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View Full Version : long term care facility visit - sobering


0302
March 29, 2012, 23:32
i visited a lady suffering from alzheimers at the care facility, a nice clean place, she just gave me the blank stare and asked if i got the mail, she was laying on the bed with the blanket pulled to her chin, like a child. i tried to smile but was getting choked up. she used to be so nice to me & my family. most everyone there was in a wheelchair, barely able to move. many had that desperate save-me look in their eyes, trapped in their bodies. i hope the Lord takes me before i wind up in a facility like that.

medicmike
March 30, 2012, 00:05
One of the hardest parts of running on the ambulance was responding to those places. Alzheimer's is a terrible disease, I am sorry about your friend.

Pistolwiz
March 30, 2012, 00:33
i visited a lady suffering from alzheimers at the care facility, a nice clean place, she just gave me the blank stare and asked if i got the mail, she was laying on the bed with the blanket pulled to her chin, like a child. i tried to smile but was getting choked up. she used to be so nice to me & my family. most everyone there was in a wheelchair, barely able to move. many had that desperate save-me look in their eyes, trapped in their bodies. i hope the Lord takes me before i wind up in a facility like that.

I feel the same way. I'd rather go before I get put into one of those places. Sad. I'm pretty sure I'll get that wish.

BUFF
March 30, 2012, 01:08
My Mom's biggest fear was ending up "being put" in one. She developed dementia. It eventually became too dangerous for her to keep her at home. Searching for a decent care center for her was one of the most painful things I ever have had to do.

The lucky dementia patients are so far gone mentally that they do not know where they are or what shape they are in. My mom seemed to be in a happy place in her mind.

God bless the people who work in the good care centers. It's got to be a tough job.

brunop
March 30, 2012, 01:29
God bless the people who work in the good care centers. It's got to be a tough job.

Amen. Don't think I want that job, either.

one hand clapping
March 30, 2012, 07:00
I can remember visiting my great grandmother in the nursing home.I was young ,but was curious about some of her friends, Back then ,there were lots of old bodies, but sharp minds.
I can remember hearing all kinds of great stories and only a very small group were medicated and out of it.
I wonder aloud what has changed in these intervening 45 yrs in our populations enviroment/bodies to cause so many to fall to dementia.
I suspect over use of aluminum and chemicals in the food chain.
Aluminum in the brain blocks nuron /synaspe exchange, exactly what alot of our elders are now experiencing.
Even though she didn't remember you, its still good on your part to go to her.
I respect anyone who will go out of their way for another, especialy to the old folks home.
OHC

Blackmore
March 30, 2012, 07:08
My Mom was in long term care for nearly seven years with dementia/Alzheimers before she passed. Though the quality of care varied with changing administrators, thankfully it never fell below "good".

The sociology of the visitors was interesting. Some people would walk in with tunnel vision and an accelerated gait until they got to their loved one. There were other residents I never saw get a visitor at all. I tried to speak to anyone who made eye contact with me. If my Mom was asleep or being bathed, etc., I'd visit with other residents I'd gotten to know so as not to waste the trip. Even attended a few funerals of residents since I'd gotten to know their families. An interesting community, but a sad place.

VonFireball
March 30, 2012, 07:41
My wife has worked in that type of setting for over ten years. Here is what I've found:

Scabies are rampant in these facilities.
Abuse of patients is disturbingly frequent.
They are mainly staffed with homosexuals, ghetto dwellers, and drug addicts.
Profit, not care, is the driving motivator for nearly all parties save the patient.
Shorthanded with regards to staffing is the order of the day. As such, incompetent, uncaring staff a given.
Theft of medication and items of value is commonplace.
Generally hostile work environment.

You can hire a nurse to care for your loved ones at home for less than the cost of such facilities. I would trust that setting over that of the elderly mills. I was almost gonna tie these facilities in with the organ donation thread in that while lifespan is extended, quality of life is reduced quite frequently. I'm not making value judgements on what someone else does, just noting that even with advanced care and medicine I see many of you are not interested in staying in such a place when you are older. I for one, REFUSE to stay in such a place.

