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Topic: Rant on higher degrees

Abominog
Wannabe Moderator
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November 18, 2009 04:50

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Post #1

OK, so I'm working on being edumacated. After 3 years in an MBA program and with a 3.77/4 average, I observe:

MY FELLOW STUDENTS ARE MORONS

Before you ask why do it, 1) it's free to me (except for time) and 2) it will look good on the resume and 3) I'm actually learning something because I try.

The scary thing is these meatheads are the ones that will run companies in the future...run them into the ground. The whole system of thinking "higher degree" earners are informed is a major (but not complete) falsehood.

It is absolutely amazing that these morons can take a leak without hitting their zippers.

Thanks for listening. You blue collar guys are going to jump in and scream and agree. Sadly, you will be right.

__________________
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Tempus Edax Rerum

easttex
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November 18, 2009 05:55

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Post #2

Ab,

I hear what you're saying. Here are my thoughts on it:

The one thing you understand that they won't until later is their greatest learning experience won't happen until they graduate: Try finding a job with a degree and no experience; more to the point, try finding a job with an advanced degree and no experience.

When you're paper smart, but experience dumb, and your degree intimidates the person across the desk performing your interview, your job search can get kind of interesting. It took me a while with a BS and nothing to back it up. I'm glad I wasn't holding something higher up with no professional experience. Hell, I'd still be at the glass studio watching the world pass me by!

I applaud higher education and I would never discourage anyone from it. However, I think people really need to get the hell away from the theoretical world of the universities and into the real world and work for a few years before they go back for a masters. I really think the experience and maturity the real world often instills help immensely.

__________________
Chance favors the prepared mind.

Molon labe

Brett
Veteran Member

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November 18, 2009 08:53

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Post #3

Experience is most important. A degree and grades indicate how much effort and how much garbage someone will put up with to get ahead. I got a B.S. in '74 and have never used it for a job. I went back to get cheap health ins. and have 175 hrs. I can't be smarter than I was in '74, but my grades are now always A's. They weren't in '74. I think it's because I'm not as distracted by sex, and the classes are easier. Seriously...they have "test reviews" before the test. How is that a test?

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Outlaw Patriot
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November 18, 2009 09:01

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Post #4

People are morons. Even smart people often choose to just be really really dumb. I know lots of people that can apply their considerable intellect to certain specific things that require it, but then they just turn off their brains the rest of the time, and do some of the dumbest stuff imaginable.

STGThndr
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FALaholic # 14583

November 18, 2009 09:45

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Post #5

yep there's some pretty dumb folxx out there with college and beyond. I work with a few. Most seem to excell in arrogance and self-importance and expectation of deference. Many seem to be narrowly focussed in one area. Knowledge per se, especially book learning, is a very narrow measure of ability and intelligence. Ive known some knowledgable meatheads with very few apparent survival abilities in (say) a Katrina situation. But, not all smart people are stupid.. some will surprise ya.

__________________
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

W.B Yeats

L Haney
Seriously Ponderin'
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November 18, 2009 10:46

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Post #6

I've seen both sides of the coin (and a few from the rim).Some are educated beyond their intelligence, in some others it seems to start waking up their abilities. Far as the distribution of how many end up in which camp seems to be a crap shoot. Hey! Where's the guy on here does statistics? Maybe he could gin us up a Poisson spread of moron incidence.

owlcreekok
Chronosycix Infindubulum
Gold Contributor
FALaholic # 15323

November 18, 2009 13:04

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Post #7

These days, learning something and being educated are usually two different things.

__________________
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Nick H.
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November 18, 2009 14:19

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Post #8

My observations indicate that the main requirements for a top management job in declining order of importance are a big ego, willingness to play the right political games, and usually a good work ethic. Intelligence, family values and practical knowledge is not a high priority among that crowd. I do know some self made millionaires who have all the qualities that I tend to value, but for the most part, the "successful" people I have known have lied, cheated and trampled their way to the top. They often treat their wives and children with the same lack of respect they treat their co-workers with.

