The FAL Files  

Go Back   The FAL Files > Discussion Forums > Gear & Accessories

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old April 20, 2017, 13:29   #1
Incognito
Registered
 
FALaholic #: 1785
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,624
Review of Special Operations Equipment

I had a recent negative experience with Special Operations Equipment that I thought I would share. I think the drama outlined below is worth reading (obviously, I wrote it) and entertaining but you can also just skip to the bottom and read the key points.

This is really more of a negative review on human nature in general and specifically the way people in "the gun world" act. I bought a tactical belt on the SOE web site. After placing the order I was immediately taken to a page with my order acknowledgment. At the top of this order acknowledgment it said that it "could take 8-12 weeks for my order to ship". Additionally it stated that "no refunds would be given for their products". None of this information was posted anywhere else on their web site, you only get these details AFTER you place your order. This was not going to work for me so I started looking for ways to contact SOE and find out more information. That is when I discovered they do not have a phone number listed on their web site (mistake number one for me) Under "contact info" they list an email address and a link to their Facebook page.

So I sent a courteous, professional, and to the point email telling them that 8-12 weeks was not going to work for me and asked if they would cancel my order. I waited patiently for one day and received no response. So I sent another email just as courteous and almost identical to the first. I waited another day and still no response. In the meantime I had received an email from SOE welcoming me bla bla bla. I sent another email to that address, and still no response.

The only other way they give to contact them on their web site is Facebook, so I clicked the link and headed on over to their Facebook page. That is when I read some posts from some of their customers saying things like "I don't understand the people who claim SOE's service sucks, my order was great...etc." And the posts on their Facebook page from their very loyal fans were pretty combative to any notion that SOE is not God's gift to the planet. I do not have a Facebook account so my wife was kind enough to let me user her account (her first mistake) to send SOE a PRIVATE message through Facebook. In that private message I just stated that I had tried to contact them via email the past few days with no response and that I needed to cancel my order. One interesting thing that I did not know about Facebook is that it shows you when the recipient reads your message. That message was read at 8:50 PM on Tuesday. At noon on Wednesday I still had no response. So I did the only option left to me, I posted a public message to their Facebook page. Now, I am already very wary about this company and the crowd that hang out on their Facebook page. So I write the most bland and white washed message I could and simply said that I had been trying to reach them by email and private Facebook message but had not had any response for a few days and asked if they could just contact me about my order and gave my order number.

God...Almighty...Their loyal customers immediately started responding to my post saying this was not going to end well, telling me I was an idiot, condemning me for criticizing SOE with a public message, making threatening statements, bla, bla bla. It really was ridiculous. However, within an hour of that post I received two emails from SOE. One from Amanda saying: "Our belts never take the 8-12 weeks. That is for most of the other items we sell. You have not gotten a response about this because we are all working our asses off to build the gear. Give it a week or so. Id be very surprised if you dont have tracking by then. Also in the future, if there is something you need by a specific date, you should put that in the notes on your order." Another email from John copied to Amanda saying: "Amanda just kill his order. Itís in with all the others but just let him find something elsewhere."

Ultimately, the situation was resolved with an acceptable outcome. They cancelled my order and refunded my card. But the manner in which they did it reflects such a poor commitment to customer service. But more than that it reflects a poor attitude towards your fellow human beings and in my opinion shows a lack of any professionalism, sophistication, or intelligence. Meanwhile, the Facebook posts by their loyal customers just continued to get nastier and nastier and my poor wife has to endure all of that because each time one of those idiots posted their crap it popped up on her Facebook. She tried to lessen the damage and posted explaining that she had let her husband use her account because he was having trouble contacting SOE and that only seemed to make matters worse. Eventually John or Amanda also posted and said something like when I can learn to manage my life then they would be happy to welcome me into the SOE family. I laughed so hard I cried and I really wanted to respond to that but I decided to let it go. One especially aggressive post said that this would not end the way I wanted it to . So I decided to let everyone know that the situation was resolved. I thanked everyone for their concern and said that within an hour of my post John and Amanda had both contacted me via email and had agreed to my request to cancel my order and refund my money. So I was very happy that this did in fact end the way I wanted it to after all.

