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View Full Version : I need help guys!! Any FFL holders read plz....


Ak_guy
August 24, 2002, 22:28
I sold a extra PC and have a very little bit of $$ to put twoard a MPA30 (mac11 that takes 9mm Sten mags :D) Wife even ok'd it !

This is a gun I can afford and mags are only $3-$4 each!!

Anyhow I have VERY little $$ to put twoard it so the better I can get twoard the Wholesale price of $230 the better it will be for me!

I want the side-cocking one with rail and threaded barrel. I have no idea IF a Post ban CAN have a threaded barrel so if it can't I'll go with side-cocking and non-threaded barrel. Like I said Wholesale is $230 and I have a local guy to take delivery (FFL) that only asks for $15

Any help on this is GREATLY appreciated!
Please help me out on this guys... shadow@vci.net

usmc326
August 25, 2002, 00:07
So what's the problem? Give your FFL the money, or get a postal money order for the wholesale cost + shipping, and have your FFL dealer order it for you(he has to send a signed copy of his FFL to RPB).

I'd also recommend buying one of those document size Priority Mail envelopes, with stamp & delivery confirmation, to give to him, along with a copy of the ad or a printout of RPB's MPA page & mail/contact
info. And give him a daytime number you can be reached at.

Ak_guy
August 25, 2002, 15:24
Originally posted by usmc326
So what's the problem? Give your FFL the money, or get a postal money order for the wholesale cost + shipping, and have your FFL dealer order it for you(he has to send a signed copy of his FFL to RPB).

I'd also recommend buying one of those document size Priority Mail envelopes, with stamp & delivery confirmation, to give to him, along with a copy of the ad or a printout of RPB's MPA page & mail/contact
info. And give him a daytime number you can be reached at.

Well the local place is known for a high markup. BUT they only do a transfer at $15 a pop. I figured I'd find a member of the board with a FFL, get a good deal on the gun, have the local guy do it for $15 and STILL come out ahead...

Mark at CGA
August 25, 2002, 17:47
AK guy, I'm not understanding your concern I guess. If your local FFL charges $15.00 for transfers... do as usmc326 says and prepay the FFL or send MO to suppier. When the FFL gets the firearm, he calls you... does 4473... collects any unpaid shipping charges or sales tax (if applicable)...and the $15.00 for the transfer.
What am I missing??

good luck, c u, Mark

doubletap
August 25, 2002, 19:07
AK-Guy It looks from the ad that RPB is wholesaling these pistols themselves. An dealer that wants to purchase one is gonna pay the $230, so your local FFL doing the transfer is gonna pay the $230, plus shipping, plus the $15 fee. Don't think you'll find a better deal except maybe lower transfer fees.

Do us a favor and post a review when you wring it out please. It is a very appealing little pistol.

Ricketts
August 25, 2002, 19:31
Sounds to me like he even wants the transfer to be free. Me thinks you are asking a bit too much, especially since you are spending a whole $230.

Pay the guy.

Ak_guy
August 25, 2002, 23:17
Originally posted by Ricketts
Sounds to me like he even wants the transfer to be free. Me thinks you are asking a bit too much, especially since you are spending a whole $230.

Pay the guy.

Nope..not even close. :)

What I didn't know was how difficult it was to get a local guy to call a place he has never dealt with, get the gun at a wholesale price, and then not MARK it up to me ... :) See my concern? :(
Since he marks everything else up what would stop him from adding a chunk to what I want?...maybe I'm being paranoid but I know for a certainty that if one of the ffl guys on here were to order it he wouldn't tack on a large mark-up that my local guy might do.

Am I paranoid or cautious?

idsubgun
August 25, 2002, 23:39
I'll order one for you. That will be $500 and I'll pay the shipping.:uhoh:

Listen, the FFL didn't go into business to GIVE away merchandise. If you want this guy to be around in a couple years, pay him a mark up on the piece.