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xcpd69
OLDMEMBER
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November 18, 2009 14:28

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Post #9

"You can lead a student to knowledge, but you can't make him think."

BIG difference between being able to repeat what you've memorized, and learning to think.

A parrot can do the first.

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Sailor553
breaking for coffee
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November 18, 2009 14:50

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Post #10

While we would like to blame the CEOs of the banks, insurance companies, mortgage houses, and industry on the recent financial crisis....the single item they all have in common is an MBA...and, I'd be willing to bet most were obtained during the mid to late - nineteen eighties. We reap what others sow.

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gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 18, 2009 14:59

Post #11

I have a couple degrees gathering dust on the wall. I totally agree with you. Most Americans are morons. Those with degrees are most dangerous because they believe they are not. Heck - just read a few posts here and see that adults can't write coherent English sentences, even with free spellcheck!

That piece of paper is a prerequisite to get your foot in the door, that's about it. My sister has a law degree - she couldn't argue her way out of a wet paper bag. My buddy has a high school diploma and a covey of engineers working for him in missile systems. Not being politically correct, when THEY ask "hey - why are we working for you, we have degrees" he responds "Because I know what I'm doing you're a f-cking moron - that's why!" But it was a lot harder for him to get the job - he started as a grunt assembler and worked his way up to director of quality control & testing. The enginers had a "VIP Pass" to at least get by the entry level jobs.

Personally, if I had to pick someone blind, I'd give preference to one with 4 years in the military than 4 years in college.

College (as differentiated from "education") is a commodity. Those marketing it use the same techniques as those selling beer or designer clothes or anything else. Their greatest weapon in propagating the myth is the arbitrary value placed on the product.

College graduates typically make more than non-college grads, but is it because of the education? Or because those with the determination to finish 4 years of school are also the same people who would do better at any job, with or without college?

__________________
T. Mark Graham
Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

Last edited by gunplumber on November 18, 2009 at 15:05

SmokeEater2
Orthodox Druid
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November 18, 2009 15:05

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Post #12

quote:
Originally posted by owlcreekok
These days, learning something and being educated are usually two different things.

Owl nailed it.

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ggiilliiee
Browning's love child

FALaholic # 17179

November 18, 2009 15:29

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Post #13

GP gots a duhgreee....what kind of matches were they ....??

man buddy one minute the FN engineers are top,(rail widening) then the next minute they are morons ......(brass strikes no feed )
are you running with car salesman mcain in 2012 ..ya both go in multiple directions (as needed) and end up last place ...

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gunplumber
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Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 18, 2009 15:42

Post #14

Oh gosh, did my drunken troll crawl back out from under his rock? Ghillie, dear, you are a liar - a fraud and a poser. Your lack of integrity defines you.

As does your historical ignorance.

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T. Mark Graham
Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

Stranger
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November 18, 2009 16:27

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Post #15

But does that make him uneducated and unlearned?

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toolman5256
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November 18, 2009 16:38

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Post #16

quote:
Originally posted by owlcreekok
These days, learning something and being educated are usually two different things.

you hit it right on the head.

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is it war that brings on the worst in man, or the worst in man that brings on war.

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gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 18, 2009 16:48

Post #17

quote:
Originally posted by Stranger
But does that make him uneducated and unlearned?

The distinction is irrelevant. He is a liar. That is the ONLY thing that matters.

__________________
T. Mark Graham
Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

308bolt
Heathen
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November 18, 2009 16:52

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Post #18

quote:
Originally posted by owlcreekok
These days, learning something and being educated are usually two different things.

What's needed is a course of study in common sense.

__________________
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owlcreekok
Chronosycix Infindubulum
Gold Contributor
FALaholic # 15323

November 18, 2009 16:59

Post #19

quote:
Originally posted by 308bolt

What's needed is a course of study in common sense.

