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Old December 12, 2018, 15:12   #151
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I was thinking just the same. I have a British L1A1 “Sporter” barrel that that was chopped by Century during the ban and this should be a good option, just swap out the gas blocks on the press. Donezo. Better than buying a new one.
Except for the part where the L1A1 gas port is 45 degrees and the FAL is 90 degrees, and the slingmounts are different, and the L1A1 uses a breeching washer (modify handguard ring and carry handle nut to fit).

Don't understand buying a nice historical example kit and putting the wrong barrel on it. Not that there is anything wrong with a Frankenfal, but why use scarce parts for one?
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Old December 12, 2018, 18:18   #152
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Shipping notification from DSA today. Receiver on the brown truck. Received kit and barrel with installed gas block already. Should be twisting this baby up next week
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Old December 12, 2018, 19:48   #153
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Mark,

I certainly appreciate you educating me on the subject. As I have both your FAL workbook and DVD set, the knowledge learned has proven to be very valuable. I agree insofar that if it is not correct, then there is really no point to it at all.

For whatever reason, I have never really been wild about the look of a FAL sans flash hider. It just looks naked, but that’s just my take on it. Historically correct or not, I will probably opt to have a break threaded on one anyway, with the correct barrel.

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Except for the part where the L1A1 gas port is 45 degrees and the FAL is 90 degrees, and the slingmounts are different, and the L1A1 uses a breeching washer (modify handguard ring and carry handle nut to fit).

Don't understand buying a nice historical example kit and putting the wrong barrel on it. Not that there is anything wrong with a Frankenfal, but why use scarce parts for one?
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Old December 12, 2018, 20:00   #154
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Mark,

I certainly appreciate you educating me on the subject. As I have both your FAL workbook and DVD set, the knowledge learned has proven to be very valuable. I agree insofar that if it is not correct, then there is really no point to it at all.

For whatever reason, I have never really been wild about the look of a FAL sans flash hider. It just looks naked, but that’s just my take on it. Historically correct or not, I will probably opt to have a break threaded on one anyway, with the correct barrel.
If you're going to do that you might look into removing the lug too. Should be pretty easy to do. Have the machinist who does your threading look at it and see what he thinks. Also it could be silver soldered on and you could file it down close to the barrel and a maap gas torch will knock it off without too much heat on the barrel. Then you will have the "correct look".

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Old December 12, 2018, 20:30   #155
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That’s also an option. I am capable of all of the torching and press work for the block,no problem. With the exception of the lathe work to thread the barrel, I would just send it to GP to have that done.
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Old December 13, 2018, 09:25   #156
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never really been wild about the look of a FAL sans flash hider. . .. . Historically correct or not, I will probably opt to have a break threaded on one anyway, with the correct barrel.
A lugged barrel with a combo device would also be correct - Israel retrofitted them.

I'd trade a fal barrel for a serviceable L1A1 barrel. But all my FAL barrels are currently para length. Same with a lugged barrel - don't want the lug, I can trade if there's something comparable on my list.

Not sure what the other guy is knocking off with mapp gas . . .
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Old December 13, 2018, 20:32   #157
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Correct me if I am wrong. Would putting a Israeli gas block on a imbel barrel give you a clone of a late model Israeli light barrel with the combo muzzle attachment? Would all dimensions be correct?
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Old December 13, 2018, 20:49   #158
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Correct me if I am wrong. Would putting a Israeli gas block on a imbel barrel give you a clone of a late model Israeli light barrel with the combo muzzle attachment? Would all dimensions be correct?
Yes. And that's exactly what I did.




This IMBEL barrel was like new. Wear was negligible and reparked like new, NOS GB installed, wears a DSA repro FN combo device.
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Old December 14, 2018, 08:04   #159
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wears a DSA repro FN combo device that I will be timing correctly
fify
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Old December 14, 2018, 10:34   #160
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fify
Never cared. And it's only hand tight still today. Maybe someday I'll get after it.
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Old December 14, 2018, 10:52   #161
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Correct me if I am wrong. Would putting a Israeli gas block on a imbel barrel give you a clone of a late model Israeli light barrel with the combo muzzle attachment? Would all dimensions be correct?

