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-   -   Anesthetic (https://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198104)

miles1111 March 27, 2007 02:00

Anesthetic
 
Would anyone know of a effective anesthetic that is readily available over the internet ?
Cheers
Miles

jerrymrc March 27, 2007 08:14

General, Local or topical?

miles1111 March 27, 2007 20:30

local

AndyC March 28, 2007 11:43

One of my family-members is an anaesthesiologist - I'll ask him tonight and report back.

renaissance_warrior March 28, 2007 22:02

An oral in my stash is Laphroiag. Tastes like iodine first sip, that should be ok for a local to get rid of germs at least. :wink: Cells outside the body get drunk too, don't they? :shades:

Mark

Edgsmth March 28, 2007 22:41

Quote:

Originally posted by renaissance_warrior
An oral in my stash is Laphroiag. Tastes like iodine first sip, that should be ok for a local to get rid of germs at least. :wink: Cells outside the body get drunk too, don't they? :shades:

Mark

An oral anesthetic would be benzocaine, cocaine or novacaine (Lidocaine). Anesthetics numb nerves, eliminating or reducing pain during procedures such as suturing.
Cocaine was also used for repairing broken noses etc.

An antiseptic kills germs. Betadine is excellent as long as it has time to dry.

Most injectable anesthetics are regulated.

Lidocaine, in 1% or 2% concentrations is an acceptable injectable local anesthetic but can cause problems in cases of sensitivity or over use as it is also a cardiac drug. It is also available mixed with epinephrine for use in suturing (for example) of more vascular areas. Epi constricts the blood vessels and, incidentally, is also a cardiac drug. In doing so it reduces blood loss when used in minor procedures.

Either should be used with caution, both from a standpoint of sensitivity, that of cardiac implications and that of precautions against blood borne pathogens. Neither is readily available. There may be a form of Lido available from a veterinary supply house without prescription. One can obtain some antibiotics from veterinary supply houses without prescription. Tetracycline comes to mind.

Probably, if absolutely necessary, a general in the form of a fifth of bourbon or maybe ether (starting fluid) properly administered would serve you better.

shogan March 28, 2007 22:58

Veterinarian meds! Mail order. Hopefully you know how to use parental anesthetics and when.

Shannon

Edgsmth March 28, 2007 23:04

Quote:

Originally posted by shogan
Veterinarian meds! Mail order. Hopefully you know how to use parental anesthetics and when.

Shannon

Now we're getting into a whole other thing. Besides the how and when you need to understand life support and be ready to continue that for hours after your procedure is over. This topic was about locals.

Hint: The welding supply houses sell you pretty much the same oxygen as the hospitals use.

But now we're talking cholecystectomies and beyond.

Don't figure on transplanting any organs, especially brains.

miles1111 March 29, 2007 05:21

"eliminating or reducing pain during procedures such as suturing"

The above is what I am trying to achieve. I have built up a good medical kit, but its the "local anesthetic" for the above proceedures that I am trying to obtain.
This is only for use when no hospitals are available.
I am thinking that maybe some strong "drink" is safer than guessing. I had hoped for some kind of externally applied ..maybe sprayed..magic pain block.....

Rik March 29, 2007 09:09

Quote:

Originally posted by renaissance_warrior
An oral in my stash is Laphroiag. Tastes like iodine first sip, that should be ok for a local to get rid of germs at least. :wink: Cells outside the body get drunk too, don't they? :shades:
liking the Islays eh? :biggrin:

W.E.G. March 29, 2007 09:13

All the effective local anesthetics are DEA regulated items.

You do NOT want to get caught with any such thing if you do not have a DEA license.

You won't find those items on the FAL Files.

Keep good friends with your M.D.

AndyC March 29, 2007 09:48

Quote:

Originally posted by AndyC
One of my family-members is an anaesthesiologist - I'll ask him tonight and report back.
Sorry, he was working last night, so haven't got a hold of him yet - I'll try again later today once he's woken-up.

Beepy March 29, 2007 12:53

If you use xylocaine (lidocaine) with epi, remember -- No toes, nose, fingers, or weiners......

