Israel gives Hamas 36-hours ultimatum before starting major offensive

[the gman]

Originally Posted by brunop

Jewish people want a homeland - like Englishmen do. Some of them, having been chased around the world for generations, have made permanent homes elsewhere. Some have gone 'home', once the Brits, Americans, and the U.N. got them a little piece of heaven they can call their own - which happens to be the same place they came from ever since Abraham left Ur.

Israel as a nation is the home of Jewish-heritage people (in some or many cases). If you want to see what Jewish people have brought to the world, look up a list of Nobel Prize winners in the sciences and medicine.

Indeed but that was not the question kind Sir. Your comparison to England is neither fair nor accurate; the English, though unquestionably diluted over millennia, have never left their ancestral home unlike the Jews. There is no Jewish race per se; merely a disparate grouping of various cultures, ethnicity, nationalities and factions that have one common denominator of a shared religion.

I did not ask what Jews have done to advance the culture, science or knowledge of the world; I asked what has Israel brought forth to better the world as a whole? Israel was born from the desire of Zionists and only formed by displacing others who had more than an equal claim on the real estate by dint of thousands of years of continuous occupancy.

If the United States treated Native Americans in the same way the Jews have treated the Palestinians, there would be international outrage but for some strange reason, much of the western world is silent in this matter.

Israel has continuously spied on America, via Jonathon Pollard and others since its inception. Again, what benefit accrues to the world from the state of Israel?

[brunop]

Originally Posted by AliYahu

Please tell me this is sarcasm!

Eli

Put differently, he's asking about the state of Israel, not about Jewish people.

[0302]

Yanno, Syria, Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon, etc, are home to some of the oldest societies, thousands of years old, predating Jesus, and they are still locked in the Stone Age technologically, socially, spiritually, and will stay there as followers of the false & illigitimate prophet known as mo. They are the losers of history, locked in their own hell, their women nothing but slaves & property. They resent Israel because they will never match the success of Israel, and that knowledge hurts.

[jaxpicker2]

I think the question we have to ask our selves is what will the Obama dictatorship do if or when Isreal invades Gaza? I think they will sit back and watch. Bad mouth Isreal when it is all over.

"WHAT SAY YOU" -Captain Jack Sparrow

[brunop]

Originally Posted by the gman

Indeed but that was not the question kind Sir. Your comparison to England is neither fair nor accurate; the English, though unquestionably diluted over millennia, have never left their ancestral home unlike the Jews. There is no Jewish race per se; merely a disparate grouping of various cultures, ethnicity, nationalities and factions that have one common denominator of a shared religion.

I did not ask what Jews have done to advance the culture, science or knowledge of the world; I asked what has Israel brought forth to better the world as a whole? Israel was born from the desire of Zionists and only formed by displacing others who had more than an equal claim on the real estate by dint of thousands of years of continuous occupancy.

If the United States treated Native Americans in the same way the Jews have treated the Palestinians, there would be international outrage but for some strange reason, much of the western world is silent in this matter.

Israel has continuously spied on America, via Jonathon Pollard and others since its inception. Again, what benefit accrues to the world from the state of Israel?

1. I know what the original question was. And I posted to AliYahu that you were asking about the state, not the people.

2. The United States government does treat the American Indians the way Israel treats the Palestinians. We just did most of it 150 years ago - before mass media.

3. I understand you to be confusing practitioners of Judaism with Jewish-heritage peoples. I think Jews are, by and large, from the twelve tribes and claim Abraham as Father through his son, Isaac. Many Arabs, if I'm not mistaken, hold the tradition that Arabs are descended from Ishmael - firstborn of Abraham through the handmaid/second wife named Hagar.

4. Didn't Jewish-heritage peoples also have the same claim that Palestinians had (in fact, weren't some Jewish-heritage peoples also Palestinian) - by dint of their continuous habitation?

5. Zionist: yes. Is this the belief that Jews would be gathered into a super-state, sooner or later? Good for a people to believe in themselves. England improved the world immensely in many ways (another topic for another time) - not the least of which was the exportation of football. In the United States, we "believed" in Manifest Destiny for more than 100 years. Jews can believe in themselves, too. I guess?


