The anatomy of an Israeli Romat (Light Barrel)- curls 56K up like bacon - Page 2

Ziv · May 28, 2010, 04:28

Pictures?

I want one!

**Slo cat** · May 28, 2010, 08:24

Windy,

How about some pics of the forearm spacers? I notice your Izzy has two of them.

Best Regards,
Slo cat

Windustsearch · May 28, 2010, 10:08

Not sure how informative they'd be, they aren't Israeli.

When I bought this rifle it had Belgian furniture that looked like it had been used to beat a leopard. I bought the Israeli furniture and donuts and replaced it. These are the aluminum ones made by a Falfiles member.

If I could find an original spring C-clip one I'd get it, but nobody seems to want to sell theirs.

I can post pics anyway if you want though. Or anything else anyone thinks might be informative.

**Slo cat** · May 28, 2010, 13:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Windustsearch
Not sure how informative they'd be, they aren't Israeli. These are the aluminum ones made by a Falfiles member. If I could find an original spring C-clip one I'd get it, but nobody seems to want to sell theirs.

OK, thanks, don't need to see pics of aftermarket handguard spacers as I have a couple on my Izzy LB. I thought those might be originals, and I have never seen original Izzy LB spacers.

I have had a couple of Izzy heavy barrel kits and both of them had one HB spacer each.

Oh, BTW, I have an original Israeli heavy barrel spacer for sale. $825 plus shipping. And I will throw in an Izzy HB kit free!

Best Regards,
Slo cat

**2barearms** · May 28, 2010, 21:13

I'm ready to assemble my LB Clone. I didn't realize the LB had
a short combo device on it? Did they use wood grips on the
early rifles?

**2barearms** · May 28, 2010, 21:35

Quote:

Originally posted by Ironhandjohn

My humble contribution to this thread. A 1967-dated kit built on an Entreprise Arms Israel Match receiver by a friend of mine...

Is the rear sight original to the rifle, I have a beautiful new Venezuelan
that is real close to that one.

Ironhandjohn · May 29, 2010, 12:49

Quote:

Originally posted by 2barearms

Is the rear sight original to the rifle, I have a beautiful new Venezuelan
that is real close to that one.

No, the rear sight is from a Canadian C2, a 1000 meter disc. The top cover is also Canadian, and the wood grip is a US Ironwood. The rest of the rifle(other than the receiver)is Israeli.

**2barearms** · May 29, 2010, 14:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Ironhandjohn

No, the rear sight is from a Canadian C2, a 1000 meter disc. The top cover is also Canadian, and the wood grip is a US Ironwood. The rest of the rifle(other than the receiver)is Israeli.

Slow, Owlcreek, English Mike and I were checking out my Vene Rear
sight this morning while Slow barreled and HS'd it for me, I like the
way it looks and will put mine on. Other than the LB furniture and the
Charging handle everything else is not Izzy.

Ironhandjohn · May 29, 2010, 14:57

The original owner/builder of this rifle swapped the Izzy sight because it would sometimes hit his glasses under recoil. This is also why the ferrule is gone and the contour of the stock is different. The rifle was built as a shooter, so he changed a few things around.

Ductapeman · January 30, 2011, 21:58

I want to thank everyone who contributed to the wealth of enormously useful information in this thread. Some of us are still building these old warhorses, despite how far behind the curve we've gotten, and help like this is just not as easily available as it once was. On behalf of the HB Community, thanks!

And yes, this should be a sticky if it isn't already.

jaykden · January 31, 2011, 00:41

can't believe i missed this thread before.

it is now stickied!

RT · January 31, 2011, 09:11

I have shot windy's Izzy. me and the GF went to WA for a vacation and Mike took us shooting. i now have a izzy hb with 1 flaw the lower is a SED lower. every thing is Izzy, but the lower. i will try to get a pic of it.. --if any of y'all have a niw izzy lower let me know.~RT

Ironhandjohn · January 31, 2011, 16:03

Same rifle, new muzzle-thingy...

