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Old September 29, 2019, 16:58   #1
ftierson
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Guy-epic's thread...?

Did Guy-epic's recent thread on the best AR in the world get moved to the basement for some reason or did he delete it because he didn't like the responses?

Just wondering...

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Old September 29, 2019, 17:09   #2
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Interesting - just did a quick skim in DB and didn't see it. Seems to be gone entirely.
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Old September 29, 2019, 17:15   #3
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Old September 29, 2019, 17:47   #4
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I just want to know what it is so I can go buy one.

Can someone he'p a brotha out?
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Old September 29, 2019, 17:51   #5
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Go buy a nice AR15 at a very high price, post your review, and we'll just do it again.
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Old September 29, 2019, 18:06   #6
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Meh. All of my AR15s are Tier 1 Special Operators approved!
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Old September 29, 2019, 18:07   #7
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Go buy a nice AR15 at a very high price, post your review, and we'll just do it again.
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Old September 29, 2019, 18:35   #8
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I just want to know what it is so I can go buy one.

Can someone he'p a brotha out?
A Hodge Mod AR 15. It's perfect... Not clumsy or clunky like most "cheap" AR's.
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Old September 29, 2019, 19:41   #9
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Not as clumsy or random as a blaster AR. An elegant weapon for a more civilized age.

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Old September 29, 2019, 20:00   #10
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Old September 29, 2019, 20:30   #11
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An elegant weapon for a more civilized age.
You can shorten that sentence by just typing "Garand", but this is a thread about a thread about ARs
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Old September 30, 2019, 00:09   #12
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Does that mean all my machined billet magnesium receiver builds are high speed/low drag special ops classified catagory and not to be discussed? I really didn't try to disrespect the rifle in thread but explain from a businessman perspective why a smaller specialty firearms company is going to have to charge a fair amount more as amortizing liability insurance, BATFE/DDTC/ITAR paperwork out over fewer units than a bigger company means same rifle costs more for the smaller company to build.

I can build a $1,000 in parts into a nice rifle for $1,000 if not figuring in labor but it's a personal not resale rifle. Shopped product liability insurance to do general full service gunsmithing, builds and sales of AR 15s and AR 10s. Cost was $2,000 a month to do gunsmithing and retail sales. To do manufacturing prices varied from $3,000 to $7,000 per month which would be audited every quarter with price adjusted up or down based on number of units built and sold. Add in utilities and such most likely have over $500 per rifle in overhead even in a paid for building. Cost is now $1,500 without paying skilled labor.

Have now built over two dozen AR 15s on the Mag Tactical magnesium receiver sets which are 40% lighter than aluminum and not had a single upper or lower break. I have not used them for any build with over 14.7" medium taper barrel and even under abuse of running tactical courses and binary fire they hold up fine even when practice extracting a stuck case. That said Fostech who bought their equipment and made modifications to the design has had multiple complaints of uppers breaking during build process and under normal operating conditions at a range to the point many retailers are dropping them from their line. Price has dropped over $100 per set over where Fostech began with their Fight Light receiver sets.

My contacts at Mag Tactical said all depended on the forged blocks they received for machining. They had a couple or three lots come through that had voids that would not always show after machining and cause failures. They only let one group out, others they caught in Q.C. of billets. Their product kept getting better as figured out where to add material and where they could shave. Have full confidence in the 100+ lowers and couple dozen uppers left but would only build 5.56 short rifles on the uppers. The lowers combined with SIG or DPMS uppers make fine rifles and have hung up to 26" length, 0.997" diameter to gas block and 0.875" from gas block to muzzle barrels using this setup and none have failed even in 22 Nosler or 6.8 spc II with fat heavy tubes.

Proprietary alloys for receivers are tricky and cost money to do right and may be part of the Hodge expense. There were actually three generations of the Mag Tactical magnesium which after only one production run of Gen 3 uppers they changed machine to lowers and stopped selling uppers as could not run both at same time. Much more weight was saved on the lowers which every breakage I knew of happened to upper during a beginner tactical class where user was learning to extract stuck cases for first time. I have tried and built even 550 grain chunkin binary 458 SOCOMs on the magnesium lowers with zero issues yet but figure if going to break one some of the 7.5" and 8.5" piston drive 5.56, 6.8 and 458 SOCOM most with binary triggers would break them slamming against barricades and dropping from standing to prone while trotting along would have done it by now considering have built over thirty of the lowers and LGS sold over 300 and not had a single return.

I suggested they do the $20 bulk price lowers I was getting and they only sold four uppers which came from my stash of Gen 2 series which were the good ones and saving what's left for spacial builds like the 13.7" Noveske 6.8 on bench now and a 12.5" White Oak Armament which are both pinned to 16.015" with flash cans and proper thickness washer. Most of my going out into the dark of night with zombies at the fence line poodle shooters are the magnesium lowers with SIG uppers or Gen 2 magnesium uppers. Have no idea why Fostech is having issues as was told lead equipment operator was going to work for them.