My wife continued to get nasty and threatening posts directed to her on Facebook until she finally posted a message on her page explaining what had happened and shared that post with all of her friends and SOE so that it would appear on SOE's Facebook page. No one has responded to that because I guess they know if they do a great many people outside of the SOE Facebook page would then be seeing it.

What an absolute cesspool that business and their customers turned out to be. Here are the points that I take from this.

1. Always, alwasys use a credit card instead of your bank card when making internet purchases. Much more protection that way.

2. Always, always make sure the company has a phone number.

3. I think SOE actually makes really high quality gear, but they are just proud, simple, and unintelligent people who do not have the skills to interact with other human beings.

4. The "family" of SOE customers are, unfortunately, a representation of what I have seen my whole life hanging out in gun shops and doing business with people in the gun industry.

5. There is no set of circumstances under which I would ever choose to do business with SOE again, ever. I want nothing to do with them or their "family" of customers.

6. I ordered my belt from High Threat Tactical the next day and already have my tracking number.
Incognito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 15:04   #2
RG Coburn
Registered
 
FALaholic #: 27406
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 19,156
Not to be confused with Spec Ops Gear?
RG Coburn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 16:52   #3
xtremerange
Curio & Relic
 
FALaholic #: 4305
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 3,287
From one of their products on their website:

"We have turned on all AK/M4 micros. Many of them we do not have and have no ETA. We have turned on the inventory so that you may order them. Ordering them now is considered a pre order and is non refundable."
xtremerange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 18:36   #4
0302
Registered
 
FALaholic #: 348
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 8,443
no facebook for me.
0302 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 19:21   #5
longhair51
Constitutional curmudgeon
Bronze Contributor
 
FALaholic #: 5884
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: MO
Posts: 1,733
Quote:
Originally Posted by RG Coburn View Post
Not to be confused with Spec Ops Gear?
Yeah, www.specopsbrand.com is a different company. I've bought from them a fair amount with no problem.
__________________
"When Fascism comes to America, it will be called anti-Fascism!"
unknown

ďIn a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.Ē
G. Orwell
longhair51 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 19:46   #6
Tuhlmann
Sand In Your Shorts
Contributor
 
Tuhlmann's Avatar
 
FALaholic #: 69411
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Here & There, WI
Posts: 1,907
They make top shelf gear, but you gotta follow their instructions and you gotta be patient. I have two belts and two Micro Rigs. My experiences were not at all like yours, but I can see how you would be miffed. Watch their YouTube vids and you will see a CS philosophy that is maybe a bit unorthadox, but very simple. I can't comment on their social media presence since I don't participate in that nonsense, but the one email I did send John was answered that evening with a two word response - "shipping tomorrow". That was all the words I needed.

Don't take this as a rebuttal to your experience. I'm not disputing or questioning the accuracy of your complaints. Just another experience with different results. It's too bad you had a negative one, because their gear really is built beautifully and built for actual use. My belts are the finest I've worn with a pistol, and my Micro Rigs are well designed and executed (used mine at Rockcastle this year) with everything I need and nothing I don't. Again, if you can follow directions and be patient, I would have no problem recommending SOE. If you are in a hurry and are more interested in shopping than buying, then I'd direct you elsewhere.
__________________
Future Crotchety Ol' Bastard

ďIím saying: Think about your contribution to society. Be careful when you get into a business that extracts value. Broaden your idea about whatís enough. And for Godís sake, think about who you are.Ē - J. Bogle

Last edited by Tuhlmann; April 20, 2017 at 19:52. Reason: Clarity
Tuhlmann is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 21:54   #7
lew
Registered
Bronze Contributor
 
lew's Avatar
 
FALaholic #: 16727
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 7,253
Do consider the fact that the proprietor is a convicted felon.
__________________
Statism: Ideas so great, they're mandatory.
lew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2017, 22:24   #8
Tuhlmann
Sand In Your Shorts
Contributor
 
Tuhlmann's Avatar
 
FALaholic #: 69411
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Here & There, WI
Posts: 1,907
Quote:
Originally Posted by lew View Post
Do consider the fact that the proprietor is a convicted felon.
True. I wish all felons had the grit to turn it around and build a successful $1M+ business that provides quality gear to military, police, and regular guys, all while providing a substantial tax base and employment for his community. Yep, I'd say consider that at length please.
__________________
Future Crotchety Ol' Bastard