But all of this is to say that I can't think of anything that Israel (the state) has done to improve the world. Except for the one tiny fact that they are a lightning rod for Muslim hatred, and a true 'stop' in the gap against Muslim jihad.

A lot of this has to do with a person's perspective on history. I'm biased against the "Us versus them" view of modern world history, which looks like the United States and Britain (and other less-involved nations) as the Good Guys, and the Soviet System (first the National Socialists in Germany, and then Soviet Russia and satellites, China, etc.) as the Bad Guys. In this interpretation, Israel is a VERY important (and positive) actor against the Evil Empire: an ally in a diffcult part of the world, a proxy in the fight against the Soviet-influence-peddling in the OPEC world.

In my mind, this "Us Versus Them" model is really just Republicans versus Democrats on a world scale. It keeps people from seeing the real issue, which is the world-scale theft of wealth through currency manipulation, debt, and taxes for the benefit of a certain class of people. News flash - there are participants in this game on both sides of the "Us Versus Them" model. It's funny how football fans in Scotland know that the Owners of Rangers and Celtic benefit from the hatred and fighting and loyalty that comes with the rivalry - they call the annual game The Old Firm. They know.

In my mind, Israel is part of this. It's part of keeping things off balance. But I also believe in unintended consequences, so the keg may blow in a way that people didn't mean to see happen.

[RomanLeaderII]

Originally Posted by the gman

Indeed but that was not the question kind Sir. Your comparison to England is neither fair nor accurate; the English, though unquestionably diluted over millennia, have never left their ancestral home unlike the Jews. There is no Jewish race per se; merely a disparate grouping of various cultures, ethnicity, nationalities and factions that have one common denominator of a shared religion.

I did not ask what Jews have done to advance the culture, science or knowledge of the world; I asked what has Israel brought forth to better the world as a whole? Israel was born from the desire of Zionists and only formed by displacing others who had more than an equal claim on the real estate by dint of thousands of years of continuous occupancy.

If the United States treated Native Americans in the same way the Jews have treated the Palestinians, there would be international outrage but for some strange reason, much of the western world is silent in this matter.

Israel has continuously spied on America, via Jonathon Pollard and others since its inception. Again, what benefit accrues to the world from the state of Israel?

No question about it the Jewish people are not a race, but a Peoplehood united by their faith.

Israel literally defined are "those who struggle with G-d"

As for Israel the land was given by G-d to the Jewish People for the Jewish People. Unfortuntely even with G-d somtimes bad things happen to good people. Those of the Jewish faith were run off by their bastard bretheren at the tip of the sword. They have now returned in more contemporary times with the ability to defend against evil doers.

You have to admit it seems that there have been a disproportionately high number of Jewish folks throughout history who have contributed to the betterment of mankind. How many Arabs or Muslims have you ever found contributed to such a degree for the benefit of mankind? Why or why not?


I find it interesting and disingenous that you refer to the Clash of Civilizations between Native Americans and Western Europeans as one similar to the Israeli/Muslim/ Arab conflict. They are both different and clearly distinct historically or otherwise.

The Israelis do not want to be subject to another Holocaust at the hands of the crazy, extremist Iranian Muslim Zealots. I rank the Iranian Leadership and those who support them as being akin to the criminally insane.

I certainly wouldnt trust the criminally insane with any kind of weapon let alone a nuclear bomb.

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by RomanLeaderII

As for Israel the land was given by G-d to the Jewish People for the Jewish People.

Complete and utter bullshit.

[Brett]

I don't know why but it always seems like the simple things always become complicated. If someone were to shoot at my house with my family inside I would do my best to kill them, reload, and wait for their friends to show up. If their friends couldn't make it but held the same commitment I would try to hunt them down. Maybe my common sense is wrong, but it's mine.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by 308bolt

Complete and utter bullshit.

Maybe he thinks the british and the UN are G-d?





.............juanni

[VonFireball]

The United States government does treat the American Indians the way Israel treats the Palestinians.

Do Indians lob rockets into non indian territory? Do they strap explosives to their women and children and send them into our towns and cities to detonate themselves to appease their gods? No.

Well I don't want to see anybody exterminated, but the entire let's create a jewish nation in the middle of muslim territory has been a total failure.