Unless they bought lowest bid magnesium blocks from foundry should be as reliable as Mag Tactical have been for me. Also believe a lot of the upper breakage (reading reviews buyers often say upper broke during assembly) is from the lack of using a torque wrench and being gentile as they tightened their barrel nuts. If don't fully support the magnesium upper in a clam shell or use the picatinny rail option on a Wheeler could snap one if over torqued while had wrench not perpendicular to the nut and receiver.

I can see using proprietary alloy to save weight and do so in manner it does not break then it could add a hundred bucks to the expense of receiver set. I also believe if Mag Tactical had only sold completed rifles they would not have had the issues that killed the company. Never heard of a Mag Tactical complete factory build failing but they understood they were working with a more brittle material. Many first and second time kitchen table builders chasing that three pound rifle likely didn't. I have many threads that went south but leave as they usually like the Hodge rifle thread present a myriad of opinions.

Personally I don't see paying $3,000 for what is a 85% milspec build but for those that don't have over $1,000 in just AR parts truing and assembly tools plus years of mining knowledge while building many rifles and documenting every aspect, testing and working toward a formula which parts of are used on all builds and others on certain types. I never wanted an AR pistol nor a piston drive AR till discovered when went on the road doing subcontract telecom work many states I worked did not allow loaded rifles as am used to. Thats when I decided to build an AR pistol for a truck gun and it took a dozen builds before discovering the best AR pistol/truck gun formula. I ditched DI quickly in pistol length gas and went to piston drive.

Built a 7.5" 5.56, 8.5" 6.8, 8.5" 458 SOCOM, pair of 10.5" 5.56, pair of 10.5" 6.8 along with an 11.5" in 5.56 and 6.8. After nine pistols built in different configurations with a lot of testing of each for reliability, portability, accuracy and range. Finally determined the absolute best pistol of all for my purposes is a 10.5" Noveske 6.8 barrel with Superlative Arms Bleed Off Carbine piston drive, LMT bolt, M16 carrier, Battle Arms Development four inch short buffer system, Tail-Hook pistol brace, Gorilla free float forearm topped with a SIG Romeo 5 red dot and BUIS sights. First pair of 6.8 piston pistols one was an ARP barrel with Shockwave buffer and brace along with the Noveske and Battle Arms Development buffer build. Ran both hard side by side then ordered up another Noveske 10.5" barrel and Battle Arms Development short buffer with Tail Hook and built a carnon copy of hardest hitting and best shooting in the smallest overall package of every pistol built.

Now wife and I each have a 10.5" Noveske piston drive 6.8 as our "truck guns" and mix of 15 and 25 round magazines so if travelling through a state with 20 round limit can leave the 25s at home and carry a big sack of 15 round magazines. By the time I picked the winning truck gun and then built an exact copy it took a total of ten builds to come up with a pair which I feel 100% confident in to bust zombies and knock them on their proverbial @$$ out to 250 yards with relative ease. At 25 to 100 yards they are absolutely deadly with Speer 90 grain Gold Dots and actually chewed up a friend's plates which he shoots regularly with 5.56 and 300 BO but had never been exposed to fire from a 6.8.

Till I had run his course double tapping the silhouettes dropping the 8", 10" and 12" plates plus a series of knock downs and others. When we went to reset the course discovered the 6.8 had bent and warped quite a few of his plates which were bought from a local guy who makes three series of plates of different thicknesses, 5.56, 7.62×51 and then magnum plates. He has two courses of which one is for AR 15s and the other from AR 15s and MBRs. Since I was technically running an AR 15 pistol we never considered my hot loaded 6.8s with 90 grain bonded bullets make 85% of the muzzle energy of a 7.62×51. He was not upset as plates were not ruined per say but between the bent and dented plates he decided it was time to screw together a 6.8.

I now have ten AR pistols of which eight have migrated to rear of vault and the matched pair of Noveske 6.8s are what came out as the top pick for a truck gun that fell under BATFE pistol definition to carry loaded using our GWL/CCW licenses. That's eight pistols that will likely get wiped down with oil once a year or so and remind me of the great search for my ultimate AR pistol to use when travel out of state as a truck gun. That's how I build, decide on outside specs and goals for a rifle, build as many as it takes till feel it can't be improved and then that is my template for future rifles. Have at least eight 18" 5.56 ARs not counting Mk 12 Mod 0 clones and except for brand of barrel all are pretty much exactly built based on initial test builds. Same with my safe of 14.5"/14.7" M4geries. Built, tested, checked accuracy, cyclic rate, reliability ease of use and now have 24 in 5.56 that are near clones and will have same number that are 6.8 and near clones. No matter what all get M16 full auto bolts and at least a dozen other exact same milspec parts.

