The ATF strikes again

MarkG · July 13, 2005, 13:20

Just today, the ATF has come up with a new import ban, on the barrels and recievers of all 'non sporting guns' that are already unconsitutionally banned from importation as complete firearms. So unless something changes, that means no more FAL kits, No more IMBEL recievers, no more AK kits, no more 1919A4 kits, etc. Unless something drastic happens, and the ATF is reigned in (which seems unlikely) this means the end of our hobby. Here is the ATF's open letter on the subject: ATF letter

JoeLad · July 13, 2005, 13:30

A boon for DSA, Entreprise, and Dan Coonan, if they take advantage of it.
More U.S. receivers and barrels.

Bad for us. Everything just became more expensive.

JoeLad

Farmer from Hell · July 13, 2005, 13:44

Well I guess that blew that thread in the RKBA part of the board about this being bogus out of the water.

That looks like a pretty authentic gooberment letter to me.

I wont be selling any of my kits now!

This is the final straw. Its over.

I wonder what this will do to CAI and were WASR rifles?

Did this trickle down off the desk of the new AG that may get nominated to the SC?

FfH

Sword of Laban · July 13, 2005, 13:58

Ever get that sinking feeling that just when you thought everything was starting to get better you found out it was getting worse? This is another absurd dictatorial ruling and I am so pissed I had better not say anymore at this time.

**jwv3** · July 13, 2005, 14:03

I don't think it will end the current style of importation. Any new kits will have to be sold as stricktly for replacement barrels only.

Isn't this what has been happening with the Imbel receivers for a long time?

Farmer from Hell · July 13, 2005, 14:39

Quote:

Originally posted by jwv3
I don't think it will end the current style of importation. Any new kits will have to be sold as stricktly for replacement barrels only.

Isn't this what has been happening with the Imbel receivers for a long time?

Quote:

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) has determined that the language of 18 U.S.C. § 925(d)(3) permits no exceptions that would allow frames, receivers or barrels for otherwise non-importable firearms to be imported into the United States. Accordingly, ATF will no longer approve ATF Form 6 applications for importation of any frames, receivers, or barrels for firearms that would be prohibited from importation if assembled. No exceptions to the statutory language, for example for “repair or replacement” of existing firearms, will be allowed.

Thats spellin it pretty plain.

FfH

farscrape · July 13, 2005, 16:23

I'll bet the WASR'S are going to be OK. They can be imported as "sporting" firearms just like they were before, sans the muzzle attachments and with the narrow mag well. Of course, CETME's and all the others will go through the roof when you add the cost of US-made barrels and installation.

farscrape · July 13, 2005, 16:27

I don't think it bans the kits, just the barrels and receivers. The AK kits will probably come with cut barrels now. It'll mean extra work removing the sight posts and mounting them on a costly US barrel.

ftierson · July 13, 2005, 16:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Sword of Laban
Ever get that sinking feeling that just when you thought everything was starting to get better you found out it was getting worse? This is another absurd dictatorial ruling and I am so pissed I had better not say anymore at this time.

Yup...

blackbird · July 13, 2005, 19:25

Boy, I am glad we put this so called "conservative" trash in the White House... (yeah! I blame myself too... it was the "lesser of evils" but I often wonder).

I can't wait for his Supreme Court nominee!

Talyn · July 13, 2005, 20:59

The Bush family strikes again. GWB is completing what his $%#@^ old man started.