W.E.G. March 29, 2007 13:25

Get epi in any of the above, and you will be missing said appendage forthwith.

Muggzy March 29, 2007 14:28

OK.....what is epi?

ya gonna make go look it up?

armed1 March 29, 2007 15:10

Most anesthetics are DEA regulated and cannot be obtained or used by lay persons. I would strongly advise against it anyway as they can be dangerous and even deadly if misused.

Local anesthetics that can be obtained over the counter are topically applied, usually to the teeth, gums, and throat. Things like orajel work very well for gums and teeth. Also, I believe clove oil may be available over the counter and makes a good temporary dental packing.

If you are sick or injured, DO NOT TRY TO PRACTICE MEDICINE AT HOME. SEEK PROFESSIONAL HELP OR ADVICE. PAIN IS AN INDICATION THAT SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH YOU AND NEEDS ATTENTION.

armed1, M.D.

Deltaten March 29, 2007 18:29

I've always been partial to Lydocaine ;) ; but in a pinch....
How's about oil of clove? Works pretty well in tooth ache juice!

Alcohol as the vehicle and a few drops(?) of clove oil. UNless you're doing (against all better judgement and medical advice!) internal, vascular or inter-muscular surgery; It oughta work for topical, surface dermal sutures. Better yet..just cowboy up and do the deed!:)
I've done 'em on meownself when needed ; but I prefer sugi-strips and butterflys...less chance of complications

ANy recommendations against that one, armed1? Complications arising from the oil or the (?) active ingredients/chems in same?

Best,
paul

miles1111 March 29, 2007 18:42

I'm talking survival scenarios here...
Currently, I just drive to the doctors or the hospital, what I am talking about is a requirement if there are no medical facilities. what you call a shtf environment. At this time I would care less what is legal, but what is necessary for survival. !

Deltaten March 29, 2007 19:19

That goes understood, miles :)

If it's THAT bad that I gotta worry about sutures/other than superficial; I'd be mo worried about dieing from blood loss, losing a limb or peritonitis!
If yer able to effect repairs in *those* scenarios; yer better off hiring out as a surgeon than a gunslinger;)

AFA battle field wounds...slap a Carlyle bandage on it and holler "Corpsman!" Barring that; you're SOL :(
If it's run-of-the-mill Bug-out boo-boos; deal w/it from yer FA case. ANything that needs serious home-surgury is best left for the Medicos or SF-Med-trained Troopies!

Best,
Paul

Sig220 March 29, 2007 20:09

I have sutured a cut before, took three stiches. The reason I sutured it was that it was pretty deep. My topical anesthetic was ice. Might not be available in a SHTF scenerio, but I had it and made it work.

Now, why did I suture instead of go to ER or armed1?? I wanted the experience os stiching up a real wound, and I was the only volunteer!!

I had the site checked later by an ER Doc I knew, he suggested I add another overhand knot to my routine and called it a pretty damn good job! It healed great, and the Doc donated some extra suture kits to my stash!!

I could tell you some storys of very a lightly trained "Doc" having to perform emergency procedures in some bad conditions during the Bosnian war, but we will save them for another time.

W.E.G. March 29, 2007 20:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Muggzy
OK.....what is epi?

ya gonna make go look it up?

"Epi" is ephinephrine - a.k.a. adrenaline.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epinephrine

Its the stuff that is found in "epi" pens that people with allergies carry.

Whatever you do, do NOT get stabbed in the finger by an epi-pen.

Epi is a hard-core vasoconstrictor, and a shot to the finger from an epi-pen will cause every blood vessel in the finger to completely say fugk-it. You will probably lose that finger.

Medics carry epi in a more dilute solution to give to patients who may be in need of emergency vasoconstriction.

You don't want to mess with pharmaceutical epi unless you have serious training.

Edgsmth March 29, 2007 20:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Muggzy
OK.....what is epi?

ya gonna make go look it up?