My formula for 20" Hbars does not vary, White Oak 1:8 barrel then all milspec parts on SIG upper and Mag Tactical lower. Anytime I do a heavy barrel build it goes on a set of matched DPMS LoPro receivers or if leans tactical then SWAT Firearms machined billet receivers with hand matched uppers and lowers before pin holes are line bored through both upper and lower while clamped together. All of my 22 Noslers are DPMS LoPro with two stage triggers. I have enough poodle shooters built, tested for function, cleaned and locked away if wanted to start a rifle company likely have my first years inventory already built but turning a hobby into a business, especially where you can end up in a class action civil court lawsuit with 47 people suing your company because their kid was killed with a rifle you built and sold will put a small company into bankruptcy so fast these days wouldn't follow that path unless investors took all the risk.
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Old September 30, 2019, 02:28   #13
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Not familiar with Jean-Guy Epic or teh World's Greatest AR.
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Old September 30, 2019, 06:23   #14
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Old September 30, 2019, 07:26   #15
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Guy is okay, it was merely a brief moment of AR induced euphoria. A very brief malady compared to falcoholism.
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Old September 30, 2019, 07:47   #16
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Mr Huey, you have exceeded expectations!

The guy bought a nice rifle. Great.
He may have succumbed to the hype.
Happens to many of us, at times.

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Old September 30, 2019, 09:20   #17
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Tried to recall the statements made in missing thread along with my responses. Many looked at a person getting fleeced for a well thought out semi custom milspec rifle at $2,850 retail. I dissected it from a self builders and business owners perspective. At a split between "weekend special internet" and wholesale prices the rifle had $1,000 in parts.

If a man already has all the equipment to build down to upper receiver lap to square it, hammer & sear jig to true fire control system engagement areas, quality calibrated torque wrench, proper punches, holding fixtures, shop vice, etc that's $500 to $1,000 in build tools. Also the rifles I saw on Internet were well finished thus the ability to finish all parts to matching color rather than six shades of grey and black my SataJet HVLP for shooting Cerakote was $400 plus cost of an oven (free to scroungers) and I.R. heat lamps for assemblies that won't fit in a free or wife's oven and your over $600 but could use a cheap HVLP or tank the entire main assembly so parkerizing matches which is more expensive then your likely already building a lot of rifles and cost of tools is amortorized over multiple units.

Same with complete set of quality build tools. I consider $400 minimum buy in for required tools to build an AR correctly though many of us would already have a decent torque wrench, vice and all the basic shop tools. I occasionally have to make an alteration using a mill but lets forgo that and say bought all well matched milspec parts. The Hodge rifle has its proprietary alloy receivers and custom roll marked with company logo/name which I have priced and if buy a couple hundred units is not horribly priced up cost.

It's the government from firearms related paperwork to basic payroll, taxes, insurance, especially liability insurance that hobble a small shop with a huge burden plus the time taken to do said paperwork. Add cost of facilities (rent or payments), utilities, maintenance, paychecks for employees and that's a $500+ up charge for small shop so our home built rifle has a $500 advantage going to the home builder but the custom shop also has the advantage of R&D to figure out best combination of parts to build a nice rifle though if basically go with A Grade milspec parts that are properly fitted an AR should shoot well once your properly gassed either with port size, buffer or combination of the two executed well.

Have to buy probably a decent shipping box with company logo printed, label maker to mark each box with rifles serial number etc so say it's $1,500 to $1,800 investment ready for shipping. Even if just $1,300 the distributor and retailer want a slice of pie so price of rifle reflects it's cost to build a "custom" milspec rifle. Hmmm. For $1,800 can get a Daniel Defence with a lot of custom features. The first AR that wasn't "clumsy or clunky" escapes me but everyone has their own tastes and I have not handled a Hodge.

I do know when I started chasing a reliable and effective truck gun that fell under the legal,definition of a pistol it was a lot of work and expense to get there. That's R&D which could be a one time ride on a rifle such as one discussed but being odd I built nine rifles making big changes at first then smaller and smaller till honed in on what I felt was a light fighting combat gun that fit the pistol definition. Most would not put that much effort. They would order their parts, assemble, troubleshoot and call it done when had first attempt running.

I really wanted to be building a price line product like the Hodge with options in the $2,000 to $3,000 range for well built rifles on Noveske, White Oak and Compass Lake class barrels but the overhead was going to make it a challenge to compete unless found a cult following or dot go contract. Too risky to me in the day of $400 Smith & Wesson M&P 15s that are fine little poodle shooters. I see both sides and if not someone with a pile of specialty tools and lots of AR experience wanting just one reliable rifle it's likely cheaper to buy an expensive semi custom you feel 100% confident in.

Meanwhile I will continue to use my base formula, modify for more odd configurations then when have it worked out usually build a second on exact same pattern or more so don't have to try again later if some of the parts used are not available anyore due to vendors going belly up. I might be better off with a half dozen nice factory riflles than dozens of builds which many were just evolutionary experiments. Know I would have more money in my wallet.
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Old September 30, 2019, 09:26   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hueyville View Post
Does that mean all my machined billet magnesium receiver builds are high speed/low drag special ops classified catagory and not to be discussed? I really didn't try to disrespect the rifle in thread but explain from a businessman perspective why a smaller specialty firearms company is going to have to charge a fair amount more as amortizing liability insurance, BATFE/DDTC/ITAR paperwork out over fewer units than a bigger company means same rifle costs more for the smaller company to build.