WannaFal · July 14, 2005, 13:26

What will be the last straw?
Ive seen folks brag about "preparing" but still keep swimming around as the water gets hotter (the frog in water getting slowly hotter analogy).
We are being "kept safe from XYZ" to death.
Ive seen info/posts suggesting that this is all about keeping terrorists from getting guns easily. Anybody given any thought to all the imported ammo? All that x39, well dang, the rags in Afghanistan use most everything under the sun, all the 8mm, everything.
What will it take for men to say goodbye to their families and march.
Is it an impossiblility? Is the country so large now that there would never be any chance for a movement to catch enough people to effectively overcome the domestic terrorist/Tim McV Oklahoma bombing/Eric rudolph labels?
Who steps into the barrel first? Who leaves his family behind, leaves them without a father to go get killed in a hail of police gunfire and be branded a right wing wacko extremist gun nut?
Im not anywhere near doing that myself, Im too scared to.
Am I less of a man than Washington, Hancock, Nathan Hale who before leaving on an espionage mission into British-held New York as a volunteer said:
"I am not influenced by the expectation of promotion or pecuniary award; I wish to be useful, and every kind of service necessary to the public good becomes honorable by being necessary. If the exigencies of my country demand a peculiar service, its claims to perform that service are imperious." .
Yes, I believe Im less.
What are/will be our "intolerable acts" what will finally push us to the final solution. Just because it is the law of the land is BS, slavery was once legal, but it was still wrong!!
Are "we" doomed because there are no "enlightened" thinkers on our side. The 18th century had Jefferson and Adams' and Washington and Franklin and Jay and Madison and Revere among many others. Where are our leaders?
Why was our nation birthed by so many great minds, giants of ALL TIME not just their own. America has been left to wander aimlessly in her adolescence. Can anyone point to 6 minds/leaders in our government today that might be considered 1/2 as "GREAT" as our countries founders. Nevertheless, even with the "great minds" they still had to fight, families still lost fathers and brothers and sons.
Are we afraid to fight? Are we forcing a fight on our sons or grandsons.
Enemies of our country do not all speak a "foreign" language. This has been beat to death but many of us "took the oath", that oath of enlistment. Theres a part in there that says you/I swore to defend the USA against ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC. Like I said its been beat to death at militia meets and such but I still think about it.
Look at the "conflict" in Iraq right now. The Iraqis that want freedom and a good life have been stepping forward, bravely defying the terrorists that mark them for death for helping the "Americans" and many, many of them have died many of their children have died. Better men than I.
How about the terrorists, I dont agree with anything they believe but they are to be grudgingly admired. They fight for what they believe in and die for it too, in great numbers, against a far superior force both technologically and in numbers.
Willing to die for something they believe in. I fear too, that they are better men than me.
I realize that the ballot box is the best way to win any fight, but we arent winning. The best we've managed to elect are still selling the constitution out, selling US out.
Whichever party is in power, they want to restrict us. The commie-democraps want to take your guns, take your money, take your children, take your morals, they will violate civil rights in the name of protecting the public etc, etc..................
The republicrats the want to dictate your morals to you, they want to control what you do in your bedroom, they too want to take your guns, they will violate civil rights in the name of protecting the public, etc, etc................
NO politician can withstand the onslaught of special interest money that hits them in office. Every politician out there is heavily insulated from the common man. He only knows what his advisers tell him and all of them are ultimately interested in only one thing and thats getting re-elected.
Is it too late?
Will there ever be another Revolution?
Yes we have freedoms, but think about it, the only freedoms we have are the ones that, SO FAR, the gubbmint has let us keep. Just a few days ago the Supreme court stomped on another amendment when they allowed the gubbmint to take your house just in the name of higher taxes.
The water is getting hotter.
Whos gonna step up? If we all sit around aiting for the other guy to break the ice and go first We will all boil alive.
Me, Im not going out there.

July 13, 2005, 13:20	#1
MarkG Registered FALaholic #: 17143 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 89	The ATF strikes again Just today, the ATF has come up with a new import ban, on the barrels and recievers of all 'non sporting guns' that are already unconsitutionally banned from importation as complete firearms. So unless something changes, that means no more FAL kits, No more IMBEL recievers, no more AK kits, no more 1919A4 kits, etc. Unless something drastic happens, and the ATF is reigned in (which seems unlikely) this means the end of our hobby. Here is the ATF's open letter on the subject: ATF letter

July 13, 2005, 13:44	#3
Farmer from Hell Registered FALaholic #: 171 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: The "free" state Maryland Posts: 1,751	Well I guess that blew that thread in the RKBA part of the board about this being bogus out of the water. That looks like a pretty authentic gooberment letter to me. I wont be selling any of my kits now! This is the final straw. Its over. I wonder what this will do to CAI and were WASR rifles? Did this trickle down off the desk of the new AG that may get nominated to the SC? FfH __________________ Its good to be alive and not crappin in a bag. Anthony Bourdain Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post. Stewie Griffin "Family Guy" The trouble with the world is that everybody in it is about three drinks behind. Humphrey Bogart Mason Dixon FAL Collectors Association

July 13, 2005, 13:58	#4
Sword of Laban Registered FALaholic #: 8248 Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 812	Ever get that sinking feeling that just when you thought everything was starting to get better you found out it was getting worse? This is another absurd dictatorial ruling and I am so pissed I had better not say anymore at this time. __________________ "Butt kicking for goodness!" “When they’re using a mosque to do command and control for insurgents and kill my fellow Marines and soldiers and airmen that are out here — no holds barred, the gloves are off,” said Marine Staff Sgt. Sam Mortimer.

July 13, 2005, 19:25	#10
blackbird Registered FALaholic #: 5487 Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 867	Boy, I am glad we put this so called "conservative" trash in the White House... (yeah! I blame myself too... it was the "lesser of evils" but I often wonder). I can't wait for his Supreme Court nominee! Last edited by blackbird; July 13, 2005 at 19:31.

July 13, 2005, 20:59	#11
Talyn Registered FALaholic #: 1702 Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Idaho Posts: 1,154	The Bush family strikes again. GWB is completing what his $%#@^ old man started. __________________ NRA Life Member "Those without swords can still die upon them" An armed country is a free country. If guns kill people I can blame my pencil for causing misspelled words.

