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-   -   The Drawbacks of Open Carry (http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=422385)

Story December 26, 2017 18:46

The Drawbacks of Open Carry
 
equally subtitled "Tales from Fayette-nam".

Quote:

An incident involving a stolen gun caused a commotion at Walmart on Skibo Road on Thursday afternoon.
About 3 p.m., Fayetteville police spokeswoman Asia Cannon said, inaccurate information based on radio scanner traffic began circulating about a shooting at the Walmart. Officers arrived and discovered that a man had grabbed a gun off another man who was open-carrying the weapon. The man who grabbed the gun then ran off. :whistling:
During the incident, someone yelled out in the business about a gun, and a commotion broke out. Cannon said one Walmart employee was treated by emergency personnel for an asthma attack. No one else was injured.
http://www.fayobserver.com/news/2017...t-causes-panic

Jaxxas December 26, 2017 20:20

Unless you are meeting some hombre at high noon I see little upside to open carry!

You can run through many scenarios but simply buying groceries in a supermarket line you could easily become crowded, overwhelmed and disarmed in moments.

YMMV

4x401 December 26, 2017 22:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaxxas (Post 4518511)
Unless you are meeting some hombre at high noon I see little upside to open carry!

You can run through many scenarios but simply buying groceries in a supermarket line you could easily become crowded, overwhelmed and disarmed in moments.

YMMV

I have to agree.

All the emotional open carry rights arguments aside....

I prefer to be the Wolf in sheeps clothing, as opposed to the Wolf walking around with his dick hanging out..

flejl December 27, 2017 10:00

Stealth is a valuable asset.

Why advertise and make yourself a target for attention or worse...

Herr Walther December 27, 2017 10:48

Dual and triple retention duty-grade holsters come to mind. If the weapon is secure and the carrier has had any amount of weapons retention training I don't see a problem.

But of course, how many will go to those lengths? :rolleyes:

Story December 27, 2017 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herr Walther (Post 4518662)
But of course, how many will go to those lengths? :rolleyes:

Wal-Mart.

Wolf1952 December 28, 2017 03:41

Iíve been OCing sense 1975 when I put on the badge. I took off the badge in 1986 but I keep on OCing. So Iíve been OCing for how long now? I OC everywhere except where I canít. But I do watch, look and am very a wear of my surroundings. Usually my right arm is resting on my sidearm, you ant getting it without a fight.

https://i.imgur.com/cOvOr3m.jpg

Wolf

Falfan2017 December 28, 2017 08:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herr Walther (Post 4518662)
Dual and triple retention duty-grade holsters come to mind. If the weapon is secure and the carrier has had any amount of weapons retention training I don't see a problem.

But of course, how many will go to those lengths? :rolleyes:

Even if you're retention is correct you still look like a jackass

D P Six December 28, 2017 11:41

The only advantage of having 'open carry' is when a 'concealed carry' handgun becomes accidentally visible which is considered a violation in some areas. Other than that 'open carry' is a fight hardly worth fighting.

Herr Walther December 28, 2017 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Story (Post 4518823)
Wal-Mart.

Huh?

ExCdnSoldierInTx December 28, 2017 19:16

Dang, Wolf, what are you hauling around there? It looks like a '58 Remington clone....
Nice hip rig there, store bought, or custom made?

Wolf1952 December 28, 2017 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExCdnSoldierInTx (Post 4519215)
Dang, Wolf, what are you hauling around there? It looks like a '58 Remington clone....
Nice hip rig there, store bought, or custom made?



In the picture Iím carrying a 1861 NAVY / Richards Transition Model, Type II .38 Special, with a 8" Barrel. The 1961 NAVY was 36 Cal cap and ball pistol. The Type II is conversion from cap and ball to 38 long colt / 38 special. The leather is store bought, but it is hand made special order.

https://i.imgur.com/mel85E8.jpg

My every day OC is a SAR K2-45 which is a 14 +1 double stack 45acp which is a CZ 97 clone that uses the Sig barrel lockup. The leather for it is all custom hand made.

https://i.imgur.com/TKavkYg.jpg

Wolf

ExCdnSoldierInTx December 29, 2017 09:02

Very nice rig. You can't beat a Navy Colt conversion. Being able to shoot factory .38s out of them is nice.

I did the same with a 58 Rem, but used a conversion cylinder for 45LC. Turns a cool conversation piece into a very nice pistol with the nicest trigger I've ever had on an old wheelgun. Not real useful in a modern world, but still quite utilitarian.
It's my choice over the 72 open top conversion Army every day.

I'm blessed to have a saddle maker as a good friend, and he made me a very nice Mexican cross draw rig for the Rem....

lockjaw December 29, 2017 15:18

I primarily observe two types of persons who open carry...

1. The person with little pecker syndrome.

2. The person who looks like he couldn't get a carry and conceal permit if he
wanted one.

Both types seem to get some type of passive aggressive satisfaction out of making others uncomfortable.

I have a couple friends who open carry from time to time, mostly out of convenience ("work" related). I've called them douchebags in passing (jokingly... ish). I know that they are not either of the above, and I'm content that a civilian in passing wouldn't as well.