That is called falling one's ass in a "hole" and there not being anyone around to help you up out of it and tell you it was not your fault.

Pluribus
Human Endeavourist
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November 18, 2009 17:15

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Post #20

Some folks are naturally intelligent. Some folks are intelligent because they are educated. Some folks think because they are educated, they are intelligent.

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johnny.308
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November 18, 2009 17:31

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Post #21

A lot of intelligent and well educated people showed their stupid follow the herd mentality in the last presidential election and are now scratching their heads wondering what happened.

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cowbilly
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November 18, 2009 17:33

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Post #22

I'm still working on my MA, not sure it is worth the minimal raise I'll get for it. But like everyone has stated , it is "checking the block". It proves you have the dicipline and drive to reasonably think (some would disagree) and complete a task.

Regarding education in general, I always hear the saying "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink". My answer to that is yes you can make him drink, you just have to lead him around the pond a few more times. Eventually, he'll take a drink.

The problem today is that everyone pushes college on high school students. Though it is more readily available as far as funding goes, it is not for everyone. It also seems to be turning into the 13th grade. It is getting dumbed down like high school is now and is definately not what it used to be.

308bolt
Heathen
Bronze Contributor
FALaholic # 19255

November 18, 2009 17:35

Post #23

quote:
Originally posted by owlcreekok

That is called falling one's ass in a "hole" and there not being anyone around to help you up out of it and tell you it was not your fault.

Interesting viewpoint.
To build on that concept for a moment.......
Common sense could keep you out of the hole but in one lacking common sense, education may help them out of the hole.
If they learn from their experience, does it mean they've gained common sense?

johnny.308
Senior Member
Bronze Contributor
FALaholic # 32261

November 18, 2009 17:38

Post #24

quote:
Originally posted by Pluribus
Some folks are naturally intelligent. Some folks are intelligent because they are educated. Some folks think because they are educated, they are intelligent.

No amount of education can make a person intelligent. You either are or you are not. Unlike the Wizard of Oz, you can't give a scarcrow a diploma and create instant genius.

Andy the Aussie
Dinosaur
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November 18, 2009 17:52

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Post #25

All education here I have seen is designed to get the student "passed" not so much qualified. They don't like to tell people that is just not good enough/you don't have the intellect/ability for this as it may jeopardise the campus income stream.

I will always take a person with experience/hands on over one with a bit of paper alone.

Andy

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quote:
Originally posted by GOVT1911
You could do some searching and find a nice TLC and do the same thing, still saving a bunch of $$ and end up with a nice, comfortable CAPABLE rig...

(Jiminy Christmas, did I just recommend a 'yota?!!??)

quote:
Originally posted by J. Armstrong
I never though I'd be telling 'nog that I like his rack

gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 18, 2009 17:56

Post #26

It is interesting that we are bandying about the term "intelligent".

Will someone please define it . . . ?

I have pondered this in great length. While obtaining my teaching certification, I was trying to explain why 5+5 was not a culturally biased question.

I remember missing a question on the ASVAB on the firing sequence of engine cylinders. They didn't ask me the firing sequence of a Browning .30.

I have a buddy who cannot write a coherent English sentence. He is slysdexic and was put in the retarded classes in school. But he can carve a 1911 out of a 2x4. His ability to visualize spacial relationships is amazing. But by any written test today, he'd be an idiot.

__________________
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Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

308bolt
Heathen
Bronze Contributor
FALaholic # 19255

November 18, 2009 18:09

Post #27

quote:
Originally posted by gunplumber
It is interesting that we are bandying about the term "intelligent".

I've always considered intelligence as the ability to absorb information.
I consider being able to see the links between various bits of information and forming a conclusion to be common sense.

Some people seem to have an unlimited capacity for storing and correlating information.

Others......
Not so much.

