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Old December 03, 2017, 20:17   #1
J. Armstrong
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Reciprocal Carry Bill got a political farcking ?

I just received the following from a friend of mine. Haven't had a chance to vet the report, but if true it really puts the kibosh on the reciprocal carry bill and sounds like a "few" calls to legislators are in order. What say the hive ?

"Sneaky s.o.b.'s are at it again. If what this Congressman says is accurate, this needs our attention, and a huge rash of phone calls."

Congressman Thomas Massie
Yesterday at 1:13pm ·
ALERT: Feinstein/Schumer sponsored gun legislation that amends the “Brady bill” will be added to Concealed Carry Reciprocity bill (HR 38) in the House this week....
As Chairman of the Second Amendment Caucus, I’m blowing the whistle on the swamp. Last week, Republicans in the House fast tracked through committee HR 4477, a gun bill titled “fix-NICS.” The Senate version of this bill is cosponsored by Senator Dianne Feintstein and Senator Chuck Schumer and it will send $625 million over 5 years to states to expand the national background check database. The bill will also advance former President Obama’s agenda of pressuring every branch of the administration (such as the Veteran’s Administration) to submit thousands of more names to the NICS background check database to deny gun purchases. The House bill is identical in every way to the Senate bill except the House bill will also commission a study on bump-stocks.
What you don’t know, and what virtually no one in Washington wants you to know, is that House leadership plans to merge the fix-NICS bill with popular Concealed Carry Reciprocity legislation, HR 38, and pass both of them with a single vote. Folks, this is how the swamp works. House leadership expects constituents to call their representatives demanding a vote on the reciprocity bill, when in fact the only vote will be on the two combined bills.
How fast did Fix-NICS, HR 4477, move through the Judiciary Committee? This bill broke the previous records for fast track legislation. It was voted out of committee within hours of being introduced in the House. Check the dates on this link: https://www.congress.gov/…/115th-con...bill/4477/text . That means the text of the bill wasn’t even discoverable by the public on congress.gov until after the bill passed out of committee! The text was however available over in the Senate where you will find Senator Diane Feinstein and Senator Chuck Schumer are cosponsors. https://www.congress.gov/…/115t…/sen...135/cosponsors
If that’s not odd enough, consider this: the fix-NICS bill was introduced in the House by a Democrat two weeks ago. https://www.congress.gov/…/115th-con...bill/4434/text . But, in a very unusual move, the bill was re-introduced verbatim by a Republican two weeks later, with language added to it to commission a bump-stock study. Six Republicans in Judiciary Committee weren’t persuaded by the switcheroo, and voted No. However, because every Democrat voted yes and some Republicans voted yes at the urging of the Chairman, the bill made it out of committee. The deed will be complete this week when the bill is quietly added to the Reciprocity bill, HR 38, and passed without the knowledge of those who would oppose the legislation if they knew what was in it.
To recap, what are some clues that you should be concerned with the fix-NICS bill?
(1) The first sentence after the title of the bill reads “Section 103 of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act (34 U.S.C. 40901) is amended…”
(2) Senators Dianne Feinstein and Chuck Schumer are cosponsors in the Senate.
(3) It’s being rammed through, without a hearing, in a very nontransparent process, and it will be passed by attaching it to the popular concealed carry reciprocity bill which already has enough votes to pass on its own.
(4) It spends over half a billion dollars to collect more names to include in a list of people who will never be allowed to own a firearm.
(5) It compels administrative agencies, not just courts, to adjudicate your second amendment rights.
In my opinion, #5 is the biggest problem. The bill encourages administrative agencies, not the courts, to submit more names to a national database that will determine whether you can or can’t obtain a firearm. When President Obama couldn’t get Congress to pass gun control, he implemented a strategy of compelling, through administrative rules, the Veterans Administration and the Social Security Administration to submit lists of veterans and seniors, many of whom never had a day in court, to be included in the NICS database of people prohibited from owning a firearm. Only a state court, a federal (article III) court, or a military court, should ever be able to suspend your rights for any significant period of time.
Does the NICS background check system have problems? Yes, it results in tens of thousands of unjustified denials of gun purchases every year. But like many bills in Congress, the fix-NICS doesn’t live up to its name – it will likely do the opposite. It throws millions of dollars at a faulty program and it will result in more law-abiding citizens being deprived of their right to keep and bear arms.
If we continue to give the executive branch more money and encouragement to add names to the list of people prohibited from buying a firearm (without a day in court) and if the gun banners achieve their goal of universal background checks, one day, a single person elected to the office of President will be able to achieve universal gun prohibition.
House leadership should immediately de-couple the fix-NICS legislation from the concealed carry reciprocity legislation. People hate it when Washington combines bills like our leadership plans to do this week.
A few have speculated that the House is combining the bills to ensure reciprocity will pass in the Senate. I have some news for them: Senators Feinstein and Schumer aren’t going to vote for reciprocity even if it contains the fix-NICS legislation they support for expanding the background check database. If someone is naïve enough to think that’s going to work, and they’re willing to accept fix-NICS to get reciprocity, then they should ask the Senate to go first with the combined bill.
Here’s a dangerous scenario that’s more likely to play out: The House uses the popularity of reciprocity (HR 38) to sneak fix-NICS through, while the Senate passes fix-NICS only. The Senate and the House meet at conference with their respective bills, with the result being fix-NICS emerges from conference without reciprocity. Fix-NICS comes back to the House and passes because all of the Democrats will vote for it (as they just did in Judiciary Committee) and many Republicans will vote for it. Because Republicans already voted for it once as part of the reciprocity deal that never came to pass, they won’t have a solid footing for opposing fix-NICS as a standalone bill. Then we’ll end up with fix-NICS, which is basically an expansion of the Brady Bill, without reciprocity.
If our House leadership insists on bringing the flawed fix-NICS bill to the floor, they shouldn’t play games. We should vote separately on HR 38, the Concealed Carry Reciprocity Bill, and HR 4477, the fix-NICS bill. And we should be given enough time to amend the fix-NICS bill, because it needs to be fixed, if not axed.
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Old December 04, 2017, 10:53   #2
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text of my e-mail to Scott Perry:
the proposed "fix-NICS" would allow for administrative denial of fundametal civil right without due process by a court adjudication, as has already happened to persons who have appointed fiduciary representatives. if the House passes a combination of CCW reciprocity (HR38) and "fix-NICS" and this is forwarded to reconciliation with a "fix-NICS" only as passed by Senate, we risk a reconciliation with loss of rights to un-conunted many in an ever-expanding category of "prohibited individuals" by executive decree, with no gain in CCW reciprocity. this is about preserving a fundamentsl "pre-existing" civil right and the voters of Pennsylvania need your immediate attention to the fast tracking bait and switch that we see going on in this case. DE-COUPLE these bills NOW. thank you.
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The next time I hear "THE RANGE IS NOW HOT", it just wont be the same.