Yeah, you are one of those morons who thinks they should've set up camp in south America as was considered in the early days of zionism. That's the problem, you would be whining about their existence there if they had and how they displaced the native amazonians or some bullcrap. But that's you. What part of you isn't filled with crap is filled with lies.

As for Israel the land was given by G-d to the Jewish People for the Jewish People.

This. It's why jews are always the biggest scapegoat for the world's problems. Their very existence is evidence that a sovereign God reigns over all mankind; that one day men will answer for their wrongs; that they are held to a moral standard that is unchangeable.

Those of the Jewish faith were run off by their bastard bretheren at the tip of the sword.

They were run off because they broke their covenant with God through their sins. As a nation they didn't follow his decrees. They did not heed his commands. The curse in Leviticus, beginning in chapter 26 vs 14 fell upon them.

I asked what has Israel brought forth to better the world as a whole?

......Again, what benefit accrues to the world from the state of Israel?

Jesus Christ. Without him you will spend eternity in hell. Cliche, I know, but therein lies the truth. Through the jews the world can be redeemed. Much more important than tea and crumpets. But to a modernist, an unbeliever who lives only in the physical it means little. Still, a false belief has no bearing on what reality is. Just sayin'.......

But all of this is to say that I can't think of anything that Israel (the state) has done to improve the world.

I need a facepalm smiley.

Besides messiah, how about save the jews from another holocaust? How's that work?

[juanni]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

Yeah, you are one of those morons who thinks they should've set up camp in south America as was considered in the early days of zionism. That's the problem, you would be whining about their existence there if they had and how they displaced the native amazonians or some bullcrap. But that's you. What part of you isn't filled with crap is filled with lies.

Reverend VonGoofball weighs in.

Rev, it was Uganda which is in Africa, not S. America.



...........juanni

[VonFireball]

Reverend VonGoofball weighs in.

And the juammunist replies.

Rev, it was Uganda which is in Africa, not S. America.

Guyana, Argentina, Madagascar, Japan. Either way you'd have something to whine about how they trampled on someone else in order to SURVIVE. People like you would've liked to have seen them wiped out by the nazis and stalin, you just won't say so openly but it's implied through your smugness and criticisms towards their continued existence as a nation. You might not have agreed with the methods but I think you'd feel we were better off if they had been liquidated wholesale entirely.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by Brett

I don't know why but it always seems like the simple things always become complicated. If someone were to shoot at my house with my family inside I would do my best to kill them, reload, and wait for their friends to show up. If their friends couldn't make it but held the same commitment I would try to hunt them down. Maybe my common sense is wrong, but it's mine.

Oh, what would you do if an outsider came in, decided that your property lines were to be moved, perhaps moved onto your property when you were gone and said tough?




...............juanni

[VonFireball]

Oh, what would you do if an outsider came in, decided that your property lines were to be moved, perhaps moved onto your property when you were gone and said tough?

Shut your mouth you sawed off little jew hating commie twerp. That's all you have shown yourself to be here. You speak poison everywhere on this forum.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

Shut your mouth you sawed off little jew hating commie twerp. That's all you have shown yourself to be here. You speak poison everywhere on this forum.

What happened to love your neighbor Rev VonGoofball?




.............juanni

[308bolt]

Go easy on him, you almost made him think.

[V guy]

Israel has existed for 65 years in its current iteration; not going away anytime soon.

The conflict between the so called "palestinians" and the jewist people will never end, because it is rooted in religion.

The only insane people invovled in the struggle are the muslims; "time to get it on."

If it was not the jews, the Muslims, would be killing the shia, sunni, whabbais, Christians, Hindus, democrat journalists, alawhites, taliban and alqaeda types, etc etc.
Oops, they already do!!!!!!!!

Muslims simply want to kill, do kill, and keep on killing.......... even their own------it is in their culture, and muslim upbringing/ religion.

Islam in any country, is like dogshit on septic scum............ parading around like terminator units, to the rest of a countries, typically diverse population---like Hells Angels plotting to kill everyone in town, because they are alive.

In the conflict between good and evil, the lines are clearly drawn, and even posters here can see the fact that the problem is not confined to Israel, it is confined to Islam, ANYWHERE, in the civilized world.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by 308bolt

Go easy on him, you almost made him think.

