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-   -   I may never resize or trim another .308 case (https://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=446483)

W.E.G. October 31, 2019 13:44

I may never resize or trim another .308 case
 
https://www.theamericanmarksman.com/...s-1000-CT.html

16 cents per primed Lake City case.

I hope I didn't just piss-away $320

ArtBanks October 31, 2019 14:39

If it pans out, you can't beat that with a stick.

Keep us informed.

W.E.G. October 31, 2019 14:55

Supposed to arrive soon

I suspect its "pulled" brass.

If you look at the necks closely in the poor pics on the website, you can kind of see some swelling in the neck just above the junction of the shoulder and the neck - as though the bullet previously seated in the case didn't go as far down the neck as to extend below the neck.

Might need neck resizing. Although, I've pulled bullets in my own ammo, and re-used the "pulled" brass without any sort of neck-sizing. The ammo still functioned fine, and accuracy was normal.

Wondering too if the necks will have any sealing lacquer residue.

Expecting crimped primers - which is a plus from my perspective.

yellowhand October 31, 2019 15:45

Thats a damned good price.:bow:

ftierson October 31, 2019 16:24

The only concern I have is that I see no neck anneal on the four cases pictured, which makes me wonder...

Of course, who knows what the picture is really a picture of...

And original .mil crimped primers would be a plus for me too, but the ad is unclear about that too...

I wish you the best of luck, Gary.

Forrest

meltblown October 31, 2019 17:02

Never say never. Eventually they run out of the shit. Can't hurt to grab a couple of K to check it out. I have about 1k sized, trimmed and primed and another K sized and trimmed. At my rate of shooting the past year it would last me till I'm about 150 yrs old. And that's not counting the other 10K of factory and reloaded already gathering dust.

ArtBanks October 31, 2019 17:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by ftierson (Post 4802358)
The only concern I have is that I see no neck anneal on the four cases pictured, which makes me wonder...

Of course, who knows what the picture is really a picture of...

And original .mil crimped primers would be a plus for me too, but the ad is unclear about that too...

I wish you the best of luck, Gary.

Forrest


Wouldn't see anneal on most cases as they have been tumbled after annealing.

W.E.G. October 31, 2019 17:18

Iíve been doing a pretty good job of blowing through my flavors-of-the-world surplus.

Man, that neck sealer on the Greek surplus makes a mess of the throat.

Iím not too worried about annealing. That absence may be why the lot was demilled. I figure if I get even one PITA-Free firing, Iím ahead.

If I donít let people stomp on it on the concrete before I police it, it oughta have some worthwhile value as once-fired when Iím done with it.

W.E.G. October 31, 2019 17:21

They donít show quantity in stock on the product page.

Somewhere during checkout it popped up they had 20 or so packs of 1000 in stock - if thatís even reliable information.

This should tide me over for a good spell if it inspects OK

jjjxlr8 October 31, 2019 17:45

Thanks for the post! I just ordered some, too. Seems like a great deal.

ammolab October 31, 2019 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtBanks (Post 4802365)
Wouldn't see anneal on most cases as they have been tumbled after annealing.

Maybe the seller tumbled the cases but Lake City Military cases are not tumbled after annealing. Most military ammo is this way...It is left to be visible so no questions as to if it was done or not.

ArtBanks October 31, 2019 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by ammolab (Post 4802381)
Maybe the seller tumbled the cases but Lake City Military cases are not tumbled after annealing. Most military ammo is this way...It is left to be visible so no questions as to if it was done or not.

Rgr on military brass having visible annealing.
From the add.

"7.62x51 Primed Brass Cases - Brass has never been fired and is made from the same Lake City Brass that our Military uses."

Does not say that it is military brass.

boman October 31, 2019 18:56

Most likely pulldowns---from their website

American Marksman is a manufacturer and supplier of high-quality ammunition in the primary calibers of 9MM, .223, 5.56, 7.62, 300 Blackout and 50 Caliber. Our experts oversee the pull-down, manufacturing, sales and distribution of military and non-military grade ammunition. Along with producing ammunition, our team also sells projectiles, casings and smokeless powder to customers and businesses nationwide.