Epi is epinephrine, and is a vasoconstrictor that is mixed with Lido to force the blood out of tissue that is being worked on to prevent blood loss and facilitate the procedure by preventing blood pooling where the work is being done. It is always clearly marked on vials containing it. It is often used in dental procedures as well as minor bedside surgery like debridement of pressure ulcers. Interesting to watch it work, inject a small amount into the flesh and it turns pale in a matter of minutes, indicating the evacuation of nearly all the blood in that area.

References above about using it on small appendages is something I have never heard nd will ask a doc or two about it tomorrow. Such tissue will survive about 8 hours without a blood supply, even after accidental amputation in the case of fingers and even weenies. Just ask John Bobbet. Ice is recommended in this case.

Lidocaine and Epi used to be used to treat severe cardiac arrythmias. Ever see the cardiac needle scene in Pulp Fiction? That would be Epi, injected directly into the heart to jump start it. That scene was completely bogus as Uma reacted to the injection like she was given a narcotic antagonnist and not a cardiac drug. She still would have been obtunded by the heroin.

Lido was used in cases where the heart was acting irritably, like cases of ventricular tachycardia. It numbed the heart's pacemakers and slowed the rate, if the code team (and patient) was lucky.

Interestingly there was a case where a young boy in his early teens was killed on an operating table because the two drugs were accidently mistaken for one another. They are antagonists in a cardiac sense, each doing the opposite of the other. IIRC, either the boy started to brady down and was given Lido under the understanding that it was Epi or he became tachy and was given Epi under the assumption that it was Lido.

In the case of field suturing and given a healthy patient, not enough Lido would be injected to cause cardiac problems. Then come sensitivities which alter the potential for serious problems.

You used to be able to buy (~45cc) bottles) of 15% benzocaine (Liquid Oragel). Maybe you still can. This pooled in a deep cut would probably anesthetize the area if given about 10 minutes or perhaps more. It is mostly alcohol and the cure may be worse than the injury at first but suturing is a prolonged process. This sort of use would minimize any systemic dispersement of the drug and, although it is clearly labelled "Not for internal use" should not cause any tissue death and probably can be considered sterile due to the alcohol content.

Given the intent of your original post I think that this may be your best option. It should not be interpreted as any form of medically acceptable advice but more along the lines of "last ditch" option. Personally, if I had a ten inch gash on my arm and was getting tired at around the 20th suture I might try it.

I have also had excellent results closing some wounds with super glue. Bear in mind that super glues are "Cyanoacrylics" with emphasis on the "Cyano.." as it is a cyanide derivitave. I do not believe there is any appreciable systemic uptake of cyanide when so used but that is only from my own experience.

Again, my first option would be large enough quantities of alcohol barring substantial blood loss or significant comorbidities to grossly obtund myself or my patient.

Another thing that hasn't been brought up is street narcotics. That is all I will say on that subject except that these can be deadly as well.

Edgsmth March 29, 2007 20:59

Quote:

Originally posted by W.E.G.


"Epi" is ephinephrine - a.k.a. adrenaline.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epinephrine

Its the stuff that is found in "epi" pens that people with allergies carry.

Whatever you do, do NOT get stabbed in the finger by an epi-pen.

Epi is a hard-core vasoconstrictor, and a shot to the finger from an epi-pen will cause every blood vessel in the finger to completely say fugk-it. You will probably lose that finger.

Medics carry epi in a more dilute solution to give to patients who may be in need of emergency vasoconstriction.

You don't want to mess with pharmaceutical epi unless you have serious training.

+1 You really don't want to mess with any of this.

W.E.G. March 29, 2007 21:55

Quote:

Originally posted by Edgsmth

Another thing that hasn't been brought up is street narcotics. That is all I will say on that subject except that these can be deadly as well.

Ergh.

If you don't know what its cut with... hello vascular embolism.

Edgsmth March 29, 2007 21:58

Microemboli? BTDT w/ some dedicated IV users at the end. That's what happens when you use a hunk of wonderbread or dryer lint as a 2 micron filter.

Edgsmth March 29, 2007 22:01

Quote:

Originally posted by W.E.G.


Ergh.

If you don't know what its cut with... hello vascular embolism.

Just like ammo, we all should have stocked up during the China White days. Only thing that would kill you about that stuff was the purity.

