Fussy DSA only likes SOME mags while IMBEL luvs 'em all!

b-dog · February 17, 2007, 20:39

Here's my situation: 2 Fals - one "new" DSA Stg 58; the other an Imbel kit gun built by a fal files member.

The Imbel will do anything I want it to...

The DSA has a few issues which I haven't been able to pin down.

Some mags fit *really* tight in the DSA (not so tight in the imbel). These same mags when inserted into the DSA will flip the first round out causing a FTF if you don't realize it before cocking. With the IMBEL... it's not as tight - but will not flip out the round when inserted.

I'll ask now if anyone knows what the deal is here and whether or not to send back to DSA and then below I'll tell you my observations and grinding, sanding, observations.

OBSERVATIONS:
----------------------

1. All but one of the mags that will flip out the first round on the DSA are the type of mags with the follower with the shorter 'hump' (for lack of a better word). You know - the type of follower that if you are looking from the top you can see the two holes at the back end VS the type with the longer 'hump' and no holes visiblee from the top.

2. When comparing the mags that work with those that don't I've noticed that the ones that don't the first round sets back (closer to operator) further than the round below it. On the mags that work the top most round sets level with or slightly forward of the round below it. If I manually push the topmost round forward a bit on the mags that don't work the first round will not pop out... I don't know if the successive rounds will cause any FTF - haven't tested in field.

ATTEMPTED SOLUTIONS:
---------------------------------

1. Thought maybe the tighter fitting mags had too much parkerizing on them so I sanded about half way down. No good.

2. I thought maybe the mag catch (the lil' hump of metal on the mag itself) was not tapered enough causing a high friction mag insertion so I grinded it down and tapered it real nice. NO GO!

SOMETHING I WAS THINKING ABOUT ATTEMPTING:
----------------------------------------------------------------
1- I was thinking - for a fix to the first round popping out of some mags - of grinding down the little pin that lifts up the bolt hold open - the part that touches the magazine follower - as it seems that this is the culprit for this problem.

Are these two seperate problems that just some how coincidentally coincide with the tight fitting mags or are these problems connected some how??

Anway, thanks for reading and responding.

-Brian

dirtyrice · February 18, 2007, 06:06

STOP GRINDING EVERYTHING. jk. I dunno where'd you get the magazines.

chromestarhustler · February 18, 2007, 06:31

dont be surprised if the kit gun with the used "surplus" barrel shoots better than the new us made gun with its superior barrel.

Rosstradamus · February 18, 2007, 12:08

Quote:

Some mags fit *really* tight in the DSA (not so tight in the imbel).

My experience is just the opposite. My DSA is kind of loose. My Imbel GL is kind of tight. The difference is very small and not the source of any problems. All mags work in both.

**BUFF** · February 18, 2007, 12:38

Are you aware of the difference between inch and metric mags?

(Probably, just a thought.)

b-dog · February 18, 2007, 12:44

All the mags are metric.

ggiilliiee · February 18, 2007, 12:59

look at the base of the spent rounds any deep scratches at the base ???

b-dog · February 18, 2007, 22:27

Quote:

Originally posted by ggiilliiee
look at the base of the spent rounds any deep scratches at the base ???

I haven't noticed any.... I can check next time I go out but what would this mean?

-thx,

-Brian

b-dog · February 20, 2007, 19:18

Come on guys, don't give up on me that easy!

At least explain the difference between the Austrian and belgian mags and other countrys' mags...

W.E.G.?? I know you have something to contribute! Don't hold back!

I'd like to get this rectified... worse case... I'll trash a few mags but would like to know which mags to avoid in the future.

Give me your 2 cents or 3 dollar bills!!!

EricCartmanR1 · February 20, 2007, 19:33

My SA58 loves all the mags, even the dented ones.

b-dog · February 20, 2007, 19:41

"My SA58 loves all the mags, even the dented ones."

Super!

My rifle loves even the dented mags too! Please read the post before you post!
(sounds kinda redundant don't it?)

Para Driver · February 21, 2007, 13:27

just a total WAG, but the Ejector Block is not installed correctly, causing magazine misalignment??

jbrooks · February 21, 2007, 13:50

SAME THING HAPPENED to me...