If I order the pistol for you, I'm going to charge you the shipping to me, as well as the pistol, plus a few bucks to make it worth my time. Then you will pay the shipping charges to your FFL and his transfer fee. How much do you think you are saving? These shipping fees will be overnight, by the way, because it's a pistol.

Actually, it's fairly easy to get the price in SGN that RPB (or whoever) advertises, put up with the .gov BS and get your own FFL. Sorry to be so cold, but as an FFL, I'm tired of hearing about how much something is in SGN and why a nonlicensee can't get those prices.

Ak_guy
August 25, 2002, 23:57
Originally posted by idsubgun
I'll order one for you. That will be $500 and I'll pay the shipping.:uhoh:

Listen, the FFL didn't go into business to GIVE away merchandise. If you want this guy to be around in a couple years, pay him a mark up on the piece.

If I order the pistol for you, I'm going to charge you the shipping to me, as well as the pistol, plus a few bucks to make it worth my time. Then you will pay the shipping charges to your FFL and his transfer fee. How much do you think you are saving? These shipping fees will be overnight, by the way, because it's a pistol.

Actually, it's fairly easy to get the price in SGN that RPB (or whoever) advertises, put up with the .gov BS and get your own FFL. Sorry to be so cold, but as an FFL, I'm tired of hearing about how much something is in SGN and why a nonlicensee can't get those prices.



Seems like I hit a sore spot. Not trying to be a cheapskate. This guy has plenty of business (despite the pricing) and I make about 1 gun purchase a year so my patronage isn't gonna keep him going. :) Reason I even was asking was that he is the only FFL local and he is more of a "hunting gun" type of store. Bolt actions, etc.

I didn't figure the shipping in on the equation...hummmm. I may have to call around to anyone within 40miles.

On getting a FFL, as stated above, my 1 gun a year won't be worth it. Oh well... I'll try to find someone within 40 miles that might do it. Just figure I'd try here first...

Ricketts
August 26, 2002, 08:23
But you see, that's the issue. You are certainly willing to drive 40 miles each way, waste a minimum of 2 hours of your time and related gas to save his mark-up? That's being a cheapskate in my book.

I'll let you in on a little secret. That FFL holder had to jump thru hoops to get that FFL. He also signed over his rights to protection from involuntary search and seizure of his property. And you don't want to pay him his due, or offer a service in compensation?

I had an FFL for a long time. It was a bigger pain on the ass than it was worth. Crimony--a $20 bill ain't gonna break you but may keep that dealer in business longer. And, if he does not want to do it free for you, he ain't losing much of a customer.

Ak_guy
August 26, 2002, 09:53
Originally posted by Ricketts
But you see, that's the issue. You are certainly willing to drive 40 miles each way, waste a minimum of 2 hours of your time and related gas to save his mark-up? That's being a cheapskate in my book.

I'll let you in on a little secret. That FFL holder had to jump thru hoops to get that FFL. He also signed over his rights to protection from involuntary search and seizure of his property. And you don't want to pay him his due, or offer a service in compensation?

I had an FFL for a long time. It was a bigger pain on the ass than it was worth. Crimony--a $20 bill ain't gonna break you but may keep that dealer in business longer. And, if he does not want to do it free for you, he ain't losing much of a customer.

I see YOUR issue..can you see MINE? I have time..but money is alot more scarce. :( I know some on here have great jobs making 60K + a year unfortunately I am not one of them.

Last I heard it was a free-market economy, buy from the place with the lowest price that has the same product/service. If you are much too high then either you are A) gouging or B) doing something wrong financially that necetates that you have a larger mark-up (too many employees, high electricity bill, etc). I am not taking bout a ffl making money, I am all for that. What I am talking bout is a guy selling a $300 gun (anywhere else) for $500+

I'll let YOU in on a little secret: He did it willingly. He entered into it as a business and just like any other business you have to be at least CLOSE to a competitors price. If anyone else can sell a item for $300 then why does he have to charge $500?? I am not talking bout this guys profit, I am talking bout his gross over-pricing. Why does everyone ALWAYS assume things? I am saying he grossly overprices things.

