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Old September 21, 2017, 15:50   #1
AFeod
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pistol predicament

So heres the question I'd like some different views on... Sure as sh*t, the Filers can give me some of those.

I'm in the market for a new pistol. I will be planning on carrying it. A bit of background. 1. I'm not made of money, but am able to save where I can. 2. I tend to stick to calibers .308, 5.56, .45 acp, .45 colt. because I am set up to reload those(not yet on the 45colt but soon). 3. I live in CA (so please no "just move BS") so there are only a select number of pistols available.

My thought for the last year is to start saving(yes thats how long it takes to save) for a FNH 5.7. I've shot them and I think they're great. Now that I have most of the cash the availability is few and far between. I've always loved the 1911, and always told myself if, and when I get one I would like a sub compact model.

As stated now that I am actually shopping around I've wandered over to the Kimber 1911 3" and 4" models. They're, in general 500 smackers cheaper.

So thats my delima. Save a hair more, and get the 5.7, or Kimber 1911. I know, Its my choice, you only live once... yadda yadda.

pros : firepower w/ the 5.7 light wieght accurate way fun to shoot. the kimber, love 1911s, already reload for it, know it, less expensive, easily concealled
cons: 5.7 expensive, ammo too. kimber: not a 5.7, not as accurate past 15/20 yards.


thats that.
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Old September 21, 2017, 16:35   #2
chet
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Since those two guns arent really comparable in any meaningful way, just get both.
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Old September 21, 2017, 16:41   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AFeod View Post
So heres the question I'd like some different views on... Sure as sh*t, the Filers can give me some of those.

I'm in the market for a new pistol. I will be planning on carrying it. A bit of background. 1. I'm not made of money, but am able to save where I can. 2. I tend to stick to calibers .308, 5.56, .45 acp, .45 colt. because I am set up to reload those(not yet on the 45colt but soon). 3. I live in CA (so please no "just move BS") so there are only a select number of pistols available.

My thought for the last year is to start saving(yes thats how long it takes to save) for a FNH 5.7. I've shot them and I think they're great. Now that I have most of the cash the availability is few and far between. I've always loved the 1911, and always told myself if, and when I get one I would like a sub compact model.

As stated now that I am actually shopping around I've wandered over to the Kimber 1911 3" and 4" models. They're, in general 500 smackers cheaper.

So thats my delima. Save a hair more, and get the 5.7, or Kimber 1911. I know, Its my choice, you only live once... yadda yadda.

pros : firepower w/ the 5.7 light wieght accurate way fun to shoot. the kimber, love 1911s, already reload for it, know it, less expensive, easily concealled
cons: 5.7 expensive, ammo too. kimber: not a 5.7, not as accurate past 15/20 yards.


thats that.
I wouldn't save for a round I could only carry, legally, in a half-empty pistol. Seven or eight rounds of .45 trump ten of 5.7. Moreover, since they have you by the short curlies on ammo, may as well stick with what you can reload or buy by the case in Vegas or AZ. 1911, CZ97 or HK45 would be on my list.
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Old September 21, 2017, 16:57   #4
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Subcompact 45s suck dog balls.

Officer's Model 45s suck small dog balls.

Get a Colt Commander, spend $200+ on a belt and holster, and practice as much as possible.


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Old September 21, 2017, 17:54   #5
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You want to use it for self defense so try to find a 1911 commander.

Pass on the 5.7. Odds are you can't get the correct ammo for the gun. You can get sporting ammo though.
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Old September 21, 2017, 18:02   #6
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At least a Commander size, but I'd buy something besides an overpriced Kimber.
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Old September 21, 2017, 18:16   #7
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The Kimber Ultra Carry is about as schweeet as it comes for a 1911 aficionado in a carry size package. Mine has excellent sights and is surprisingly (if not shockingly) accurate for a carry pistol.