There is little danger of that happening.



............juanni

[juanni]

Originally Posted by V guy

Israel has existed for 65 years in its current iteration; not going away anytime soon.

Nope, but doubtful they make a 100.

Too little population, surrounded by too many that want them gone.

The only reason they have made it so far is our $$$, our bribery, our technology and our military presence in the area.

Trouble is we are bankrupt.
And nation of unemployed, food stamp recipients, plagued with chronic and expensive health problems,, and the few that do work at minimum wage nuking precooked burgers or greeting at WaddleMart can't support a massive military empire or be subsidizing a failed Euro Nation Building project on the other side of the planet.

When the US reserve currency status collapses...... Israel's days are numbered.
It's population base is simply too small to support the military spending and technology required to hold off the hoards.
Std of living will decline, taxes will become oppressive, daily life will become more grim >>> the best and brightest will leave for greener pastures and better opportunities.



...........juanni

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by juanni

There is little danger of that happening.



............juanni

I recall that 0302 found the shift key one time.

If that can happen anything is possible.

[VonFireball]

The only reason they have made it so far is our $$$, our bribery, our technology and our military presence in the area.

God has seen Israel through, they will never be removed as a nation. They are evidence that he exists, that the world will face judgement. That unsettles you and him and the rest of the world. Their existence, surrounded by swarms of enemies and a world of jew haters, is living proof of God's favor of Isaac over Ishmael; the jew over the arab.

What happened to love your neighbor Rev VonGoofball?

I don't not love you, I just think you're a jew hating red bastard. You don't offer much on this forum except your secular humanist based red politics. Really, you don't belong here. And now you've found a friend in .308 bolt, what luck!

[homelandprotector]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

I don't not love you, I just think you're a jew hating red bastard. You don't offer much on this forum except your secular humanist based red politics. Really, you don't belong here. And now you've found a friend in .308 bolt, what luck!

He can't help himself.....

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

And now you've found a friend in .308 bolt, what luck!

Nothing newsworthy in that.
I've never had an issue with juanni or the vast majority of the people here on the files for that matter including you.
You, like everyone else, are welcome to believe in whatever makes you happy but it's my belief that ignoring everything that doesn't happen to fit your own philosophy is unhealthy.

[308bolt]

.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
- Hamlet (1.5.166-7), Hamlet to Horatio

.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

God has seen Israel through, they will never be removed as a nation. They are evidence that he exists, that the world will face judgement. That unsettles you and him and the rest of the world. Their existence, surrounded by swarms of enemies and a world of jew haters, is living proof of God's favor of Isaac over Ishmael; the jew over the arab.

Rev,


If Israel's formation and continued existence is the hand of God, why to they need our money and support?

Can't they just slay all their enemies with a low budget weapon,,,,say the jawbone of an ass and not all the expensive, high tech and radioactive stuff and leave us sinners out of it?






............juanni

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by juanni

Can't they just slay all their enemies with a low budget weapon,,,,say the jawbone of an ass and not all the expensive, high tech and radioactive stuff and leave us sinners out of it?

............juanni

They're using the jawboning asses in D.C.

[the gman]

Originally Posted by Brett

I don't know why but it always seems like the simple things always become complicated. If someone were to shoot at my house with my family inside I would do my best to kill them, reload, and wait for their friends to show up. If their friends couldn't make it but held the same commitment I would try to hunt them down. Maybe my common sense is wrong, but it's mine.

How about one bright sunshiney day in 1948, a group of soldiers show up at your house, the one your great grandfather built in the mid 19th Century, to which you own the freehold and insist at bayonet point you leave in less than 3 hours? You are not allowed to take anything more than a suitcase with you, none of the precious manuscripts, handed down from generation to generation, nothing from the library your ancestors have built up, no works of art, no furniture gathered from Europe, the Middle East and elsewhere.

You are then herded off your property, never to be allowed to return and have to live out your life in another country, stateless and without rights?? Meanwhile, some immigrant from Russia who knows NOTHING of your country inhabits your home and has little appreciation of how the olive and fig trees that were planted over a hundred years ago came to be there.

Ya think you might just be a tad pissed off about that?? Who cast the first blow? Isn't it a case of the Israelis reaping what they sowed??