This is my old '67-dated LB with the Israeli grenade launcher installed. Nothing fancy, it clips right on over the barrel lug. Found at Knob Creek back in October for $20...... The launcher, that is! The rifle was quite a bit more than that.

Also, I found the original Izzy front sling swivel assembly in a box of non-gun related stuff! The original screw had stripped out, so I swapped the entire part out for a generic swivel. After finding the original part I simply swapped screws and everything was once again cool.

HighRatMaster · January 31, 2011, 16:20

Here's a top and bottom view of the charge handle on my HBAR, bought the kit about 16 years ago and everything appeared new and unused except the charge handle and handguard spacer. The diameters of the knob are .600 and .800

**gunplumber** · February 02, 2011, 07:46

In the context of Israel as a country frequently at war, like south africa (due to the embargo) there is little that can't be called "correct". Anything that worked was used.

I don't have both of the cocking handles handy - just a heavy barrel with the cocking slide with the flat. The knob appears to be longer.

While I always associated the shorter knob with the standard barrel and the taller knob with the heavy barrel, I don't see why the flat would be restricted to the FALO. Maybe its just a lightening cut?

I don't have both right now to compare but I think they are interchangeable.

**gunplumber** · February 02, 2011, 07:51

Quote:

Originally posted by Slo cat
Where can one get an Izzy hinge pin washer thingy? I have a nice Izzy HB kit I built that is missing this part.

Brad had some as of yesterday

**Slo cat** · February 02, 2011, 11:10

Quote:

Originally posted by gunplumber Brad had some as of yesterday

Thanks, but I bought a couple of the Izzy hinge pin washers from Sarco some time ago. $4. http://e-sarcoinc.com/falhingepinwasher.aspx

Ironhandjohn · February 03, 2011, 11:26

I don't think mine had a washer at all, so I used a crush washer out of the parts bin that I parked at work one day. Not 100% but nothing's come loose, either.

Ironhandjohn · April 14, 2011, 17:33

This is the same rifle I've shown several times before, but with a few new things.

At Knob Creek last Friday I traded off the C2 1000 meter disc rear sight for an Israeli 600 meter rear sight, plus a new Israeli stock. The one that was on my rifle was an Israeli light-barrel stock, but the builder/previous owner reshaped the front of it, as well as deleting the ferrule. While the modified stock was more comfortable, I am more than happy to have the original parts on my rifle! I also found the original gas regulator in my box-o-parts and put it back on, replacing the metric collar the builder used.

Today at the range I had my work cut out for me!! The front sight had to be cranked almost completely down in order to re-zero the rifle. It still hits a little low @ 50yds, but it's in the bull. I also had to readjust the gas regulator, and I understand why the builder used a standard metric piece. There are too many clicks on the Izzy unit, and the result was it took me 25rds to get in the ballpark. I finally got it tuned in at the 5-setting.

Anyway, I had the range to myself for most of the afternoon. There were a bunch of cops doing some form of firearms training when I got there, but they were finishing up. It was a good day!!

Windustsearch · May 05, 2011, 11:04

Quote:

Originally posted by 2barearms
I'm ready to assemble my LB Clone. I didn't realize the LB had
a short combo device on it? Did they use wood grips on the
early rifles?

I think it was just the real late production ones that had the Belgian combo device. Word around here is that they were largely out of production for general military issue at the time and were being made and used as DMRs with some kind of optic or NV and the flash hider. That barrel dates to 1981, and by then regular issue was Galils, M16s, and probably still some AK-47/AKM pick-ups.

Not sure about the wood grips, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of the real early ones had them.

**embatp** · July 22, 2011, 12:40

here's mine....

Ironhandjohn · October 20, 2011, 15:30

Are Israeli gas regulator collars marked as such? I swapped out the one-turn standard metric piece for the one in the bag of Izzy parts that came with the rifle, and the Israeli collar shows no markings other than the numbers stamped in the grooves.

The search function turns up nothing useful..