Only NON bipod cut barrel.
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Old December 17, 2018, 09:19   #162
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I have seen Type 1 and 2 lowers shipped with these kits. Has any one received a Type 1 lower cut for the A stock?
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Old December 17, 2018, 20:41   #163
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My bolt appear to be 68 FN proofed....carrier is FN with steyr oval type proof...no serials on either....lower is serialed type 1...tall FN rear site aperture...base is metric with stop pin to keep aperture from sliding off....never seen these bases on izzy stuff before...hammer has rod attached by pin..vertical takedown lever..unmarked internals...beveled trigger guard...falo charging handle....
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Old December 17, 2018, 21:58   #164
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My bolt appear to be 68 FN proofed....carrier is FN with steyr oval type proof...no serials on either....lower is serialed type 1...tall FN rear site aperture...base is metric with stop pin to keep aperture from sliding off....never seen these bases on izzy stuff before...hammer has rod attached by pin..vertical takedown lever..unmarked internals...beveled trigger guard...falo charging handle....
Yeah, strut riveted on Type A. Generally hammer and trigger pins don't interchange with later And fixing plate will have a recess for pin shoulders - type A trigger and selector. Shoulder on pin a hair wider than later. It's weird how subtle it is - like why bother?

I've got a couple type A hammers with fn proofs and I think the others have the Tz'hal.

https://arizonaresponsesystems.com/w...l19-hammer.jpg

On the rear sight - the cross pin stop or the vertical one? Never seen a cross pin one except in pics.
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Old December 17, 2018, 22:15   #165
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Mark....the rear site base is the same front to back....no raised portion where the 2 is to stop the aperture....there is a stop pin left to right thru the rear site base....I’ve seen YDS marked bases with no stop,...and some with no stop and a pin in the rear going kind of vertical but this is the first metric one with a stop pin and no raised rear portion....the base looks to be izzy proofed with the aperture FN proofed....
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Old December 24, 2018, 12:37   #166
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..... wears a DSA repro FN combo device that I will be timing correctly.
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fify
Since Mark was so kind to call me on my laziness I thought it was high time I corrected this. Until he did so I had actually forgot about it and didn't even notice it in the two year old pics when I posted.

Pic quality sucks, is what it is.




Thanks, Mark.
Now I feel better.




.
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Old December 24, 2018, 13:52   #167
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Since Mark was so kind to call me on my laziness I thought it was high time I corrected this. Until he did so I had actually forgot about it and didn't even notice it in the two year old pics when I posted.
Thanks, Mark.
Now I feel better.
.
Just ribbing you.

It's like seeing a beautiful girl, then she turns around and she has a nose or lip ring!

Acck! (cough) (gag)

And yeah, some of my earlier ones, the flash didn't time right. Bill did some testing with bayonet mounted and found the strike of the round changed with the position of the bayonet - but not opposite the blade. It was90 degrees off, but I don't remember if it was 90 before or 90 after the flat. Pretty weird.
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Old December 24, 2018, 14:04   #168
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Just ribbing you.

It's like seeing a beautiful girl, then she turns around and she has a nose or lip ring!

Acck! (cough) (gag)

And yeah, some of my earlier ones, the flash didn't time right. Bill did some testing with bayonet mounted and found the strike of the round changed with the position of the bayonet - but not opposite the blade. It was90 degrees off, but I don't remember if it was 90 before or 90 after the flat. Pretty weird.
I know, Mark. I wasn't offended but it did motivate me. And that you took a few seconds to make to the effort, a little flattered.
Your beautiful girl analogy is spot on, know the feeling well.