"And you don't want to pay him his due" There is reasonable mark-up then there is what he does, gouging. People on here talk about "SO AND SO GUNSHOW" and how dealer X had a gun for $XXX and dealer Y had it for $250 less, where did they buy from? Guess...

I feel your pain on the FFL not being worth it, the gov keeps raising the price so that sooner or later it'll be REALLY cost-prohibitive to have one.

"Crimony--a $20 bill ain't gonna break you but may keep that dealer in business longer." A $20 won't break me but a $200+ would.

"And, if he does not want to do it free for you, he ain't losing much of a customer." Who said free??? What I am willing to pay for is a item from a FFL that has a reasonable mark-up, and kind courteous service.THAT is the kind of ffl i am willing to help keep in business. Heck, I'd buy my ammo and send others to him. (Which there is one within 40miles that I do support in that way, I send everyone I know to him for guns and accessories) What I am not willing to support and keep in business is a price-gouger that only wants the "hunting crowd" Not the "hunting crowd", the nieve uninformed hunting crowd.

I am willing to mark this up to a mis-understanding. After someone posted
"Sounds to me like he even wants the transfer to be free."
you might have gotten the wrong idea as you don't know my local ffl or what he charges AND I certainly don't expect to get it free. All I ask is that you give me the benefit of the doubt instead of jumping to conclusions.

Ricketts
August 26, 2002, 12:17
Jumping to conclusions? Re-read your first post. You said you had a guy willing to do a transfer for $15. You said the gun wholesales at $230. That's damn fair. The only transfers I get for free is if I parkerize a bunch of stuff for my local guy. I gotta wash his back for him to was mine. That's fair too. All that said, And you wanted more help? Seemed to me like you wanted the transfer for free because wholesale cost is fixed plus shipping. I don't see how I misunderstood you at all. Now, if you would have said something like, "Hey Guys--This is what they cost new, anyone out there have a used one they want to sell?", you would have been crystal clear. But I still don't know what you are hoping to get out of all of this. Are you wondering if anyone has seen them anywhere cheaper than that $230 new wholesale?

Ak_guy
August 26, 2002, 13:03
Originally posted by Ricketts
Jumping to conclusions? Re-read your first post. You said you had a guy willing to do a transfer for $15. You said the gun wholesales at $230. That's damn fair. The only transfers I get for free is if I parkerize a bunch of stuff for my local guy. I gotta wash his back for him to was mine. That's fair too. All that said, And you wanted more help? Seemed to me like you wanted the transfer for free because wholesale cost is fixed plus shipping. I don't see how I misunderstood you at all. Now, if you would have said something like, "Hey Guys--This is what they cost new, anyone out there have a used one they want to sell?", you would have been crystal clear. But I still don't know what you are hoping to get out of all of this. Are you wondering if anyone has seen them anywhere cheaper than that $230 new wholesale?

Jumping to conclusions...yes.
I said he'd do the transfer for $15 YES. BUT he will try to mark it up ABOVE wholesale. He has tried it before. And I dont mean $20-$50 above, I mean $100-$150. Had a friend want him to call up a on-line place and get a C&R gun. Gun was $99 wholesale. By the time he was done and the gun arrived he wanted $199 + his $15 transfer fee. Said the $100 was cuz he had to call the on-line place and arrange things. :( I called RPB and said I wanted the gun shipped to a FFL, price from them was $345 .... am I missing something? Does the FFL call up and get a better price? By the time I deal with my local guy it'll be $400 I can guarantee.

Again I say NO I DONT WANT THE TRANSFER TO BE FREE!!!! Maybe its just a lack of communication as typing out stuff on the net just doesn't seem to translate too well..... :( Or maybe its RANT day??

Ricketts
August 26, 2002, 13:25
Now I understand you a little better. Sorry for any communication issues.

Sounds like your guy is doing a hurt on you. He charges $15 for the transfer plus a surcharge for getting on line and setting things up? That's nuts. Most of the guys I deal with will charge a flat percentage. Or, If I buy the gun from say, someone on the board, they would charge me a fee (about $20) to transfer and that's it.