I can build a $1,000 in parts into a nice rifle for $1,000 if not figuring in labor but it's a personal not resale rifle. Shopped product liability insurance to do general full service gunsmithing, builds and sales of AR 15s and AR 10s. Cost was $2,000 a month to do gunsmithing and retail sales. To do manufacturing prices varied from $3,000 to $7,000 per month which would be audited every quarter with price adjusted up or down based on number of units built and sold. Add in utilities and such most likely have over $500 per rifle in overhead even in a paid for building. Cost is now $1,500 without paying skilled labor.

Have now built over two dozen AR 15s on the Mag Tactical magnesium receiver sets which are 40% lighter than aluminum and not had a single upper or lower break. I have not used them for any build with over 14.7" medium taper barrel and even under abuse of running tactical courses and binary fire they hold up fine even when practice extracting a stuck case. That said Fostech who bought their equipment and made modifications to the design has had multiple complaints of uppers breaking during build process and under normal operating conditions at a range to the point many retailers are dropping them from their line. Price has dropped over $100 per set over where Fostech began with their Fight Light receiver sets.

My contacts at Mag Tactical said all depended on the forged blocks they received for machining. They had a couple or three lots come through that had voids that would not always show after machining and cause failures. They only let one group out, others they caught in Q.C. of billets. Their product kept getting better as figured out where to add material and where they could shave. Have full confidence in the 100+ lowers and couple dozen uppers left but would only build 5.56 short rifles on the uppers. The lowers combined with SIG or DPMS uppers make fine rifles and have hung up to 26" length, 0.997" diameter to gas block and 0.875" from gas block to muzzle barrels using this setup and none have failed even in 22 Nosler or 6.8 spc II with fat heavy tubes.

Proprietary alloys for receivers are tricky and cost money to do right and may be part of the Hodge expense. There were actually three generations of the Mag Tactical magnesium which after only one production run of Gen 3 uppers they changed machine to lowers and stopped selling uppers as could not run both at same time. Much more weight was saved on the lowers which every breakage I knew of happened to upper during a beginner tactical class where user was learning to extract stuck cases for first time. I have tried and built even 550 grain chunkin binary 458 SOCOMs on the magnesium lowers with zero issues yet but figure if going to break one some of the 7.5" and 8.5" piston drive 5.56, 6.8 and 458 SOCOM most with binary triggers would break them slamming against barricades and dropping from standing to prone while trotting along would have done it by now considering have built over thirty of the lowers and LGS sold over 300 and not had a single return.

I suggested they do the $20 bulk price lowers I was getting and they only sold four uppers which came from my stash of Gen 2 series which were the good ones and saving what's left for spacial builds like the 13.7" Noveske 6.8 on bench now and a 12.5" White Oak Armament which are both pinned to 16.015" with flash cans and proper thickness washer. Most of my going out into the dark of night with zombies at the fence line poodle shooters are the magnesium lowers with SIG uppers or Gen 2 magnesium uppers. Have no idea why Fostech is having issues as was told lead equipment operator was going to work for them.

Unless they bought lowest bid magnesium blocks from foundry should be as reliable as Mag Tactical have been for me. Also believe a lot of the upper breakage (reading reviews buyers often say upper broke during assembly) is from the lack of using a torque wrench and being gentile as they tightened their barrel nuts. If don't fully support the magnesium upper in a clam shell or use the picatinny rail option on a Wheeler could snap one if over torqued while had wrench not perpendicular to the nut and receiver.

I can see using proprietary alloy to save weight and do so in manner it does not break then it could add a hundred bucks to the expense of receiver set. I also believe if Mag Tactical had only sold completed rifles they would not have had the issues that killed the company. Never heard of a Mag Tactical complete factory build failing but they understood they were working with a more brittle material. Many first and second time kitchen table builders chasing that three pound rifle likely didn't. I have many threads that went south but leave as they usually like the Hodge rifle thread present a myriad of opinions.

Personally I don't see paying $3,000 for what is a 85% milspec build but for those that don't have over $1,000 in just AR parts truing and assembly tools plus years of mining knowledge while building many rifles and documenting every aspect, testing and working toward a formula which parts of are used on all builds and others on certain types. I never wanted an AR pistol nor a piston drive AR till discovered when went on the road doing subcontract telecom work many states I worked did not allow loaded rifles as am used to. Thats when I decided to build an AR pistol for a truck gun and it took a dozen builds before discovering the best AR pistol/truck gun formula. I ditched DI quickly in pistol length gas and went to piston drive.