Outside of our pull-down operation of U.S. Military ammunition, we also do the following:

Advanced Research
Development of Technology Systems
Expanded Recycling

Since our launch in 2014, we have seen great growth over the years with the acquisition of two other companies. In 2017, American Marksman acquired Stryker Ammunition (Searcy, AR) and Bullets First Manufacturing (Phoenix, AZ). The acquisition of Stryker and Bullets First has added to our product offerings & enhanced speed of delivery.

Looking towards the future, American Marksman will continue improving production, which will allow for more quality ammunition to be made and even faster shipping to your door. In addition, we are continuously looking for ways in which we can help you, as the customer, save money!



Who We Partner With

We contract with Northrop Grumman to de-militarize ammunition that is made at the Lake City Army Ammunition Plant (LCAAP) in Independence, Missouri. Northrop Grummanís Small Caliber Systems is the largest manufacturer of small caliber ammunition for the U.S. Department of Defense.

During the last five years, Northrop Grumman has manufactured more than eight billion rounds of small-caliber ammunition for the U.S. Military and other customers. Typically, the ammunition acquired by American Marksman fails strict federal specifications. Reasons for the rounds failing to meet the federal specification can be caused by scratches, dings or other blemishes that donít affect accuracy or performance, however the military requires ammunition with practically zero flaws.

Steve

Sh3008 October 31, 2019 19:12

What does pull down mean? I just got ripped off on my 1000 rd of 308 from st auctions on gunbroker.

The listed it as ďmatchĒ LC 149 gr. It arrives and is obviously third party reloaded ammo. The scumbag seller then says in the fine print we are not responsible for Ammunition that does not load, eject, Fire, etc.

Any how they mentioned lake city pull down. What ever that means??

My credit card company refunded me my money but looking at this ammo itís un safe to shoot.

ammolab October 31, 2019 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtBanks (Post 4802391)
Rgr on military brass having visible annealing.
From the add.

"7.62x51 Primed Brass Cases - Brass has never been fired and is made from the same Lake City Brass that our Military uses."

Does not say that it is military brass.

Their nomenclature is a bit strange for someone in such a business. They list loaded ammunition as ďBulletsĒ and continue using that term throughout description of 7.62 NATO Match and ball cartridges for sale.

Tuscan Raider October 31, 2019 20:26

You will have quite a few with cracked necks.

Used to deal in pulled brass and quit selling because of that.

brunop October 31, 2019 20:51

^

Atta boy! I knew you were going to talk me out of this. :thumbsup:


Good luck to everyone else: still might be a deal if it's in good shape.

Sig220 October 31, 2019 21:13

I have bought primed brass from this group before and have been happy with it.

https://americanreloading.com/en/79-308-win-762-nato

I saw the price when I copied the link, but did not add it up for 1K pieces. Use the code "trick25" for a additional 25% off. That makes them about .21 each delivered.

I should clarify, the brass I bought was .223 that was marketed to convert to 300BO as it was described having creases/dents in the neck. Only about 50% had bad enough to only use as 300BO, the rest was got at least 1 firing as 223.

Going on a road trip Saturday to fetch 10K primers for less then .02 each, so I will be priming my own for a while. :rolleyes:

ftierson October 31, 2019 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtBanks (Post 4802365)
Wouldn't see anneal on most cases as they have been tumbled after annealing.

Not if they were .mil LC cases, which should show neck anneal...

But I guess that we'll see what they are... :)

Forrest

2barearms October 31, 2019 21:22

The price is right...they appear to be a large operation. Iíd check ARFCom for feedback.....ijs

ftierson October 31, 2019 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ftierson (Post 4802449)
Not if they were .mil LC cases, which should show neck anneal...

But I guess that we'll see what they are... :)

Whoops, I see that ammolab already beat me to it. That's what I get for responding before reading all the rest of the comments.

Sorry...

Forrest

boman October 31, 2019 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh3008 (Post 4802404)
What does pull down mean? I just got ripped off on my 1000 rd of 308 from st auctions on gunbroker.

The listed it as “match” LC 149 gr. It arrives and is obviously third party reloaded ammo. The scumbag seller then says in the fine print we are not responsible for Ammunition that does not load, eject, Fire, etc.

