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-   -   Mild steel core 7.62x25 Tokarov rounds?? (http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=290445)

Sand Pirate June 11, 2010 06:50

Mild steel core 7.62x25 Tokarov rounds??
 
Gents,

I'm doing some work with a body armor maker, and have been told that early imports of 7.62x25 were mild steel core, not lead.

Anybody have any intel on this. If so, I need to get my hands on some.

Any help greatly appreciated, thanks in advance.

mutter June 11, 2010 08:05

I've got some.

However, your info is a little off.

They are lead core with a descently thick and hard (harder then gun steel) jacket with a thin outer copper jacket.

I also believe, but can't prove, these are actually meant for the sub guns as they are hot as hell out of my TT33. I only know the general construction because I carry my TOK for self defense so I decided to turn a couple mags worth into hollow points.

I can send you some but the hazmat fee's at UPS will cost more then the loaded rounds.

I have a thought though, I could pull a few down and send you the projectiles if you want to load em up and there'd be no hazmat. However I'd think you would want the original rounds for testing.

Let me know,
Mutter

PS Just opened a tin of 1260 rds I ordered a while back to check it. It is Polish and it is the same kind of stuff. It is headstamped with a 52 and moving clockwise by 90 degrees you get: the oval with something in it, 33, 24.

I'm not saying I'm willing to sell it; but I am willing to help you out with some.

mutter June 11, 2010 08:36

1 Attachment(s)
The rounds have a headstamp with the number 54, then 90 degrees clockwise is the number 4 then 90 degrees is an oval with 21 or Z1 inside. I think? I had to borrow my wife's reading glasses.

I posted this before opening the case listed in the prior posts edit and yes, there's enough steel in the jacket for this cheesy little frig magnet to hold it up.

Sand Pirate June 11, 2010 09:12

That's exactly what I'm looking for. PM sent, and thanks a ton.

Shay June 11, 2010 09:24

Wish I could help you. ...Because that would mean I had access to some.
The only steel-cored x25 I have heard of is of Czech origin and, IIRC, from the early 50's. Unfortunately, I have never had any to inspect, cut-open, shoot, savor, ...so I can't really tell you much about it.
Someone on the boards over at cartridgecollectors.org will probably have some decent info about it. I believe there are a couple of folks there who specialize in that caliber.
Most surplus will attract a magnet, as they typically have mild steel bullet jackets. I seem to recall steel jacketed bullets on the Bulgarian, Polish, Chinese, and lead-cored Czech surplus I have seen.

ammolab June 11, 2010 10:21

The majority of the ComBloc 7.62x25 has a steel jacket but Some, just SOME of the Czech made 7.62x25 does have a steel core. You may find older Soviet made ammo in this caliber with a steel core bullet as well.

The magnet will not tell you if it is steel core.... you will have to pull and or cut into a bullet to tell.

It may be hard to hunt this item up as many may just "think" they have steel core ammo because of the "magnet thing".

Timber Wolf June 11, 2010 15:09

Sorry to step on the thread but I just received this in an e-mail today that might be of interest:
Special Deals from Cope's Distributing
Polish 7.62x25 Tokarev 1260rds [DSP] Polish 7.62X25 Tokarov FMJ ammunition. Corrosive, 1950's era production. 1,260rd spam can. Since this is stab crimped older ammo some cracked necks are to be expected. There are 18-70rd boxes in one spam can. (Flat Rate $7.95 Shipping Applies!) MUST BE OVER 21 TO PURCHASE PISTOL AMMO
This is an awesome price on this ammo. Feel free to call 1 866 523 2673 ask for Misty, Carmen or Geri. Our Price: $ 104.99

That is the best shipped price I have seen in a while and I will be ordering a case Monday so don't buy it all this weekend!

bobm1919 June 11, 2010 17:37

Don't know about a steel core but the old paper wrapped CZ stuff is loaded obscenely hot.

It shows up from time to time at gun shows or on the recycle rack at my local gun shops.

Some of the copper washed Chinese stuff is loaded too.

To mutter, I advise caution, a steady diet of this stuff has been known to crack the slides on TT33's right at the ejection port, left side rear.

The radius on that corner is too sharp, leading to cracking.

I've got the remains of what was a friends brand new Polish TT in the museum, with just such a crack showing. My friend refused advice and believed that if the box said "7.62 TOK" then all was well. I suppose he was right, up to the point when physics proved him wrong.

There is a lot of 7.62 TOK. labeled ammo out there that is really loaded too hot for long term firearm survivability (not to mention the risk to the shooter). Occasional use, OK: moderate use, risky: steady use, guaranteed bad.

To sand pirate, I don't know what is being used for armor in this case but you might want to investigate high velocity pointed bullets (if using a weave material) or jacketed wadcutter style bullets (if using plate).
There is some interesting stuff being rediscovered along both of those lines.

yarro June 14, 2010 01:08

Czech made ammo for the CZ52 was steel cored and loaded much hotter than anyone else's 7.62 Tok ammo. It is not safe to shoot in anything other than a subgun or CZ52. The increased velocity id what makes it harder to stop with softbody armor, but the mild steel core makes it AP under US law.

-yarro

ammolab June 14, 2010 11:08

Quote:

Originally posted by yarro
Czech made ammo for the CZ52 was steel cored and loaded much hotter than anyone else's 7.62 Tok ammo. It is not safe to shoot in anything other than a subgun or CZ52. The increased velocity id what makes it harder to stop with softbody armor, but the mild steel core makes it AP under US law.

-yarro

Yarro: Have you run Czech 7.62 Tok ammo over a chrony?

How much of it have you checked for a "steel core"?

Truth is ( and I HAVE run a LOT of it over a chrony ) the Czech 7.62x25mm ammo is not much faster than many other milspec 7.62x25mm rounds. It has no significant velocity advantage, and is in fact SLOWER than the new commercial S&B ammunition in 7.62x25. It does run 20 to 80fps faster than some other 7.62x25 but that is not "much hotter". The "hottest" Tok ammo I have run across my Chrony was the New commercial FMJ S&B, followed by Hirtenberger GI and third place goes to that infamous Czech GI ammo.

Steel core? Yes some Czech 7.62x25mm has a steel core...just SOME! Much of it is lead core with a steel jacket and this ammo is going to perform just like Chinese, Romanian, Bulgarian, or Polish Tok ammo with a similar core bullet.

jefferyc22 June 14, 2010 17:55

The white box Winchester(S&B?) 7.62X25 def "felt" mild compared to Pole ammo

ammolab June 14, 2010 21:48

Quote:

Originally posted by jefferyc22
The white box Winchester(S&B?) 7.62X25 def "felt" mild compared to Pole ammo
Maybe they 'tamed it' a bit.... It has been 5 or 6 years since I chrony'd those rounds.

pmf June 21, 2010 13:52

Century has it for $87 + $13 shipping until the end of June.

My brother shoots tons of this stuff out of Toks and swears by it.


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