W.E.G.
March 30, 2012, 07:58
You can hire a nurse to care for your loved ones at home for less than the cost of such facilities.

This comment reveals that you clearly have no experience with this subject.

def90
March 30, 2012, 08:16
This comment reveals that you clearly have no experience with this subject.

+1

V guy
March 30, 2012, 08:54
Home nursing care is expensive.

My 88 year old mother has suffered a stroke last summer, after a series of seizures.

We have gotten home care down to two 2 hr visits a day. She can still get around with a walker, but cannot drive or remember much anymore.
The cost is low now--about $1200/mo, but was up around $4000/mo with all day service.
The aide gets her showered, dressed and fed. We help out as we can.

She hopes to die at home in her chair.

0302
March 30, 2012, 09:01
my cherokee grandpa went blind due to diabetes, stayed home , but his mind was sharp, nurses and family visited every day until he died in his bed. five nurses showed up for his funeral, they really liked him and took good care. wwII vet, north africa, belgium, france.

skeeterbay
March 30, 2012, 09:37
I can remember visiting my great grandmother in the nursing home.I was young ,but was curious about some of her friends, Back then ,there were lots of old bodies, but sharp minds.
I can remember hearing all kinds of great stories and only a very small group were medicated and out of it.
I wonder aloud what has changed in these intervening 45 yrs in our populations enviroment/bodies to cause so many to fall to dementia.
I suspect over use of aluminum and chemicals in the food chain.
Aluminum in the brain blocks nuron /synaspe exchange, exactly what alot of our elders are now experiencing.
Even though she didn't remember you, its still good on your part to go to her.
I respect anyone who will go out of their way for another, especialy to the old folks home.
OHC


I have been wondering the same thing for a long time. In a town I once lived in there was an old soldiers home. It was a huge old three or four story house, (might have been an old hotel in the 1800's, don't know) Anyway this place had some old WWI vets living there. With the exception of the ones suffering from injuries and shell shock. Almost all had had very sharp minds and lived to a ripe old age.

Many claim the average life expectancy is longer today. I don't know about that. When I think back to all the old people that were around the area I grew up in. Many were well into their 90's and their minds were as sharp as ever. Most of them died from their hearts giving out. You would hear about cancer once in a while but I don't recall hearing as much about it back then as I do now.

Fast forward to today and we see people suffering with dementia in their 60's and people in their 20's and 30's with cancer. I can't help but think you are correct. Something in the environment is causing or contributing to this. I did hear that some doctors think that heavy use of aluminum cookware might have something to do with early dementia.

festus
March 30, 2012, 10:36
You can hire a nurse to care for your loved ones at home for less than the cost of such facilities.





Maybe in Indonesia, but not here. Advanced dementia requires full time care. Check out the cost for just 8 hours of RN care per day. Do not compare Visiting Angels home care assistants with a real licensed nurse. Just requiring some assistance with daily chores and providing a companion is not the same as providing medical care.

TnHawk-45
March 30, 2012, 10:57
I have been VERY familiar with such facilities for over 30 years now as that is how long my wife has been the Social Worker for the County run one here.

In all that time the level of care has gone down across the board at all facilities because of losing staff to paperwork requirements that would otherwise be spent on care givers! Thank you Federal and State government for NOTHING!

Yes some can be and are bad, but on the other hand you can find ones that give long and loving care to patients.

One of my first experiences was the fact that two of the lady patients insisted of helping my wife in sewing her wedding dress! I can also remember consoling my wife when she lost them. To some staff it is like losing family members constantly.

Look for one that stresses the "Eden Alternative" style of care. These are ones that try and make the facility as much of a home as possible. At my wife's facility they have three cats and a dog which interact with the patients daily. They also have a day care facility where the children can interact with their surrogate grandparents.

No, it is not perfect, but they are trying.

