Opinions wanted!

**skeeterbay** · December 05, 2008, 15:14

Recently I got into a conversation about re checking zero after taking a military bolt gun out of the stock. The person I was talking to said I was nuts to do all that I do. So I am just wondering exactly what the rest of you folks do when you put a bolt rifle back together such as a Mauser?

I always do the following:

Snug down the action bolts front to rear. I then torque them to forty pounds. After which I give the butt of the rifle a couple of thumps on the floor to help seat the action. I then torque again to about 50 pounds.

Once I do this I then take the gun to the range and check zero. If the groups are open for that particular rifle then I play with the bolts some more until she settles in.

I also do this with wooden stocked sporting rifles that are not bedded. The only difference is I try to torque to the factory specs if I can find them or 40 pounds.

So am I way off base with what I do? What do you folks all do?

Skeeter!

mitchellh · December 05, 2008, 17:27

Nothing, Clean any oil off, swab the bore, check head space with a field guage, and shoot.

Alas, most rifles I own shoot better than I can.

DYNOMIKE · December 05, 2008, 19:29

While I have never went to such lenghts I do/would question the Torue value you have chosen??

40-50 "FT LBS" sure seems like a Lot to me??

mj2evans · December 05, 2008, 20:44

I assume in lbs and seems like an ok process to me. Then again I completely tear down a new-to-me gun as a safety check. Have not messed with different torque values on Mauser screws (most have lock screws and I really like this feature). I can tell you first hand that playing with the torque on the rear screw of a K31 sure can help group size (check swissrifles.com). I even tried my hand at pillar and glass bedding a 91/59 and 1969 Romanian 22. The Romanian shoots remarkably well for a $90 rifle, will try out the 91/59 this weekend.

**skeeterbay** · December 05, 2008, 22:12

I am sorry Dynomike, I should have said inch pounds

mj2evans: I also completely tear down any new gun I get. However every once in a while I take down most of my rifles. Just to make sure no rust has formed under the wood. Especially if i use them a lot in the winter. They go from hot to cold to hot again which causes them to sweat. I also try to do it if I have been shooting lots of corrosive ammo. You never know were fine powder or primer resdue will end up.

Skeeter!

DYNOMIKE · December 05, 2008, 22:40

No Sweat Skeeter, I just didn't want you to bust an action screw/bolt.. I use Torque wrenches several times a week on Cyl heads, closure plates, etc. and 40 Ft Lbs is a bunch..
I suspected In. Lbs but wanted to be sure...

Prolly should have posted more anyway as I "ALWAYS" completly tear down, clean, inspect, & Lube every new (OLD) Rifle I buy.. It is and has been part of my regular thing for many years..

What I meant I don't do is re-check for any Change in POI or anything like that..
I suppose it could change though and would be interested in what effects the Tension/Tightness (is that a word) of the action screws can make??
Like the example of the K-31 what changes? I need to try that on the K-31's but wonder if it may be helpful with the Mosins as well??

**skeeterbay** · December 05, 2008, 23:02

Mike, I don't know about all rifles but I have noticed a difference on some over the years. A couple have been quite noticable. Next time you tear down a few rifles and then head back to the range. Take along a screw driver and play with the torque on the action bolts. See if you have any that get worse or get better.

Skeeter!

DYNOMIKE · December 05, 2008, 23:27

Well O.K. then I'll do it..

Very interested now in how my FINNS will react to this?? Already know what I will try first too, my New M-27..
If they shoot even better I owe you some BEERZ..

mj2evans · December 06, 2008, 00:05

The K31 respond to 1/8 turns. Tighten the rear screw well then back off about 3/4 a turn, now shoot 5 rounds - tighten 1/8 - shoot 5 more. Try this at 50-75 yards. I really did see a sweet spot. The article on swissrifles also goes into free floating the barrel and barrel band pressure also. Its worth a try. Now you make me want to try it on my Mosin.

DYNOMIKE · December 06, 2008, 07:41

Quote:

Originally posted by mj2evans
The K31 respond to 1/8 turns. Tighten the rear screw well then back off about 3/4 a turn, now shoot 5 rounds - tighten 1/8 - shoot 5 more. Try this at 50-75 yards. I really did see a sweet spot. The article on swissrifles also goes into free floating the barrel and barrel band pressure also. Its worth a try. Now you make me want to try it on my Mosin.

Good, now I have an Idea of the steps to take.. I figure I will do the Mosin the Same way.. Snug up the Action and shoot 5 Rds @ 50 yds, back off 3/4 turn and shoot 5 more.. Bring it back in with 1/8 at a time and see what happens..
COOL, give me something else to dick around with while I'm making my shoulder sore..

Now did you see the SWEET Spot while going back to Tight from that initial 3/4 turn out, and just to be sure we are talking about the FORWARD Screw/Bolt yes??

mj2evans · December 06, 2008, 09:51

Actually its the rear bolt you adjust. On the K31 I tried it turned out about 1/4 back from real tight was better than torquing the snot out of the rear stock bolt (as I had been doing...oops). I guess I was adding stress to the receiver.

**skeeterbay** · December 06, 2008, 11:34

I have no idea how a Mosin Nagant will work. But of the bolt rifles that I have that react to this. Most seem to be affected more by adjustments on the front bolt. Course the Mosin may act like the K31 does, who knows. Best to play around with them and see what you can do. What works for one rifle may or may not work for the other.

Skeeter!