Solution:

You said top round sits back a little. Look at the rear of the mag, inside. There is a fold in the sheetmetal on both sides. If the fold does not push the top round forward enough, it hangs up on the pin sticking out of the mag catch. This can be caused by the fold being dented "in". Some mags have this fold closed on top, so it cannot be dented.

Take a thin screwdriver and bend the fold back out so the top round sits further forward. Easy to do once you've found the problem.

Some pins on mag catches are tapered, but this is not the original configuration.

If I could post pics, this would be clear as a bell. PM me if you need more help, I can email you pics.

JWB

Nightops · February 21, 2007, 14:17

Are you saying that if you have the bolt held open, and lock in a full mag, the top round pops loose of the feed lips?

Sounds like something may be distorting the mag body when you lock it in.

ce · February 21, 2007, 14:29

Buy another bolt hold open from DSA for $15.
But it sounds like the rails are forcing the left side round of a full magazine to the center, and allowing an egress for the recalcitrant round, which is then propelled out of the breech.

Keep grinding, you will address the problem area eventually.
Try the undersides of the rails next. Grind sharp edges smooth to the touch. You do like touching it, n'est pas?
It feels good, yes?That's from all the grinding, so smooth, so voluptuously tapered to a svelte opening with easy insertion.

But keep buying parts, when in doubt, buy parts, try them on, buy more parts.

Soon you will have enough to build another rifle, this one will take notice and behave.

b-dog · February 21, 2007, 15:02

Quote:

Originally posted by Nightops
Are you saying that if you have the bolt held open, and lock in a full mag, the top round pops loose of the feed lips?

Sounds like something may be distorting the mag body when you lock it in.

This is exactly what I'm saying but it only happens on SOME of the mags.

Could it be an Austrian mag vs. Belgian mag thing? What is the difference anyway?

**W.E.G.** · February 21, 2007, 15:44

Quote:

Originally posted by b-dog

This is exactly what I'm saying but it only happens on SOME of the mags.

Could it be an Austrian mag vs. Belgian mag thing? What is the difference anyway?

Its simply the relationship of the two parts that need to engage.

You've only got one pin that sticks out, but you got lots of humps - from diverse parts of the world - you seek to engage.

Keep your eye on the pin, and be careful where you stick it.
Here's another expedient solution.

Can anybody tell me what is the difference between the picture on the top, and the picture on the bottom?

And what is the significance in the context of this discussion?

**W.E.G.** · February 21, 2007, 15:49

Another pic to ponder.

Anybody care to comment?

**W.E.G.** · February 21, 2007, 15:50

And for the bolt-hold-open-blues generally:
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showt...hreadid=143624

ce · February 21, 2007, 15:57

Ummm, ggiilliiee worked on yer ejector, and now your coat is confetti?

owlcreekok · February 21, 2007, 15:58

Top= Left Stack

Bottom= Right stack

As one who has fought in the big "Left Stack in her Century" engagement, I know that ground well.

As far as your Imbel having an inferior barrel to the DSA.............

owlcreekok · February 21, 2007, 16:00

Quote:

Another pic to ponder.

Ahhhh, the short pitot tube syndrome. Pilots so equipped must needs taxi closer to the urinal.

Gunga Din · February 21, 2007, 16:18

This thread gets into magazine inspection. Not your exact problem, but you may want to check the rear feed lips as described.

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showt...threadid=61936

Gunga Din · February 21, 2007, 16:37

Quote:

Originally posted by W.E.G.
....Another pic to ponder.....

I'm thinkin' it's a deformed projection on the mag follower. Possibly conjoined with a slightly worn pin on the BHO.

jbrooks · February 21, 2007, 17:42

Read this from the original post:

"When comparing the mags that work with those that don't I've noticed that the ones that don't the first round sets back (closer to operator) further than the round below "

The round "setting back" is caused by a deformed mag, just to the rear of the round.

In the mags above, this will not happen since the rolled sheetmetal to the rear of the round is "closed" at the top.

Izzy mags, and others, are open at the top and can get deformed.

I will send pics to b-dog, if someone can post them for me I will email them to you also.