As a pro-firearm person, who is also required to carry concealed off duty, I strongly feel that the open carry types cause more harm than good as they attract negative attention, while making themselves a target for many segments of our society. I don't want the above types anywhere near myself or my family.

If a person wants to carry, take the appropriate measures to obtain a carry and conceal license. If you live in a state that does not allow one, well... move. That is a right that nobody can take from you.

...

Wolf1952 December 29, 2017 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by lockjaw (Post 4519548)
I primarily observe two types of persons who open carry...

1. The person with little pecker syndrome.

2. The person who looks like he couldn't get a carry and conceal permit if he
wanted one.

Both types seem to get some type of passive aggressive satisfaction out of making others uncomfortable.

I have a couple friends who open carry from time to time, mostly out of convenience ("work" related). I've called them douchebags in passing (jokingly... ish). I know that they are not either of the above, and I'm content that a civilian in passing wouldn't as well.

As a pro-firearm person, who is also required to carry concealed off duty, I strongly feel that the open carry types cause more harm than good as they attract negative attention, while making themselves a target for many segments of our society. I don't want the above types anywhere near myself or my family.

If a person wants to carry, take the appropriate measures to obtain a carry and conceal license. If you live in a state that does not allow one, well... move. That is a right that nobody can take from you.

...


Your welcome to try and measure my pecker if youíd like. Most people donít even notice that I am carrying. And for the most part when they do, the most questions I get are, are you a bounty hunter and my reply is, is there a bounty on you, if so Iíll be happy to collect.

The main thing is I donít like having to ask for permission to do something.
Open Carry has been legal in Louisiana sense 1878.

lockjaw December 30, 2017 13:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by hkshooter (Post 4519857)
I see douche bags OC around here frequently. And it's always the same guy, ball cap wearing read neck types with soiled, well, everything, a dirty bandana under their hat, a two week "I can't grow a bear but I'm trying" types who make me cringe at the thought they are representing law abiding, hard working, non-douche bags. These guys are the ones the sheep see, not the clean cut, well dressed, respectful guy or gal who has their pistol behind their belt of in their purse.
I have to remind myself that America is made of all types and simply ignore them, knowing they will be the first ones shot in an event of any sort either by the bad guy or later, the police.

I used to see the same dude in the last town that I lived in. By coincidence, I ended up right behind him twice in the check-out line at the local grocery store, during the same week. Both times he wore the same black wife beater tucked in his jeans, sloppy fat rolls hanging over his belt, chicken arms with "jail house" tats, pony tail, facial stubble, wearing sunglasses inside, and prominently displayed an M&P holstered on his hip.

The guy was a total prick to the girl running the register. The guy rubbed me wrong and made my blood boil..... I later learned he was a popular figure on a local "Cop Block" Facebook page and one of the "sovereign citizen" nutjobs. He was eventually arrested for showing up in a government office somewhere and was arrested, trying to make some kind of stupid theatrical statement for his Facebook followers.

Then there is another dude, a fat little round 5 foot tall, while drives a lifted F-250 extended cab, with Marine, veteran, Sniper, blah blah blah .... decals slapped all over the rear window, tail gate, and bumper. He carries a 1911 on his hip. He had a carry and conceal license, but he chose to open carry anyway. He is a massive prick as well, he didn't believe that he needed to use a turn signal or seat belt. He was very quick to point out that he was a veteran and disabled, apparently the decals all over his truck didn't give it away. Local court thought otherwise. Ha ha.

Herr Walther December 30, 2017 14:40

Illegal in Illinois so I don't see any OC here.

Story December 30, 2017 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herr Walther (Post 4519045)
Huh?

I'll answer your question with a rhetorical question of my own - Where did the incident in question happen?

Thundermaker December 31, 2017 21:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by D P Six (Post 4519034)
The only advantage of having 'open carry' is when a 'concealed carry' handgun becomes accidentally visible which is considered a violation in some areas. Other than that 'open carry' is a fight hardly worth fighting.


And yet that is such an important advantage that it makes the fight worth fighting.

55bird January 02, 2018 15:34

I hold my ten foot pole between me and this thread.

BamaFal January 03, 2018 13:48

With two years street experience I attended a weapons retention class with 10 officers. As a test scenario to start the class, we were dispatched to "sears" to get an unhappy customer to remove himself from the front door as he was creating a disturbance - things have changed some over the last 30 years!

We each took turns being the dispatched officer and then the unhappy customer. Of the 22 tests, 21 of the officers lost their weapon.

Street experience of the 11 officers varied from 2 to 15 years. Quite a bit of retrospection/discussion took place.

My opinion based on my experience from that class and career is that open carry is for those that have weapons retention training. Otherwise, stealth is your friend.

lockjaw January 12, 2018 06:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaFal (Post 4521703)
With two years street experience I attended a weapons retention class with 10 officers. As a test scenario to start the class, we were dispatched to "sears" to get an unhappy customer to remove himself from the front door as he was creating a disturbance - things have changed some over the last 30 years!

