don't work for me anymore.
Also a fan of the "wide" hammer and have one on my old customized (mutilated) Rem-Rand clunker. Pretty fond of the newer Colt Safety however and use them on most of my 1911's including a Kimber.

Hope your new Colt GM shoots as good as it looks. Let us know how it works.


ps: Have been hearing that Colts extractor tuning is not up to par these days. Just saying.
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Old March 23, 2019, 13:12   #35
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How about picking up an Essex or other frame, a GI slide and put one together?
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Old March 23, 2019, 14:52   #36
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Essex? O 'ell no. No no no no no !!
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Old March 23, 2019, 15:35   #37
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I'm with this 110% .. I own both .. several .. and I work on 'em .. untrained except for the Kuhnhausen book .. the 80 series are every bit as good as the 70 series .. maybe better .. if you can't live with the extra 80 series parts remove them and put the plate in .. if you can't do that buy a Damn Glock .. I carry a series 80 Defender, 3" barrel, everyday .. I'll shoot it against anyone on this board .. any day .. everyday .. !



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For all the 80 series haters......why do you hate them?

I want to hear your reasons for hating 80 series 1911's. If your only answer is it can be a pain to reassemble, I get that and agree. But it in NO way effects operation of the pistol.
If your reason is people say you can't get a good trigger pull with a series 80, then you don't know how to tune a 1911.

Before you answer, let me tell you I'm a 1911 pistolsmith, trained by Bill Laughridge at Cylinder & Slide, so no BS. I'll see right through it.

The reason for my post is maybe I can convince you that just because a 1911 is series 80 doesn't mean it isn't a good choice. I own probably 20-some 1911's and some are 80 series. I can guarantee if I were to hand one after another to you and let you fire them, you could NOT tell which was which.
In fact, two of my 1911's are 70 series National Match pistols that have never been touched inside...never tuned, and my series 80 pistols have MUCH better trigger pulls then they have.
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Old March 23, 2019, 17:11   #38
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Essex? O 'ell no. No no no no no !!
There are other options as well
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Old March 24, 2019, 02:46   #39
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if you can't live with the extra 80 series parts remove them and put the plate in ..
What purpose does the plate serve? I like the true Series 80 Colts with the collet bushings BTW
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Old March 24, 2019, 09:54   #40
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The plate just fills the machined cut in the frame that the original parts occupied. Keeps fire control parts from shifting to side on the pins.
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Old March 24, 2019, 10:18   #41
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There are other options as well
I'm aware of STI and Caspian, both rated as good to go, but I was somewhat traumatized by a couple of Ezzex builds for so-called friends in the 90's and haven't quite recovered as yet.

Essex may well deliver a decent frame the past couple decades for all I know now. As I said, for me, building from scratch isn't economical anymore and I can find plenty of desirable 1911's about.
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Old March 24, 2019, 11:28   #42
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Early Essex frames were know to be out of spec. Usually in the hole locations of the fire control group.

I've heard they have gotten better but I haven't tried one to see. Would I build on one? Maybe but I'd check everything over for being in spec, especially the hole locations.

I did do some work on one many years ago but it was all in spec. So no issues.

I know nothing of their metallurgy. I'm sure it's no worse then the stuff coming from the Philippines.

That Series 70 Colt is a great pistol to makeover into a 1911A1 if that's your goal. The sights are taller then originals but that an advantage.
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Old March 24, 2019, 17:50   #43
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I think this Colt fits what I was looking for pretty nicely. Its been raining here so I haven't got out to shoot it yet, But just looking at it makes me smile so that's good. Every thing appears very nicely fit. Well see how well the extractor is tuned when I can get out.
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Old April 25, 2019, 22:11   #44
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So this Colt is pretty hard on brass. All the case mouths are bent, and there is a slight dent on them where the rim hits the ejector. I cant claim to see a pattern to the ejection but they ARE hitting the top rear of the ejection port (finish wear there), and immediately behind the ejection port (top of pistol) there are serious brass kisses.
trigger is nice, action i s smooth as glass, ran 100% reliable. cant speak to accuracy, as i was plinking objects not punching paper. at 50 feet milk jugs are not safe, and after i find my hold neither is a 3 1/2" plate (clears throat, mostly).
Is there something that can be done about the brass hitting the top of the gun, and the back of the ejection port. I almost feel like the recoil spring may be on the weak side compared to other 1911s I've shot, but I've not tuned a 1911 before.
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Old April 26, 2019, 07:04   #45
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JMB didn't design this pistol with reloaders in mind.

This is one of the reasons that I do like some of the modern configurations of ole Slabsides. Reliable ejection and saving brass is the reason for an enlarged and lowered Port, along with extended Ejectors.

I'd give an extended ejector a try, but I'm not sure how Colt attaches the thing these days.
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Old April 26, 2019, 08:01   #46
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The main thing is: The brass is being ejected and not hitting you in the face!
The rest is secondary.
Nice pistol!
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Old April 26, 2019, 11:05   #47
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Wish I had not done stuff like this when WW2 vintage 1911's were common and cheaper to build on than a new one.





Except for metal checkering and altering ejection ports could put quite a few back to as issued. Kept all my original parts but once put the file or the dremel tool to them there was no backing up.
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Old April 26, 2019, 11:20   #48
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I’ve heard that the laundry list of hoops you’ll have to jump thru to acquire a CMP 1911 is a mile long to boot (mich more involved than their other firearms).
Yes. My packet was there 4 days after the send in date and I still missed the first round. Hopefully, I will get mine in the next batch.
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Old April 26, 2019, 11:28   #49
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Late long follow up. I just picked up a new Colt "series 70" today.
How did you get it in blued finish? Colt Website only shows it in parkerized.
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Old April 26, 2019, 12:21   #50
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How did you get it in blued finish? Colt Website only shows it in parkerized.
hello, I found a place online that had one, I think they had it for awhile. it was a brick and mortar shop, but had horrible hours 10 am to 2 pm. I'd imagine its hard to sell stuff with hours like that.
the blue is done very well, almost didnt want to shot it it looked so good
EDIT: I've seen the mainspring housing listed as plastic too, it's not, it is blued steel.
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