December 05, 2008, 15:14	#1
skeeterbay Veteran Member Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 20461 Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,772	Opinions wanted! Recently I got into a conversation about re checking zero after taking a military bolt gun out of the stock. The person I was talking to said I was nuts to do all that I do. So I am just wondering exactly what the rest of you folks do when you put a bolt rifle back together such as a Mauser? I always do the following: Snug down the action bolts front to rear. I then torque them to forty pounds. After which I give the butt of the rifle a couple of thumps on the floor to help seat the action. I then torque again to about 50 pounds. Once I do this I then take the gun to the range and check zero. If the groups are open for that particular rifle then I play with the bolts some more until she settles in. I also do this with wooden stocked sporting rifles that are not bedded. The only difference is I try to torque to the factory specs if I can find them or 40 pounds. So am I way off base with what I do? What do you folks all do? Skeeter! __________________ 'S Rioghal 'Mo Dhream Ard Choille!

December 05, 2008, 17:27	#2
mitchellh Registered FALaholic #: 16852 Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: VA Posts: 2,033	Nothing, Clean any oil off, swab the bore, check head space with a field guage, and shoot. Alas, most rifles I own shoot better than I can. __________________ e

December 05, 2008, 19:29	#3
DYNOMIKE Registered Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 11982 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: FLORIDA Posts: 13,983	While I have never went to such lenghts I do/would question the Torue value you have chosen?? 40-50 "FT LBS" sure seems like a Lot to me?? __________________ "If your Gonna DIE, DIE Standing UP"!! The WOLVERINES.......

December 05, 2008, 22:12	#5
skeeterbay Veteran Member Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 20461 Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,772	I am sorry Dynomike, I should have said inch pounds mj2evans: I also completely tear down any new gun I get. However every once in a while I take down most of my rifles. Just to make sure no rust has formed under the wood. Especially if i use them a lot in the winter. They go from hot to cold to hot again which causes them to sweat. I also try to do it if I have been shooting lots of corrosive ammo. You never know were fine powder or primer resdue will end up. Skeeter! __________________ 'S Rioghal 'Mo Dhream Ard Choille!

December 05, 2008, 22:40	#6
DYNOMIKE Registered Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 11982 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: FLORIDA Posts: 13,983	No Sweat Skeeter, I just didn't want you to bust an action screw/bolt.. I use Torque wrenches several times a week on Cyl heads, closure plates, etc. and 40 Ft Lbs is a bunch.. I suspected In. Lbs but wanted to be sure... Prolly should have posted more anyway as I "ALWAYS" completly tear down, clean, inspect, & Lube every new (OLD) Rifle I buy.. It is and has been part of my regular thing for many years.. What I meant I don't do is re-check for any Change in POI or anything like that.. I suppose it could change though and would be interested in what effects the Tension/Tightness (is that a word) of the action screws can make?? Like the example of the K-31 what changes? I need to try that on the K-31's but wonder if it may be helpful with the Mosins as well?? __________________ "If your Gonna DIE, DIE Standing UP"!! The WOLVERINES.......

December 05, 2008, 20:44	#4
mj2evans Registered FALaholic #: 11922 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,084	I assume in lbs and seems like an ok process to me. Then again I completely tear down a new-to-me gun as a safety check. Have not messed with different torque values on Mauser screws (most have lock screws and I really like this feature). I can tell you first hand that playing with the torque on the rear screw of a K31 sure can help group size (check swissrifles.com). I even tried my hand at pillar and glass bedding a 91/59 and 1969 Romanian 22. The Romanian shoots remarkably well for a $90 rifle, will try out the 91/59 this weekend.

December 05, 2008, 23:02	#7
skeeterbay Veteran Member Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 20461 Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,772	Mike, I don't know about all rifles but I have noticed a difference on some over the years. A couple have been quite noticable. Next time you tear down a few rifles and then head back to the range. Take along a screw driver and play with the torque on the action bolts. See if you have any that get worse or get better. Skeeter! __________________ 'S Rioghal 'Mo Dhream Ard Choille!

December 05, 2008, 23:27	#8
DYNOMIKE Registered Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 11982 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: FLORIDA Posts: 13,983	Well O.K. then I'll do it.. Very interested now in how my FINNS will react to this?? Already know what I will try first too, my New M-27.. If they shoot even better I owe you some BEERZ.. __________________ "If your Gonna DIE, DIE Standing UP"!! The WOLVERINES.......

December 06, 2008, 00:05	#9
mj2evans Registered FALaholic #: 11922 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,084	The K31 respond to 1/8 turns. Tighten the rear screw well then back off about 3/4 a turn, now shoot 5 rounds - tighten 1/8 - shoot 5 more. Try this at 50-75 yards. I really did see a sweet spot. The article on swissrifles also goes into free floating the barrel and barrel band pressure also. Its worth a try. Now you make me want to try it on my Mosin.

December 06, 2008, 09:51	#11
mj2evans Registered FALaholic #: 11922 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,084	Actually its the rear bolt you adjust. On the K31 I tried it turned out about 1/4 back from real tight was better than torquing the snot out of the rear stock bolt (as I had been doing...oops). I guess I was adding stress to the receiver.

December 06, 2008, 11:34	#12
skeeterbay Veteran Member Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 20461 Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,772	I have no idea how a Mosin Nagant will work. But of the bolt rifles that I have that react to this. Most seem to be affected more by adjustments on the front bolt. Course the Mosin may act like the K31 does, who knows. Best to play around with them and see what you can do. What works for one rifle may or may not work for the other. Skeeter! __________________ 'S Rioghal 'Mo Dhream Ard Choille!

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