Bawana jim
March 30, 2012, 11:26
You guys ain't going to like my post. I have spent a lot of time in the homes helping friends and family die so my opinion is from what I have done. Every time someone tells me to stay healthy for a long life I think of the oldsters in those homes and what they are going through. I have no plan for long life:biggrin:

When the body starts failing I won't give all I have worked for to keep it going. Got a good doctor who has promissed we will be able to save my family the money.

medicmike
March 30, 2012, 12:47
You guys ain't going to like my post. I have spent a lot of time in the homes helping friends and family die so my opinion is from what I have done. Every time someone tells me to stay healthy for a long life I think of the oldsters in those homes and what they are going through. I have no plan for long life:biggrin:

When the body starts failing I won't give all I have worked for to keep it going. Got a good doctor who has promissed we will be able to save my family the money.

I am with you on this one Jim!

I always said that when it gets too bad to just take me to the hills and prop up against a tree with a bottle of good single malt and leave me for the animals.

bill3542
March 30, 2012, 12:55
Alzhiemers is a hideous disease, i saw the changes in my dad over a 4 year period go from a precision machinist to a man who would scream and yell at his own reflection thinking there was stranger in the house. add Parkinsons to this and he could be handful to deal with sometimes.
sometimes it was tough but managed to keep him at him at home until he died in April 2010, we knew it was coming about a week before he passed and all the grandchildren came in from out of state and got to see him before he passed. mom still has bad days on occasion be deals with it and i'm glad we live close to her.

def90
March 30, 2012, 13:18
I have been wondering the same thing for a long time.

Many claim the average life expectancy is longer today. I don't know about that. When I think back to all the old people that were around the area I grew up in. Many were well into their 90's and their minds were as sharp as ever. Most of them died from their hearts giving out. You would hear about cancer once in a while but I don't recall hearing as much about it back then as I do now.

Fast forward to today and we see people suffering with dementia in their 60's and people in their 20's and 30's with cancer. I can't help but think you are correct. Something in the environment is causing or contributing to this. I did hear that some doctors think that heavy use of aluminum cookware might have something to do with early dementia.

People are living longer and things like cancer are being diagnosed where as much of the time up until the last couple decades if someone died it was from "wasting disease" or just old age, not cancer yet in reality it just wasn't diagnosed that way.

Same thing with autism.. in the past a kid was just categorized as being a bit "slow", retarded or behind for their age, now they are being diagnosed as autistic. The overall numbers of mental illnesses over all hasn't really changed, just the way people are being categorized.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/240649.php

http://www.science20.com/news_articles/autism_overdiagnosed_or_undiagnosed-78658

jimmbob
March 30, 2012, 14:13
Alzhiemers is a hideous disease, i saw the changes in my dad over a 4 year period go from a precision machinist to a man who would...

:( Same here, my Dad -Patton's 3rd, precision machinist, certified welder of anything(taught at the local college), built his own aircraft from scratch,etc., etc.

Eventually he would get confused even running his drill press, the least of his problems at that point. :sad:

Texgunner
March 30, 2012, 15:31
My wife's best friend had recently mentioned that her husband, 61, was having trouble remembering what she'd told him. A couple weeks ago, a doctor told him it was early stages of Alzheimer's. They are devastated as well they should be. I told my wife that if that were my diagnosis, I would make some "final" plans while I still could. I saw how nursing homes cared for my mom. Not for me Jim!
Gary

VonFireball
March 30, 2012, 18:56
This comment reveals that you clearly have no experience with this subject.

Thanks for stating the obvious. I'm glad I have "no experience" on the subject. Unfortunately my wife does.

Most of the "homes" my better half has worked at ran 3-4k on the low end and 5-6k per month on the high end. A lot of facilities shake the state down for as much cash as possible, profit, not care, being the primary motivator.

Yes, you can hire a nurse for home care for less than that, generally speaking, unless, as festus noted, round the clock advanced care is required. Trachs, tube feedings, and lots of opiates and psychotropics for complete invalids.

