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-   -   DuraCoat vs. Metacol vs. Gunkote vs. ??? (http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304979)

Col. Bat Guano February 11, 2011 16:34

DuraCoat vs. Metacol vs. Gunkote vs. ???
 
I have absolutely no first-hand experience with any of these coating processes. I would be interested in hearing from more knowledgeable members regarding the durability, appearance, application and expense of these various coatings.

Thanks!:whiskey:

gobbler February 11, 2011 18:07

I have an ARS metacol & several Gunkote and my vote goes to Gunkote everytime

gobbler

IRONWORKER February 11, 2011 18:13

Ambient cure Cerakote is the best IMO

jugrunner February 11, 2011 18:18

Gunkote ...

LaConservationist February 11, 2011 18:23

Quote:

Originally posted by jugrunner
Gunkote ...
X10

Delta-3 February 11, 2011 19:15

Cerakote or Gunkote are the only types I use.

tbugher February 11, 2011 21:03

So is Cerakote harder to apply than Guncote..

preston1026 February 11, 2011 21:13

I have heard it is... I have a cerakote and a gunkote and I like the gunkote better. I have heard from other people that Metacol is better. Metacol will be one my next finishes I think.

BC February 11, 2011 23:56

Which one is closest to the original Imbel finish? Refinish the receiver only, install the Imbel kit, which coating to use?

While I'm here, which coating is closest to the original Steyr import Belgian FAL?

gunplumber February 12, 2011 10:32

Considering METACOL III is not available for purchase, and only I apply it, the comparison is odd.

90% of the results of any finish are in the application preparation.

You can use the best finish in the world with poor prep and you get crap results.

Gunkote and Metacol III have the same roots - they went different ways about 25 years ago. For home application, I recommend gunkote.

Ceracote is a good finish. I evaluated it carefully - I'm not married to any finish, if I find something better, I'll switch. The results are nice, the color selection is impressive.

The application and catalyst ratios have improved a lot since I did my intitial testing several years ago. But they are still overly complicated and the short batch life raises the application cost dramatically.

While good results, I didn't find it better than the results I obtained with METACOL III, so I found no reason to change.

Duracoat is floor paint with a new label and 1000% markup. Crap on guns.

Might as well use krylon.

msnyder February 12, 2011 10:44

Doesn't anyone use Norrell's Moly Resin anymore? I did a CZ-52 and an R1 in Norrell's over park and was very pleased.

Vaughn L. Allen February 12, 2011 10:50

I use both Gunkote and Norrell's and both work great.

Inkognito February 12, 2011 10:59

I bought a $14 airbrush at Harbor Freight and refinished my Para FAL in Gunkote. Was the first time I had ever tried anything other than spray paint and it came out beautiful. Strong, smooth finish and it goes on very thin so it is very easy to apply if you do your prep work and get set up right. I've never tried any of the others, I'm sold on Gunkote. But then I do not have the desire to ever finish a gun in any color other than black.

IRONWORKER February 12, 2011 11:49

Quote:

Originally posted by tbugher
So is Cerakote harder to apply than Guncote..
No, actually it's much easier if you use the ambient cure formula - It's comes ready to spray & does NOT need to be cured in a oven - It is EXTREMELY durable, very EZ to spray & is the best stuff i have used

gunplumber February 12, 2011 11:55

Quote:

Originally posted by IRONWORKER


No, actually it's much easier if you use the ambient cure formula - It's comes ready to spray & does NOT need to be cured in a oven - It is EXTREMELY durable, very EZ to spray & is the best stuff i have used

\
Hmmm - haven't tried that version. The 1:32 measuring in a graduated cylinder and then having to discard anything not used in 8 hours was LAME!

IRONWORKER February 12, 2011 17:22

Quote:

Originally posted by gunplumber

\
Hmmm - haven't tried that version. The 1:32 measuring in a graduated cylinder and then having to discard anything not used in 8 hours was LAME!


The thermal cure version is a pain in the ass for sure

BamaMike February 12, 2011 18:42

I have been interested in CeraKote and GunKote for some time and still have not decided on which I want to try. Can you elaborate on the ambient cure formula. I went on the NIC site to look for it and cannot find a reference to it. The site is good, but not great for finding info like that...

Thanks!

- Mike
Quote:

Originally posted by IRONWORKER


No, actually it's much easier if you use the ambient cure formula - It's comes ready to spray & does NOT need to be cured in a oven - It is EXTREMELY durable, very EZ to spray & is the best stuff i have used


SurplusAmmo February 12, 2011 19:32

finishes
 
I've used Gunkote and Norrell's Moly Resin and both are great in my opinion. They seem to be the same bake on finish.