The plastic FN in an oddball caliber??? YUCK! If I won one in a raffle today, it would be for sale here in the MP tomorrow.
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Old September 21, 2017, 18:19   #8
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S&W model 25 setup for 45acp & 45 LC
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Old September 21, 2017, 18:37   #9
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I wouldn't let lack of a $25 set of dies and some bullets determine my choice of carry pistol. And although I was for many years a proponent of 1911 and 45 acp, my opinions have changed quite a lot.

I recommend starting with the problem then work your way to the correct solution without regard to your starting point with reloading equipment.
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Old September 21, 2017, 18:56   #10
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Colt combat commander, be nice to get a 70 series...but a new one will do well. Perfect size, weight and power! Colt has a lot of nice 1911s out right now. Buds gun shop has a good selection
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Old September 21, 2017, 19:01   #11
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+1 for a Commander. LW if you can find one. Shoot it a lot, practice a lot, become proficient.
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Old September 21, 2017, 19:02   #12
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So what is the FN 5.7? I here it advertised on talk radio as the FN proven end end all of everything they've ever made for a century. I was not impressed by the FNX line. Buying a pistol with some exotic ammo like Sig and others doesn't interest me in the least.

Lots of nice designs out there without the bulk and the price. I have little Kimber 3" CDP that cost me $800 used like new. it is accurate as hell. It is not a go to the range and shoot all day pistol for competition.
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Old September 21, 2017, 19:08   #13
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https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...lack_cherry_g1




Hopefully this is ok, not affiliated with buds, just d'I'd some business with them a couple of times....might be my next 1911


Nice
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Old September 21, 2017, 19:38   #14
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Given you are in Kali (you have my condolences), and looking for a "legal" firearm at a decent price in one of the listed calibres, then I would be more inclined to go with a compact 1911 myself. The lowest priced I can think of right off the top of my head would be a Rock Island brand as they are well made, functional and as good if not more so than a Kimber (just not as "pretty").

Kimber is a "pretty" gun but the price is a bit high for an EDC pistol if you are looking to save money. As for higher priced 1911s, I had my eye on the Colt New Agent as far as a smaller compact is concerned but even that is more expensive and is just something on my "wish list" for my collection. My carry 1911 is an Argentine Sistema Colt but I do have Rock Island compacts and have even given out a few as Christmas gifts in the past.

Anyway, that's just my opinion fwiw ...

BTW, I lived in Kali myself for a few years in the 1970s and 1980s for work and for my late first wife who had family in the Bay Area. Kali laws have just made it more difficult for gun owners since then. Too bad because outside the socialist monkey hives (L.A., Sacramento, Bay Area, etc.) it's a very nice place. So good luck in your search for a decent legal carry piece.
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Old September 21, 2017, 19:38   #15
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Well, to go a different route. My daily carry is a S&W M&P Shield in 45ACP. It is small, easily concealable, and packs a wallop. Price is nice and until 30 September, S&W has a bonus program in place (2 boxes of Hornady Critical Defense ammo, 2 magazines for your pistol, and a mag loader).

Link to bonus plan:

https://www.smith-wesson.com/mp-rebate-v2
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Old September 21, 2017, 21:07   #16
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Kimber is a "pretty" gun but the price is a bit high for an EDC pistol if you are looking to save money.
Admittedly I got a good deal on an "almost new" used one ($600 IIRC), but the price new is really not too bad for a very accurate EDC.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg EDC.jpg (109.1 KB, 633 views)
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Old September 21, 2017, 21:37   #17
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Admittedly I got a good deal on an "almost new" used one ($600 IIRC), but the price new is really not too bad for a very accurate EDC.