HTH,

JWB

Gunga Din · February 21, 2007, 21:21

I'll put 'em up. iiiATpenn.com

jbrooks · February 21, 2007, 21:54

Thanks,

PM sent.

JWB

jbrooks · February 21, 2007, 22:25

I just sent the pics to Gunga Din (THANKS!).

It will be clear what the issue is. When either side is deformedas in the pic, the round sits too far back and hooks onto the pin in the mag catch.

Some folks trim the pin down, to avoid hitting the base of the round. This is not good, as ti simply fixes a symptom, not the problem.

IMO, only the mags that have a "closed" fold as in the pics should be used for serious business. The IZZY mags I have are all unsuited for that purpose. If you drop a mag and the rounds cause the rear of the mag to be deformed as in the pics, they can be fixed by opening the fold back up, but this will only be temporary.

JWB

MTS · February 21, 2007, 22:40

I'd like to see those mag pics, myself. I've been chasing a "bolt rides over round" problem for a while.

Gunga Din · February 21, 2007, 22:44

Here are jbrooks' photographs: (This is good info.)

Gunga Din · February 21, 2007, 22:49

For bolt over base, also please check out the info in the thread I mentioned above.

jbrooks · February 22, 2007, 00:51

To add to the above:

We usually think of slapping the mag against the palm of a hand to "seat" the rounds to the rear. This works fine for the M-14 type mags, and the M1 garand clips. But the FAL mag is made so the rounds are critically placed, and the tip of the bullet must be forward, as opposed to the base of the cartridge being "seated' to the rear.

So if you have a FAL mag, I suggest you "tap" it so as to force the bullet tips forward, just the opposite of the M1 and M-14.

JWB

Windustsearch · February 22, 2007, 01:44

I am holding and looking at an Israeli mag that has closed folds, so they are not all the same. I went and looked at all 10 of my Israeli mags and they all have the closed folds. All have the Israeli stamp inside the oval.

jbrooks · February 22, 2007, 02:03

Interesting...

So not all Izzy's are created equal. All 3 of my Izzy's have the "open fold".

JWB

b-dog · February 23, 2007, 18:52

JBROOKS, sorry I didn't get your PM until now and see that you've already posted the pics.

The pics are informative however. I guess all my mags are Argy (bought from kfranz) since they do not have a 'hollow' fold but are solid. And just by looking at them they seem to be fine. I'll have to go load them up and take a look again.

**W.E.G.** · February 23, 2007, 18:57

Let's look at the symptoms.

Tight mag in the mag well.

BHO pin interferes with rounds in the magazine.

I'd say the ejector block is just a hair forward of where it ideally should be.

I'd trim that BHO pin just a smidgen.

b-dog · February 23, 2007, 19:27

Behold! The mags that mostly have this problem are the ones on the left...

Are these two mags from different countries? If so , any idea which?

b-dog · February 23, 2007, 19:30

Here's a pic of both mags (one good vs bad) both of the solid fold type that Jbrooks posted but one clearly has a set back round....

**W.E.G.** · February 23, 2007, 20:05

Do you have any NEW magazines you can use?

That one with the (looks to me like) collapsed fold probably should be put in the Grade 2 box.

jbrooks · February 23, 2007, 21:58

I agree.

The "closed fold" can still get deformed, which looks exactly like what has happened to yours. Take the spring and follower out and inspect the folds very carefully.

Go ahead and use it as a "target of opportunity"!

Do NOT mix it up with your good mags. Although it will function if you Tap it Forward as I mentioned above, my preference is to not have ANY mags that are not 100%.

JWB

MTS · February 24, 2007, 10:14

In reading this thread (very informative) and continuing to look at the "bolt over round" issue I have, I found a mag issue that may or may not matter.

I have my magazines divided into those that don't work at all, and those that work most of the time. The bad ones all have some play in them which allows the follower to move front to back. The good ones do not allow that movement.

I'll be going back to the range soon and see how much good the polishing and other steps I've learned here does with the better magazines.

b-dog · February 25, 2007, 20:04

The bad mag in the pic is a bit exaggerated... I have some mags that aren't as obviously set back which are little culprits as well. Funny thing is - the Imbel will take 'em no matter what shape they're in. Instead of seperating the mags into 'work' and 'don't work' bins I'll probably have to go w/ an "imbel" bin and "DSA" bin.