Windustsearch · October 20, 2011, 16:45

Mine just has the numbers.

**Bug Tussell** · February 07, 2012, 09:39

I'm seeing an Izzy LB in my future.

Windustsearch · May 11, 2012, 03:54

A few things I've noticed lately; the earliest use of the beveled gas block I've seen is Ironhand's 1967 example (they were clearly in use during the Six Day War, so probably they are earlier). The earliest I've seen the barrels with a flash hider is 1972. The latest I've seen of an Israeli made barrel is my 1981 example. Please add info if you have something outstanding from this. This will help in deciding whether a type I or a Type II receiver would be correct for people's builds, and other things.

Now I will post old photos.

Windustsearch · May 11, 2012, 04:18

The markings on an Israeli light barrel;

Ironhandjohn · May 18, 2012, 11:55

From my last range trip a few weeks ago.

Since Pat's passing last year, who does engraving like the ones in winddustsearch's pic??

Windustsearch · May 20, 2012, 10:16

Orion Arms does similar engraving.

http://www.orion-arms.com/gun-engrav...engraving.html

Ironhandjohn · May 23, 2012, 18:30

Cool!!

More Izzy pics are needed to this thread......... Cough 'em up!

aus71383 · June 06, 2012, 21:36

I'm very pleased to have found this thread - I just got my Izzy LB handguards and stock from Sarco, and I've been cleaning the cosmoline off the handguards. I don't think I'm going to use the buttstock though - I don't like the look of the ferule, and I may get an Ironwood stock and then stain the handguards to match.

My rifle is a DSA - nothing Israeli about it, and it has an 18" barrel. Still this thread was a great read - thanks for sharing all the pictures and information. It was nice to at least see that there were Type A stocks on these guns as well.

Thanks again,

Austin

CLP · August 09, 2012, 22:07

I too want to thank everyone for this thread. I always liked the Izzy furniture and just ordered a set from Sarco which I will put on one of mine.

Ironhandjohn · December 19, 2012, 19:28

My old rifle with a new(to me) barrel. It has the '0' stamp, 4/71 date, and both the barrel lug and muzzle threads.

homebrewkid · December 19, 2012, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ironhandjohn

My old rifle with a new(to me) barrel. It has the '0' stamp, 4/71 date, and both the barrel lug and muzzle threads.

Thanks for posting those pics!!! I have had one of those slings for years and never could figure out how to attach it....

Nice gun BTW.....

Ironhandjohn · January 25, 2013, 16:13

This is a buddy of mine airing out some targets with The Hammer last weekend.

May 28, 2010, 04:28	#51
Ziv Registered FALaholic #: 53007 Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: NY Posts: 32	Pictures? Pictures? I want one!

May 28, 2010, 08:24	#52
Slo cat Veteran Member Gold Contributor FALaholic #: 11908 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Corner of 'Walk' and 'Don't Walk' Posts: 2,362	Windy, How about some pics of the forearm spacers? I notice your Izzy has two of them. Best Regards, Slo cat __________________ Always do the right thing. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest. Mark Twain Sicher - Einzelfeuer - Dauerfeuer ORWAC 68-2, NRA DR #24, CMP DP #922, P-100

May 28, 2010, 21:13	#55
2barearms 3 Percent Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 13866 Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Houston,Texas Posts: 8,656	I'm ready to assemble my LB Clone. I didn't realize the LB had a short combo device on it? Did they use wood grips on the early rifles? __________________ "Owning a Firearm doesn't make you Armed any more than owning a Guitar makes you a Musician" Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

January 30, 2011, 21:58	#60
Ductapeman Registered FALaholic #: 17797 Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Sunny Puget Sound Posts: 349	I want to thank everyone who contributed to the wealth of enormously useful information in this thread. Some of us are still building these old warhorses, despite how far behind the curve we've gotten, and help like this is just not as easily available as it once was. On behalf of the HB Community, thanks! And yes, this should be a sticky if it isn't already. __________________ Just because it stopped smoking doesn't mean you can pick it up. -FotBR I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure.--Clarence Darrow

January 31, 2011, 00:41	#61
jaykden Moderator Resident Alaskan FALaholic #: 3800 Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: sitka, ak Posts: 4,221	can't believe i missed this thread before. it is now stickied! __________________ In a family of fudds, i'm the black sheep of the family...... EBR black, that is...

