Portuguese surplus

[herodrh]

To CaptainK I believe it is. Your post is confusing. You say that you got 2k rounds of port from samco that had no corrosion issues to speak of but then you go on to say you think stuff from samco had been stored poorly? I'm sorry but I don't comprehend. As to your assertion about purchasing the linked ammo this makes absolutely no sense in my mind. The ammo in battle packs has been hermetically sealed off from oxygen and atmosphere since '82 or' 83 when it was manufactured but the linked ammo has been exposed to the ravages of atmosphere for 30 years. I just don't see the logic in that my friend. Maybe you can 'splain it to me.

[captk]

Originally Posted by captk

I picked up 2K of port locally last year($80 per pack) with about half of the battle packs dates 82. No issues with any corrosion from what has been opened so far. It looks to me like the stuff Samco imported was stored poorly and you cannot just go on the lot #'s.
I sent a current copy of my C&R today to Samco today so I can order 3 more 250 linked belts of the Port which has had no issues with corrosion.
Ken

No, I said I picked up 2K locally in battle packs. It was very local, just a few blocks from where I live, ammo was dated from 76 - 82. I was going to order the linked ammo from Samco but went with Sportsman Guide instead, free shipping and ammo cans. I have not ordered any of the Port from Samco.
As far as the condition of the ammo for links versus battle packs I would agree with you except the reports from people buying it in the packs are finding it corroded, it is even listed on the Samco website that there "may be" some corrosion. The linked ammo is also sold at a higher price. The reports I have read for the linked ammo are that the ammo is generally in very good condition. There a bunch of folks in this thread reporting corroded ammo in the packs. I use feedback from other members to make decisions about what I want to purchase. Based on their reports I am going with the linked ammo. If you decide to buy the battle packs I hope you get good condition ammo, not the corroded stuff others are reporting. For my money I'll go with the linked ammo.
I'm no expert but isn't the linked ammo stored in ammo cans or at least sealed cases? I don't see any military leaving ammo, linked or not, exposed to the ravages of the atmosphere for 30 years, maybe you can 'splain that to me?
Sorry for any confusion, Ken

[kwthor]

The pic that SamCo shows for the linked ammo looks like a wood case with a metal liner. Probably stores better than battle packs. I can't explain the partial corrosion of the boolits with the linked ammo, however the brass against cardboard is not an issue.
I ordered a case of linked a couple months ago and it came in cardboard shipping boxes and not the original case. I think the shipping weight of a full case is the issue. Will have to sort, clean and pack in ammo cans.

[herodrh]

Well gentlemen we certainly do have our choices but honestly my sentiments are somewhat in agreement with Dynomike in that some surface discoloration without attendant pitting probably won't affect your ammos performance. I think it would be worthwhile to get some info on what can be expected and what should be avoided at all cost. I'm still of the opinion that hermetically sealed ammo in battle packs should be more stable over the years. Just stubborn I guess. What has been shown and proven by the experiences of thousands of shooters - many on this forum - and others is that the portuguese ammo is just of superior quality that so many swear by it to this day. I am sort of in that camp. But you know if you are down on small discolorations on cases then maybe you should buy new production Prvi partisan or perhaps some nice PMC bronze (great ammo, I'm told) and be done with the angst. I have been shooting FNM in lots from '82 and '83 in my FAL for 15 years and my rifle flat embarrasses people at my range. I have 3 cases in my closet and plan on purchasing a couple more soon from - wait for it.... Samco!

[captk]

Originally Posted by herodrh

Well gentlemen we certainly do have our choices but honestly my sentiments are somewhat in agreement with Dynomike in that some surface discoloration without attendant pitting probably won't affect your ammos performance. I think it would be worthwhile to get some info on what can be expected and what should be avoided at all cost. I'm still of the opinion that hermetically sealed ammo in battle packs should be more stable over the years. Just stubborn I guess. What has been shown and proven by the experiences of thousands of shooters - many on this forum - and others is that the portuguese ammo is just of superior quality that so many swear by it to this day. I am sort of in that camp. But you know if you are down on small discolorations on cases then maybe you should buy new production Prvi partisan or perhaps some nice PMC bronze (great ammo, I'm told) and be done with the angst. I have been shooting FNM in lots from '82 and '83 in my FAL for 15 years and my rifle flat embarrasses people at my range. I have 3 cases in my closet and plan on purchasing a couple more soon from - wait for it.... Samco!

The linked Port and battle pack Port is the same ammo, the only difference is the packaging and condition of the ammo. The cost for 3 linked belts of Port (250 rnds each) or 4 battle packs from Samco works out pretty close to the same price when you figure in the free shipping from SG and add in cost of the ammo cans. So it's either clean it or delink it, take your choice. In the end we get the same accuracy.

Ken

[herodrh]

Originally Posted by captk

The linked Port and battle pack Port is the same ammo, the only difference is the packaging and condition of the ammo. The cost for 3 linked belts of Port (250 rnds each) or 4 battle packs from Samco works out pretty close to the same price when you figure in the free shipping from SG and add in cost of the ammo cans. So it's either clean it or delink it, take your choice. In the end we get the same accuracy.