I don't hate Jews, I don't hate anyone. I have little time for idiots with little historical perspective and no PRACTICAL experience about what they preach so piously about. We never, due entirely to the bias present in our media, hear both sides of the story.

What the Israelis have done and are doing to the Palestinians is not much less than what the Nazi's and the Russians did to the Jews. Man's inhumanity to man is never far from the surface, regardless of creed, color or religion.

What a lot of you who speak of Israel being a 'lightening rod' against Islamic militancy don't understand is that Israel has been the REASON most of this hatred has risen in the Muslim world. I have no love for radical Islam or a culture that is mired in the middle ages. This was not always the way the Middle East was headed. Lebanon, until the Civil War of 1975 was known as Switzerland of the East with Beirut known as the Paris of the East. Iran in the days of the Shah was a progressive, open and relatively free society. Iraq, prior to the rise of Saddam was also progressive and proceeding towards a more westernized society.

The rise of Wahhabism as advanced by the House of Saud has used the state of Israel as the raison d'être to unite and link all Muslims, both Sunni and Shia in a common goal. Throughout the Muslim world, the outrages and undoubtedly initially unfair and often extremely brutal treatment of the indigenous population of Palestine by the Jewish settlers is an open wound.

Israel is less a 'lightening rod' but much more the catalyst of most of the strife in that region. The house of Saud bears a HUGE responsibility as well through its massive funding of Wahhabism and the ultra conservative, radical and regressive teachings it advances. If only we could time travel back to the end of WW1 and take action to exterminate the Saud family and all other tribes in that area......

Let no-one be blinded by religious ideals; the Israelis are NO friend to the US except when it suits them. Many of the secrets sold to them by Pollard were passed on to the Russians in exchange for the relaxation of emigration of Jews from Russia. Who knows the damage such exchanges did to the US but they surely were NOT the actions of a 'loyal' friendly nation....

[Brett]

Gman, I didn't know I needed to address this from the morality of war perspective. Simply...I will not be herded out of my house, I will win or die. Cattle are herded.

[the gman]

Originally Posted by Brett

Gman, I didn't know I needed to address this from the morality of war perspective. Simply...I will not be herded out of my house, I will win or die. Cattle are herded.

The female who recounted this story to me lost her brother in the struggle to leave their residence; he was shot and then bayoneted by the Jewish soldiers on the stairs of their home. He was 19, she was 10. Her father decided she needed a father more than a house and Charmaine and her family have lived in Jordan since that time.

You have easy words to speak now; I venture it would not be so easy when your children look to you and the option is you all die or you leave. There was no "morality of war" question to answer; the Jews decided to act as terrorists and thugs, no different to the Nazis but we never hear those stories....

I guess you flip flop too much for me; when it was the Palestinians shooting at the Jews, you were in favor of making it simple by attacking the Palestinians. When faced with the Jews attacking the Palestinians, now you favor attacking the Jews. Make your mind up who is in the wrong rather than simplistic statements.

[VonFireball]

If Israel's formation and continued existence is the hand of God, why to they need our money and support?

You don't know that they "need" our support until you cut it off, do you now? Why did they send soldiers into the field in the old testament? Why didn't they just sit in their tents munching figs and wait for God to hand them the keys to the kingdom? Any other ignorant questions you wanna ask there before we are finished?

What the Israelis have done and are doing to the Palestinians is not much less than what the Nazi's and the Russians did to the Jews.

Delusional. Where then are the many death camp complexes? Where are the ovens? Who has the zyklon B? Where are the hundreds of mass graves? Which muslims are operating as sonderkommando? Where are the yellow crescent moons marking them as muslims? Fact is, you can be muslim and live at peace in Israel. It's only when you pick up an RPG or a rifle and start firing at civilians that you get treated like trash.

What a lot of you who speak of Israel being a 'lightening rod' against Islamic militancy don't understand is that Israel has been the REASON most of this hatred has risen in the Muslim world.