May 28, 2010, 10:08	#53
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	Not sure how informative they'd be, they aren't Israeli. When I bought this rifle it had Belgian furniture that looked like it had been used to beat a leopard. I bought the Israeli furniture and donuts and replaced it. These are the aluminum ones made by a Falfiles member. If I could find an original spring C-clip one I'd get it, but nobody seems to want to sell theirs. I can post pics anyway if you want though. Or anything else anyone thinks might be informative.

May 29, 2010, 14:57	#59
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	The original owner/builder of this rifle swapped the Izzy sight because it would sometimes hit his glasses under recoil. This is also why the ferrule is gone and the contour of the stock is different. The rifle was built as a shooter, so he changed a few things around.

January 31, 2011, 09:11	#62
RT Signal Zero Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 9330 Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Florida Posts: 4,016	I have shot windy's Izzy. me and the GF went to WA for a vacation and Mike took us shooting. i now have a izzy hb with 1 flaw the lower is a SED lower. every thing is Izzy, but the lower. i will try to get a pic of it.. --if any of y'all have a niw izzy lower let me know.~RT __________________ ~RT

January 31, 2011, 16:03	#63
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	Same rifle, new muzzle-thingy... This is my old '67-dated LB with the Israeli grenade launcher installed. Nothing fancy, it clips right on over the barrel lug. Found at Knob Creek back in October for $20...... The launcher, that is! The rifle was quite a bit more than that. Also, I found the original Izzy front sling swivel assembly in a box of non-gun related stuff! The original screw had stripped out, so I swapped the entire part out for a generic swivel. After finding the original part I simply swapped screws and everything was once again cool.

January 31, 2011, 16:20	#64
HighRatMaster Registered Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 19296 Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Oleta CA USA Posts: 1,186	Here's a top and bottom view of the charge handle on my HBAR, bought the kit about 16 years ago and everything appeared new and unused except the charge handle and handguard spacer. The diameters of the knob are .600 and .800 __________________ It doesn't matter what you miss them with. Don't bother burying your guns because that's the time they need to be dug up. "You in or out?" "I'll take his legs."

February 02, 2011, 07:46	#65
gunplumber Arrogant Bastard Gold Contributor FALaholic #: 96 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Surprise, AZ Posts: 15,765	In the context of Israel as a country frequently at war, like south africa (due to the embargo) there is little that can't be called "correct". Anything that worked was used. I don't have both of the cocking handles handy - just a heavy barrel with the cocking slide with the flat. The knob appears to be longer. While I always associated the shorter knob with the standard barrel and the taller knob with the heavy barrel, I don't see why the flat would be restricted to the FALO. Maybe its just a lightening cut? I don't have both right now to compare but I think they are interchangeable. __________________ T. Mark Graham Master Gunsmith Arizona Response Systems, LLC

February 03, 2011, 11:26	#68
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	I don't think mine had a washer at all, so I used a crush washer out of the parts bin that I parked at work one day. Not 100% but nothing's come loose, either.

April 14, 2011, 17:33	#69
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	This is the same rifle I've shown several times before, but with a few new things. At Knob Creek last Friday I traded off the C2 1000 meter disc rear sight for an Israeli 600 meter rear sight, plus a new Israeli stock. The one that was on my rifle was an Israeli light-barrel stock, but the builder/previous owner reshaped the front of it, as well as deleting the ferrule. While the modified stock was more comfortable, I am more than happy to have the original parts on my rifle! I also found the original gas regulator in my box-o-parts and put it back on, replacing the metric collar the builder used. Today at the range I had my work cut out for me!! The front sight had to be cranked almost completely down in order to re-zero the rifle. It still hits a little low @ 50yds, but it's in the bull. I also had to readjust the gas regulator, and I understand why the builder used a standard metric piece. There are too many clicks on the Izzy unit, and the result was it took me 25rds to get in the ballpark. I finally got it tuned in at the 5-setting. Anyway, I had the range to myself for most of the afternoon. There were a bunch of cops doing some form of firearms training when I got there, but they were finishing up. It was a good day!!