Max tried another question. "What sort of people live about here?"
"In THAT direction," the Jin said, waving its right paw round, "lives a Han: And in THAT direction," waving the other paw, "lives a Ming Hare. Visit either you like: they're both mad."
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Max remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Jin: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Max.
"You must be," said the Jin, "or you wouldn't have come here."
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Old December 04, 2017, 13:36   #3
J. Armstrong
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You da man - a well considered and written letter
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“I respect the government only in the sense that I respect any other dangerous predator who views me as food.”

“The consolidation of the states into one vast empire, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of ruin which has overwhelmed all that preceded it.” Robert E. Lee
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Old December 04, 2017, 19:19   #4
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Well, the attempt is to make all states and counties comply with reporting to NICS.

"Fugitive from Justice" charges, can include parking tickets from anywhere, if a county or city becomes aggressive.
A Low credit score, has not been proposed YET, as disqualifying.

Fed Depts, not reporting to NICS, is part of the bill, along with the State, County and Cities being encouraged/forced to participate.

What may kill the bill is the fact that the lib states will NEVER obey a CC reciprocity law.
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Old December 05, 2017, 09:21   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V guy View Post
...

What may kill the bill is the fact that the lib states will NEVER obey a CC reciprocity law.
My sister lives in one of those NE puke states ... no shall issue, no reciprocity. It took her about two years to get a carry permit (she was issued a 'non carry permit first). Interestingly, the sheriff who must sign off on the permit is considered pro gun and the permit is no good in the downstate 'Emerald City'. I agree with you, states that only very reluctantly allow their own residents to even posses a handgun will never sign onto a reciprocity agreement.
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Old December 07, 2017, 07:31   #6
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Well, they merged all three bills, and it was approved by Congress. It'll never make it through the Senate, but they're already talking about dropping the reciprocal carp part and just proceeding on the NICS and bump stock components.