Ken

Ken, I don't disagree with you on your point about the linked ammo in essence. However, to belabor a point once again - the battlepack (unsealed) ammo should chemically be more stable over the course of the years regardless of age and 0r appearance. This is my opinion having a rudimentary knowledge of chemistry and chemical storage. One thing that I will offer by way of the difference in a different vein is that if you are purchasing from the importer such as Samco directly and you buy the linked ammo you will be paying much more in shipping cost due to the weight of the linked ammo. You may not be doing that although I almost exclusively buy this way. The crated weight of 1000rds in battle packs is said to be 62 lbs. Samco shipped me 2k rds of FNM ammo last year packaged in cardboard boxes (as they do for customers sometimes to reduce their cost) which ended up costing me $808.00 shipped. All of the battle packs were pristine as to their integrity so I was not missing the crate so much. So it ended up costing me something like a hundred bucks for ground shipping from miami to seattle (you really can't get much further away inside the contiguous U.S.) which all things considered isn't too bad. If I were shipping the linked variety it would have been crated, much heavier in general and of course the shipping would have been more. If you are purchasing at shows and gun shops then you probably won't see the shipping expense (at least you won't think you are) and you will be content. Hey, purchase your linked FNM and have a blast (literally)!

[captk]

I received my 3 linked belts of Port from Sportsman Guide. Out of the 750 rnds, I had 7 that has some corrosion on them, all are shootable. 1 belts had 84 ammo, the other 2 83 dated ammo. There is a little tarnish on some rounds but most look like they came out of a sealed battle pack. I delinked all 3 belts and was going to order more from SG but they are on back order. I decided to order 1 more linked belt from Samco and included 2 battle packs as well. I'll post pic's of what I receive. They told me 7 - 10 days before they can ship because they are backed up with orders.
I'll have 1K of links for 308 after I delink the last belt from Samco. I would hate to throw them away, if anyone has a use for them send me a pm.

Ken

[captk]

Just finishing delinking the 250belt of ammo from Samco and opened up the battlepacks. The linked ammo had about 80 rounds with corrosion just on the tip of the bullets, the cases looked close to new.
The battlepacks had pin hooles in them, one was 82-28 and the other 82-41. the 82-28 looks in much better condition then the 82-41. I culled 76 of the 200 82-41 rounds and culled about 8 of the 82-28 rounds. I got what I was afraid I would get. Last order from Samco for this ammo.
I have 3 more linked belts due Monday from Sportsman Guide. The last 3 I got a few weeks ago from SG were in very good condition, hoping for the same this time.
I have a pic of the worst cases, these all have what appears to be pitting (pink color) on the cases. Other cases were cleaned up to shoot. I'll go over the culled rounds and what looks OK will be shot in bolt guns. The rest will be dumped.
Ken

[captk]

I contacted Samco about the rounds I consider unsafe. All of these rounds have a "pink" spot (1 or more), which appears to either weaken the brass or corrode through. To their credit they are going to replace to 105 rounds I have with questionable cases.

[adbm3]

Just got done cleaning up a 250 link 83-2 Port that I got from Samco today. I'd say about 80-100 of the rounds were corroded on the brass and bullets. I put all the corroded stuff into the tumbler for a couple of hours. Any corrosion left over I brushed off with a buffing wheel on my Dremel. There were only about 6 that appeared irredeemable. A couple had some pink on them. For the most part this ammo all looks brand new now. I also made sure I had a good coating of Amsoil Metal Protectant on the ammo after putting it all in a US 50cal can.

Its a pain cleaning this stuff but I'll probably order more.

[DYNOMIKE]

For those on the fence about PORT in B/PAKS I tried to order 40 cases of it the other day and SAMCO is OUT..

Was however able to order (and have since received) 15 cases of the LINKED ammo to check it out.. We've opened 8 cases so far and man this stuff is REALLY nice..

I suspect it too will soon be gone and then I guess we'll have to start a new thread...

Might go something like:

"WILL WE SEE ANY SURPLUS 7.62X51 THIS YEAR??"
or

"MAN I WISH I WOULDA BOUGHT SOME OF THAT NASTY ASS PORT BACK IN THE DAY"

[captk]

I ordered 1 linked belt from Samco, had 80+ rounds with corroded tips, some had the lead exposed. I shot them all. i also got 6 linked belts from Sportsman guide. I removed 7 - 8 rounds total from all 6 belts. They are sold out and no longer list the ammo. It was in excellent condition, see pic's
Ken

[adbm3]

I have one with exposed lead from the corrosion. So, is it OK to shoot? Won't hurt the barrel?

[FALRifle]

Mine looked just like that when I got some from a local shop.I was concerned about the corrosion and some of the pink spots. I polished with steal wool and got most of the grit off. The cases were black and tarnished looking. Anything that had a pink spot I sanded down with super fine sand paper just a little. Most of the pink spots were just surface blemishes. All shot fine without a problem. I love port surplus!