July 22, 2011, 12:40	#71
embatp What? Me AR? Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 39856 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: ga. Posts: 1,920	here's mine.... __________________ "only he is lost who gives himself up for lost" "Fighting Douchebags from the sky When they get hurt, they start to cry 100 men will test today But only 3, will want to stay You've built your FAL, you've passed the test Sell your ARs and all the rest You'll go to Hell and back again But you'll be with, men among men Back at home, the old lady waits The Big Brown Truck, brought 3 more crates He swore this time would be the last But she took his FAL, and shot his ass" ce

October 20, 2011, 15:30	#72
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	Are Israeli gas regulator collars marked as such? I swapped out the one-turn standard metric piece for the one in the bag of Izzy parts that came with the rifle, and the Israeli collar shows no markings other than the numbers stamped in the grooves. The search function turns up nothing useful.. __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

October 20, 2011, 16:45	#73
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	Mine just has the numbers.

February 07, 2012, 09:39	#74
Bug Tussell Curio & Relic Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 2872 Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Rusticating USA Posts: 2,428	I'm seeing an Izzy LB in my future. __________________ Make your time

May 11, 2012, 03:54	#75
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	A few things I've noticed lately; the earliest use of the beveled gas block I've seen is Ironhand's 1967 example (they were clearly in use during the Six Day War, so probably they are earlier). The earliest I've seen the barrels with a flash hider is 1972. The latest I've seen of an Israeli made barrel is my 1981 example. Please add info if you have something outstanding from this. This will help in deciding whether a type I or a Type II receiver would be correct for people's builds, and other things. Now I will post old photos. Last edited by Windustsearch; May 11, 2012 at 04:24.

May 11, 2012, 04:18	#76
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	The markings on an Israeli light barrel;

May 18, 2012, 11:55	#77
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	From my last range trip a few weeks ago. Since Pat's passing last year, who does engraving like the ones in winddustsearch's pic?? __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

May 20, 2012, 10:16	#78
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	Orion Arms does similar engraving. http://www.orion-arms.com/gun-engrav...engraving.html

May 23, 2012, 18:30	#79
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	Cool!! More Izzy pics are needed to this thread......... Cough 'em up! __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

June 06, 2012, 21:36	#80
aus71383 Registered FALaholic #: 41174 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: WA Posts: 1	I'm very pleased to have found this thread - I just got my Izzy LB handguards and stock from Sarco, and I've been cleaning the cosmoline off the handguards. I don't think I'm going to use the buttstock though - I don't like the look of the ferule, and I may get an Ironwood stock and then stain the handguards to match. My rifle is a DSA - nothing Israeli about it, and it has an 18" barrel. Still this thread was a great read - thanks for sharing all the pictures and information. It was nice to at least see that there were Type A stocks on these guns as well. Thanks again, Austin __________________ Austin

August 09, 2012, 22:07	#81
CLP Registered Contributor FALaholic #: 61859 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: SE MI Posts: 40	Izzy Fal I too want to thank everyone for this thread. I always liked the Izzy furniture and just ordered a set from Sarco which I will put on one of mine. __________________ www.cqtusa.com

December 19, 2012, 19:28	#82
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	Latest incarnation of the "Hebrew Hammer" My old rifle with a new(to me) barrel. It has the '0' stamp, 4/71 date, and both the barrel lug and muzzle threads. __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

January 25, 2013, 16:13	#84
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	'The Hammer' at a local shoot last weekend.. This is a buddy of mine airing out some targets with The Hammer last weekend. __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

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