Thanks, Mark, for all the effort you put into your work and then come here to share it. For free. Few have been/are such a valuable source to the forums on your level.

Merry Christmas!
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Old December 24, 2018, 15:23   #169
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Israeli type A lower receiver

Munchoman, there are some type A lower receivers in this group of parts kits. See AZAK’s post #126 in the “Israeli light barrel kits” thread by Moosie for an example of a type A lower receiver.
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Old December 25, 2018, 00:25   #170
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So.. as far as correctness goes is it:

Type A lower = open ear GB = lugged barrel

Type 2 lower = closed ear GB = threaded barrel with combo device?

My kit came with a type 2 lower and open ear GB.
I was going to spend the coin and get a lugged barrel because I like the look but if a standard Imbel is more correct may go that route.
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Old December 27, 2018, 14:58   #171
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We have been notified that our next shipment of US made FAL barrels for the Israeli kits are on the way.
These ones will be parkerized.

Richard
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Old December 27, 2018, 15:07   #172
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Damnit man, and I just got notice that my kit from you is headed my way. Oh well, something else to get after my next paycheck.

I look forward to unboxing that kit.
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Old December 27, 2018, 17:52   #173
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Damnit man, and I just got notice that my kit from you is headed my way. Oh well, something else to get after my next paycheck.

I look forward to unboxing that kit.
I do appreciate the purchase.
I think we are about to send out a E-News with the sales for this week.
All HOGUE products will be on clearance, I think the CETME C kits will be on sale.

Richard
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Old December 27, 2018, 19:41   #174
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So.. as far as correctness goes is it:

Type A lower = open ear GB = lugged barrel

Type 2 lower = closed ear GB = threaded barrel with combo device?

My kit came with a type 2 lower and open ear GB.
I was going to spend the coin and get a lugged barrel because I like the look but if a standard Imbel is more correct may go that route.
Type 1 lower (type A stock) = probably all FN manufacturered with opened eared GB lugged Barrel early t48 style handguards and wood grip

Type 2 lower (type C stock) = Israeli manufactures with open or closed GB. Israeli handguards and plastic grip. Some lugged barrels with or without combo device some (mostly) non-lugged barrels with combo device.
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Old December 27, 2018, 21:42   #175
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I do appreciate the purchase.
I think we are about to send out a E-News with the sales for this week.
All HOGUE products will be on clearance, I think the CETME C kits will be on sale.

Richard
Do you think the Sterling kits will ever go on sale? I have the itch to build some tube guns and if they really do come with a barrel they are perfect for a weekend project.
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Old December 28, 2018, 14:41   #176
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I ordered a kit from DSA and got it yesterday. It's pretty beat up and ratty... The buttstock and handguards are in poor condition. The buttstock is a disaster so are the HGs. How they were able to classify this as "good" condition is beyond me. Just another wonderful experience from the fine folks at DSA... I'll definitely avoid their receiver. I decided to give DSA a forth, now fifth chance but this is pretty sad. I would not get another one from them, you may want to go with APEX. I've always had positive experiences with them.
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Old December 28, 2018, 16:25   #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaughn L. Allen View Post
I ordered a kit from DSA and got it yesterday. It's pretty beat up and ratty... The buttstock and handguards are in poor condition. The buttstock is a disaster so are the HGs. How they were able to classify this as "good" condition is beyond me. Just another wonderful experience from the fine folks at DSA... I'll definitely avoid their receiver. I decided to give DSA a forth, now fifth chance but this is pretty sad. I would not get another one from them, you may want to go with APEX. I've always had positive experiences with them.
I have the same problem first kit is good the second kit is poor I contacted DSA to return the lower for another as it is in poor condition so far no contact with me. will you send your kit back?
https://imgur.com/U6ZWGDP
anyone know who made the lower thanks https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/3f2e6sf
https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/2S5ElLR