308bolt
Heathen
Bronze Contributor
FALaholic # 19255

November 18, 2009 18:12

Post #28

After giving myself a moment for further thought:
I believe intelligence to be the combination of absorbing and correlating information.

gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 18, 2009 18:17

Post #29

The world is full of people who can recite with no understanding of what they were reciting. There are also people who have memorized key phrases about a topic and sprinkle their posts with these words to pretend they are knowledgeable, without any understanding of the words' application.

The tests asks "what date started the Battle of the Bulge" and the reciter says December 16, 1944. He scores the points.

Someone like me doesn't remember the date - just that it was winter of 44-45, but I understand the significance of it - the German die Ardennenoffensive objectives and reasons for the objectives (why is Antwerp significant) etc.

Many teachers are lazy and grading essay questions is harder than multiple choice questions.

They teach to their tests and the reciters outperform those with less rote memorization and more conceptual understanding.

NOT that memorization is bad. There are things that must be memorized, like multiplication tables. Having a philosophy about multiplication is interesting, but not as useful as doing 7 x 6 in your head.

But is a name or a date as significant as the historical impact of the event? Who is more "intelligent"?

Just look at politicospeak. Sprinkle a completely meaningless goblidygook speech with blah blah freedom blah blah american deream blah blah social justice blah blah change blah blah rights of all Americans blah blah and you may get elected president. Just don't respond to anyone who deconstructs your speech and notes "this is just a bunch of goblidygook - he didn't actually SAY anything!

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Last edited by gunplumber on November 18, 2009 at 18:25

martin35
Still indubitably Texan
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November 18, 2009 18:31

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Post #30

I have no degree, I did make attempts to obtain one in night school, a classic path for success, that interfered with my making more money than most of those who already had degrees. As I progressed my knowledge in my chosen field became greater than that of my contemporaries, in time others with degrees worked under my non-degreed direction. A few of those went on to become leaders in very large corporations, they were members of a club I would never belong to. That clubs members required a conformation of educational accomplishment for entry but to rise to the top tier it required the audacity to be preeminent among the membership and bear the envy of all. "Who dares wins" is more than a motto, until deployed it remains a motto, we can feel superior but sooner or later we have to prove it,,, or not.
Abominog, if indeed your fellow students remain "morons" your success is assured,,, by the application of your superior intellect and industry, not much will happen until the latter are put to use.,,, good luck buddy the only affirmative action you are likely to see is that which you already have.

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brumalis
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November 18, 2009 22:43

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Post #31

I have several issues with the entire "Got to get a degree" frame of mind.

Too many heads of education need to fill the schools with students for financial funds and state requirements. We end up with barely passing students with a degree and therefore we have a worthless piece of paper just to serve up fries.

College degrees are advertised as the key for financial gain- "graduate college and get a $40,000 a year job". College costs so much one needs a good job just to pay off student loans.

I'm all for Trade Schools. Not as glamorous as a degree, but practical. I think this should be offered as the same degree of importance as college.

Not everyone one is college material; some people have natural skills, and others have to find what they can do. My wife never had college, yet is a very successful business person. I suck at math and I could not get a college degree without any math classes - so I joined the military, got out to go a trade school, and life is good. We have friends with degrees - some who work in the field of their degree and others have gone completely in opposite directions. We know people without degrees who make a fortune: the repairmen, electricians, plumbers, carpenters and such.

I don't care if Obama's mantra that "everyone needs a degree". That is a typical Ivory Tower opinion which defies practicality.

owlcreekok
Chronosycix Infindubulum
Gold Contributor
FALaholic # 15323

November 19, 2009 01:09

Post #32

quote:
Originally posted by brumalis
Obama's mantra that "everyone needs a degree". T

Harumphh.

Only degree that bastard has that is worth a red piss is 98.6. I would that the decimal be moved left a space.

As ar as the rest of your post, Brumalis, it is worth remembering.

longhair51
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November 19, 2009 02:48

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Post #33

I don't have anything against college, or college degrees. I have about 70 semester hours, but have no desire to complete the classes to finish.