Originally Posted by captk

Just finishing delinking the 250belt of ammo from Samco and opened up the battlepacks. The linked ammo had about 80 rounds with corrosion just on the tip of the bullets, the cases looked close to new.
The battlepacks had pin hooles in them, one was 82-28 and the other 82-41. the 82-28 looks in much better condition then the 82-41. I culled 76 of the 200 82-41 rounds and culled about 8 of the 82-28 rounds. I got what I was afraid I would get. Last order from Samco for this ammo.
I have 3 more linked belts due Monday from Sportsman Guide. The last 3 I got a few weeks ago from SG were in very good condition, hoping for the same this time.
I have a pic of the worst cases, these all have what appears to be pitting (pink color) on the cases. Other cases were cleaned up to shoot. I'll go over the culled rounds and what looks OK will be shot in bolt guns. The rest will be dumped.
Ken

[Steve in SC]

Not too long ago I bought an Izzy HB FAL that came with 17 boxes of Port. There were 20 rounds that were discarded. I still need to pull the bullets.

[captk]

Originally Posted by DYNOMIKE

For those on the fence about PORT in B/PAKS I tried to order 40 cases of it the other day and SAMCO is OUT..

Was however able to order (and have since received) 15 cases of the LINKED ammo to check it out.. We've opened 8 cases so far and man this stuff is REALLY nice..

I suspect it too will soon be gone and then I guess we'll have to start a new thread...

Might go something like:

"WILL WE SEE ANY SURPLUS 7.62X51 THIS YEAR??"
or

"MAN I WISH I WOULDA BOUGHT SOME OF THAT NASTY ASS PORT BACK IN THE DAY"

Maybe Sportsman Guide bought it all, they are now listing cases of Port for sale. The do not list the belted ammo anymore and the packs were not there when I checked yesterday.

[pmf]

Back when this stuff was $140/case delivered, I bought a number of cases -- 10 or more years ago. This was before I had kids/a life and I shot quite a bit of it. I never encountered a single round with any corrosion. This is the NATO Portugese ammo in 200 round battle packs. The rest (6000 or so rounds) has been sitting under the stair steps in my basement on a wooden pallet for 10 or so years. I'd guess that it's still in perfect condition. What's the market for it? What are you guys payng for that corroded ammo?

[jefferyc22]

I was offered 700 rounds of in the box S&B M80 ball for .50......and I passed. No fkn way am I going to pay anywhere near .30 for shitty surplus.

[Trypcil]

CLR really does work!

[tywest]

Originally Posted by speedysst

The linked version of this ammo is good. Got 250 rounds from Sportsmans Guide and it was all good and came in a can.

this x2 im sad they are out of stock!! only had 5 corroded rounds out of 250 and they easily seperated by hand. Im sorry about all your corroded rounds.............Id be teeeeeeeed...........I wouldnt shoot pink spotted ammo.........thats what the DAG or MEN had that turned into pin holes when fired

[harleypower69]

UNAMMO.com here in Phoenix still has really nice Port for sale in bulk. I just ordered some more of it. Clean, bright brass and it shoots sweet. Just trying to help you locate some more if you are still searching.

No, I don't work for them.

Chris

[tac556-1]

Pretty unfortunate that some awesome ammo has been turned to junk by poor storage. I absolutely love Port ammo, as it has been great in all my FAL's, and sub-MOA on occasion with one or two of my guns.

My guess is that all the Port ammo that was bought from say 2000-2008 or so was from different storage facilities or exporters. This corroded stuff seems to mainly be popping up in ammo purchased within the last year or two, mainly in BP's.

I'm guessing that everyone who has some stored from a few years ago is in good shape, because it wasn't until the last year or so that the corroded stuff started being on the market. If you can find someone who has been sitting on some for a few years, it is probably better than the currently available stuff.

.50 or more for corroded ammo is just too much. I recently bought some "salvage" 7.62 x 39 ammo that actually looks better. I don't mind cleaning up ammo, so long as it was not expensive and I knew what I was getting. At the prices for .308 these days I will be avoiding it, and if you are needing some I would go with newer ammo, or look for the linked stuff.

[jefferyc22]

Port is nice but not up to NATO spec usually.....also not sub MOA.
Now DAG/MEN is right up to NATO spec and almost as accurate as Port

[ammolab]

Originally Posted by jefferyc22

Port is nice but not up to NATO spec usually.....also not sub MOA.
Now DAG/MEN is right up to NATO spec and almost as accurate as Port

How does Portugese 7.62NATO (and so marked) fail to meet NATO Specs?

You must be the only trigger puller that expects GI Ball to be "sub MOA"....Is there such a thing??? Swiss GP 11 7.5x55 is the only one I have seen to date.

[jefferyc22]

I was just responding to the above "sub. MOA" comment....port is a bit slower than other NATO.