Rick March 30, 2007 08:32

Back in organic chem lab we worked with ether - anhydrous di-ethyl ether, pharmacutical grade. I'd be very reluctant to use it. Too easy to put the person under for good and it's highly flamable. Ether boils at 98F. You can pour it on a bench top and watch it evaporate. A small spark and kaboom.

As a side note, organic chem lab was a dangerous place. Many VERY toxic chemicals and volatile ones (like ether). Many students have died in chem labs cause they just didn't realize how dangerous some stuff is.

Howling Fury March 30, 2007 10:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Rick
As a side note, organic chem lab was a dangerous place. Many VERY toxic chemicals and volatile ones (like ether). Many students have died in chem labs cause they just didn't realize how dangerous some stuff is.
Can you elaborate on "many students have died"? Sure there are accidents, but death? I've heard the rare and unique case. Most anyone that's been in chem lab has heard about "Johnny" and his misadventures with H2SO4 and that's fiction...

I beg to differ that a chem lab is a dangerous place (though probably not your overall intention to say; first sentence), it's dangerous when people don't think or know what they are doing, or are supervised by someone who doesn't. No you don't heat volatile liquids with a bunsen burner (use an IR lamp), fume hoods are good, gloves don't do anything when you stick your gloved fingers in a mouth, eye, nose, etc (see that one often :rofl: ) ...


On the subject of superglue for "closing wounds"... I've never done it. Don't plan or hope to. But does the superglue irritate things or no? I ask as I was using superglue (Meijer brand) in the proper manner, and my eyes started watering uncontrollably and my nose running. Never had that before. Just a guess, but I wonder if they now put irritants into it so you don't sniff it (and I had an overabundance of irritant in mine)???

CR1198 March 30, 2007 14:45

Quote:

Originally posted by Howling Fury



On the subject of superglue for "closing wounds"... I've never done it. Don't plan or hope to. But does the superglue irritate things or no? I ask as I was using superglue (Meijer brand) in the proper manner, and my eyes started watering uncontrollably and my nose running. Never had that before. Just a guess, but I wonder if they now put irritants into it so you don't sniff it (and I had an overabundance of irritant in mine)???
I've used super glue on fairly deep paper cuts. I have some in the medical kit.

This was on the Krazy Glue site, in the FAQ's:



"Cyanoacrylate proved valuable to military surgeons during the Vietnam War. Under battlefield conditions, they could use the material to close wounds and stop bleeding. Today, specific formulations of cyanoacrylate have been developed for medical use. Instant Krazy GlueŽ products should not be used for wound care."


http://www.lifepassages.net/SuperGlue.html
Apparently it's used by midwives.


From Wikipedia:
Quote:

The original Eastman formula was not FDA approved for medical use, however, because of a tendency to cause skin irritation and to generate heat. In 1998 the FDA approved 2-octyl cyanoacrylate for use in closing wounds and surgical incisions. Closure Medical have developed medical cyanoacrylates such as Dermabond, Soothe-N-Seal and Band-Aid Liquid Adhesive Bandage.
I've used the Band-Aid Liquid Adhesive Bandage with some success.

olsarg March 31, 2007 18:20

a while ago patched a ladies ripped nipple with butterfly tape and super glue healed perfect. use super glue a lot for cold weather splits. guess I've been lucky so far. But I do lousy stitchs. Been using butterflys for years. If its too bad for butterflys you need a doctor.

W.E.G. March 31, 2007 18:49

Quote:

Originally posted by olsarg
a while ago patched a ladies ripped nipple...
I can only say :eek:

ThePitbullofLove March 31, 2007 20:07

Quote:

Originally posted by olsarg
a while ago patched a ladies ripped nipple with butterfly tape and super glue healed perfect. use super glue a lot for cold weather splits. guess I've been lucky so far. But I do lousy stitchs. Been using butterflys for years. If its too bad for butterflys you need a doctor.
This clearly needs some backstory....:uhoh:

olsarg March 31, 2007 20:19

Doing rapid exit and caught her nipple ring.

