with all the threads on kabooms a couple questions.

[Gungho_1989]

10 maybe 12 yrs ago I purchased a enterprise and a couple cans of Radway. Went to the range and started shooting. Bout halfway through the can had a case seperateinto two halves. blew the bottom of the mag out, put the mag back together and fired the rest of the can with no issues.

A few yeara ago I had a Para that while out shooting some surplus izzy? We had a case seperate and blow a mag floorplate out. After inspecting the rest of th ammo in the can we found some with corroded as well as cracked casings. So after sorting we shot the rest up without an issue. Mag was ruined, never found the baseplate.

Recently I purchased a new DSA Para. Two weekends ago took it to the range and put about 400 rnds through it. Ran great with the exception of on issue.
In the last few mags we fired, while a freind was shooting the same thing happen case seperated bottom coming clean off. Blew bottom out of the mag. We put the mag back together, loaded it and fired off another magful or two. The ammo was remanuf Prescision cartridge. Usually great stuff. Out of a can of 500, 1round blew.

Now Ive owned a balf dozen different FALs over the years and shot lots of different fodder through them. But never had a rifle damaged.

these things that tough or was I lucky?

?
Now when I have an issue like the above I just look the rifle over, sort or inspect remaining ammo and go back to shooting.
Bad idea? Am I asking for trouble?
.

[W.E.G.]

Usual admonitions:

Check your headspace.
Don't shoot shitty ammo and expect nothing bad to happen.

Yes, the FAL is tough.
Yes, you were lucky.

[Liftrat]

Wow, that's a lot of near misses! Good admonitions above. After the first time, I'd have developed a good flinch . I've been shooting mil surp & reloads for years (admittedly most out of M1as and M1s), and have never had more than a case head separation (the head ejected but the rest of the case remained in the chamber, with no damage), so I guess you're both lucky and unlucky. Ever been struck by lightning?

[xtremerange]

There is a world of difference between a case rupture in the chamber and an out of battery (OOB) firing.

From yours and other experience it appears the FAL is well designed to vent the gases of the case rupture through the mag (Seems a lot rifles do this so it is not unique to the FAL). The bolt is still locked so just the gasses move out of the chamber guided by the steel.

A true OOB puts the thousands of PSI blowing threw the brass into open space. Lots of pieces can go flying in all different directions then.

Thank you ATFE for not allowing safety sears.

[Gungho_1989]

I guess my current concern is a couple of things.
One is the DSA. After almost 400 rounds of different types of ammo it had only the one issue. I am still going to get the head space guages but im pretty certian it was a ammo issue.
The other is the nearly full can of the Izzy? I stil have, dont want to throw the stuff away and I sortrd out all the obviouse problems?

[4 brigada]

Check your headspace.
Don't shoot shitty ammo and expect nothing bad to happen.

Words to live by. Spot on as usual W.E.G

[W.E.G.]

If you have a batch of ammo that is producing kabooms, either destroy it, or sell it "as-is" with full disclosure, and denial of any warranty.

...or keep on blowing up magazines - or worse.


What happen?


WTF?!!!!


Did anybody get the number of that truck?

[Arby]

Originally Posted by Gungho_1989

.....The other is the nearly full can of the Izzy? I stil have, dont want to throw the stuff away and I sortrd out all the obviouse problems?

If it is from one of the batches of TZ that have already been known to KB you will be risking the rifle as well as possible injury to yourself if you shoot it. If I had a can of suspect Israeli TZ ammo I'd pull the bullets and trash the brass.

There are some interesting threads on this site dealing with TZ ammo. Some posters maintain that the brass is sub-par in the rounds that have KB'd.

[W.E.G.]

[SmokeEater2]

OK, I haven't bought any ammo since the cases of Aussie were on the market so I haven't kept up with availability.

Is all the milsurp gone or is the steel russkie stuff just too cheap to resist? Not tryin' to be a smartazz, Just curious about the ammo supply.

[Gungho_1989]

Originally Posted by W.E.G.

wow Now that had to suck!


Just to clarify the Izzy stuff I have we had one Kaboom out of and that was the last of three cases we ran, between a para and a couple of M1A's and that was prior to sorting out the corroded rounds,

This is the Case that separated on my DSA PARA

[Ironhandjohn]

Originally Posted by SmokeEater2

OK, I haven't bought any ammo since the cases of Aussie were on the market so I haven't kept up with availability.

Is all the milsurp gone or is the steel russkie stuff just too cheap to resist? Not tryin' to be a smartazz, Just curious about the ammo supply.

Milsurp is looooooooooooong gone, at least priced at what we used to think of as reasonable. Scalper's rates apply to good 7.62x51 surplus today. Even the Russian KB ammo isn't such a good deal at the price it is found today.

[MK ULTRA]

Originally Posted by W.E.G.

Usual admonitions:

Check your headspace.
Don't shoot shitty ammo and expect nothing bad to happen.

Yes, the FAL is tough.
Yes, you were lucky.

So would too loose or too tight headspace cause this??

[Mr.JayJay]

Originally Posted by MK ULTRA

So would too loose or too tight headspace cause this??

It can cause case head separations and other bad things depending on how far off it is. My rifle passes .308 field reject and head spaces for 7.62 nato. It is a little loose for what a lot of people use for firing both cartridges but I have never had a problem. Also there is little to worry about with these rifles as long as everything is set properly. (chances of an OOB with a factory fun switch fal and a us fal are the same contrary to popular belief).