We each took turns being the dispatched officer and then the unhappy customer. Of the 22 tests, 21 of the officers lost their weapon.

Street experience of the 11 officers varied from 2 to 15 years. Quite a bit of retrospection/discussion took place.

My opinion based on my experience from that class and career is that open carry is for those that have weapons retention training. Otherwise, stealth is your friend.

Right on. Our agency conducts weapons retention training (and vice-versa) annually. Our issued holsters have a retention safety that must be tripped before unholstered... which is PIA, but with additional training, it is manageable.

Criminals train. Criminals may also have more tangible street experience than most person tangible training experience. Outside of uniform, stealth is king. The wolf isn't going to show you his cards, why would you show him yours?

Thundermaker January 13, 2018 20:11

Some of you guys need to stop watching so many movies.

longhair51 January 13, 2018 22:30

I prefer to not bring attention to myself, armed or unarmed. It's concealed carry for me.

Whydah January 16, 2018 17:44

How could I walk into someplace with a 'No firearms" sign open carrying? *laugh*

fry January 16, 2018 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaxxas (Post 4518511)
Unless you are meeting some hombre at high noon I see little upside to open carry!

YMMV

what he said.
element of surprise over draw time. I never fancied myself any kind of pistol arrow and I would always rather be concealed. thinking about changing my user name to "pistol arrow". said the guy with a 38 revolver in his pocket.

justashooter January 17, 2018 10:16

sometimes i carry an I frame S&W 1903 type32 long with bobbed hammer in my pocket. it makes me glad to see you, and i call it my "magnum".

open carry with shoulder holster is OK in my book. that, or a retention holster. either way concealed is an advantage.

pistolero1911 January 22, 2018 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by fry (Post 4526994)
thinking about changing my user name to "pistol arrow".

Hey, I resemble that remark.

"pistol arrow" = Pistolero

hueyville February 28, 2018 10:22

I carry open almost every day but have an oversize shirt can pull on and hide the gun except to people that notice such things. Between wearing light armor daily (if you need a gun, don't you need armor or are you really that much better than the guy who sticks a Glock against your spine from behind) and a shirt to cover the armor it gets warm doing manual labor but my job has me on side of the road half the week doing field work and in my building other half except for going to pick up supplies or stop at grocery store/pharmacy on way home.

At LGS workers will occasionally slip up and take a stab at getting another's gun for grins if paying attention to computer or gunsmith in task. Stunned them when two of the worst purpetrators of shenanigans and practical jokes make a play for mine and the Level 3 dual lock holster combined with always trying to keep elbow over gun butt allows me plenty of time to pivot on gun hand and have hand on pistol with first lock actuated and finger on second and they are under a second from a speed rock.

Work I always carry a SIG in 40 Smith using a SIG or Blackhawk Level 3 retention holster and three spare mags on weak side. For dress carry a 1911 in either a Bianchi thumb break rig or Galco Shoulder rig and often both. When carry concealed always try to have a level 1 retention holster.

One of my Level 1 retention holsters for 1911:

http://i65.tinypic.com/f2ouwj.jpg

Mag carrier comes off as adds time to draw as muzzle has to clear top of mag before begin bringing muzzle up toward target:

http://i63.tinypic.com/jqnm85.jpg

Level 3 SIG retention holster note side lock:

http://i68.tinypic.com/1zd9j88.jpg

Thumb Lock on same SIG holster:

http://i68.tinypic.com/dgjqee.jpg

I practice drawing from this rig at least five days a week for a dozen cycles plus a couple of live fire, draw double tap, re-holster and repeat. Only adds a half second from surrender position to first round over a traditional holster with lots of practice. Thumb bumps release as hand meets butt of pistol and trigger finger depresses side lock before hand is totally wrapped around butt. If not positioned on shooter it's almost impossible for someone else to operate both locks even if know how the work if carrier starts pivot quickly.

A few 1911's in Bianchi thumb break rigs:

http://i68.tinypic.com/1zm30p1.jpg

Believe it or not wear two to three 1911's when herding sheep at church:

http://i67.tinypic.com/21bj66g.jpg

With the three pistols above level 3a armor plus Dyneema multi-threat plates with a tailored sport coat very few realize am even carrying, much less a rebuilt IPSC pistol with tritium front sight and trigger pull raised to 3.25 pounds.

My older sheep herding setup, still use for lower profile events:

http://i68.tinypic.com/oppcgi.jpg

Super low profile Safariland mag carriers:

http://i68.tinypic.com/2mnr8ur.jpg

http://i63.tinypic.com/2rwlsmh.jpg

Briefcase carry, great for doctor visits as level 3a armored with special threat plates, close at hand and can get through scans or exams without major flags if nervous practice:

http://i65.tinypic.com/2eltipy.jpg

Some of the contents not counting lots of spare mags in velcro pouch.

http://i67.tinypic.com/14lszu0.jpg

BiGB808 March 01, 2018 14:25

I believe you were the one who carries a Sash..or badge or whatever that announces you are a "armed citizen". That stuff cracks me up


Nope... concealed for me


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