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Old November 29, 2017, 14:02   #1
Bawana jim
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Army fields new Sig

Looks like it's been fielded but I have some questions now about the Berettas. Who gets all the surplus guns and mags?

Story on Sig...


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3608990/posts
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Old November 29, 2017, 15:56   #2
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Well,

I have been deeply involved in the Modular Handgun System (MHS) testing and I cant say specifics but wait at least a year if you plan to buy an M17 or M18.

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Old November 29, 2017, 16:21   #3
Nuttz
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Hope they donít drop em!!!

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Old November 29, 2017, 17:34   #4
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Wow, good contract for Sig. Guns and special ammo.
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Old November 29, 2017, 19:50   #5
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Hope they don’t drop em!!!
Recall for that reason, on the CIVILIAN market.

Army contract NOT recalled, and shown above.


EDIT: Correction, Army version has different internals.

Last edited by LYCAN; December 16, 2017 at 22:31.
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Old November 30, 2017, 14:22   #6
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leave it to the army to dick up something as simple as ordering a pistol. but goes with the gray cammies, m4 rifle, etc.
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Old November 30, 2017, 16:59   #7
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So when will the old M9's be declared surplus to needs and put on sale was the question.

Never IMHO. The federal gov't doesn't sell milsurp weapons to us mere civilians anymore except for the CMP M1 Garands and some old beat up M1911A1's at inflated prices.

Instead those M9's will most likely be sent to the Anniston Arsenal down in Alabama and run through "Captain Crunch". This is the nickname for a big metal shredding machine used to destroy old and no longer needed small arms. The shredded parts are then sold for recycling to scrap metal dealers.

Quite honestly I wouldn't want some beat to hell M9. I own two US made 92FS's and that is enough for me. I just don't see the allure for some whacked out milsurp piece of junk when you can buy a NIB 92FS/M9A1 commercial model for less than $500 these days.

And so it goes.


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Old December 03, 2017, 01:34   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bawana jim View Post
Looks like it's been fielded but I have some questions now about the Berettas. Who gets all the surplus guns and mags?
Well, having issued and carried one while I worked for the Army, I hope no one ever gets any of the ones my team had. If we didnít have a full time armor who could fix the damn thing, all of our M9ís would have been dead lined. I think we had at least one locking block brake every time we went to the range, which was at least once a month. The sad part of it all is that the spare parts came from our spare guns that were supposed to be operational and were secured in separate arms room which meant we didnít have a real contingency plan if we couldnít get to our primary weapons.

If ever see another M9 it would be way to soon. Iíve never understood why people have and still are keen on the M9. I got an Italian made 92F from my dad and could stand the thing. I think a lot of people saw Mel Gibson in Leathal Weapon use it and wanted one. The thing never really fit my hand and I like my Glock G20 because it fits my hand.

I think the only place for the surplus M9ís is a scrap machine.

As for the Sig, well the could have pick a worse gun. I didnít mind my ex-FBI P226 I had. It shot great. It was marked made in West Germany too. Never really liked the decocker on it, as my trigger finger always seemed want to slide on to the trigger when I was using the decocker.

Part of my job I did for the Army was a firearms instructor. Some people have no business what so ever being around firearms let alone using them. What the military needs is an idiot proof hand gun. I had the same officer split his left hand open from the slide running across it as he had his left thumb crossed over his right thumb. He did this not once, not twice, but three time in three outings to the range before we could get him permanently band from the range. The paper work we hand to do on the incidents probably wiped out a rain forest somewhere not to mention all the blood we hand to clean up. I believe he was up to about 20 stitches between the three incidents. After the first one we had a remedial class for him on how to grip the gun but it was after the dang mag change that he would switch his thumb back over the top again. He couldnít keep the instructions between his ears for 30 minuets to shoot his qualification.

I think something with a frame mounted safety (not a de-cocking lever) and a real hammer, just to list a few things would be a good starting point.
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Old December 04, 2017, 16:01   #9
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To this day I do not understand why the P226 lost to the Beretta. I think if they had selected the P226 they would still be using it for generations to come.
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Old December 04, 2017, 19:15   #10
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To this day I do not understand why the P226 lost to the Beretta. I think if they had selected the P226 they would still be using it for generations to come.
I highly doubt that. The simple issue is this: the NATO spec ammo the US military and the remainder of NATO issues is just too hot for pistol use. Why is that you ask? Well, gentle reader, the NATO spec 9mm ammo was based directly on the British Mk2Z ammo developed and fielded during WW2 for the STEN SMG which uses advanced primer ignition and thus can digest a steady diet of very hot ammo.

Pistols? Ah, not so much. UK Browning High Powers weren't usually shot that much but those that were suffered locking cams being sheared off until FN changed the manufacture of the barrel into a two piece operation with a sleeved monobloc type arrangement. This allowed the locking cam to be machined from a separate piece of steel with the grain structure of the locking cam oriented to prevent the failure. This did not stop those pistols with a high round count cracking slides at the corner of the ejection port on a regular basis.

In 1995, I was part of the British Army Combat Shooting Team and I shot pistol exclusively. We were training for a match in the USA which was geared around the Beretta M9 and the whole DA/SA operation. Our team leader, an asshole of a Lt. Col decided instead of using our trusty and accurate BHP's, we would use SIG P226 pistols that had been privately purchased by the SAS using their own funds which had nicely side stepped the usual long drawn out Defense procurement process.

These 226's came with log books which purported to accurately record the number of rounds fired through them. I'm not certain they were 100% accurate as I knew some fellas over at SAS and they weren't too good with paperwork but the average round count was in the region of 12,000 rounds of Mk2Z through them. Some had 9K, others were up at 15K and they were just shot to bits. Inaccurate, rattling and just horrid guns to try to shoot at much past 15 meters. Considering one of the courses of fire was the bullseye course at 50 yards, one handed, we were onto a loser before we even started.

My point? With the ammo the military fed the M9, I have no doubt the SIG 226 would have fared no better and would have crapped out just as much as the M9 has. YMMV
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Old December 08, 2017, 05:39   #11
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.

Quite honestly I wouldn't want some beat to hell M9. I own two US made 92FS's and that is enough for me. I just don't see the allure for some whacked out milsurp piece of junk when you can buy a NIB 92FS/M9A1 commercial model for less than $500 these days.
I hate the damn things, but I'd pick up half a dozen @ $200/per (bout all they'd be worth IMHO) test fire them, load them up, and stash them around with a couple mags each.
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Old December 16, 2017, 17:08   #12
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To this day I do not understand why the P226 lost to the Beretta. I think if they had selected the P226 they would still be using it for generations to come.
The Beretta came with allowing cruise missiles in Italy.
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Old December 16, 2017, 17:14   #13
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Well,

Beretta also built a factory in Maryland.

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Old December 16, 2017, 22:05   #14
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pistols play a very very small roll in the usmc infantry. if the nato ammo is too hot then its time to cool it off. my personal 92 slways worked well - it had the 1911 style safety and i rarely used double action. kinda miss it.
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Old December 16, 2017, 23:03   #15
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Well,

Beretta also built a factory in Maryland.

Thorack

Are they still moving to Tennessee ... did they move?
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Old December 17, 2017, 00:26   #16
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I personally think the M9 is a hell of a gun, and very fond of the platform.

That said, I wouldn't touch a military issues M9 for any amount of $$$ unless I could put hands on and inspect it for serviceability.... the majority of our M9s have lived a long and hard life.
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Old December 17, 2017, 02:21   #17
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Are they still moving to Tennessee ... did they move?
yes, last year
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