I see too many people that don't have the ability to apply what they know, to complete the job at hand in a satisfactory manor, no matter what the degree. I'm not so sure that common sense is all that common.

I read this article by Jay Leno some time ago, but I think it speaks volume's. Although he speaks about machinists, I think the point of the article could be applied to Americas industrial base as a whole.

link

W.E.G.
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November 19, 2009 02:57

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Post #34

I got the THIRD degree once.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-V0K7BHDt4

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justashooter
harsh, but entertaining

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November 19, 2009 03:19

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Post #35

quote:
Originally posted by easttex

When you're paper smart, but experience dumb, and your degree intimidates the person across the desk performing your interview, your job search can get kind of interesting.

in that case, you can always teach.

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The next time I hear "THE RANGE IS NOW HOT", it just wont be the same.

Max tried another question. "What sort of people live about here?"
"In THAT direction," the Jin said, waving its right paw round, "lives a Han: And in THAT direction," waving the other paw, "lives a Ming Hare. Visit either you like: they're both mad."
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justashooter
harsh, but entertaining

FALaholic # 5967

November 19, 2009 03:19

Post #36

quote:
Originally posted by 308bolt

I've always considered intelligence as the ability to absorb information.
I consider being able to see the links between various bits of information and forming a conclusion to be common sense.

Some people seem to have an unlimited capacity for storing and correlating information.

Others......
Not so much.

intelligence is the ability to make advantageous use of information.

jimmbob
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November 19, 2009 03:49

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Post #37

quote:
Originally posted by johnny.308
A lot of intelligent and well educated people showed their stupid follow the herd mentality in the last presidential election and are now scratching their heads wondering what happened.

Well stated, johnny.308

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easttex
Perpetual Home Renovator

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November 19, 2009 03:50

Post #38

quote:
Originally posted by justashooter
in that case, you can always teach.

Which reminds me of something the math professor in my freshman class told me many, many years ago:

"Remember kids, those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach teachers."

Coming from a department head, it kinda put things in perspective.

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Bawana jim
Curio & Relic

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November 19, 2009 03:58

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Post #39

Fact is that those with the degrees are the ones that have run the country into a depression. How smart is that?

jim

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Arby
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November 19, 2009 04:30

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Post #40

I used to gripe about the idiots that I knew who had received degrees but who knew little about anything. A younger sister who worked with a number of PhDs remarked that most of those whom she worked with were not capable of writing a coherent memo. Of course, they weren't trained to write coherent memos. My sister did get her PhD, and writes quite well for a "scientist". Another friend who earned a PhD remarked that one could go through the local university, put out the minimum effort, and matriculate. Or, one could put in a bit of effort, and enjoy the benefit of an excellent education (which they would have thereby EARNED).

You get out of it what you put into it. Sure, there are people with graduate or terminal degrees that aren't models of functional intellect. I have known non-degreed craftspersons that have a whole lot more practical and applied intelligence (and probably higher I.Q.s) than some others I know that proudly wave their Juris Doctorate sheepskins in the faces of us lesser mortals.

In defense of higher degrees: If you work hard at it, you have the benefit of the challenge that is offered by that level of education, plus whatever skills you gain in the process. Plus, it is something that no one can ever take away from you. Even if it doesn't translate into higher earnings. But the sheepskin doesn't mean that you are smarter than those without it.

To address Abominog's complaint: I have heard some really, really stupid things proposed by MBA candidates, and graduates. I've also known some that have been pretty smart. The degree is no guarantee of smarts.

TheChief94
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November 19, 2009 06:09

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Post #41

Had a freshly minted young Ensign that reported aboard my last sea command as Gunnery Officer. He introduced himself, and commented that he held an advanced degree in Industrial Engineering, so any problems that my gun crew and I (with advanced technical schools as well as about 90 years total practical experience) could not fix, he would be happy to take on for us. One side of the loading system had been giving us fits, so we handed him the keys to the carrier room, explained briefly what the problem was, and wished him luck. Told him I'd be in the Chief's Mess...