Beepy April 01, 2007 00:38

Quote:

Lidocaine and Epi used to be used to treat severe cardiac arrythmias
UHHHH, they still ARE. Use them on my crash cart regularly, or irregularly -- which ever way you look at it...

CR1198 April 01, 2007 14:14

Quote:

Originally posted by olsarg
Doing rapid exit and caught her nipple ring.
Ouch!! And I thought my paper cut hurt. :redface:

lowr8 April 01, 2007 23:44

Quote:

Originally posted by olsarg
Doing rapid exit and caught her nipple ring.
rapid exit of what?

there is more to this...

mrrk1562 April 12, 2007 23:39

in may of 06 i had to go to to er ..as i needed 8 stiches on my pepee....right where the reg skin ends and the membrian skin begines ..lydicaine was used ..and this marines luck would have it i was sown up by a an ol navy doc ....works fine ..the best bart was when i went to family doc .. he had a young female intern remove the stiches..and she had to ask all the prerec qustions ..like does it still work ..she was asking me as her face was about 3 inches away from my member.....note dont drinl and ride an atv with a wal-wart gun rack on the front rack ..it was a good thing a medic on the local squad was there with us that day and it was just skin that was damaged ..just missed all the big blood vessals ....but cabelas sells a nice body staple kit and coag as well ..its a good buy for about $40 for both ..now as iv worked in machine shops super glue works pretty good for fingers and things along with a rather judiguse amount of tape ..now i just saw for sale in my local pharmacy real strie-strips ..but i like useing super glue because it helps keep dirt out of cut real good ..when i worked as a prep cook at william patterson army hospital on ft monmouth as summer help ...small cuts where treated with lemone or lime juise ..but ill say the best would the body staples ..each one is just a click and if you have no pain killer a fast klick is better then tring to put a sowing needle and thru 2 side of flesh..fast and easy ..that and a few maxi pads and an ace bandage go real far

Sentient April 14, 2007 23:24

Quote:

PAIN IS AN INDICATION THAT SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH YOU AND NEEDS ATTENTION.

armed1, M.D.
Pain can also be an indicator for being married.

Sentinelofold May 02, 2007 23:41

Am i the only one here that knows that Super Glue was designed by the military as a non-toxic automatic field suture? I have used this method several times and ALWAYS had a decent outcome. Sure if your not careful you might glue a part of your body to another part but aside from that is pretty safe and with time will fall off/go away on its own. i had a cut on a finger that went into a nerve and to the bone and used the Super Glue to suture it and found it worked well and i did not need an anesthetic or needles or thread err stitching material and was quick and easy. Simply close wounded area , apply Super Glue to dry skin let bond and leave a small corner open for which it can breath and seep out. Also i might add that it wont really heal like stitches seem to (small lump up on skin for a few years where it unevenly healed for me) but then again we are talking SHTF right???

Robert

J308 May 02, 2007 23:56

Once on a solo camping trip I cut a finger real good while cleaning a fish. Didn't feel like packing out early so looked around my stuff and didn't find any crazy glue. so I broke the barb off the smallest fishhook I had, tied a length of light leader to it, and gave myelf a couple stitches. Wished I'd had some crazyglue. Now it's in all my 1st aid kits. For SHTF anything that'll get the area damn good and cold will help cut the pain down.

thatmguy May 04, 2007 20:04

Go read up on local anaesthetics.

There are two classes, amides, and esters.

The ester based gorup more often causes allergic or anaphaylactic reactions.

Xylocaine/lidocaine is an amide group, and sees a very small percentage of negative/fatal reactions.

I have an ester-based hypersensitivity, and almost ought the farm using an OTC throat losenge containing benzocaine.

If you are looking into something to stock, go with lidocaine and products containing it.