Built a 7.5" 5.56, 8.5" 6.8, 8.5" 458 SOCOM, pair of 10.5" 5.56, pair of 10.5" 6.8 along with an 11.5" in 5.56 and 6.8. After nine pistols built in different configurations with a lot of testing of each for reliability, portability, accuracy and range. Finally determined the absolute best pistol of all for my purposes is a 10.5" Noveske 6.8 barrel with Superlative Arms Bleed Off Carbine piston drive, LMT bolt, M16 carrier, Battle Arms Development four inch short buffer system, Tail-Hook pistol brace, Gorilla free float forearm topped with a SIG Romeo 5 red dot and BUIS sights. First pair of 6.8 piston pistols one was an ARP barrel with Shockwave buffer and brace along with the Noveske and Battle Arms Development buffer build. Ran both hard side by side then ordered up another Noveske 10.5" barrel and Battle Arms Development short buffer with Tail Hook and built a carnon copy of hardest hitting and best shooting in the smallest overall package of every pistol built.

Now wife and I each have a 10.5" Noveske piston drive 6.8 as our "truck guns" and mix of 15 and 25 round magazines so if travelling through a state with 20 round limit can leave the 25s at home and carry a big sack of 15 round magazines. By the time I picked the winning truck gun and then built an exact copy it took a total of ten builds to come up with a pair which I feel 100% confident in to bust zombies and knock them on their proverbial @$$ out to 250 yards with relative ease. At 25 to 100 yards they are absolutely deadly with Speer 90 grain Gold Dots and actually chewed up a friend's plates which he shoots regularly with 5.56 and 300 BO but had never been exposed to fire from a 6.8.

Till I had run his course double tapping the silhouettes dropping the 8", 10" and 12" plates plus a series of knock downs and others. When we went to reset the course discovered the 6.8 had bent and warped quite a few of his plates which were bought from a local guy who makes three series of plates of different thicknesses, 5.56, 7.62×51 and then magnum plates. He has two courses of which one is for AR 15s and the other from AR 15s and MBRs. Since I was technically running an AR 15 pistol we never considered my hot loaded 6.8s with 90 grain bonded bullets make 85% of the muzzle energy of a 7.62×51. He was not upset as plates were not ruined per say but between the bent and dented plates he decided it was time to screw together a 6.8.

I now have ten AR pistols of which eight have migrated to rear of vault and the matched pair of Noveske 6.8s are what came out as the top pick for a truck gun that fell under BATFE pistol definition to carry loaded using our GWL/CCW licenses. That's eight pistols that will likely get wiped down with oil once a year or so and remind me of the great search for my ultimate AR pistol to use when travel out of state as a truck gun. That's how I build, decide on outside specs and goals for a rifle, build as many as it takes till feel it can't be improved and then that is my template for future rifles. Have at least eight 18" 5.56 ARs not counting Mk 12 Mod 0 clones and except for brand of barrel all are pretty much exactly built based on initial test builds. Same with my safe of 14.5"/14.7" M4geries. Built, tested, checked accuracy, cyclic rate, reliability ease of use and now have 24 in 5.56 that are near clones and will have same number that are 6.8 and near clones. No matter what all get M16 full auto bolts and at least a dozen other exact same milspec parts.

My formula for 20" Hbars does not vary, White Oak 1:8 barrel then all milspec parts on SIG upper and Mag Tactical lower. Anytime I do a heavy barrel build it goes on a set of matched DPMS LoPro receivers or if leans tactical then SWAT Firearms machined billet receivers with hand matched uppers and lowers before pin holes are line bored through both upper and lower while clamped together. All of my 22 Noslers are DPMS LoPro with two stage triggers. I have enough poodle shooters built, tested for function, cleaned and locked away if wanted to start a rifle company likely have my first years inventory already built but turning a hobby into a business, especially where you can end up in a class action civil court lawsuit with 47 people suing your company because their kid was killed with a rifle you built and sold will put a small company into bankruptcy so fast these days wouldn't follow that path unless investors took all the risk.
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Old September 30, 2019, 12:24   #19
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Go buy a nice AR15 at a very high price, post your review, and we'll just do it again.


I may do it. Stand by...
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 12:25   #20
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"And now was the Winter of our discontent"...
"Boom in the crotch, boom in the crotch - and let's go to work."
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 12:40   #21
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I'm going to make a list of THE BEST IN THE WORLD components for AR building.

As with everything I post, feel free to bring the hate. Also, Nomex Big Boy Pants are recommended.


My favorite barrels cost a bunch of money, and are CHF with double-thickness chrome lining (per M249 spec). I learned - sorta by accident - that Noveske buys these blanks from FN, and then does the finish work themselves. FN won't sell me blanks for an FAL project, because I don't even qualify as a tiny little pimple on the ass of whatever small-batch buyer type Noveske is. They're $445 with a low-pro gas block.