You guys called it: political games to screw us all over. We've just potentially been royally screwed, folks.
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Old December 07, 2017, 09:57   #7
justashooter
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Originally Posted by ExCdnSoldierInTx View Post
Well, they merged all three bills, and it was approved by Congress. It'll never make it through the Senate, but they're already talking about dropping the reciprocal carp part and just proceeding on the NICS and bump stock components.

You guys called it: political games to screw us all over. We've just potentially been royally screwed, folks.
this was teh pelousy plan all along.
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If the concept of heading on down to the local Home Depot and transforming $100 worth of random pipe bits into a killing machine doesn’t appeal to you, you’re a frikkin' pansy. Also, you’re probably sane and will live significantly longer than I will.

Nonetheless you disgust me, and I take comfort in the knowledge that your obituary will be nowhere near as humorous as mine.


The next time I hear "THE RANGE IS NOW HOT", it just wont be the same.

Max tried another question. "What sort of people live about here?"
"In THAT direction," the Jin said, waving its right paw round, "lives a Han: And in THAT direction," waving the other paw, "lives a Ming Hare. Visit either you like: they're both mad."
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Max remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Jin: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Max.
"You must be," said the Jin, "or you wouldn't have come here."
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Old December 07, 2017, 17:43   #8
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It will never pass, even if Republicans held 60 seats in the Senate. GOP sucks.


We shouldn't even need such a bill. The Full Faith & Credit clause should cover CCW permit holders the same way a driver's license in one state allows you to drive in all 50 states without any hoops to jump through.

If one state can reject my right to CCW if I have a legal state issued permit, then why can't they reject a driver's license too?
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Old December 07, 2017, 19:15   #9
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Trump needs to threaten to veto any gun Bill unless it includes National Carry Reciprocity.
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Old December 08, 2017, 07:28   #10
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Trump needs to threaten to veto any gun Bill unless it includes National Constitutional Carry Reciprocity.
FIFY
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Old December 09, 2017, 14:46   #11
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Originally Posted by ExCdnSoldierInTx View Post
Well, they merged all three bills, and it was approved by Congress. It'll never make it through the Senate, but they're already talking about dropping the reciprocal carp part and just proceeding on the NICS and bump stock components.

You guys called it: political games to screw us all over. We've just potentially been royally screwed, folks.
Do you think Trump will sign if it makes it to his desk? I'm not trolling, this is a valid question.
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Old December 09, 2017, 17:04   #12
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I reached the conclusion long ago that we have seen and enjoyed the sunny days of private gun ownership and now the sun is setting. Those shit birds are coming for them eventually. What else can they do? Certainly not leaving millions of armed serfs running loose!
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Old December 09, 2017, 20:38   #13
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Feinstein and Schumer are senators not representatives.

Here is the text of what passed the House:

https://www.congress.gov/bill/112th-...-bill/822/text
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Old December 10, 2017, 00:54   #14
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Originally Posted by Whydah View Post
I reached the conclusion long ago that we have seen and enjoyed the sunny days of private gun ownership and now the sun is setting. Those shit birds are coming for them eventually. What else can they do? Certainly not leaving millions of armed serfs running loose!
You are a pessimist and I agree with you.
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Old December 11, 2017, 10:28   #15
justashooter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobk538447 View Post
Feinstein and Schumer are senators not representatives.

Here is the text of what passed the House:

https://www.congress.gov/bill/112th-...-bill/822/text
HR 4477 is a carbon copy of SR 2135, which was written by schumer and pelosy.

once SR 2135 passes in the senate the HR38 will be stripped out in reconciliation, and we will be left with boards of political appointees deciding who gets to have a gun, and who does not. shades of nuremburg.
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If the concept of heading on down to the local Home Depot and transforming $100 worth of random pipe bits into a killing machine doesn’t appeal to you, you’re a frikkin' pansy. Also, you’re probably sane and will live significantly longer than I will.

Nonetheless you disgust me, and I take comfort in the knowledge that your obituary will be nowhere near as humorous as mine.


The next time I hear "THE RANGE IS NOW HOT", it just wont be the same.

Max tried another question. "What sort of people live about here?"
"In THAT direction," the Jin said, waving its right paw round, "lives a Han: And in THAT direction," waving the other paw, "lives a Ming Hare. Visit either you like: they're both mad."
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Max remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Jin: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Max.
"You must be," said the Jin, "or you wouldn't have come here."
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Old December 11, 2017, 15:29   #16
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Disregard any anti-gun bills as they are Not Legal.

That's right, F@ck'em, stand up like Men do and tell them to F@ck right off.

Whining does Not do a damn thing positive, but a BULLET would.
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