What is that on the right of the pistol? Is that a skinny wallet? My father used to laugh at me saying I'd spend My last dollar on a wallet and didn't have any left to actually use the wallet.
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Old September 21, 2017, 21:44   #18
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on the right of the pistol? Is that a skinny wallet?
The billfold stays "skinny" from riFALs and boolits, not from peestools
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Old September 21, 2017, 21:53   #19
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The billfold stays "skinny" from riFALs and boolits, not from peestools
I do like that little Kimber. 380 I guess. I'm too old to carry a weapon in a holster. Shit you have to wear a jacket or a bowling shirt
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Old September 21, 2017, 21:54   #20
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I have no problems shooting my Officers ACP in .45 - I like it just fine.
If you have a hankering for the high velocity low recoil of the 5.7, maybe consider a .22TCM. One of the Filipino companies sells them and they are based on the Colt Government pistol. It would be an easy swap between .22TCM and .45ACP. There was a recent write up in the American Rifleman on the caliber and it sounds interesting.
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Old September 21, 2017, 22:03   #21
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Couples things to remember

1.Jan 1 ammo ban happens so after that it will be harder to get ammo ..
2. http://certguns.doj.ca.gov/ is the list of handguns you can buy new the rest either
a. PPT though FFL now very pricy as
b. SSE is dead it is much harder to bring a gun into the state then it was .
c. family out of state can send you one

So because of that

I would skip the 5.7 ..I love the gun and really it is cool and the round is great but the main selling point is you get 20-30 rounds ..10 rounds eh not worth it imop ..Plus the ca models are not cheep ..So you would need to get a normal model and find a FFL with a hi cap permit who can block them ..Also sucks


I would look for a single stack gun a 1911 or sig 220 or 227 or 245 ..
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Old September 21, 2017, 22:21   #22
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I'm not a big guy and I don't enjoy small pistols (or big ones) so while I have a carry permit I almost never carry. Since you're limited to 7 rounds or whatever it is, you might put comfort at the top of your criteria. If I committed to carrying all the time, I'd pick something small, cheap, and light weight. I'd go that route because I'd be more likely to put it on every day.

My favorite pistol is a full sized BHP knock off and it weighs a ton. 9mm, 13+1. No way I can carry concealed in the warm months without showing. However the extra magazine in my front pocket makes me popular with the ladies.

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Old September 21, 2017, 22:28   #23
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Couples things to remember

1.Jan 1 ammo ban happens so after that it will be harder to get ammo ..
2. http://certguns.doj.ca.gov/ is the list of handguns you can buy new the rest either
a. PPT though FFL now very pricy as
b. SSE is dead it is much harder to bring a gun into the state then it was .
c. family out of state can send you one

So because of that

I would skip the 5.7 ..I love the gun and really it is cool and the round is great but the main selling point is you get 20-30 rounds ..10 rounds eh not worth it imop ..Plus the ca models are not cheep ..So you would need to get a normal model and find a FFL with a hi cap permit who can block them ..Also sucks


I would look for a single stack gun a 1911 or sig 220 or 227 or 245 ..
From the OPs info it appears that he lives close to the Nevada border (Tahoe) so he can easily slip into Reno and buy his ammo there unmolested in any quantity and return behind enemy lines.
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Old September 21, 2017, 22:42   #24
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Thanks for all the great replies. I really do appreciate it. A few things, there are NO colts on the list. With that being said the colt 1911s I do see for sale here a crazy expensive. Hell, my same model colt I bought get a handful of years back people are charging twice what I paid. Since there are a few kimbers on the list the price hasn't skyrocketed... yet. Also to the benefit of the 5.7, I live a stones throw from NV, keep a few things there and would be happy to shoot 20 and 30 rounds per mag, only there of course. I'll have to handle a compact 1911 more. I'm a big dude 6'4" 200lbs. A gov't size 1911 fits beautifully in my hand. My dad has a few sigs and xd's, I don't care for them. I will be getting my ccw with this new pistol, but I won't carry everyday. So super compact isn't as important either. In CA when you get you ccw you have to register your pistol and that's what you carry, not like every where else, get your ccw carry what you will. The two pistols I will sign onto my ccw will be the new one(which ever one) along w/ my colt 1911a1. This feed back has helped a lot. Please keep it coming.
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Old September 21, 2017, 22:43   #25
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From the OPs info it appears that he lives close to the Nevada border (Tahoe) so he can easily slip into Reno and buy his ammo there unmolested in any quantity and return behind enemy lines.
That's a-firm
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Old September 21, 2017, 23:11   #26
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Old September 22, 2017, 00:36   #27
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Hard to beat a couple of 1911's, one short and one regular.
You have mags now for the full size Colt, just make sure the smaller one accepts the same magazines, just protruding out the bottom a little.
No matter what you get, it seems it always comes back to magazines, their cost and availability, plus the number you have, always the more the merrier.