If you call a wholesaler and you do NOT have a FFL, the price quoted to you is going to be more. The dealers are who they are catering to, not you and me. Also, the dealer's spending level and history with them affects price too. And I think this is totally right and proper. Look at it this way--what other commodity or good can YOU as an individual see wholesale prices on if you buy a few magazines for sale at the newsstand? You certainly can't buy a washer or dryer that way. Forget TV's. You don't know what the big sales places like Best Buy pay for the goods they sell you. You don't even know that with cars, even tho they want you to think that you do. Firearms is the only thing I have ever heard that an average Joe like us can get the actual pricing on.

You definately need to find a local FFL. Ever try checking the Shotfun news, or maybe getting on ATF's website to see if you can search your area for FFL holders?

Ricketts
August 26, 2002, 13:28
Oh--and I still didn't jump to any conclusions. You didn't mention that little price kicker in your first post. You said that he would do a transfer for $15 on a gun that cost $230 wholesale. It sounded to me like he was outright selling the gun to you for the wholesale price and shipping and just adding the $15 for his trouble--and you had issue with him adding the $15 bucks. Sorry--

Ak_guy
August 26, 2002, 17:27
Originally posted by Ricketts
Oh--and I still didn't jump to any conclusions. You didn't mention that little price kicker in your first post. You said that he would do a transfer for $15 on a gun that cost $230 wholesale. It sounded to me like he was outright selling the gun to you for the wholesale price and shipping and just adding the $15 for his trouble--and you had issue with him adding the $15 bucks. Sorry--

Sorry on this side also. I imagine we all can be rather in-articulate on typing things out. Smilies help a little to give emotion but you can usually leave out things or sometimes a sentence can have 2 seperate meanings... :)

usmc326
August 26, 2002, 17:44
Just like I told you: postal money order for wholesale + shipping, and a Priority mail stamped & "delivery confirmation" document envelope(about $4 @ post office)
and address it to RPB with the gun shop as the return address.

You can list yourself as the sender/buyer
on the money order, as all RPB cares about is cashing it.

The only thing you want from the FFL is a signed copy of his FFL. Seal the envelope in his presence, to allay any fear he might have that you'll copy it. Ask him if he wants to mail it, or if you can.

When the gun comes in pay him his $15, which is a VERY fair fee. Some charge sales tax on transfers, some don't.

perryturner
August 26, 2002, 22:09
Like Ricketts said, try to find a more reasonable FFL near you. If you can't find one at shotgunnews.com, try these:

http://www.gunbroker.com/user/DealerNetwork.asp

http://www.fulton-armory.com/FFLs.htm#TX

http://www.bestbuyguns.com/fflsearch/fflsearch.shtml

Mad Dog 7.62
August 26, 2002, 22:12
AK-guy, your first posts were a little confusing. The dealer should either charge you a flat price, or a percent above his cost, or a flat transfer fee. I am fortunate to live near idsubgun, and he does my transfers for me for a flat fee. Check the SGN listings or call around, you can probably find somebody to do the transfer for you for a flat fee. If you're short on cash, look around on the auction boards and you might find a used one a little cheaper, or with some extra mags or something. We have some vendors on the board that are great about this stuff, like Harlan at FAC. I have ordered lots of recievers and stuff from them, and just had them ship them to idsubgun for me. He does the 4473, I pay him for the transfer, done deal. There is bound to be a pawn shop or "home" FFL out there that will work with you on it. Good luck.
MD

madecov
August 26, 2002, 23:48
AK, drop me an e mail. I'll try to help you out.

MagicAnimal
August 27, 2002, 08:13
I use my local FFL to transfer only. I do all the calling, mailing of payment, etc. Never had any problems, and to date no one's refused my MO. When i find something i want i call my dealer and he has the FFL in the mail the next day. When it arrives, i pay him the transfer fee, fill out the 4473, put it in the truck, take it home, hide it from the old woman:D Simple AND easy!