7.62 NATO AP?

**rochte** · July 17, 2012, 20:28

Found some ammo that I bought a *long* time ago hiding in a box... I'm not sure if it's really what it says it is or not.

The cases have a really strange appearance that is hard to capture in a photo: a very bright sheen, almost matte in appearance yet with a very bright colour (brighter than "new" ammo). At the same time, most of the cartridges also show marked corrosion.

Headstamps are NATO, some say FN, dates are mostly in the 60s with some in the late 50s (I found one in another box that was dated 55!).

Anyone have any of this stuff? Can you tell me anything about it? Is it safe to shoot?

Thanks!

ap1.jpg

ap2.jpg

ap3.jpg

Illurian00 · July 17, 2012, 20:58

Well,,,the price is right.

Given thedeviation in appearance it might be 're-cased'.
Pull a few, weigh the components,,,see what you've got.

**2barearms** · July 18, 2012, 05:52

I got some of that from the Ohio Ordnance gunshow guy, it was made
for the Izzy's.

Ironhandjohn · July 18, 2012, 11:00

I've seen both Israeli and FN AP. All headstamps are from the 1970s.

**brunop** · July 18, 2012, 12:01

I'm sure it's junk. Send it to me for safe disposal.

ammolab · July 18, 2012, 14:02

You can find Corrosive primers in IMI 7.62x51 Ball and AP from the 50s and 60s as well as FN mfg 7.62x51mm for the IDF.

The "NATO" mark on the headstamp for your FN AP gets you a NONcorrosive primer but clean as 'corrosive' for FN ammo not so marked until 1968 or so.

mpnv · July 18, 2012, 17:34

Quote:

Original Quote:
2barearms I got some of that from the Ohio Ordnance gunshow guy, it was made for the Izzy's.

I have Izzy linked, and all of it has FN & SMI mixed in. I have had no problems shooting this at all. Mine was not corroded though.

Deltaten · July 19, 2012, 10:10

I bought one or two boxes of something very similar years ago at a show. I recognize the
FedOrd" and "El Monte" on the label. Remanufactured but all dolled up as "new" by [nefarious] vendor/supplier. Fortunately, it was as a lark and was [relatively] cheap at the time. A buddy found it and wanted to halvsies on a full case. Glad I bowed out as it was fakery...the bullets were simple steel core, painted to appear as hard-core AP.
Urs *might* be the same..then again...mebbe not?!?!

ammolab · July 19, 2012, 12:34

A LOT of 7.62x54R .310" steel core type LPS bullets have been resized to .308" (I hope!) and loaded into .308/30-06 cases with the tips painted black and sold as "AP".

They are just mild steel cores as stated, and a 'ripoff' at AP prices.

mpnv · July 21, 2012, 05:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by ammolab

A LOT of 7.62x54R .310" steel core type LPS bullets have been resized to .308" (I hope!) and loaded into .308/30-06 cases with the tips painted black and sold as "AP".

They are just mild steel cores as stated, and a 'ripoff' at AP prices.

What brand do these sell by and by whom?

ammolab · July 21, 2012, 09:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpnv

What brand do these sell by and by whom?

No brand whatsoever....sold on auction sites and gun shows in the sellers box or plastic baggie.

**rochte** · July 22, 2012, 07:29

I cut one open and got the core out. Looks like a precisely machined (and very hard) core, much like the 30.06 AP core but without the boat-tail. Definitely not the little slug of steel found in Chicom 7.62x39 or the like. I'll post a pic later.

jerrymrc · July 22, 2012, 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by rochte

I cut one open and got the core out. Looks like a precisely machined (and very hard) core, much like the 30.06 AP core but without the boat-tail. Definitely not the little slug of steel found in Chicom 7.62x39 or the like. I'll post a pic later.

That sounds right. I had 2 styles of AP bullets that I bought from Pat's years ago. one had the long machined core and one had a smaller core with pusher like the 30.06.

My thread on the two types with pics. http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=189109

And in looking at the old thread I do wonder which one is best. I just can't bring myself to put one of the ar500 targets out there to try.

jefferyc22 · July 22, 2012, 23:39

It's probably legit....blunt tip and double canular.