[101ABN327]

Go on Brownells and order a set of GO NO/GO guages. I check mine about every 1000 rounds just to be sure. I haven't had a single case separation or KB...

They are cheap insuraance.

101

[Cava3r4]

Doesn't anybody reload their own for the FAL or M1A
I've re-loaded for 30+ years and have not had a problem with a KB.
I've got some pet loads that were worked up by myself and a whole bunch of other NRA highpower shooters with M1A's and they group close to an inch with IRON sights when fired by someone who is still in "NRA highpower tune".
Also have pet loads for the AR-15's for highpower.
they are however from 2000 to 2005.

[TOM DONIPHON]

Ya know W.E.G. I usually cut the side of the receiver stub and pry it apart to remove the barrel.

[Tat2]

Originally Posted by Cava3r4

Doesn't anybody reload their own for the FAL or M1A
I've re-loaded for 30+ years and have not had a problem with a KB.
I've got some pet loads that were worked up by myself and a whole bunch of other NRA highpower shooters with M1A's and they group close to an inch with IRON sights when fired by someone who is still in "NRA highpower tune".
Also have pet loads for the AR-15's for highpower.
they are however from 2000 to 2005.

+1. I can reload ( minus brass ) for less than most surplus out there now...

T

[MK ULTRA]

Originally Posted by Mr.JayJay

It can cause case head separations and other bad things depending on how far off it is. My rifle passes .308 field reject and head spaces for 7.62 nato. It is a little loose for what a lot of people use for firing both cartridges but I have never had a problem. Also there is little to worry about with these rifles as long as everything is set properly. (chances of an OOB with a factory fun switch fal and a us fal are the same contrary to popular belief).

Well you didn't really answer my question. I asked was one worse than the other, too loose or to tight? I'm going the the following.

10 years ago when I ordered my HS gages I ordered .308 gages so thats what I have. I think I like having them because the NOGO for the .308 is a GO for the 7.62.

I just HS'd a para I'm building. I set it to .308 NOGO gage which is 1.634. The GO 7.62 gage is 1.635 so it should set back some and I should be good for both cartridges.

All I shoot is surplus 7.62 so I should be fine.

[ac7120]

If you used the "no go" gauge as your minimum headspace, you're going to develope problems sooner than later. Personally, I don't want to end up in "field gauge" territory too soon. Also, too much headspace can cause the case head separations, or to a lesser degree, shorten the life span of your brass. If your headspace is way too tight, your bolt may not lock into battery.

[Tat2]

Originally Posted by MK ULTRA

Well you didn't really answer my question. I asked was one worse than the other, too loose or to tight? I'm going the the following.

10 years ago when I ordered my HS gages I ordered .308 gages so thats what I have. I think I like having them because the NOGO for the .308 is a GO for the 7.62.

I just HS'd a para I'm building. I set it to .308 NOGO gage which is 1.634. The GO 7.62 gage is 1.635 so it should set back some and I should be good for both cartridges.

All I shoot is surplus 7.62 so I should be fine.

Personally, I like my headspace on the tight side.....

Seriously, I have seen it increase accuracy on guns I bought and re-headspaced to be tighter. One went from 3 1/2" groups to 1 1/2" groups after I tightened up the headspace.

T

[MK ULTRA]

Originally Posted by Tat2

Personally, I like my headspace on the tight side.....

Seriously, I have seen it increase accuracy on guns I bought and re-headspaced to be tighter. One went from 3 1/2" groups to 1 1/2" groups after I tightened up the headspace.

T

It is TIGHT.

It's tight on a 7.62 x 51 gage. Go back and read my post. The 7.62 gage is .005" longer than a .308 gage.

Thats why guns are blowing up. The headspace was set tight with .308 gages and your using 7.62 ammo and the bolt doesn't lock up. Or the opposite.

You set it with 7.62 gages and you shoot .308 ammo and the thin walled .308 expands and splits. I'd rather have that happen than it not lock up.

[MK ULTRA]

Originally Posted by ac7120

If you used the "no go" gauge as your minimum headspace, you're going to develope problems sooner than later. Personally, I don't want to end up in "field gauge" territory too soon. Also, too much headspace can cause the case head separations, or to a lesser degree, shorten the life span of your brass. If your headspace is way too tight, your bolt may not lock into battery.

I've got .011" before I'm into FIELD territory.

[IRONWORKER]

Originally Posted by ac7120

If you used the "no go" gauge as your minimum headspace, you're going to develope problems sooner than later. Personally, I don't want to end up in "field gauge" territory too soon. Also, too much headspace can cause the case head separations, or to a lesser degree, shorten the life span of your brass. If your headspace is way too tight, your bolt may not lock into battery.

A .308 NOGO gauge will measure around 1.635 & .308 FIELD gauge will measures around 1.640 so....

A FAL that has been properly built from good condition milspec parts & a DSA/Coonan/contract receiver will NOT get near "field guage territory"... You might see a thou or 2 of set back but not .005 or .006....

I personally like my HS to measure around 1.632 or 33 but to say that "your going to develop problems" if you build rifles with a HS of 1.635 is BS, I've owned many rifles with HS around 1.635 or 36 (NATO min by the way) & none have had any HS related issues

[MK ULTRA]

Well ive asked Mark but havent gotten an answer yet.

All im saying is If I HS at 1.632 then technically a 7.62 GO gage wont chamber and that is what I shoot.

AND I HS'ed at 1.634. GO GAGE is 1.635" I dont see a problem.