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Old March 09, 2019, 14:44   #1
Combloc
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Colt Sporter Target Converted to Carbine?

At least I think that's what's going on here. Please tell me if I'm right. It looks to me like someone removed the stock and barrel from a pre-ban Sporter Target Model and replaced them with parts from a 1995ish Tactical Carbine and threw in a captured front take down pin while they were at it. I don't know why people do the things they do and normally I wouldn't even waste my time with such things but at least they used all Colt parts as far as I can tell and, other than one chewed up barrel nut tooth, it looks like it was well done. I'm pretty clueless on this AR stuff though so again, please tell me if I'm reading this clunker correctly.

A couple general views with and without a Clinton era Police trade in:






Some receiver details:











I didn't bother taking pictures of the bolt group components because they are clearly marked as Colt bits and modified just like a typical late pre-ban would be.



The gas key and tube show no weird wear patterns so I assume everything is properly aligned:





The stock is an original fiberlite with correct markings:

I didn't take a picture of the "1" but it's there.



The castle nut was not staked:



Handguards look correct:










Barrel and front sight details:














Barrel nut details:





Chewed up tooth:



So, to sum up, it looks to me like all someone did was swap out parts between two Colts. The only other thing I think someone did was clean up the trigger pull because, while all the parts appear to be factory, the pull is much lighter and smoother than any of my other ones. But that's not important. SO tell me, am I reading this Frankenberry correctly? Thank you in advance for any information you folks can provide.
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Old March 10, 2019, 04:39   #2
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Could not tell if bolt was M16 or half moon due to focus at rear and saw no picture of whether had a sear block. Go to http://www.biggerhammer.net/ar15/
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Old March 10, 2019, 05:35   #3
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The barrel carrier is clearly half moon.
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Old March 10, 2019, 05:51   #4
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Upper receiver lacks M4 feed ramps.

Barrel has M4 feed ramps, and a bayonet lug. LEO barrel for the vintage.

Lower is sear blocked. I can see the pin in the pix. Receiver is machined to accept front take down pin, so it is mid to late 1990s, right before receivers became black rather than grey.

Looks like someone will installed an LEO barrel and a Colt carbine stock kit... not uncommon modifications.


...
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Last edited by lockjaw; March 10, 2019 at 06:06.
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Old March 10, 2019, 10:22   #5
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Thanks. That's exactly what I thought as well.
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Old March 10, 2019, 10:34   #6
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A large Nancy Carragin


WHY!:


The Parts are available so you can bring it back.

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Old March 10, 2019, 12:32   #7
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FrankenColt. A 1/9" 6721 barrel w/F-base and M4 ramps but a Sporter rifle upper receiver w/800m sight and rifle ramp. At least you have what appear to be Colt parts. Somebody wanted a 6721 and put one together. It would be easy to restore to A2 configuration if you so desired.
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Old March 10, 2019, 13:15   #8
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Thanks guys. You are confirming what I thought was the case. I have other pre-ban Colts so I have no real need to convert this back. I don't know why I liked this when I saw it but I did. As I suspected and you have confirmed, it's all Colt parts and it looks to be well done. If it shoots well and reliably, I'll just leave it like it is.
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Old March 10, 2019, 13:28   #9
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Maybe their CAR-15 barrel / ETC, had not come in yet.
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Old March 10, 2019, 13:42   #10
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LOL. Maybe.
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Old March 10, 2019, 15:10   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imacoonass01 View Post
Maybe their CAR-15 barrel / ETC, had not come in yet.
During the vintage, Colt actually had match target carbines in a very similar configuration, heavy 1/9 twist 16” HBAR.... but the civilian versions didn’t have a bayonet lug. I initially thought the upper might have been factory LEO as a whole, but the lack of M4 cuts kinda’ threw that out the window.

I have some very nice original Colt A2 assemblies with grey receiver extension, and handguards if you decide to barter. I can add cash to balance values out.
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Old March 10, 2019, 16:33   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Combloc View Post
Thanks guys. You are confirming what I thought was the case. I have other pre-ban Colts so I have no real need to convert this back. I don't know why I liked this when I saw it but I did. As I suspected and you have confirmed, it's all Colt parts and it looks to be well done. If it shoots well and reliably, I'll just leave it like it is.
If you like it and it functions then leaving alone is a perfect option, especially owning other pre-ban AR's. I have a myriad of as shipped from factory pre-bans as well as modified. Only thing I don't have are many transitional rifles. I was building SP1's new in box for $449 to $499 based on options in college and first couple years of having a job.

Some reason soon as left college seemed like most of my friends ran out and rented an apartment then financed a car. I kept driving the car took to college and drove one of the spare work trucks when needed a truck. Bought my first AR still in high school and bought a couple while in college and kept two part time jobs just to feed my gun habit. Parents payed the school bills, gave me some occasional folding money and didn't realize that every semester after buying new books for upcoming classes was able to sell my very clean, well kept used textbooks for enough to buy a Smith & Wesson wheel gun or pay off a Colt had on lay away.

Had converted my dad's home office into a reloading and vault room thus already had two well equipped reloading benches, one bullet casting/swaging bench along with work bench for cleaning and building guns plus the first vault. Had a bowling pin table, steel plate racks and shooting trees, etc set up where could work at various ranges with brass landing on driveway and not having to scour through grass. Rain days opened both garage doors and swith ed to big wheel guns and AR's with home swaged bullets that used rim fire cases for jackets so shot well but didn't punch holes in my plates. Had a 100 to 200 yard range with bench cemented in ground for stability if shot toward woods behind barn and up to 400 yards if turned 90° and shot toward end of pature but top of driveway was right behind targets so had to be careful not to shoot parents or occasional visitor.