**rochte** · July 23, 2012, 16:29

Still haven't pulled the pic off my phone, sorry... Given the way these cases look, should I consider this ammo unsafe to shoot?

jefferyc22 · July 23, 2012, 16:31

FN with nato cross is high quality plus its prob true AP.....save it.

**rochte** · July 23, 2012, 20:15

I'm not suggesting that I would just blast it... But with the cases like that, I'm wondering if it's safe to shoot "someday" or if it's a kaboom waiting to happen.

joeyjoejoe · July 23, 2012, 20:46

Just give it a tumble. At the price on the box, I'd have bought a truckload.

jerrymrc · July 23, 2012, 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyjoejoe

Just give it a tumble. At the price on the box, I'd have bought a truckload.

I think I paid $80 for 1000 bullets from Pat's in 06. The supply was running out and just like many things I could see the writing on the wall. They are not the most accurate but I did find a load that matched my Aussie surplus at 200 yards.

Still have some left but I did load a few hundred for a rainy day. sealed em up and there they sit. Need to go load the rest.

TaylorWSO · July 24, 2012, 19:38

I got some of that ammo as well from a pawn shop couple years back.

I did a ton of research to find out what it is.

Its is FN AP produced for Israel. The tips have dual cannalures for the 30-06 as well as 308 loadings. Those AP rounds are considered the best out of all the AP except for the current production Tungsten carbide rounds. They are the hardest and have a pointed bullet like tip, vice the other conical offerings.

The cases look like crap because thay have been tumbled with a acid laced media that gives them that dull but bright colored brass (and causes the corrosion you see). Hanson Cartridge Company lawfully imported FN & IMI 7.62x51mm AP on belts and in 20 round boxes as Israel surplus before further import was restricted by Klinton in '94. notice the weird bullet crimps one yours as well as mine.

Some of my pics and a stolen chart

ETA those shhot like shit and cause FTEs. I pulled most of the 800 I got and reloaded into WRA 68 cases for SHTF. I have 400 of the best in a ammo can for collection purposes

July 17, 2012, 20:28	#1
rochte Veteran Member Contributor FALaholic #: 16305 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Grosse Pointe, MI Posts: 1,406	7.62 NATO AP? Found some ammo that I bought a long time ago hiding in a box... I'm not sure if it's really what it says it is or not. The cases have a really strange appearance that is hard to capture in a photo: a very bright sheen, almost matte in appearance yet with a very bright colour (brighter than "new" ammo). At the same time, most of the cartridges also show marked corrosion. Headstamps are NATO, some say FN, dates are mostly in the 60s with some in the late 50s (I found one in another box that was dated 55!). Anyone have any of this stuff? Can you tell me anything about it? Is it safe to shoot? Thanks! ap1.jpg ap2.jpg ap3.jpg

July 18, 2012, 05:52	#3
2barearms 3 Percent Silver Contributor FALaholic #: 13866 Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Houston,Texas Posts: 8,656	I got some of that from the Ohio Ordnance gunshow guy, it was made for the Izzy's. __________________ "Owning a Firearm doesn't make you Armed any more than owning a Guitar makes you a Musician" Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

July 18, 2012, 11:00	#4
Ironhandjohn Registered FALaholic #: 11561 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 1187 Hundertwasser Posts: 2,351	I've seen both Israeli and FN AP. All headstamps are from the 1970s. __________________ Stripping motivated people of their dignity and rubbing their noses in it... is a VERY bad idea!!

July 18, 2012, 12:01	#5
brunop Refresh Key Masher Platinum Contributor FALaholic #: 17136 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: oregon Posts: 6,474	I'm sure it's junk. Send it to me for safe disposal. __________________ "I love you, Pluskat..." - brunop "Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God." - Thomas Jefferson "The constitutions of most of our states [and of the United States] assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property and freedom of the press." - Thomas Jefferson

July 19, 2012, 10:10	#8
Deltaten Registered FALaholic #: 124 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lancaster, PA USA Posts: 8,498	I bought one or two boxes of something very similar years ago at a show. I recognize the FedOrd" and "El Monte" on the label. Remanufactured but all dolled up as "new" by [nefarious] vendor/supplier. Fortunately, it was as a lark and was [relatively] cheap at the time. A buddy found it and wanted to halvsies on a full case. Glad I bowed out as it was fakery...the bullets were simple steel core, painted to appear as hard-core AP. Urs might be the same..then again...mebbe not?!?! __________________ All or Nothing! Senator McCarthy was right! and as always......FYB!