ďIím saying: Think about your contribution to society. Be careful when you get into a business that extracts value. Broaden your idea about whatís enough. And for Godís sake, think about who you are.Ē - J. Bogle
Tuhlmann is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 21, 2017, 05:18   #9
gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Gold Contributor
 
gunplumber's Avatar
 
FALaholic #: 96
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Surprise, AZ
Posts: 23,460
I ran into this surprisingly on amazon. Nothing in the listing saying anything but normal shipoping. After checkout "8-12 weeks." Screw that.

It is dishonest for them to post anything for sale that is not in stock and ready to ship, without full disclosure. Commonly called fraud.

I believe it is also a violation of federal law (UCC title 9?) to accept a credit card payment for an item that is not to ship within 30 days, without full disclosure.

I don't care if you wrap a dog shit in cellophane and present it on a Styrofoam platter - as long as it is labeled accurately. This kind of dishonest business practice needs to be exposed. Having never used them before, I will not in the future.


People like this screwed the entire gun industry after the sandy hook panic buying - billing cards for products they don't have, hoping to use the money to acquire the product - this caused an avalanche of chargebacks and motivated the credit card companies to add a surcharge to "gun related businesses." The surcharge remains.

Best recourse is an immediate chargeback with your bank.

Glad you got it resolved.
__________________
T. Mark Graham, Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC
gunplumber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 21, 2017, 11:46   #10
Tuhlmann
Sand In Your Shorts
Contributor
 
Tuhlmann's Avatar
 
FALaholic #: 69411
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Here & There, WI
Posts: 1,907
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunplumber View Post
I ran into this surprisingly on amazon. Nothing in the listing saying anything but normal shipoping. After checkout "8-12 weeks." Screw that.

It is dishonest for them to post anything for sale that is not in stock and ready to ship, without full disclosure. Commonly called fraud.

I believe it is also a violation of federal law (UCC title 9?) to accept a credit card payment for an item that is not to ship within 30 days, without full disclosure.

I don't care if you wrap a dog shit in cellophane and present it on a Styrofoam platter - as long as it is labeled accurately. This kind of dishonest business practice needs to be exposed. Having never used them before, I will not in the future.


People like this screwed the entire gun industry after the sandy hook panic buying - billing cards for products they don't have, hoping to use the money to acquire the product - this caused an avalanche of chargebacks and motivated the credit card companies to add a surcharge to "gun related businesses." The surcharge remains.

Best recourse is an immediate chargeback with your bank.

Glad you got it resolved.
You mean like here?

https://www.originalsoegear.com/page...riority-policy

Appears pretty clear to me, and it's on their homepage.
__________________
Future Crotchety Ol' Bastard

ďIím saying: Think about your contribution to society. Be careful when you get into a business that extracts value. Broaden your idea about whatís enough. And for Godís sake, think about who you are.Ē - J. Bogle
Tuhlmann is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 21, 2017, 20:46   #11
Incognito
Registered
 
FALaholic #: 1785
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,624
I think they actually do make quality products, but so does a lot of other folks. So why do business with a douche bag if there are other more professional and customer friendly businesses out there? Not only is it not smart simply because doing business with a douche bag opens me up to all of their douchery, but I just don't like supporting ass holes. Lots of good people out there; I don't need or want douche bags like SOE in my life.
Incognito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 21, 2017, 20:49   #12
Incognito
Registered
 
FALaholic #: 1785
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,624
I think they actually do make quality products, but so does a lot of other folks. So why do business with a douche bag if there are other more professional and customer friendly businesses out there? Not only is it not smart simply because doing business with a douche bag opens me up to all of their douchery, but I just don't like supporting ass holes. Lots of good people out there; I don't need or want douche bags like SOE in my life.

The purpose of my review was just to give a heads up. Probably if you are patient and you order from SOE there is a good chance you will get your order and all will be well. But if there is any sort of hick up or question regarding your order I have no doubt SOE will screw you over in a New York minute. I did not detect an ounce of humanity in those people in my short dealings with them.
Incognito is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:05.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
©1998-2015 The FAL Files