Every weekend half my friends would be sleeping in spare bedrooms and sofas to use the ranges had been building for a decade and shoot my ammo. Stayed at home for two years after college and every Friday would take paycheck to LGS. Owner would balance my tab, add in anything I piled on counter then ask how much money needed to get through the week and keep the rest to apply toward my never ending tab. Buying my first center fire wheel gun at age 13 adding to guns dad had given me, buying guns with all my weekend and summer job money then two years of no rent, car payment or grocery bill was able to amass a gun collection that was nicer than many adultstudents who called themselves collectors.

Finally the drive from farm to work was killing my spare time to ride bikes and hit gym in evenings plus made Friday and Saturday nigh hookups inconvenient. Moved the collection to first apartment just four miles from work, used the local gun range to shoot but was climbing/cyclimg/skiing more by then but still buying a minimum of one firearm per momth. Up till about 1990 buying Colt SP1's were not overly expensive and plentiful. Same time SKS's were $79, SKS-M's were $99 and AK's were $129 all with 600 round tins of ammo. When tenants below me noticed their ceilings cracking and maintenance department noticed I had two gun safes realized had to find a house. Found a cheap slab built house for a starter home and added a third safe. I am working a deal on a 1960's 20" SP1 A1 right now and may somehow be able to get the deal on transitional pre-ban rifle at LGS to work if give up a DPMS Oracle with upgraded barrel, free float forearm and 30mm scope mounts.

Wish I had layed into more Pony guns from 1970's through mid 1990's but had to spend money chasing females and travelling the planet. At least I purchased Pythons, Diamondbacks, Cobras, Anacondas, SP1's, etc before prices shot up to the moon. Also glad when a teen had enough sense to spend my cash on firearms instead of booze, dope and too many fast females. Mostly went for females that paid the tab, a friend told hid g/f would buy her an engagement ring when she bought him a SCAR with Elcan scope and I.R. laser.

I had one g/f that would buy my a firearm every Christmas plus birthday and LGS owner made sure all were Pomy guns. Might should have married her but she wanted a passel of kids, not me in the Andes or Alps climbing. Think the guns were a con to try and keep me home more. If I did have kids would encouraged them to do similar. Work, buy guns and stay home till age 25 as too stupid to marry younger than that anyway. Would not let them live in basement till their 30's or 40's but 25 would give them opportunity to bank enough cash and buy enough guns could live decent soon as released into the wild without anything but an apartment and leased car. Still have the SP1 purchased when still in high school.
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Old March 10, 2019, 16:39   #13
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Old March 10, 2019, 16:55   #14
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I look at it differently. It is a bunch of parts, and who who knows how well the barrel was installed until you put a torque wrench to the barrel nut?

If you want to return it to an A2 or HB Han era configuration, that is easily tangible. The current six hole carbine handguards are easily worth $75+. The received extension $150+ (much more if buffer is round and/or extension is two hole). The barrel isn’t popular with collector’s or the fan boy crowd, but turn it back to 14.7” and solder/pin on your muzzle device of choice, and you have a kick ass barrel that is handy while digesting your typical off the shelf fodder (which most of us realistically shoot).

When something is no longer original and/or correct, I look at the sum of parts and the future potential of the parts. Otherwise, the rifle isn’t any different, nor will it perform any better, than any other bubba bench build.
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Old March 10, 2019, 19:19   #15
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I took it out to the range today and put a bunch of rounds through it. Being that it was the first sunny day in the 60's for months, the range was BUSY where usually I'm pretty much alone. It was a sea of guys with their tricked out AR's and me with my army man green Cetme L and my bone stock old frankenberry Colt. I was the only guy who put a target out at 100 yards while these guys were using scopes at 50. I have no idea what the hell all that was about. Anywho, some of them had problems with their rifles which is why I tend to steer away from anything NOT factory older Colt although I do have an FN15. Meanwhile, the frankenberry and Cetme L never missed a beat. The smoothed up and lightened trigger was very nice too. It's a keeper and I plan to leave it just as it is.


Hueyville, you and I would get along very well sir. I'm in my late 40's and bought my first Chicom AK when I was in high school. All through high school and college, while my buddies were out chasing women, boozing it up and buying stuff for their cars, I drove a 71 Plymouth Fury government model that was a hand me down from my dad and rode a beat up old Kawasaki KZ400 I had bought for 300 bucks back in high school. All my spare money went into firearms and some travel. I built up and still have a nice little collection of both fire arms and memories all these years later. Life is good brother!
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Old March 12, 2019, 10:08   #16
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Colt

What most people missed is the fact that the A2 upper is for a A2 rifle as the rear sight is marked 8/3 which is for a 20 inch barreled rifle. It started life from Colt as 20 inch barreled rifle. The N/1 marked retractable stock was for the Colt M-4 position conversion kits. During the assault weapons ban I used to take A2 rifles and convert them to complete M-4 profiled Flat top conversions and sell them for 2K as their was NO true M-4 semi's from Colt. I used to spend between 50K to 100K a year with Colt just in conversion parts alone. These days you can Buy real Semi-auto M-4 carbines for under 800.00 out the door. I still have a Original Bushmaster XM15E2S with all Colt conversion parts including 1 of 300 ever Colt made 16 inch M-4 profiled barrels, I had 100 of them back then. That order was split between SAW, YTM and myself. M-4 conversion uppers were around 450.00 each from Colt by the 100. With Colt back then, It was go big or spend retail from Colt.Back then suggested retail from Colt was almost 900.00 retail for just a M-4 conversion flat top conversion upper complete.
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Old March 12, 2019, 21:37   #17
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Yes sir, you are correct of course. I have no doubt the A2 upper has been with that lower since it left the factory. Someone just switched out the stock and barrel while adding a front takedown pin. They had a rifle and wanted a carbine. It's that simple.
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