The truth to your words is that you're arguing against a jewish state at all. The truth to your words is that jews should have no homeland at all and continue being victimized to levels that various governments around the world decide to victimize them in. The same old horseshit argument: "their state is the only reason they are being attacked" is easily defeated through a thorough analysis of history where jews have time and time again been persecuted and slaughtered WHEN THEY DIDN'T HAVE ZIONISM OR THEIR OWN NATION. Common sense ruled for a brief time after WWII and people said enough is enough and let them have their state. The idea that they are wanted destroyed by muslims simply because they have their own state is ludicrous. The muslims want to destroy them BECAUSE THEY ARE JEWS. Read the Koran. Thanks for your commentary Haman.

How about one bright sunshiney day in 1948, a group of soldiers show up at your house, the one your great grandfather built in the mid 19th Century, to which you own the freehold and insist at bayonet point you leave in less than 3 hours?

We wouldn't be having this problem at all if Israel would've obeyed God to the letter in about 1200 BC and destroyed every single Canaanite man, woman, child, and infant there. The beauty of God's commands. When you don't follow the commands we have the mess we see here.

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

Why didn't they just sit in their tents munching figs and wait for God to hand them the keys to the kingdom?

Because slaughtering people so you can occupy their land and force your religion on them is far more expedient than waiting for a supposed superior being to do it for you.

[VonFireball]

Because slaughtering people so you can occupy their land and force your religion on them is far more expedient than waiting for a supposed superior being to do it for you.

Because you can pray for food but God isn't gonna reach down and hand it to you. Even a handout recipient has to make the occasional trip to the welfare office if he wants to get benefits for him/herself. God helps those who help themselves. He expects effort on your part.

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

Because you can pray for food but God isn't gonna reach down and hand it to you. Even a handout recipient has to make the occasional trip to the welfare office if he wants to get benefits for him/herself. God helps those who help themselves. He expects effort on your part.

Stealing it from other people is the better solution.

[Brett]

Gman. I call bullshit. I said I would die in my house to defend it. I took my own defense side and no one elses. Interpret your own stand, not some made up interpretation of my stand. I would die in my house if I were Israeli or Palestinean(sp.)....understand????

[VonFireball]

Stealing it from other people is the better solution.

It's not stealing when they are dead.

Besides, the canaanites were wicked. They sacrificed their children to false gods, they passed them through the fire. They had no place there. They had turned from any semblance of godliness so God allowed the Israelites to destroy them. The mayans also deserved the fate they received. You sound like a liberal, did the spanish "steal it" too?

[V guy]

1948 was simply the year the UN recognized Israel.

The dp's arrived before that, and the fighting was already ongoing, as it had been since
the 1920's+-, there.

The movie "Exodus," with Paul Newman is a fair representation of those early days in the land of Moses.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

It's not stealing when they are dead.

Besides, the canaanites were wicked. They sacrificed their children to false gods, they passed them through the fire. They had no place there. They had turned from any semblance of godliness so God allowed the Israelites to destroy them. The mayans also deserved the fate they received. You sound like a liberal, did the spanish "steal it" too?

They weren't called CONQUISTADORS for nothing.

If a guy showed up on your doorstep and impaled you on a sword, took what he wanted of your possessions (especially anything shiny), YOUR wife, and family what would you call it?



...........juanni

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

It's not stealing when they are dead.

I see, it's not stealing if you murder them first.
Got it.

Originally Posted by VonFireball

It's not stealing when they are dead.

Besides, the canaanites were wicked. They sacrificed their children to false gods,

According to the people that murdered them.

[VonFireball]

If a guy showed up on your doorstep and impaled you on a sword, took what he wanted of your possessions (especially anything shiny), YOUR wife, and family what would you call it?

If I was a child sacrificing piece of crap I would call it justice.

According to the people that murdered them.

Killing, not murder. Justice, not crime. They, like the mayans, deserved the wholesale slaughter they received. It's not like it's a crime when there isn't a god to declare it as such, according to you.

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

Killing, not murder. Justice, not crime. They, like the mayans, deserved the wholesale slaughter they received. It's not like it's a crime when there isn't a god to declare it as such, according to you.

What incredible horseshit.
Did you find that in the Big Book of Justifications or dream it up on your own?
Killing for profit is murder regardless of the excuse.

[juanni]

Originally Posted by 308bolt

I see, it's not stealing if you murder them first.
Got it.

That right there is why I find VonGoofball's opinions so entertaining yet scary.