Maybe you can't get an RN all day and night at those prices, but understand that RN's aren't 100% hands on care, that is what LVN's, Nurse's aids, CNA and such are for. RN's are more often in supervisory roles and, depending on state law and a given situation, do not need to be present on a 24 hour basis or even on site at all. Even your LPN's spend a lot time charting on patients while CNA's fill the "indian" role of boots on the ground.

ukhayes
March 30, 2012, 19:30
My mother fought dimentia/alzheimers for three years. We paid $6500.00 per month for her 24 hour care. In January of '11, she became dehydrated and developed pneumoia while under this care and had to be hospitalized. When she was released from the hospital, she was given two weeks. We brought home and Hospice became involved. She lived for another eleven weeks before she finally passed. Though it was tough changing her diapers and watching her slow deteriation, we shared some special moments that I would have missed. I am blessed with a wonderful wife that cared for her during the day that feels blessed as well by the time we had her home.

davesrb
March 30, 2012, 22:44
Sorry in advance, this will be a book.
I can't comment on the Alzheimer's, but we built an apartment for my 80 year old Father and moved him into our home last year.See thread:http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=312210
Dad suffers from Parkinson's, COPD, and various other issues. He is 100% Combat Related Disabled. My wife and I simply could not bear the thought of putting him in a care facility unless there was absolutely no way for us to care for him.
We are extremely lucky that Dad bought Long Term Disability Insurance years ago. It pays $100 a day for home caregivers which we of course have to add money to for adequate help. While they are not necessarily RN's, they 2 we have working for us are both retired nurses. Even with caregivers with him from 8 am till 6 pm he requires a lot of care from us. It has been a major lifestyle change for my family, but it has also been one of the most rewarding things we have done.
When he got here he was basically wheelchair bound, on oxygen 100% of the time, and very confused. I built him a "clean room" (everything sealed, no rugs, heppa filters everywhere) and got him using his Cpap machine. My wife used to be a Pharmacy tech and was immediately concerned about his "massive" drug regimen. We found that for a vet like my Dad, he got med's from several different doctors. Some came from Tri Care through the mail, some from the base Pharmacy, and some through local Pharmacies. There was no gate keeper! So we set him up with a local Doctor to handle general issues and look at his med's. After the first visit Dad was taken off 14 med's!! He was on 3 different anti depressants, and had been prescribed Lasix to make him pee, and Vessicare to stop him from urinating!:o
Six months after getting him here he no longer uses the oxygen, uses a walker instead of a wheel chair, and is very clear headed. While I don't know if he would have improved like this had he been moved to a Care Facility, his Doctor thinks the chances are slim that he would have. I know we are very fortunate to be able to take care of Dad, but I also know people who could take care of their elderly and simply choose not to. I just can't understand that...
Here's Dad with my wife, my baby girl, and one of his caregivers out for his daily golf cart ride..
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w119/davesrb/cc5ca68e.jpg

def90
March 30, 2012, 23:18
Sorry in advance, this will be a book.
I can't comment on the Alzheimer's, but we built an apartment for my 80 year old Father and moved him into our home last year.Even with caregivers with him from 8 am till 6 pm he requires a lot of care from us. It has been a major lifestyle change for my family, but it has also been one of the most rewarding things we have done.

:bow::beer:

jimmbob
March 30, 2012, 23:42
Ya beat me to it def90, :bow::bow::bow::bow::beer::beer:

davesrb, you're the son every good father deserves:beer:

So happy to hear the progress your Dad has made. You(and your Dad) are very lucky. Very fortunate indeed!:bow:

jaykden
March 31, 2012, 00:21
i lost 3 grandparents in the last 4 months.

my moms mother died in november, dads dad died just before Xmas, and my moms dad died last month.

grandma alice is still with us (and still "all there").

my moms folks were still living at the home my mom grew up in, my dads parents are living in the LTC unit here in the loacl hospital. they treat them well and granda alice feels at home there now. took a bit of getting used to though..

its been a rough few months for us..