My second favorite barrel is the Daniel Defense 'Lightweight 'Pencil' Profile' because it is also CHF and chrome-lined, and it shoots 75gr. BTHPs like a laser - and only weighs 2 lbs. @ 16" length. $275 on Gunbroker FTW.

I don't have all day to get my ass beat by the Know It Alls here, so please hurry up and do your worst. Arm yourselves with the knowledge that some guy is going to have (probably...) a fully functional rifle from PSA for the amount of money I'm going to spend on a naked barrel. By the time I buy my next component, he'll probably have a couple thousand rounds of M193 on stripper clips sitting in his basement. Also know that I am smug in my belief that my superior Cold Hammer Forged rifle barrel will make me the (probably) bullet proof and superior operator, which will allow me to take the ammo from the person who had the poor judgment to turn his PSA Rifle on me and/or my family.

All it takes is Buying Good Stuff, men. That's all it takes.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 12:44   #22
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I'm going to make a list of THE BEST IN THE WORLD components for AR building.

As with everything I post, feel free to bring the hate. Also, Nomex Big Boy Pants are recommended.


My favorite barrels cost a bunch of money, and are CHF with double-thickness chrome lining (per M249 spec). I learned - sorta by accident - that Noveske buys these blanks from FN, and then does the finish work themselves. FN won't sell me blanks for an FAL project, because I don't even qualify as a tiny little pimple on the ass of whatever small-batch buyer type Noveske is. They're $445 with a low-pro gas block.

My second favorite barrel is the Daniel Defense 'Lightweight 'Pencil' Profile' because it is also CHF and chrome-lined, and it shoots 75gr. BTHPs like a laser - and only weighs 2 lbs. @ 16" length. $275 on Gunbroker FTW.

I don't have all day to get my ass beat by the Know It Alls here, so please hurry up and do your worst. Arm yourselves with the knowledge that some guy is going to have (probably...) a fully functional rifle from PSA for the amount of money I'm going to spend on a naked barrel. By the time I buy my next component, he'll probably have a couple thousand rounds of M193 on stripper clips sitting in his basement. Also know that I am smug in my belief that my superior Cold Hammer Forged rifle barrel will make me the (probably) bullet proof and superior operator, which will allow me to take the ammo from the person who had the poor judgment to turn his PSA Rifle on me and/or my family.

All it takes is Buying Good Stuff, men. That's all it takes.
Just make sure that, after a couple of mildly negative comments, you delete your original comment/thread and sulk off (after insulting those making the comments, of course, but I'm sure that goes without saying)...

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Old September 30, 2019, 12:51   #23
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Just make sure that, after a couple of mildly negative comments, you delete your original comment/thread and sulk off (after insulting those making the comments, of course, but I'm sure that goes without saying)...

Forrest
The personal attacks and insults come first - naturally.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 14:00   #24
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The personal attacks and insults come first - naturally.
That goes without saying, of course...

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:28   #25
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A 1975 Colt SP1 with PMC 55 grain ball shoots better than I can hold in field position.
Of course brunop can testify to what a crappy trigger presser this guy is.

And tons better than 97.2 % of the alleged shooters on this forum can do with OR without their fat ass sitting behind a bench looking through 24X glass.



So there.


Spend money on something that gets results, or just continue masturbating with a cheese grater......



......................

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:31   #26
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A 1975 Colt SP1 with PMC 55 grain ball shoots better than I can hold in field position.
Of course brunop can testify to what a crappy trigger presser this guy is.

And tons better than 97.2 % of the alleged shooters on this forum can do with OR without their fat ass sitting behind a bench looking through 24X glass.



So there.


Spend money on something that gets results, or just continue masturbating with a cheese grater......
Well, shit, what do you know...?

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:33   #27
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And 'masturbating with a cheese grater'...?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that sounds painful...

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:34   #28
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Uh... well, there's the beginning of the insults. And I didn't even have to say anything (yet).


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Old September 30, 2019, 14:36   #29
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And 'masturbating with a cheese grater'...?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that sounds painful...
Of course, keep in mind that if you disagree with me ('correct me'}, I'll just delete this thread because I can't handle that (being disagreed with).

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:40   #30
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Well, shit, what do you know...?

Forrest
A shit-ton of trivia, for one. And gun parts like you can't believe. He knows almost nothing about sportsball AFAIK, but *may* have picked some things up by osmosis from Whatsername's Sunday afternoons.

Also: I once saw tdb59 hit an A/C zone reduced IPSC target at 100 yards with an AR with no sights, so that was cool. Also saw 275 repeatedly on an IPSC with irons from standing (no sling). Can't remember which rifle, but I was pretty impressed. Might have also seen an S&W 'K' frame make repeated hits on IPSC at 100 in double-action mode. That was no joke. I've never seen him sit at a bench, so he don't know shit about fat guys and 24x scopes.

Also, he knows how to design good shooting stages. The current fave is "Dos Equis - The Most Interesting Match in the World". It actually features two 'X's and is very interesting.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 14:43   #31
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A shit-ton of trivia, for one. And gun parts like you can't believe. He knows almost nothing about sportsball AFAIK, but *may* have picked some things up by osmosis from Whatsername's Sunday afternoons.