If any state limits the number of rounds allowed in a magazine, just going as large as possible in caliber always makes sense.

What would the magazines cost for the FN 5.7 wonder pistol, vs plain old 1911 mags in California?

Two or three 1911 mags for cost of one FN??????
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Old September 22, 2017, 05:38   #28
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I do like that little Kimber. 380 I guess.
Nope, it's 45acp
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Old September 22, 2017, 07:31   #29
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If a full size (govt model) 1911 fits you well, then go with a Commander size 1911 which is merely a bbl that is 3/4" shorter and uses any old 1911 mags.
I carry one year round with a good belt and IWB holster and usually wear t-shirts. Printing is negligible. I stopped worrying about it.
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Old September 22, 2017, 08:47   #30
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The Kimber Ultra Carry is about as schweeet as it comes for a 1911 aficionado in a carry size package. Mine has excellent sights and is surprisingly (if not shockingly) accurate for a carry pistol.
This is my experience as well (late 90s Ultra CDP when it first became a production model). Just a great, J-frame-size, carry it everywhere pistol. The Ultra is a very specific combination of features and is headed towards 20 years of production. Nuts for a 1911. It must be the right combination for a lot of people.


However, I do think the 4" 9mm hi-cap is essentially the right answer for a boatload of questions. Belt carry? Yes. Deep carry? Yes. Ammo avail? Yes. Ease of use? Yes. Mods and accessories? Yes. More ammo? Yes.

Glock 19. M&PC 2.0. Sig. CZ. The list goes on.

People who need a carry pistol should be asking themselves why a 4" 9mm hi cap wont work for them. Hand fit is really the only reason I can think of.
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Old September 22, 2017, 08:49   #31
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kimbers suck and don't run reliably and are overpriced pieces of shit. California also sucks, and is an overpriced piece of shit full of smelly mexxican rapists. just move.
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Old September 22, 2017, 09:03   #32
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Nope, it's 45acp
I have the Ultra CDP. Should have recognized the size
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Old September 22, 2017, 09:20   #33
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Well, to go a different route. My daily carry is a S&W M&P Shield in 45ACP. It is small, easily concealable, and packs a wallop. Price is nice and until 30 September, S&W has a bonus program in place (2 boxes of Hornady Critical Defense ammo, 2 magazines for your pistol, and a mag loader).

Link to bonus plan:

https://www.smith-wesson.com/mp-rebate-v2
I second the shield 45, it is the nicest shooting 45s I own. Stopped carrying my hi power and 3" para 1911 once I got it. Same capacity as a 1911, lighter and you don't have to be locked and cocked. It also feeds anything. I have light target loads and full self defense loads and never had an issue. My 1911s are much more finicky with ammo.
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Old September 22, 2017, 09:29   #34
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kimbers suck and don't run reliably and are overpriced pieces of shit. California also sucks, and is an overpriced piece of shit full of smelly mexxican rapists. just move.
Brilliant remarks from a chap who didnt even know the caliber of the pistol he is commenting on a few posts before. You must have ESPN.
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Old September 22, 2017, 10:42   #35
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My $.02 and probably not worth that.
Hits count and bone fragments even more with a pistol.
I enjoy and have available full size 45 ACP and 10mm pistols and nice S&W 45 long colt revolvers. These were at home and have moved to second line duty behind a 5.56 rifle.
Real world, went to one of the FAL meets in Raton. Pistol run did OK with 45. increased my score by nearly 40% with 5.7, which I pulled out of the box, wiped off and ran the course. Why? fast recovery and larger magazine. Hits count and my wife likes it. Ordered red box ammo from UN ammo. What is your life worth?
At this time I am looking at the new FBI 9mm round. Very interesting! If true it opens the door to a lot of inexpensive high capacity pistols.
PS: have a 22tcm which I like but it is a real flash bang at night. Can convert from 22TCM to 9mm.
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Old September 22, 2017, 10:46   #36
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kimbers suck and don't run reliably and are overpriced pieces of shit. California also sucks, and is an overpriced piece of shit full of smelly mexxican rapists. just move.
Wow, such great info stated there. Thanks, this thread was pointless until you added your two cents. Zero fu*kin' help numb nuts. I understand if you're lonley out there in Pencil-tuckey, you gotta reach out some how... I understand.
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Old September 22, 2017, 11:20   #37
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Thanks for all the great replies. I really do appreciate it. A few things, there are NO colts on the list. With that being said the colt 1911s I do see for sale here a crazy expensive. Hell, my same model colt I bought get a handful of years back people are charging twice what I paid. Since there are a few kimbers on the list the price hasn't skyrocketed... yet. Also to the benefit of the 5.7, I live a stones throw from NV, keep a few things there and would be happy to shoot 20 and 30 rounds per mag, only there of course. I'll have to handle a compact 1911 more. I'm a big dude 6'4" 200lbs. A gov't size 1911 fits beautifully in my hand. My dad has a few sigs and xd's, I don't care for them. I will be getting my ccw with this new pistol, but I won't carry everyday. So super compact isn't as important either. In CA when you get you ccw you have to register your pistol and that's what you carry, not like every where else, get your ccw carry what you will. The two pistols I will sign onto my ccw will be the new one(which ever one) along w/ my colt 1911a1. This feed back has helped a lot. Please keep it coming.
I know you said not to tell you to move, but you're so damned close - surely you could drive a few extra miles and also sell your Kali property to buy NV property.
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Old September 22, 2017, 12:47   #38
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I would buy. Five-seven over a .45 ACP any day of the week and twice on Friday...unless I lived in California, which I never would....ever
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Old September 22, 2017, 13:50   #39
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Well, to go a different route. My daily carry is a S&W M&P Shield in 45ACP. It is small, easily concealable, and packs a wallop. Price is nice and until 30 September, S&W has a bonus program in place (2 boxes of Hornady Critical Defense ammo, 2 magazines for your pistol, and a mag loader).

Link to bonus plan:

https://www.smith-wesson.com/mp-rebate-v2
I agree with the above. I have the same Shield 45ACP... It's an exceptional value, great shooter, and comfortable to carry.
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Old September 22, 2017, 14:58   #40
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two for the 5.7...

really looking at it, that 1,399 price tag plus taxes and fees is starting to pull me the other way.

that pro carry and ultra carry are looking pretty nice. ther fact that the pro carry can use the mags from my fullsize are an added bonus.

But, if going concealed that ultra stainless is nice.
I've got to hit the LGS and handle the ultra.
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Old September 22, 2017, 15:21   #41
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two for the 5.7...

really looking at it, that 1,399 price tag plus taxes and fees is starting to pull me the other way.

that pro carry and ultra carry are looking pretty nice. ther fact that the pro carry can use the mags from my fullsize are an added bonus.

But, if going concealed that ultra stainless is nice.
I've got to hit the LGS and handle the ultra.
1550.00 out the door, wow, the number of spare mags the difference will buy, plus ammo, yea, pro carry looking real good in your situation.