He knocked on the door several hours later, greased up like a pig at a 4th of July barbecue, with a bewildered look on his face. He confessed he had never seen mechanisms such as these (go figure) and didn't understand the technical manuals associated with them. To make things worse, the next day we had a PAC ("Pre-Action Calibration") gun shoot. The engineers were conducting casualty control drills, and we suffered a brownout which caused the gun's logic to load two rounds to one side. Not catastrophic, but which, if we had used explosive rounds, would have tightened some sphincters.

My gun crew and I were freeing up the jammed rounds when the Ensign "requested our presence" in the carrier room, where he blasted us for ruining "his" gun shoot by our poor performance, poor maintenance, and outright lying to him in blaming the logic problem on some "imaginary" brownout. Based on his "experience," such things did not occur aboard ships...

The Weapons Officer, Chief Engineer, and Executive Officer set him straight as to the events as they actually happened (our version). Funny, we never did trust him afterwards...

__________________
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb discussing the lunch menu...liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.

USS William M. Wood (DD-715) (Sunk as a target, May, 1983)
USS Lawrence (DDG-4) (Scrapped)
USS William V. Pratt (DDG-44) (Scrapped)
USS Mahan (DDG-42) (Scrapped)
USS Jesse L. Brown (FF/FFT-1089) (Sold to the Egyptian Navy)

V guy
Curio & Relic

FALaholic # 10282

November 19, 2009 18:28

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Post #42

Where is the free spellcheck on this board's posting screen?
I can't see half of my spelling errors due to the small screen I have to work with.

gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 19, 2009 18:32

Post #43

quote:
Originally posted by V guy
Where is the free spellcheck on this board's posting screen?
I can't see half of my spelling errors due to the small screen I have to work with.

Your browser doesn't have it?

I use Mozilla. Options/tools/advanced/check spelling while typing

__________________
T. Mark Graham
Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

Scott S
Curio & Relic
Contributor
FALaholic # 355

November 19, 2009 19:35

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Post #44

I like justashooter's definition of intelligence, and I'll extend it further by adding that I believe intelligence also encompasses the ability to put information to use by physically manipulating one's environment or items in it. The ability to use one's hands, from tying a knot to barreling an FAL to changing an intake manifold gasket to rigging a tarp for cover to sewing patches on your son's scout uniform, is an oft-ignored commodity in this day of planned obsolescence and video games. We, as a society, don't fix things any more. I'm not trying to imply that folks here on the 'Files don't fix things but that, in general, many folks either call the repairman or buy a new one. Many kids these days spend a lot of time watching the tube or playing video games instead of getting outside and doing "stuff".

When I was a kid, a lot of my education consisted of tinkering with crap in the garage, watching and helping dad work on the cars and appliances, seeing the results of experiments with flammable liquids/heavy objects/power tools/sharp edges, and helping mom cook, among other fun stuff. I cut myself, burned myself, and got in trouble with the parents more often than not, but I also learned how to use my hands to manipulate things the way I wanted. I'm no master woodworker, certified auto tech, or Iron Chef hopeful, but I can do things that coworkers, parents at the kids' school, and even some relatives thing is magic. It's amazing how little practical education and application some folks have. Heck, just last weekend I saw a person my senior struggle to open a cot for heaven's sake!

There's something to be said for a person with a theoretical and practical education.

brumalis
Member
Contributor
FALaholic # 12359

November 20, 2009 02:13

Post #45

My favorite story goes as such:

Edison hired an newly graduated assistant. The first task Edison had him do was to figure out the volume of the inside of a test vacuum tube for a light bulb. An hour later Edison arrived back at his new assistants table which was strewn with pages of mathematical calculations, and asked for the figure. The assistant remarked that due to the complex shape it was taking him a while to compute the results. Edison, without a word, walked over to the sink and filled the glass tube with water; then he poured it into a measuring cup. "There", Edison pointed, "is your answer."