February 17, 2007, 20:39	#1
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	Fussy DSA only likes SOME mags while IMBEL luvs 'em all! Here's my situation: 2 Fals - one "new" DSA Stg 58; the other an Imbel kit gun built by a fal files member. The Imbel will do anything I want it to... The DSA has a few issues which I haven't been able to pin down. Some mags fit really tight in the DSA (not so tight in the imbel). These same mags when inserted into the DSA will flip the first round out causing a FTF if you don't realize it before cocking. With the IMBEL... it's not as tight - but will not flip out the round when inserted. I'll ask now if anyone knows what the deal is here and whether or not to send back to DSA and then below I'll tell you my observations and grinding, sanding, observations. OBSERVATIONS: ---------------------- 1. All but one of the mags that will flip out the first round on the DSA are the type of mags with the follower with the shorter 'hump' (for lack of a better word). You know - the type of follower that if you are looking from the top you can see the two holes at the back end VS the type with the longer 'hump' and no holes visiblee from the top. 2. When comparing the mags that work with those that don't I've noticed that the ones that don't the first round sets back (closer to operator) further than the round below it. On the mags that work the top most round sets level with or slightly forward of the round below it. If I manually push the topmost round forward a bit on the mags that don't work the first round will not pop out... I don't know if the successive rounds will cause any FTF - haven't tested in field. ATTEMPTED SOLUTIONS: --------------------------------- 1. Thought maybe the tighter fitting mags had too much parkerizing on them so I sanded about half way down. No good. 2. I thought maybe the mag catch (the lil' hump of metal on the mag itself) was not tapered enough causing a high friction mag insertion so I grinded it down and tapered it real nice. NO GO! SOMETHING I WAS THINKING ABOUT ATTEMPTING: ---------------------------------------------------------------- 1- I was thinking - for a fix to the first round popping out of some mags - of grinding down the little pin that lifts up the bolt hold open - the part that touches the magazine follower - as it seems that this is the culprit for this problem. Are these two seperate problems that just some how coincidentally coincide with the tight fitting mags or are these problems connected some how?? Anway, thanks for reading and responding. -Brian

February 18, 2007, 06:31	#3
chromestarhustler Registered FALaholic #: 19815 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: kansas Posts: 3,427	dont be surprised if the kit gun with the used "surplus" barrel shoots better than the new us made gun with its superior barrel. __________________ My God in heaven, watch over me and please let me be victorous over mine ememies, but if i must fall in battle let me be brave i am a member of the ammo hoarders of america, ask me about selling your ammo for my fun and your profit

February 18, 2007, 12:38	#5
BUFF Old Fart Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 789 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 7,135	Are you aware of the difference between inch and metric mags? (Probably, just a thought.) __________________ BUFF

February 21, 2007, 15:49	#18
W.E.G. Administrator Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 1211 Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Virginia Posts: 31,052	Another pic to ponder. Anybody care to comment? __________________ . . . Ask me about the Mason-Dixon FAL Collectors Association.

February 21, 2007, 15:50	#19
W.E.G. Administrator Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 1211 Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Virginia Posts: 31,052	And for the bolt-hold-open-blues generally: http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showt...hreadid=143624 __________________ . . . Ask me about the Mason-Dixon FAL Collectors Association.

February 18, 2007, 06:06	#2
dirtyrice Registered FALaholic #: 20129 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 5,771	STOP GRINDING EVERYTHING. jk. I dunno where'd you get the magazines.

February 18, 2007, 12:44	#6
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	All the mags are metric.

February 18, 2007, 12:59	#7
ggiilliiee banned again FALaholic #: 17179 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: orygun Posts: 4,838	look at the base of the spent rounds any deep scratches at the base ???

February 20, 2007, 19:18	#9
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	Come on guys, don't give up on me that easy! At least explain the difference between the Austrian and belgian mags and other countrys' mags... W.E.G.?? I know you have something to contribute! Don't hold back! I'd like to get this rectified... worse case... I'll trash a few mags but would like to know which mags to avoid in the future. Give me your 2 cents or 3 dollar bills!!!