July 13, 2005, 13:30	#2
JoeLad Registered FALaholic #: 3353 Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: SE PA Posts: 3,243	A boon for DSA, Entreprise, and Dan Coonan, if they take advantage of it. More U.S. receivers and barrels. Bad for us. Everything just became more expensive. JoeLad

July 13, 2005, 14:03	#5
jwv3 Senior Member Bronze Contributor FALaholic #: 1547 Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: DE Posts: 550	I don't think it will end the current style of importation. Any new kits will have to be sold as stricktly for replacement barrels only. Isn't this what has been happening with the Imbel receivers for a long time?

July 13, 2005, 16:23	#7
farscrape Registered FALaholic #: 17750 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 14	I'll bet the WASR'S are going to be OK. They can be imported as "sporting" firearms just like they were before, sans the muzzle attachments and with the narrow mag well. Of course, CETME's and all the others will go through the roof when you add the cost of US-made barrels and installation.

July 13, 2005, 16:27	#8
farscrape Registered FALaholic #: 17750 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 14	I don't think it bans the kits, just the barrels and receivers. The AK kits will probably come with cut barrels now. It'll mean extra work removing the sight posts and mounting them on a costly US barrel.

July 14, 2005, 13:26	#12
WannaFal Registered FALaholic #: 11740 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: South Carolina Posts: 338	What will be the last straw? Ive seen folks brag about "preparing" but still keep swimming around as the water gets hotter (the frog in water getting slowly hotter analogy). We are being "kept safe from XYZ" to death. Ive seen info/posts suggesting that this is all about keeping terrorists from getting guns easily. Anybody given any thought to all the imported ammo? All that x39, well dang, the rags in Afghanistan use most everything under the sun, all the 8mm, everything. What will it take for men to say goodbye to their families and march. Is it an impossiblility? Is the country so large now that there would never be any chance for a movement to catch enough people to effectively overcome the domestic terrorist/Tim McV Oklahoma bombing/Eric rudolph labels? Who steps into the barrel first? Who leaves his family behind, leaves them without a father to go get killed in a hail of police gunfire and be branded a right wing wacko extremist gun nut? Im not anywhere near doing that myself, Im too scared to. Am I less of a man than Washington, Hancock, Nathan Hale who before leaving on an espionage mission into British-held New York as a volunteer said: "I am not influenced by the expectation of promotion or pecuniary award; I wish to be useful, and every kind of service necessary to the public good becomes honorable by being necessary. If the exigencies of my country demand a peculiar service, its claims to perform that service are imperious." . Yes, I believe Im less. What are/will be our "intolerable acts" what will finally push us to the final solution. Just because it is the law of the land is BS, slavery was once legal, but it was still wrong!! Are "we" doomed because there are no "enlightened" thinkers on our side. The 18th century had Jefferson and Adams' and Washington and Franklin and Jay and Madison and Revere among many others. Where are our leaders? Why was our nation birthed by so many great minds, giants of ALL TIME not just their own. America has been left to wander aimlessly in her adolescence. Can anyone point to 6 minds/leaders in our government today that might be considered 1/2 as "GREAT" as our countries founders. Nevertheless, even with the "great minds" they still had to fight, families still lost fathers and brothers and sons. Are we afraid to fight? Are we forcing a fight on our sons or grandsons. Enemies of our country do not all speak a "foreign" language. This has been beat to death but many of us "took the oath", that oath of enlistment. Theres a part in there that says you/I swore to defend the USA against ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC. Like I said its been beat to death at militia meets and such but I still think about it. Look at the "conflict" in Iraq right now. The Iraqis that want freedom and a good life have been stepping forward, bravely defying the terrorists that mark them for death for helping the "Americans" and many, many of them have died many of their children have died. Better men than I. How about the terrorists, I dont agree with anything they believe but they are to be grudgingly admired. They fight for what they believe in and die for it too, in great numbers, against a far superior force both technologically and in numbers. Willing to die for something they believe in. I fear too, that they are better men than me. I realize that the ballot box is the best way to win any fight, but we arent winning. The best we've managed to elect are still selling the constitution out, selling US out. Whichever party is in power, they want to restrict us. The commie-democraps want to take your guns, take your money, take your children, take your morals, they will violate civil rights in the name of protecting the public etc, etc.................. The republicrats the want to dictate your morals to you, they want to control what you do in your bedroom, they too want to take your guns, they will violate civil rights in the name of protecting the public, etc, etc................ NO politician can withstand the onslaught of special interest money that hits them in office. Every politician out there is heavily insulated from the common man. He only knows what his advisers tell him and all of them are ultimately interested in only one thing and thats getting re-elected. Is it too late? Will there ever be another Revolution? Yes we have freedoms, but think about it, the only freedoms we have are the ones that, SO FAR, the gubbmint has let us keep. Just a few days ago the Supreme court stomped on another amendment when they allowed the gubbmint to take your house just in the name of higher taxes. The water is getting hotter. Whos gonna step up? If we all sit around aiting for the other guy to break the ice and go first We will all boil alive. Me, Im not going out there.

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