:(

davesrb
March 31, 2012, 07:34
i lost 3 grandparents in the last 4 months.

my moms mother died in november, dads dad died just before Xmas, and my moms dad died last month.

grandma alice is still with us (and still "all there").

my moms folks were still living at the home my mom grew up in, my dads parents are living in the LTC unit here in the loacl hospital. they treat them well and granda alice feels at home there now. took a bit of getting used to though..

its been a rough few months for us..

:(
Im sorry for your loss. Your family has had a lot to deal with lately!

Just to clarify, I have nothing against LTC facilities in general, some are fantastic. My Aunt has been in one for 4 years. She absolutely loves it! As a retired nurse, she loves visiting with all the nursing staff. But she has full use of her faculties, her body has just given out to the point she could no longer take care of herself.
When it came time that Dad couldn't take care of himself, I knew that we could take care of him. I also knew that my Dad would not be one to do well in a LTC. He likes to be as active as possible and doesn't like to watch tv all day. Usually when I get home from work my wife has brought him upstairs into our home and the kids are climbing all over him. I have set him up a 4 ft by 8 ft table and we are all laying out an HO gauge train table (actually he and I set it up, the kids "help", then we set it back up again!) I think keeping his mind stimulated and keeping him an active part of the family does as much for his well being as the medical stuff.

W.E.G.
March 31, 2012, 08:54
Dang!

Those gals are hot!

Here I thought I needed the slick ride to pull the birds.

I'm gonna buy me a golf cart TODAY!

davesrb
March 31, 2012, 09:07
Dang!

Those gals are hot!

Here I thought I needed the slick ride to pull the birds.

I'm gonna buy me a golf cart TODAY!

You didn't know? Golf Carts bring the hot chicks!

Blackmore
March 31, 2012, 09:23
You didn't know? Golf Carts bring the hot chicks!

Another 'Filer marries "up"! :wink:

Mark IV
March 31, 2012, 19:50
Think of the alternative, Brother.

At least there she's cared for, fed, and she retains some of her dignity.

Imagine if she were home alone, who'd feed her, clean her? God knows what they'd find if she passed all by herself.

I work as a part-time security officer at an assisted living center, and we have residents who have alzheimers. Heart wrenching to see, but at least they're cared for and not alone.

LaConservationist
April 20, 2012, 09:29
This is some GREAT and EXCELLENT news to hear DAVE! Great UPDATE!!

I ove to hear when guys make a so called sacrifice to take care of the people that have taken care of US for so long! You may friend are to be commended! :bow::bow:

Your wife is also a GREAT lady to help with the care and patience that is required!! :bow::bow:
MAY GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!

Chris

lawdog
April 20, 2012, 13:12
Don't forget to add the ugly downside to home health care: the very real potential for theft.

My wife's grandfather lost some nice stuff due to theft by one of the health care workers that tended him.

Sucks that it seems you have to distrust almost everyone, but nannycams do serve a good purpose.

martin35
April 20, 2012, 14:05
My grandpaw was kicked out of several nursing homes for moaning pitifully laying doggo and tricking nurses into lewd acts of behavior for a mention in one of his many last wills and testaments.
He was a great man, but a trouble maker right up to the end and his estate is a shambles.

0302
April 20, 2012, 14:21
my x-bro-n-law worked at an ltc just to steal meds, he was shot in the face & died in wichita.

martin35
April 20, 2012, 19:36
my x-bro-n-law worked at an ltc just to steal meds, he was shot in the face & died in wichita.
I hope he left a will.

kwilal
April 20, 2012, 20:39
My 81 year old uncle's bedridden in his own home while my aunt and an assortment of caregivers tend to him. Of the 6 minority caregivers who look over him, 4 are pregnant. When they found out my aunt was paying for all this care with personal savings, they told her she was a fool and she should have the government (i.e., you & me) paying for it. My aunt inquired as to how they knew all this and they said their church teaches them all about how to live well off while other people pay for it. It's getting to the point even the workers ain't nothing but a bunch of thieving parasites. Our country is doomed.
Ken