Andy the Aussie May 04, 2007 21:20

Re: Anesthetic
 
Quote:

Originally posted by miles1111
Would anyone know of a effective anesthetic that is readily available over the internet ?
Cheers
Miles

.....Bundaburg OP Rum......Killer White Bear....;)

armed1 May 05, 2007 01:06

I guess the answer to your question is no, there aren't any effective anesthetics available over the counter except topicals. Even if you gain access to real anesthetics, I strongly advise that you do not attempt to practice medicine on your own. Anesthesiology is a highly complex medical specialty that requires years of specific training in physiology and pharmacology, as well as airway management and intensive care. DO not use ether or chloroform as they are highly potent and highly explosive. Anesthetics suppress protective reflexes such as coughing. They cause muscle relaxation including airway muscles and can lead to asphyxiaxion. They suppress the heart and cause vasodilation leading to low blood pressure and possible heart attack and stroke if used improperly.

DO NOT DO THIS ON YOUR OWN. YOU WILL DIE OR KILL SOMEONE ELSE.

This is not a time for WECSOA (Wile E Coyote shool of anesthesia).

Find a professional or bite a bullet.

GreyMan May 08, 2007 10:14

I went overseas to Honduras as a medical volunteer. One of the docs along on the trip was an anesthesiologist. He used a lot of Ketamine for patient anesthesia. Can be given IM or IV, spares the airway and respiratory drive. Side effect is bad nightmares. Of course, Ketamine will get a guy without a Rx a long time in the slammer, but it's nice to know, in a "Jericho" sort of way.

If you are interested in this subject -NOT that I am suggesting you can learn how to be an anesthesiologist from a book. You can't- one of the best texts I have found is "Primary Anaesthesia" by Maurice King. Dr. King worked in third world settings for most of his life, and the book was written for people responsible for anesthesia whose primary language was not English, so it's written simply. Also, the provision is made for people who are from third world countries with shall we say, less than complete medical educations.

Lots of info about nerve blocks in the book as well, so you can numb the entire leg below the knee in one or two injections, for instance, rather than trying local infiltration anesthesia for a wound. Anyway, the book is kind of old, being written in the mid-70's IIRC, and published in Great Britain, so it can be a bit hard to find.

Anyway, sorry this went off on a tangent, but I hope it was helpful to someone.

Stay Safe,
AGreyMan

mosbysmen May 08, 2007 12:22

i think we will stick this one on top for a while ...

i tried to stich my self up one time ,could not do it .
i could do it to someone else but not me , of course i had acess to medical care at the time , if i knew i had no other choice i could probally do it..

i think everyone agees that if there is medical care available use that .
this is for , there is no medical help available ,medicate yourself or take the pain.

Azrial May 10, 2007 15:36

Quote:

Originally posted by miles1111
I'm talking survival scenarios here... Currently, I just drive to the doctors or the hospital, what I am talking about is a requirement if there are no medical facilities. what you call a shtf environment. ....
Well one would hope that you were not just trying to save money on health care!
Quote:

Originally posted by mosbysmen
....i tried to stich my self up one time ,could not do it .
i could do it to someone else but not me , of course i had acess to medical care at the time , if i knew i had no other choice i could probally do it....

I have had to stitch myself up twice while abroad. I still have the colorful scars to prove it. It is not fun and I would have preferred to the leave the work to a pro. But it sure beats bleeding to death or losing a HUGE skin flap. I can do anything that has to be done, I would think that most could if faced with no alternative.

Now ask me about doing your own filling!

doc390 May 29, 2007 07:25

Wound adhesive
 
The use of "crazy glue" is highly under-rated. I use it regularly in the ED. As long as the area being repaired isn't under too much skin tension, & bleeding's controlled, it'll do for most minor wounds. Consider that some orthopods are using it for skin closure after a total knee replacement..... much skin tension there.

Dermabond was the original & is the best (a 3M product). My hospital's now using "Indermil" - medicalese for "crap" (IMHO). No better than the 6 tubes / $2 package of universal grazy-glue that you can buy at Wally-World.

Wounds to be closed w/ adhesive usually don't need local anesthetic, first (unless extensive debridement or trimming needed).

Clean w/ antiseptic first. If using hydrogen peroxide (H2O2 - dirt cheap, & stores well), remember that it "eats" blood (disolves clots too), & will start bleeding all over again. If using antiseptic-based soap or surgical scrub, you have to get the soap out completely or you won't get a good closure. The wound may open up before it's healed.