True? Who knows, but it is a great lesson.

StarPD
Old Fart

FALaholic # 4773

November 20, 2009 17:38

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Post #46

Ya wanna see some really dumb people with degrees? Just go to any school. My wife is exceptionally intelligent and worked very hard to get a Masters + 72, a near Doctorate. She's a teacher, and can't understand how some of the teachers and administrators can be so incredibly stupid. I don't mean just a little stupid, but stupid enough to wonder how they can find their way to work. Some of her fellow teachers are quite bright though. Not surprisingly, they too wonder how so many in education are so dim. Even some with Doctorates have no sense of logic or even understand cause and effect. She's had enough of the increasing folly, and is planning on retiring this year, just to get away from the counterproductive policies and procedures inflicted on the system by supposedly superior administrators who may be book smart but can't tie their shoes.

And TheChief94, I know what you mean about dummies in the service. As a Fire Control Technician in the Navy on a Destroyer, our Chief Fire Control Technician was a "convertee". That was when the Navy was "integrating", and put minorities through a short course in the specialty they wanted to get into. He had been a Chief Steward's Mate, and after 6 weeks of schooling, became a Chief Fire Control Technician. He was dumber than a box of rocks, and hated me because I was a bright young white kid who knew more than he would ever know. He rode me unmercifully, until I took matters into my own hands. That's a story unto itself, but rest assured, he never bothered me again afterward, or any of the other guys in the Fire Control gang. I had a hard time understanding how the Navy put such an incompetent in charge of something as critical as Fire Control, but later I learned how politics can create such dangerous situations. It's still that way, both in and out of the service.

__________________
George
StarPD

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

gunplumber
Arrogant Bastard
Contributor
FALaholic # 96

November 20, 2009 17:43

Post #47

quote:
Originally posted by StarPD
but later I learned how politics can create such dangerous situations. It's still that way, both in and out of the service.

Yes, just look at Ft. Hood.

__________________
T. Mark Graham
Master Gunsmith
Arizona Response Systems, LLC

owlcreekok
Chronosycix Infindubulum
Gold Contributor
FALaholic # 15323

November 20, 2009 17:49

Post #48

Or the three branches of our government.

stimpsonjcat
Windoze free since 1-2010
Bronze Contributor
FALaholic # 470

November 20, 2009 21:52

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Post #49

I have a degree...my name is misspelled on it.

In the real world I discovered being an 'engineer' made you the enemy of most of the guys doing the work...for reasons both real and imagined.

I always prided myself on being able to work well with anyone anywhere in the process. Met a lot of dummies at all levels of the process, but things sure go smoother once there's respect on both ends.

__________________
peace!
Happiness=UPS+ORMD

"Your 8mm FAL is like a deuce coup with a Ferrari pancake 12 under the hood and a Jaguar rear end. It just kinda transcends cool into fantasy."- USMC 0341

Radio
10 Years on the Files

FALaholic # 263

November 20, 2009 22:11

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Post #50

There are many businesses or programs or production being run by professional bean counters who have obtained that bean counter degree (and thus control as the "head honcho") but have NO understanding of what they are running. No grasp of ANY technical or often even legal aspects. Many times their rules and/or instructions run contrary to the needs of the business or even of common sense. This is the main cause of slowdowns (either in production or intellectual output), conflict between what is "mandated" and what is RIGHT, and loss of faith in management by employees.

In a perfect world we would have people who UNDERSTAND the business they are running. Too bad.

--Radio

__________________
*Train Like You Fight: Second PLace is NOT an Option. --E.M. (Ted) Dannemiller II

"You seem to fantasize about me a lot. Maybe you should tell your boyfriend? He could dress up like me or something." --K.O.A.M., November 9th, 2009

"You're better off hoping she don't miss, it's quicker that way." --ce, December 15, 2009

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