Any how they mentioned lake city pull down. What ever that means??

My credit card company refunded me my money but looking at this ammo it’s un safe to shoot.

"pulldown" refers to ammunition that has had the bullet pulled for whatwever reason. Components, brass, bullets, powder etc are often salvaged rather than scraped and resold.

Lake City is the largest small arms ammunition plant in North America, supplies our armed forces, and is owned by the govt. Private contractors run the place.
Steve

boman October 31, 2019 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by ammolab (Post 4802405)
Their nomenclature is a bit strange for someone in such a business. They list loaded ammunition as ďBulletsĒ and continue using that term throughout description of 7.62 NATO Match and ball cartridges for sale.

"Bullets First" is their reloading subsidiary. The brass Gary bought is most likely good to go, either an overrun of some sort or pull down. I've bought primed Lake City pull down from several sources and other than cleaning sealant from the necks and neck sizing its all been excellent. It's not available primed very often.

Steve

Sh3008 October 31, 2019 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by boman (Post 4802456)
"pulldown" refers to ammunition that has had the bullet pulled for whatwever reason. Components, brass, bullets, powder etc are often salvaged rather than scraped and resold.

Lake City is the largest small arms ammunition plant in North America, supplies our armed forces, and is owned by the govt. Private contractors run the place.
Steve

Thanks Steve!

gunshooter October 31, 2019 22:41

Thankyou boman for info!!

I am going to try a k of 7.62 primed cases.

From what I've gleaned here I should be able to take these cases and build a decent, accurate first load to fire form the cases.

These cases have gone through the mfg. process and are to size and ready to load.

I don't intend on hot barn burner loads, just accurate, precise target loads, minute of beer can at 200-300 yards.

:cool:

kotengu November 01, 2019 06:25

In for the reports!

imacoonass01 November 01, 2019 06:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunshooter (Post 4802480)
minute of beer can at 200-300 yards


:tongue: :cheers:

W.E.G. November 01, 2019 08:04

Supposed to arrive Monday.

Figures.

My wife's tele-work day.

Heavy Big-ass box of something-else-I-don't-need shows up on the porch.

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...eys/busted.gif

Sig220 November 01, 2019 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.G. (Post 4802523)
Supposed to arrive Monday.

Figures.

My wife's tele-work day.

Heavy Big-ass box of something-else-I-don't-need shows up on the porch.

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...eys/busted.gif


Hope it all works out for ya, Gary.

Both in getting good brass and still getting brass :facepalm:

I have a couple of packages showing up Monday as well.....I gave up trying to conceal them (think she uses a "sniffer" of some sort) as I think she gets advance notice. :sad: Her latest is to get a USPS app that shows pics of what is being delivered that day. :facepalm:

V guy November 03, 2019 12:27

WTF?
"Pull downs".........are exactly that, pulled down ammo, usually military. Such ammo is used in Firearms like M14's and other guns that use .308. Most is brass in color and has a military primer still crimped in the pocket. It is not loaded ammo, but brass hulls, ready for reloading, but if it has a primer, still requires ORMD.

ORMD------------do you know that that is? Not oral mouth detergent.

Where the F have you been?

W.E.G. November 03, 2019 12:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by V guy (Post 4803197)
WTF?
"Pull downs".........are exactly that, pulled down ammo, usually military. Such ammo is used in Firearms like M14's and other guns that use .308. Most is brass in color and has a military primer still crimped in the pocket. It is not loaded ammo, but brass hulls, ready for reloading, but if it has a primer, still requires ORMD.

ORMD------------do you know that that is? Not oral mouth detergent.

Where the F have you been?

:confused:

*checks box on kitchen counter to be sure meds have been taken*

ftierson November 03, 2019 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.G. (Post 4803202)
:confused:

*checks box on kitchen counter to be sure meds have been taken*

:)

Forrest

V guy November 03, 2019 13:03

Re post #14. Very very odd............ for a gun guy. Maybe he thought it was #2 bathroom related?

Sig220 November 03, 2019 18:28

Another way to never trim brass is to use Lapua brass. On my recent reloading run, I picked up some for .40 each.....not FAL food for sure! :rolleyes:

hueyville November 04, 2019 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh3008 (Post 4802404)
What does pull down mean? I just got ripped off on my 1000 rd of 308 from st auctions on gunbroker.