February 20, 2007, 19:33	#10
EricCartmanR1 Hobbyist among Operators Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 20092 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada Posts: 1,552	My SA58 loves all the mags, even the dented ones.

February 20, 2007, 19:41	#11
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	"My SA58 loves all the mags, even the dented ones." Super! My rifle loves even the dented mags too! Please read the post before you post! (sounds kinda redundant don't it?)

February 21, 2007, 13:27	#12
Para Driver Registered FALaholic #: 6350 Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 6,297	just a total WAG, but the Ejector Block is not installed correctly, causing magazine misalignment??

February 21, 2007, 13:50	#13
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	SAME THING HAPPENED to me... Solution: You said top round sits back a little. Look at the rear of the mag, inside. There is a fold in the sheetmetal on both sides. If the fold does not push the top round forward enough, it hangs up on the pin sticking out of the mag catch. This can be caused by the fold being dented "in". Some mags have this fold closed on top, so it cannot be dented. Take a thin screwdriver and bend the fold back out so the top round sits further forward. Easy to do once you've found the problem. Some pins on mag catches are tapered, but this is not the original configuration. If I could post pics, this would be clear as a bell. PM me if you need more help, I can email you pics. JWB

February 21, 2007, 14:17	#14
Nightops Registered FALaholic #: 14221 Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: OK Posts: 257	Are you saying that if you have the bolt held open, and lock in a full mag, the top round pops loose of the feed lips? Sounds like something may be distorting the mag body when you lock it in.

February 21, 2007, 14:29	#15
ce Registered FALaholic #: 373 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: New Mexico Posts: 5,903	Buy another bolt hold open from DSA for $15. But it sounds like the rails are forcing the left side round of a full magazine to the center, and allowing an egress for the recalcitrant round, which is then propelled out of the breech. Keep grinding, you will address the problem area eventually. Try the undersides of the rails next. Grind sharp edges smooth to the touch. You do like touching it, n'est pas? It feels good, yes?That's from all the grinding, so smooth, so voluptuously tapered to a svelte opening with easy insertion. But keep buying parts, when in doubt, buy parts, try them on, buy more parts. Soon you will have enough to build another rifle, this one will take notice and behave.

February 21, 2007, 15:57	#20
ce Registered FALaholic #: 373 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: New Mexico Posts: 5,903	Ummm, ggiilliiee worked on yer ejector, and now your coat is confetti?

February 21, 2007, 15:58	#21
owlcreekok Registered FALaholic #: 15323 Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Tejas Posts: 9,331	Top= Left Stack Bottom= Right stack As one who has fought in the big "Left Stack in her Century" engagement, I know that ground well. As far as your Imbel having an inferior barrel to the DSA............. __________________ "It is necessary for the welfare of the nation that men's lives be based on the principles of the Bible. No man, educated or uneducated, can afford to be ignorant of the Bible." - Theodore Roosevelt - (1858-1919) 26th President of the United States FOUNDER- Free ggiilliiee Foundation hehe

February 21, 2007, 16:18	#23
Gunga Din Registered FALaholic #: 7437 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Pgh., PA Posts: 3,853	This thread gets into magazine inspection. Not your exact problem, but you may want to check the rear feed lips as described. http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showt...threadid=61936

February 21, 2007, 17:42	#25
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	Read this from the original post: "When comparing the mags that work with those that don't I've noticed that the ones that don't the first round sets back (closer to operator) further than the round below " The round "setting back" is caused by a deformed mag, just to the rear of the round. In the mags above, this will not happen since the rolled sheetmetal to the rear of the round is "closed" at the top. Izzy mags, and others, are open at the top and can get deformed. I will send pics to b-dog, if someone can post them for me I will email them to you also. HTH, JWB

February 21, 2007, 21:21	#26
Gunga Din Registered FALaholic #: 7437 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Pgh., PA Posts: 3,853	I'll put 'em up. iiiATpenn.com

February 21, 2007, 21:54	#27
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	Thanks, PM sent. JWB

February 21, 2007, 22:25	#28
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	I just sent the pics to Gunga Din (THANKS!). It will be clear what the issue is. When either side is deformedas in the pic, the round sits too far back and hooks onto the pin in the mag catch. Some folks trim the pin down, to avoid hitting the base of the round. This is not good, as ti simply fixes a symptom, not the problem. IMO, only the mags that have a "closed" fold as in the pics should be used for serious business. The IZZY mags I have are all unsuited for that purpose. If you drop a mag and the rounds cause the rear of the mag to be deformed as in the pics, they can be fixed by opening the fold back up, but this will only be temporary. JWB

February 21, 2007, 22:40	#29
MTS Registered FALaholic #: 17411 Join Date: May 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 966	I'd like to see those mag pics, myself. I've been chasing a "bolt rides over round" problem for a while.