Plus, I like how he sprinkles a little preaching in every post.



Probably like having a conversation with David Koresh at Mt Carmel Corn.




............juanni

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by juanni

That right there is why I find VonGoofball's opinions so entertaining yet scary.

Plus, I like how he sprinkles a little preaching in every post.



Probably like having a conversation with David Koresh at Mt Carmel Corn.




............juanni

Just another new convert.
They sound about the same as a new AAA member or someone who just quit smoking.

[VonFireball]

What incredible horseshit.
Did you find that in the Big Book of Justifications or dream it up on your own?
Killing for profit is murder regardless of the excuse.

I'm saying if you are a human sacrificing mayan or child sacrificing canaanite and me and my swarthy spanish or hebrew buddies cudgel your head in and your families heads in it's justice, not murder. The profit side of things is just a byproduct of you being dealt what you dealt to others so quit acting all righteous dog. Without a divine authority there is no such thing as morality so who are you to declare something as wrong?

Plus, I like how how I never really have a valid response to anything he says.

Fixed it for you. Nice to see you and bolt holding hands on this one.

[JasonB]

Originally Posted by brunop

Israel as a nation is the home of Jewish-heritage people (in some or many cases). If you want to see what Jewish people have brought to the world, look up a list of Nobel Prize winners in the sciences and medicine.

So since 2006 is a lot handier than MMVI we should throw our support to what makes Arabs happy?

[juanni]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

If I was a child sacrificing piece of crap I would call it justice.

Yes, I am sure if the Aztecs weren't engaged in human sacrifices, the spanish would have turned on their heels and headed home empty handed.



............juanni

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

I'm saying if you are a human sacrificing mayan or child sacrificing canaanite and me and my swarthy spanish or hebrew buddies cudgel your head in and your families heads in it's justice, not murder. The profit side of things is just a byproduct of you being dealt what you dealt to others so quit acting all righteous dog. Without a divine authority there is no such thing as morality so who are you to declare something as wrong?

Besides the jews version of why they killed the canannites what evidence do you have to support the idea that they sacrificed children?
And where do you come up with the idea that "divine authority" creates morality?

[VonFireball]

Besides the jews version of why they killed the canannites what evidence do you have to support the idea that they sacrificed children?

What evidence do you use that they didn't?

And where do you come up with the idea that "divine authority" creates morality?

No supreme law means no law other than what is invented by men. Do you argue against that idea? If one man says "murder is wrong" but has no basis other than himself for saying so then it is just as easy as another man saying "murder is good" and they are both right. Please present your case so I can have my dose of humor for the evening. I'm off for the holiday, I have time to waste.

[308bolt]

Originally Posted by VonFireball

What evidence do you use that they didn't?

Are you going to answer the question or try to dance around it?

Originally Posted by VonFireball

No supreme law means no law other than what is invented by men. Do you argue against that idea? If one man says "murder is wrong" but has no basis other than himself for saying so then it is just as easy as another man saying "murder is good" and they are both right. Please present your case so I can have my dose of humor for the evening. I'm off for the holiday, I have time to waste.

Man creates law not God.
Unless you're now arguing that abortion is the word of God.
Show me A "LAW" that was written by God.
You're "off" every day and you are my dose of humor/absurdity.
You are correct on one point, you waste your time.

[VonFireball]

Are you going to answer the question or try to dance around it?

Are YOU going to answer it?

Man creates law not God.

Based on a divine law, it has authority. Based on human invention, it only has authority among other men. If it is malleable, as the overwhelming portion of human law is, then it is not law at all but merely regulation.

Show me A "LAW" that was written by God.

Any law worth obeying is written by God. They are worth obeying because they have consequences beside jail time or a fine. Murder is a divine law. How short or long my rifle barrel can be is not. One law is from God, the other from men. And here you are, defending man as creator of law, looking like a real bastion of higher thought. Human regulation outside of divine application has no lasting authority beyond death. Enjoy your ban on imported barrels.

You are correct on one point, you waste your time.

Yeah, wasting my time on you and the juammunist. But hey, I enjoy the discussion regardless. Ain't no law against that.

[308bolt]

Ah, furball post parsing.
Not playing Buckwheat.
There is no "divine law".
You're beliefs are bullshit.