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Old December 28, 2018, 16:57   #178
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I have the same problem first kit is good the second kit is poor I contacted DSA to return the lower for another as it is in poor condition so far no contact with me. will you send your kit back?
https://imgur.com/U6ZWGDP
anyone know who made the lower thanks https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/3f2e6sf
https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/2S5ElLR
I dont see a problem with those lowers. Just get some matte black duracoat and paint over it. The stock looks good too, strip it and refinish. Mine was way more beat up when it showed up, and they were brought back to life

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Old December 28, 2018, 20:13   #179
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I ordered a kit from DSA and got it yesterday. It's pretty beat up and ratty... The buttstock and handguards are in poor condition. The buttstock is a disaster so are the HGs. How they were able to classify this as "good" condition is beyond me. Just another wonderful experience from the fine folks at DSA... I'll definitely avoid their receiver. I decided to give DSA a forth, now fifth chance but this is pretty sad. I would not get another one from them, you may want to go with APEX. I've always had positive experiences with them.
I don't know what they look like, but "Good" means "as messed up as it can be and still function." Fair means "some repairs may be necessary" and Poor means "may not be repairable."

I'm not thrilled with the NRA grading system (as correlated to surplus parts) but it's the best we have. It seems there is too big a step between Good and Very Good, and too small a step between VG and EXC.

But if you have 120 parts and 3 are Fair , 115 are Good, and 3 are VG, how else do you grade it for overall?
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Old December 28, 2018, 20:39   #180
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I don't know what they look like, but "Good" means "as messed up as it can be and still function." Fair means "some repairs may be necessary" and Poor means "may not be repairable."
?
Lol. Sounds about right. Somehow I got myself into buying “poor” and investing time with dremels , files, and welders to make things “good”.

Not from apex so much mind you. I was lucky to get a really shitty BREN mk3 kit from them at a discount , thank god I didn’t get one of the kits they had at KCR that looked like they came from the factory. That would have been boooooring.

If you want an Izzy kit buy from APEX. better yet get one of their BREN mk3 kits.

Richard please go find us some more cool kits. Fiji still has their L1A1s and I think Tonga has theirs in storage. POF still makes the mg42, cut them up and bring them in. And if I may humbly request some inexpensive MAG58 kits? Kalia claims to have them.
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Old December 28, 2018, 20:50   #181
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I don't know what they look like, but "Good" means "as messed up as it can be and still function." Fair means "some repairs may be necessary" and Poor means "may not be repairable."

I'm not thrilled with the NRA grading system (as correlated to surplus parts) but it's the best we have. It seems there is too big a step between Good and Very Good, and too small a step between VG and EXC.

But if you have 120 parts and 3 are Fair , 115 are Good, and 3 are VG, how else do you grade it for overall?
yeah, NRA grading just don't work well on parts sets unless you have a pile and are sorting...we both know this.

For those that don't
here's how it can work from decades of experience

Guns are simply not often individually broken down and kitted up
well Bowman pretty much does that today but much of these things are torn down and tubbed up as individual bits

For example you have 100 guns
that's import docs on 100 bolts, 100 bolt carriers, 100 triggers, 100 sears, etc
you guys getting it yet ?

Bowman does most of his kitting from intact weapons once they reach America
in other cases the guns are tore down overseas and da' shit gets bagged, tubbed and documented for import
that's why so many FAL kits are complete mix masters

State side you have basically minimum wage assholes snagging one part from each tub into another tub then bagging and sealing until they have a so-called "kit"
yeah that's how this often works folks

Add to that in the case of these "Chilean" kits I suspect a good share of the barrels were previously stocked items in their warehouses
some get nice bbls, some are rat holes

I have a couple very nice G1 kits,
early crap
want one, they are minimum of a grand
frankly I have no shits given

Otherwise you can spend a couple years piecing something decent together, maybe longer.