July 17, 2012, 20:58	#2
Illurian00 Registered FALaholic #: 28599 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,411	Well,,,the price is right. Given thedeviation in appearance it might be 're-cased'. Pull a few, weigh the components,,,see what you've got.

July 18, 2012, 14:02	#6
ammolab Registered FALaholic #: 10923 Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1,688	You can find Corrosive primers in IMI 7.62x51 Ball and AP from the 50s and 60s as well as FN mfg 7.62x51mm for the IDF. The "NATO" mark on the headstamp for your FN AP gets you a NONcorrosive primer but clean as 'corrosive' for FN ammo not so marked until 1968 or so.

July 19, 2012, 12:34	#9
ammolab Registered FALaholic #: 10923 Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1,688	A LOT of 7.62x54R .310" steel core type LPS bullets have been resized to .308" (I hope!) and loaded into .308/30-06 cases with the tips painted black and sold as "AP". They are just mild steel cores as stated, and a 'ripoff' at AP prices.

July 22, 2012, 07:29	#12
rochte Veteran Member Contributor FALaholic #: 16305 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Grosse Pointe, MI Posts: 1,406	I cut one open and got the core out. Looks like a precisely machined (and very hard) core, much like the 30.06 AP core but without the boat-tail. Definitely not the little slug of steel found in Chicom 7.62x39 or the like. I'll post a pic later.

July 22, 2012, 23:39	#14
jefferyc22 Banned FALaholic #: 18245 Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: PNW Posts: 3,447	It's probably legit....blunt tip and double canular.

July 23, 2012, 16:29	#15
rochte Veteran Member Contributor FALaholic #: 16305 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Grosse Pointe, MI Posts: 1,406	Still haven't pulled the pic off my phone, sorry... Given the way these cases look, should I consider this ammo unsafe to shoot?

July 23, 2012, 16:31	#16
jefferyc22 Banned FALaholic #: 18245 Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: PNW Posts: 3,447	FN with nato cross is high quality plus its prob true AP.....save it.

July 23, 2012, 20:15	#17
rochte Veteran Member Contributor FALaholic #: 16305 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Grosse Pointe, MI Posts: 1,406	I'm not suggesting that I would just blast it... But with the cases like that, I'm wondering if it's safe to shoot "someday" or if it's a kaboom waiting to happen.

July 23, 2012, 20:46	#18
joeyjoejoe Registered FALaholic #: 22193 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: PA Posts: 178	Just give it a tumble. At the price on the box, I'd have bought a truckload.

July 24, 2012, 19:38	#20
TaylorWSO Registered FALaholic #: 14404 Join Date: May 2004 Location: saudi Posts: 107	I got some of that ammo as well from a pawn shop couple years back. I did a ton of research to find out what it is. Its is FN AP produced for Israel. The tips have dual cannalures for the 30-06 as well as 308 loadings. Those AP rounds are considered the best out of all the AP except for the current production Tungsten carbide rounds. They are the hardest and have a pointed bullet like tip, vice the other conical offerings. The cases look like crap because thay have been tumbled with a acid laced media that gives them that dull but bright colored brass (and causes the corrosion you see). Hanson Cartridge Company lawfully imported FN & IMI 7.62x51mm AP on belts and in 20 round boxes as Israel surplus before further import was restricted by Klinton in '94. notice the weird bullet crimps one yours as well as mine. Some of my pics and a stolen chart ETA those shhot like shit and cause FTEs. I pulled most of the 800 I got and reloaded into WRA 68 cases for SHTF. I have 400 of the best in a ammo can for collection purposes __________________ TaylorWSO Last edited by TaylorWSO; July 24, 2012 at 19:41. Reason: more info

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