Also: I once saw tdb59 hit an A/C zone reduced IPSC target at 100 yards with an AR with no sights, so that was cool. Also saw 275 repeatedly on an IPSC with irons from standing (no sling). Can't remember which rifle, but I was pretty impressed. Might have also seen an S&W 'K' frame make repeated hits on IPSC at 100 in double-action mode. That was no joke.

Also, he knows how to design good shooting stages. The current fave is "Dos Equis - The Most Interesting Match in the World". It actually features two 'X's and is very interesting.
Well, shit, a blind squirrel sometimes finds a nut...

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Old September 30, 2019, 14:55   #32
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I *might* have said the same thing at the time...
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 15:04   #33
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It's always tricky to determine the personal relationships of 'strangers' on the web.

For full disclosure, Terry is a friend of mine, even though I've never met him in person.

And George (the gman) is a personal friend of mine (who I do know personally), and I think it was his comment that really set off the deletion of the thread in question. I thought that he was pretty gentle...

Then, after Guy-epic came back and badmouthed the people making comments (who actually do know ARs) after saying that he didn't know ARs but had the best one ever made, I probably pushed him over the edge by suggesting that he not double down on stupid, and that he should just enjoy his nice AR.

And that's where I last saw things until they weren't to be seen anymore. So it was probably my 'fault' that he deleted the thread...

Just sayin'...

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Old September 30, 2019, 15:23   #34
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Well, shit, what do you know...?

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A shit-ton of trivia, for one. ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ftierson View Post
And 'masturbating with a cheese grater'...?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that sounds painful...

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Old September 30, 2019, 15:30   #35
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I lake a good cactus rub and tug somedays when I'm feeling ornery. That'll show the wife for pissing me off.

I guess I really didn't pay much attention to the thread. Damn, I miss all the fun sometimes.
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Old September 30, 2019, 15:53   #36
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I like my FN CHF barrels and Geissel triggers wrapped up in cheap PSA parts so I can run my mouth with equal efficacy whether a thread is favoring fat ass wanna-be mouth breathers or fat ass tactical operator mouth breathers. Got it covered.

Hey, while we have all the experts in the line how can I tell if my NC Star 25X is on frontwards or backwards? Most of my high quality optics come with an integral laser pointer so if I have a dot on my face I flip it around. This one doesnt have a laser.
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Old September 30, 2019, 15:58   #37
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I like my FN CHF barrels and Geissel triggers wrapped up in cheap PSA parts so I can run my mouth with equal efficacy whether a thread is favoring fat ass wanna-be mouth breathers or fat ass tactical operator mouth breathers. Got it covered.

Hey, while we have all the experts in the line how can I tell if my NC Star 25X is on frontwards or backwards? Most of my high quality optics come with an integral laser pointer so if I have a dot on my face I flip it around. This one doesnt have a laser.
If you flip your face around, how do you know if the barrel is CHF ?



Where's my coffee ?


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Old September 30, 2019, 16:02   #38
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Most of my high quality optics come with an integral laser pointer so if I have a dot on my face I flip it around. This one doesnt have a laser.
You could put an eye out doing that shit is what my dad used to say.
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Old September 30, 2019, 16:04   #39
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It's always tricky to determine the personal relationships of 'strangers' on the web.

For full disclosure, Terry is a friend of mine
There are better websites to peruse if you are seeking out "personal relationships" on the web, but I will warn you now, your honesty is admirable, but admitting friendship with Terry won't help you any with picking up HOTT CHIX
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Old September 30, 2019, 16:11   #40
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I like my FN CHF barrels and Geissel triggers wrapped up in cheap PSA parts so I can run my mouth with equal efficacy whether a thread is favoring fat ass wanna-be mouth breathers or fat ass tactical operator mouth breathers. Got it covered.

Hey, while we have all the experts in the line how can I tell if my NC Star 25X is on frontwards or backwards? Most of my high quality optics come with an integral laser pointer so if I have a dot on my face I flip it around. This one doesnt have a laser.
In the deleted thread, most were not badmouthing the rifle in question, only the other comments that everyone who was important used this rifle and no one could build them better...

Well, I'm not sure about huey's comments because I didn't read them (hell, I'm old, and I thought that I might die before finishing them). Besides, my reading time is being taken up with Neil Gorsuch's A Republic, If You Can Keep It, Jeanine Pirro's Radicals, Resistance and Revenge: The Left's Plot To Remake America and Michelle Malkin's Open Borders Inc. : Who's Funding America's Destruction? at the moment...

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Old September 30, 2019, 16:12   #41
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There are better websites to peruse if you are seeking out "personal relationships" on the web, but I will warn you now, your honesty is admirable, but admitting friendship with Terry won't help you any with picking up HOTT CHIX
Bummer...