The listed it as ďmatchĒ LC 149 gr. It arrives and is obviously third party reloaded ammo. The scumbag seller then says in the fine print we are not responsible for Ammunition that does not load, eject, Fire, etc.

Any how they mentioned lake city pull down. What ever that means??

My credit card company refunded me my money but looking at this ammo itís un safe to shoot.

And how can you tell it's unsafe to shoot? Since your in it for free will buy it from you at a fair price and make it work one way or the other.

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 16:48

Looks good so far!

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...psttpesyqf.jpg

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...psxt3l9nk4.jpg

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...psqjnlz8he.jpg

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 16:49

Somebody else definitely got there before me :]

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...psaebg4uex.jpg

meltblown November 04, 2019 16:55

No crimp and a pull down. Now that's weird

ammolab November 04, 2019 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtBanks (Post 4802391)
Rgr on military brass having visible annealing.
From the add.

"7.62x51 Primed Brass Cases - Brass has never been fired and is made from the same Lake City Brass that our Military uses."

Does not say that it is military brass.

But yes, Lake City NATO military brass

boman November 04, 2019 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by meltblown (Post 4803590)
No crimp and a pull down. Now that's weird

Most likely M118LR pulldown. Same brass as m80 but w/o primer crimp.

Steve

meltblown November 04, 2019 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by boman (Post 4803605)
Most likely M118LR pulldown. Same brass as m80 but w/o primer crimp.

Steve

Ok. Those would get another load out of them without being a pita to swage. I've been shooting some LC brass I got that was resized and trimmed then I loaded about 4 years ago. 43.5 varget with Hornady 147s and the necks are splitting 90% of the time. No worries about picking up brass at the range.

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 18:05

You may note that one of the five cases has a nick on the neck.

May be shootable - especially if single-fed, or used for non-critical application (where no biggie if it chokes), but not to be reloaded.

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 18:06

Brass is annealed.

Not sure the pics show it very well.

meltblown November 04, 2019 18:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.G. (Post 4803610)
You may note that one of the five cases has a nick on the neck.

May be shootable - especially if single-fed, or used for non-critical application (where no biggie if it chokes), but not to be reloaded.

A whimpy AR may not eat it, but bet you an FAL wouldn't notice. I saw it.

Sh3008 November 04, 2019 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by hueyville (Post 4803460)
And how can you tell it's unsafe to shoot? Since your in it for free will buy it from you at a fair price and make it work one way or the other.

Because they aren’t all crimped tight and some rounds are seated to far down in the case neck.

Last time I checked Wikipedia I think they said that’s not good right?

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 18:40

Arrived in two boxes.

Weight each box: 26 pounds (free shipping on $300+ order)

Repackaged both boxes just so into three ammo cans.

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...psmxif8wlh.jpg

W.E.G. November 04, 2019 18:42

All cases have some sticky sealer on the case mouths.

Ball powder stuck to sealer.

Inside of cases is bright and shiny.

There will be a few culls (looks like less than 5%)

This one stood out while I was emptying the boxes into cans.

https://i227.photobucket.com/albums/...pstcujc2ru.jpg

Blackmore November 04, 2019 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sig220 (Post 4802605)
Her latest is to get a USPS app that shows pics of what is being delivered that day. :facepalm:

That would be Informed Delivery, aka Informant Delivery. :D:

Sig220 November 04, 2019 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by meltblown (Post 4803609)
Ok. Those would get another load out of them without being a pita to swage. I've been shooting some LC brass I got that was resized and trimmed then I loaded about 4 years ago. 43.5 varget with Hornady 147s and the necks are splitting 90% of the time. No worries about picking up brass at the range.

Sounds like you got some well used brass!

The last LC brass I got was picked up off the range after the USCG guys shot it through their Mag58's or whatever they are called now. Still have quite a bit I have not even resized yet. The ones I have resized and shot are holding up well after at least 2 more firings.

Sig220 November 04, 2019 19:03

WEG, have you checked the neck size/tension yet? Other then that, looks like you got some good brass!


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