If the wound's only mildly/moderately contaminated, flush liberally w/ "bug juice" (sterile/sterilized water/saline w/ a dash of betadine. Jet irrigation is better (squirting it out under pressure from a big syringe) - gets rid of more debris. If the wound's badly contaminated, after cleaning & irrigation, it may be better to do loose closure only, or just let it heal from the inside out.

Wound margins have to be reasonably clean to get a good cosmetic result. That means ragged edges should be trimmed back a little so that there's good blood supply to the margins.

Blot the wound as dry as possible immediately before using the glue. Apply the glue sparingly into the wound. Hold the edges together gently until the glue dries (15-30 sec.). Beware coming in contact with the runnoff glue while you're holding the wound together..... you may have to go home w/ your patient. It will wipe off easily w/ a gauze pad of any kind as long as the glue's still wet.

Whenever possible, I always apply Steri-Strips after the glue dries. They're better than butterfly's..... it's basically medical-grade, fiberglass-reinforced, strapping tape (light & flexible, but won't stretch).

While healing, don't use peroxide or ointment-du-jour.... they may cause the wound to open before healing is complete.

Here's a good resource from Ethicon on wound closure...

http://www.jnjgateway.com/public/NLD...re_Manual1.pdf


************
One parting thought..... another possible unintended use......
In a SHTF scenario, if one didn't have rope, duct tape, or zip-ties, I imagine grazy-glue would suffice as a makeshift replacement for handcuff's. About the same price as a bullet. Not the kind of thing to test before-hand, though

TXscout October 16, 2007 00:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Howling Fury


On the subject of superglue for "closing wounds"... I've never done it. Don't plan or hope to. But does the superglue irritate things or no? I ask as I was using superglue (Meijer brand) in the proper manner, and my eyes started watering uncontrollably and my nose running. Never had that before. Just a guess, but I wonder if they now put irritants into it so you don't sniff it (and I had an overabundance of irritant in mine)???

The cyanoacrilate vapors themselves irritate eyes and mucous membranes. You might have a sensitivity/allergy to them as well

piperpilot1 October 28, 2007 02:16

I'm posting this just for "general information". I'm not recommending you do this. I've thought about doing it, but haven't ... yet. So I also can't recommend the sellers on the website I'm going to tell you about.

Having said all of that ... I recently bought a suturing kit on Ebay to put in my medical supplies. Could I suture myself in a SHTF situation? No. Could I suture someone else? Sure, if their screaming in pain from the suturing without anesthetic didn't hurt my ears too bad.

Anyway, with the suture kit was a simple instruction sheet describing basic suture proceedures. There was also information on buying lidocaine over the Internet, and a website address. I checked out the website, and while it isn't cheap, they sell powdered lidocaine, which apparently would be mixed with sterile water to form an injectible solution. According to the website itself, this is legal, under these conditions, which I will quote verbatim ... "Lidocaine furnished by Midcoastal are not to be used for manufacturing end products or drugs for public use or consumption, end, or illegal purposes."

Okay ... I'm no lawyer, but that brief quote (if legally accurate and true) tells me that you can buy the stuff, but not use it on people. Hmmm ... so buying and storing the lidocaine in your BOB medical supplies would be okay, but if you had to use the lidocaine in an emergency ... and I'm talking about a real live SHTF no doctors anywhere, in the eye of a hurricane, surrounded by forest fires and armed insurgents sort of emergency ... and I had a huge gash that HAD to be sutured ... I think my train of thought concerning "public use or consumption" at that time would be ... fine, arrest me later, just sew me up now.

So, for what it's worth, and with all of the disclaimers I mentioned above, here's the website address for the company - www.midcoastal-environmental.com

For what it's worth.

cpd109 November 03, 2007 15:11

I used ice once to reduce pain when cutting something off me. I had been drinking too, and I'm sure that helped. Anyway, the area bled a bit that evening, mended over a few days and everything is fine now. I suppose you need to use ice that went through a water filter....
Pretty tough to do something to yourself that you know is going to hurt. Don't forget the the guy who cut off his arm (I think) when it was trapped in a car accident. That is a real man.


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