Not sure on the current influx of IDF kits
have three and out of them one is a for sure mix master
total mix of near new parts with well used ones
I mean how do you end up with a 98% dust cover with a lower thats maybe 70% ?
That's right, don't happen

some need to grow the F up
this isn't 1990
we are lucky to even have these
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Old December 28, 2018, 20:52   #182
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Lol. Sounds about right. Somehow I got myself into buying “poor” and investing time with dremels , files, and welders to make things “good”.

Not from apex so much mind you. I was lucky to get a really shitty BREN mk3 kit from them at a discount , thank god I didn’t get one of the kits they had at KCR that looked like they came from the factory. That would have been boooooring.

If you want an Izzy kit buy from APEX. better yet get one of their BREN mk3 kits.

Richard please go find us some more cool kits. Fiji still has their L1A1s and I think Tonga has theirs in storage. POF still makes the mg42, cut them up and bring them in. And if I may humbly request some inexpensive MAG58 kits? Kalia claims to have them.
don't think APEX actually imports

they just buy bulk from Century, SARCO and others that do then do quite a bit better job on CS
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Old December 29, 2018, 14:05   #183
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I dont see a problem with those lowers. Just get some matte black duracoat and paint over it. The stock looks good too, strip it and refinish. Mine was way more beat up when it showed up, and they were brought back to life

The buttstock on mine is not usable. Its been sand and whittled on to the point where the buttstock just sits inside of buttplate. It cannot be repaired. I wish that my furniture was salvageable like yours.
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Old December 29, 2018, 14:12   #184
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I have the same problem first kit is good the second kit is poor I contacted DSA to return the lower for another as it is in poor condition so far no contact with me. will you send your kit back?
https://imgur.com/U6ZWGDP
anyone know who made the lower thanks https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/3f2e6sf
https://imgur.com/ZyotbAe https://imgur.com/2S5ElLR
No, most of the parts are serviceable and I've got the parts necessary to rehab it. If I were to sell this kit to someone here, it would be "fair" condition. I have some LB furniture from back in the day and other assorted Izzy parts. It will be a nice rifle when it's done. I'm just glad that the kits are available.
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Old December 29, 2018, 14:46   #185
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wanting one but sounds like its a crap shoot....
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Old December 29, 2018, 15:39   #186
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No, most of the parts are serviceable and I've got the parts necessary to rehab it. If I were to sell this kit to someone here, it would be "fair" condition. I have some LB furniture from back in the day and other assorted Izzy parts. It will be a nice rifle when it's done. I'm just glad that the kits are available.
The first and last photo is from the second kit. not worried about the woodwork it is the metal on the first photo look at it this is classed as good condition. sending it back if the return PDF file i got from DSA will open for me. Mark or someone with more experience on working with FAL an opinion would be welcome on the first photo thanks
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Old December 29, 2018, 16:55   #187
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The first and last photo is from the second kit. not worried about the woodwork it is the metal on the first photo look at it this is classed as good condition. sending it back if the return PDF file i got from DSA will open for me. Mark or someone with more experience on working with FAL an opinion would be welcome on the first photo thanks
That lower will work just fine for you. Those are just some dings from idiots closing it with the rat tail in the wrong spot. Build the gun.
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Old December 29, 2018, 17:16   #188
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The first and last photo is from the second kit. not worried about the woodwork it is the metal on the first photo look at it this is classed as good condition. sending it back if the return PDF file i got from DSA will open for me. Mark or someone with more experience on working with FAL an opinion would be welcome on the first photo thanks
Yours looks good... I'd just keep it. You could get worse.
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Old December 29, 2018, 17:36   #189
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The first and last photo is from the second kit. not worried about the woodwork it is the metal on the first photo look at it this is classed as good condition. sending it back if the return PDF file i got from DSA will open for me. Mark or someone with more experience on working with FAL an opinion would be welcome on the first photo thanks
I must admit I would be a little disappointed with the recoil plate on that lower too.