Now you tell me...

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Old September 30, 2019, 16:15   #42
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There are better websites to peruse if you are seeking out "personal relationships" on the web, but I will warn you now, your honesty is admirable, but admitting friendship with Terry won't help you any with picking up HOTT CHIX
True.

I am an extinguished looking opinionated old fvck , although I do have the Good Housekeeping seal of approval from Whatsername.



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Old September 30, 2019, 16:20   #43
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My best AR started out as a pretty basic AR rifle and then was modified to shoot 7.62x39. Barrel was replaced with a chrome line 16" barrel, new gas tube, and also added some lovely wood handguards. Later a ergo nomical pistol grip was added to replace the original, then a shortened buttstock too. Finally added a AK Receiver and bolty-thing and piston. Hands down the most awesome AR around.
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Old September 30, 2019, 16:54   #44
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My best AR started out as a pretty basic AR rifle and then was modified to shoot 7.62x39. Barrel was replaced with a chrome line 16" barrel, new gas tube, and also added some lovely wood handguards. Later a ergo nomical pistol grip was added to replace the original, then a shortened buttstock too. Finally added a AK Receiver and bolty-thing and piston. Hands down the most awesome AR around.
Gotta love those special ARs...



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Old September 30, 2019, 17:03   #45
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Originally Posted by ByronF View Post
I like my FN CHF barrels and Geissel triggers wrapped up in cheap PSA parts so I can run my mouth with equal efficacy whether a thread is favoring fat ass wanna-be mouth breathers or fat ass tactical operator mouth breathers. Got it covered.

Hey, while we have all the experts in the line how can I tell if my NC Star 25X is on frontwards or backwards? Most of my high quality optics come with an integral laser pointer so if I have a dot on my face I flip it around. This one doesnt have a laser.
Nice barrels, triggers, and bolts are probably all that matters. Wrapping them up in a sleeper rig is super cool IMO. My 7.3 turbo diesel E350 van is faster than most people guess...

Ha-ha on NC Star w or w/o laser. I don't think there's any other way to tell, so the joke's on you for buying one without the combo-laser-dealie.
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Old September 30, 2019, 17:05   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
My best AR started out as a pretty basic AR rifle and then was modified to shoot 7.62x39. Barrel was replaced with a chrome line 16" barrel, new gas tube, and also added some lovely wood handguards. Later a ergo nomical pistol grip was added to replace the original, then a shortened buttstock too. Finally added a AK Receiver and bolty-thing and piston. Hands down the most awesome AR around.
I bet that sonofabitch runs like a scalded dog.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 17:12   #47
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Second installment of THE BEST IN THE WORLD...

I buy bolts from JP Rifles. Don't need a special carrier, and I'm partial to the Colt M-16 carriers when they're on sale somewhere. Meanwhile, back when people were selling "MILSPEC" (brought to you by the lowest bidder) and then (later) Carpenter 158 bolts, JP was building bolts out of SAE 9310 and doing MPI testing and whatever else.

Everyone else had to change (in the 'upper end' part of the market) just to keep up, and that has probably had a positive effect on the quality of what was being offered out there.

They're $124/copy, and I don't know if they're worth it. But I'm sure (because I've been told...) it's THE BEST, so only suckers would spend any money on anything that wasn't my first choice.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 17:14   #48
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Hopefully George will come back around and talk about the bolts I bought from him when he was at LWRC - the ones where the lugs were cut in half and beveled and cool-looking.

I haven't used one yet, but they're in a special place in the "Spares" drawer so I can get them out and pet them once in a while. They're happy and all - I just got them out last week for a few minutes.

Those *might* have been THE BEST IN THE WORLD, but they're not available at this point.
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"How we burned in the prison camps later thinking: what would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests people had simply not sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, ham- mers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. . . . The Organs [police] would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers . . . and notwithstanding all of Stalin‘s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt." - A. Solzhenitsyn, Gulag Archipelago
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Old September 30, 2019, 17:15   #49
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Originally Posted by brunop View Post
Second installment of THE BEST IN THE WORLD...

I buy bolts from JP Rifles. Don't need a special carrier, and I'm partial to the Colt M-16 carriers when they're on sale somewhere. Meanwhile, back when people were selling "MILSPEC" (brought to you by the lowest bidder) and then (later) Carpenter 158 bolts, JP was building bolts out of SAE 9310 and doing MPI testing and whatever else.

Everyone else had to change (in the 'upper end' part of the market) just to keep up, and that has probably had a positive effect on the quality of what was being offered out there.

They're $124/copy, and I don't know if they're worth it. But I'm sure (because I've been told...) it's THE BEST, so only suckers would spend any money on anything that wasn't my first choice.
Well, you've convinced me.

Then again, I'm easy...

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Old September 30, 2019, 17:16   #50
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Originally Posted by Invictus77 View Post
You can shorten that sentence by just typing "Garand", but this is a thread about a thread about ARs
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