February 21, 2007, 22:44	#30
Gunga Din Registered FALaholic #: 7437 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Pgh., PA Posts: 3,853	Here are jbrooks' photographs: (This is good info.)

February 21, 2007, 22:49	#31
Gunga Din Registered FALaholic #: 7437 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Pgh., PA Posts: 3,853	For bolt over base, also please check out the info in the thread I mentioned above.

February 22, 2007, 00:51	#32
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	To add to the above: We usually think of slapping the mag against the palm of a hand to "seat" the rounds to the rear. This works fine for the M-14 type mags, and the M1 garand clips. But the FAL mag is made so the rounds are critically placed, and the tip of the bullet must be forward, as opposed to the base of the cartridge being "seated' to the rear. So if you have a FAL mag, I suggest you "tap" it so as to force the bullet tips forward, just the opposite of the M1 and M-14. JWB

February 22, 2007, 01:44	#33
Windustsearch Registered FALaholic #: 10219 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Seattle,Wa Posts: 5,696	I am holding and looking at an Israeli mag that has closed folds, so they are not all the same. I went and looked at all 10 of my Israeli mags and they all have the closed folds. All have the Israeli stamp inside the oval.

February 22, 2007, 02:03	#34
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	Interesting... So not all Izzy's are created equal. All 3 of my Izzy's have the "open fold". JWB

February 23, 2007, 18:52	#35
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	JBROOKS, sorry I didn't get your PM until now and see that you've already posted the pics. The pics are informative however. I guess all my mags are Argy (bought from kfranz) since they do not have a 'hollow' fold but are solid. And just by looking at them they seem to be fine. I'll have to go load them up and take a look again.

February 23, 2007, 18:57	#36
W.E.G. Administrator Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 1211 Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Virginia Posts: 31,052	Let's look at the symptoms. Tight mag in the mag well. BHO pin interferes with rounds in the magazine. I'd say the ejector block is just a hair forward of where it ideally should be. I'd trim that BHO pin just a smidgen. __________________ . . . Ask me about the Mason-Dixon FAL Collectors Association.

February 23, 2007, 19:27	#37
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	Behold! The mags that mostly have this problem are the ones on the left... Are these two mags from different countries? If so , any idea which?

February 23, 2007, 19:30	#38
b-dog Registered FALaholic #: 19671 Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 290	Here's a pic of both mags (one good vs bad) both of the solid fold type that Jbrooks posted but one clearly has a set back round....

February 23, 2007, 20:05	#39
W.E.G. Administrator Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 1211 Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Virginia Posts: 31,052	Do you have any NEW magazines you can use? That one with the (looks to me like) collapsed fold probably should be put in the Grade 2 box. __________________ . . . Ask me about the Mason-Dixon FAL Collectors Association.

February 23, 2007, 21:58	#40
jbrooks Registered FALaholic #: 10395 Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,621	I agree. The "closed fold" can still get deformed, which looks exactly like what has happened to yours. Take the spring and follower out and inspect the folds very carefully. Go ahead and use it as a "target of opportunity"! Do NOT mix it up with your good mags. Although it will function if you Tap it Forward as I mentioned above, my preference is to not have ANY mags that are not 100%. JWB

February 24, 2007, 10:14	#41
MTS Registered FALaholic #: 17411 Join Date: May 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 966	In reading this thread (very informative) and continuing to look at the "bolt over round" issue I have, I found a mag issue that may or may not matter. I have my magazines divided into those that don't work at all, and those that work most of the time. The bad ones all have some play in them which allows the follower to move front to back. The good ones do not allow that movement. I'll be going back to the range soon and see how much good the polishing and other steps I've learned here does with the better magazines.