It shouldn't have any effect on the build itself because you won't be seeing it every time you pick it up but it's kinda like bondo on a car. You know it's there. I feel sure they will make it good.
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Old December 29, 2018, 18:23   #190
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I must admit I would be a little disappointed with the recoil plate on that lower too.

It shouldn't have any effect on the build itself because you won't be seeing it every time you pick it up but it's kinda like bondo on a car. You know it's there. I feel sure they will make it good.
thanks for all the comments guys I guess that rifle really has been around the clock. yes, Matt from sales contacted me and informed to sent it back.
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Old December 29, 2018, 19:28   #191
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Some of you guys have strange expectations for a rifle that saw at least two wars over the last 65 years.

Funny thing is, if you took that well worn stock that is "unserviceable" (yeah, whatever . . .) and slapped some baby poop on it, people would be screaming not repair it and "destroy it's historical value".

Phhhhbbbbbt!
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Old December 29, 2018, 19:31   #192
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Some of you guys have strange expectations for a rifle that saw at least two wars over the last 65 years.

Funny thing is, if you took that well worn stock that is "unserviceable" (yeah, whatever . . .) and slapped some baby poop on it, people would be screaming not repair it and "destroy it's historical value".

Phhhhbbbbbt!
Zing!


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Old December 29, 2018, 19:35   #193
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Some of you guys have strange expectations for a rifle that saw at least two wars over the last 65 years.

Funny thing is, if you took that well worn stock that is "unserviceable" (yeah, whatever . . .) and slapped some baby poop on it, people would be screaming not repair it and "destroy it's historical value".

Phhhhbbbbbt!
Hahaha.... Yep! You're right. Just curious if the unserviceable stock comment was directed at me? From a functionality perspective they are not "unserviceable". They are aesthetically unsuitable and not something anyone would want on their rifle.
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Old December 30, 2018, 00:26   #194
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Hahaha.... Yep! You're right. Just curious if the unserviceable stock comment was directed at me? From a functionality perspective they are not "unserviceable". They are aesthetically unsuitable and not something anyone would want on their rifle.
These certainly arent NOS kits. As received, perhaps they are unsuitable for your needs. If you put a little sweat equity in you could have it cleaned up and looking refreshed in a couple hours.



My cleaning efforts. Excuse the poor lighting



I left the screw holes. I like the character. I took the worst parts from 2 kits and put them together. Sanded most of the park from the receiver to match how rusty everything else was The buttplate is worn through to the wood at the top and bottom. Its my favorite of the pair, shoots great too.
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Old December 30, 2018, 10:45   #195
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I just received my kit from APEX yesterday and I am very pleased with it.

Used but nothing that is a problem for a surplus kit. Just needs some TLC.

I am excited though because the buttstock has some “personality” in that there is a carving of the Star of David and what appears to be some Hebrew letters carved in it. The letters are faint, but I plan on finishing in a way that makes them more obvious.

Thanks APEX.

Now need to decide what barrel to use and whether to put on my DSA LMT Type II receiver or wait for next batch of DSA Type I Israeli receivers. 🇮🇱

Thoughts or suggestions?
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Old December 30, 2018, 12:16   #196
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Originally Posted by gunplumber View Post
Some of you guys have strange expectations for a rifle that saw at least two wars over the last 65 years.

Funny thing is, if you took that well worn stock that is "unserviceable" (yeah, whatever . . .) and slapped some baby poop on it, people would be screaming not repair it and "destroy it's historical value".

Phhhhbbbbbt!
you are right I will keep the kit it has been around and for an old soldier like me, it will be fine. hopefully, I will get a receiver for it soon.
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Old January 01, 2019, 04:01   #197
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Do you think the Sterling kits will ever go on sale? I have the itch to build some tube guns and if they really do come with a barrel they are perfect for a weekend project.
The stock of STERLING kits and magazines is at the point where I can't put them on sale anymore. We have not seen any more of them imported in many years.
Please also note that the barrel we include is pistol length and 7.62X25.

Richard
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