Do "real" people really pay 1550.00 for a hand gun to carry around?????

Damn, one could supply a surplus Glock 40 for five men with that money dang near.

Five men with hand guns is always better than one man with a 1550.00 hand gun.
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Old September 22, 2017, 15:30   #42
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But, if going concealed that ultra stainless is nice.
I've got to hit the LGS and handle the ultra.
You are going to notice, at least on my CDP version, that it has some heavy checkering with an alloy lower and stainless slide . They are fine guns. But again it is a little cannon and after a couple of boxes you'll have had plenty.
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Old September 22, 2017, 17:47   #43
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two for the 5.7...

really looking at it, that 1,399 price tag plus taxes and fees is starting to pull me the other way.

that pro carry and ultra carry are looking pretty nice. ther fact that the pro carry can use the mags from my fullsize are an added bonus.

But, if going concealed that ultra stainless is nice.
I've got to hit the LGS and handle the ultra.
The $1399 is suggested retail price. Probably not going to pay that, $1250 is more realistic.

Do you have any interest in the PS-90? If you do, then that would be an argument for the 5.7. I think the PS-90 is very special/uniqe, I love it!

I almost bought the FN 5.7 when I shot one (around 2007). It was amazing to shoot (accuracy/low recoil) but I wasn't considering it for a carry gun. The 20 round magazine was cool but my 9mm CZ SP01 has a 19 round magazine.

I rarely carry the CZ but it goes the range every time. I don't often shoot a full 19 rounds between target changes because I can't see where the rounds are hitting.
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Old September 22, 2017, 17:55   #44
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I bought the Ruger LW Commander a few months ago and i love it! If the Ruger is not available and the Kimber (i don't know the model) LW Commander is buy it!
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Old September 22, 2017, 19:07   #45
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$1399 was what was quoted from the lgs. Cabelas was a hair cheaper, and scheels won't ship it to California because they say they the sku for the 20 rd mag and the 10 rd are different and they won't swap out 10s for 20s. As for the ps-90, I haven't thought too much about it. I have been thinking of an ar57 though...
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Old September 22, 2017, 19:12   #46
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Holy smokes. Cabelas beat someone's price?! Only in California, I guess.
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Old September 22, 2017, 21:45   #47
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the glock 27, 10 rd mag, .40 s&w, compact & potent. or the glock in .45 acp. i thought cali limited subjects to 10 round mags.

i was just in sacramento, lots of vagrants & wackos.
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Old September 22, 2017, 21:52   #48
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the glock 27, 10 rd mag, .40 s&w, compact & potent. or the glock in .45 acp. i thought cali limited subjects to 10 round mags.

i was just in sacramento, lots of vagrants & wackos.
Those were probably just the Democrat legislators.
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Old September 23, 2017, 00:45   #49
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I have a Sig Sauer 1911. 4.2 inch barrel. Love it - not anywhere as $$ as the Colt. I've attempted to get a bunch of different 10 round mags to work but non reliably. Occasionally they show up for $900-ish.

Love me the .45

I've run through Chuck Taylor's defensive handgun classes and am getting very comfy with it in simulated defensive scenarios. JUST got back from the range again today.

Here's a f'rinstance or 2: Armslist Sig 4.2 in barrel
Gunbroker Sig 1911 RCS This is my exact gun. RCS is their Custom Shop. Trigger re-work, beveled magazine well - other handy goodies.

The only mod I'd make was the extended slide release.
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Old September 23, 2017, 10:29   #50
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[QUOTE=Slaughter;4481608]I have a Sig Sauer 1911. 4.2 inch barrel. Love it - not anywhere as $$ as the Colt.





Brand new colt for 8-9...right at what you said yours was going for....and mine works with any mag I've used except for a bent lipped old beat up surplus that wound up in the trash. Don't dismiss because you haven't checked prices or shopped around.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...overnment_45_5
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