Degrease, blast with sand recommended not glass beads(use protection with sand),clean again, spray on and bake. The hardest part is getting all the parts grease free and clean. KG gunkote is $10 for 4 oz plus shipping. Plenty to practice with and you can see if you like it.

RG Coburn February 12, 2011 20:47

Quote:

Originally posted by BamaMike
I have been interested in CeraKote and GunKote for some time and still have not decided on which I want to try. Can you elaborate on the ambient cure formula. I went on the NIC site to look for it and cannot find a reference to it. The site is good, but not great for finding info like that...

Thanks!

- Mike

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=4...RAMIC_COATINGS

BamaMike February 12, 2011 21:27

Thanks for the link!

- Mike

gunplumber February 12, 2011 22:35

Oh, by "ready to spray" I thought you meant no catalyst mixing.

Tat2 February 13, 2011 02:23

I have not personally applied it.... but I am really happy with
how the Cerakote came out on my Sarco Argy barrel. The receiver
is the original finish from Coonan. We tried to match the receiver....

http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww285/tkm320/1.jpg


This pic shows the original park finish from Sarco on the threads.

http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww285/tkm320/6.jpg

The guy who did it is Jim at www.cerakoter.com

Great prices and a great guy to deal with too.

T

gunplumber February 13, 2011 10:42

Norrell's was one of the finishes I tried 20+ years ago when I was first getting into commercial refinishing. He still shipped it in glass fruit jars. I found it softer, less color consistency, taking more of a gray and "dusty" finish. It was the worst of the 4-5 different thermally cured dry film lubricants I was testing.

Now of course there may have been some improvements in 20 years, but once I found a chemical company that would mix stuff for me the way I wanted, it - in the colors I "invented" (and now everyone else has copied =- HK Satin black, Colt Gray, Parkerize Gray, WWII Gray/green, etc.) I've had no reason to play with any others.

I did give cerrakote a good wring out when it first became available. because I was hoping it would be the next step in finishes. What really pissed me off was the guy doing the selling was just that - selling - he didn't know anything about the product from a chemical and application perspective. This made a technical discussion pointless. It became clear that the guy trying to get me to switch to the product had never used it himself.

Anyway, it is good. I don't think it is "better" than gunkote, just different. And I don't like having to discard anything not used in 8 hours, but that's the cost of a finish using an external catalyst instead of heat as a catalyst. And why I still keep catalyst cured finishes around for fierglass and wood stocks and scopes.

BamaMike February 13, 2011 10:46

I have searched on air vs baked CeraKote and it sounds like both are pretty well liked but the baked on is more durable. Makes sense, GunKote is thermal cure as well with the advantage that you don't have to mix. Both have a big following and it sounds like a chevy vs. ford kind of thing. Sounds as if CeraKote is a harder finish from the propaganda (???).

Great discussion!

Thanks,

- Mike

RG Coburn February 13, 2011 16:25

Yeah,if you believe cerakote's website data,cerakote substancially out performs gunkote and duracoat. It might be interesting to coat some steel objects with all three,and leave out on a fencepost,out in the weather,just to see real-world which lasts longest. Cost-wise,it looks comparable to gunkote.

gunplumber February 13, 2011 17:14

krylon outperforms duracoat, so that's not a claim I'd dispute.

Fn/form February 13, 2011 18:07

On a somewhat related note... what do you all think about Aervoe can paints?

Supposedly much more durable than Krylon, and it doesn't burn off.

gunplumber February 13, 2011 18:11

not familiar with it. Maybe something to try.

I've been looking for a krylon plastic paint, but in the camo colors. Something with some give to it for flexible plastic on my go-kart.

moses February 13, 2011 19:43

Dura coat sucks! Dura coat is way over priced!!! I have seen dura coat bubble and melt off of a FAL barrel after 100 rds in 5 minutes thru a semi auto.

Have shot a full auto Krink until the barrel glows red and once cooled down and wiped with oil the gun kote looked just like it did when new.

Gunplumbers Metacol is also an extremely good and high quality finish I have worked on a few FAL's that had his finish.

Fn/form February 13, 2011 19:43

Pat Rogers highly recommend Aervoe for turning Target Indicator Black rifles into low profile rifles. He's not much for uber finishes--just re-spray it, he says. There was a tacked thread at Lightfighter. A lot of good info over there, albeit a lot of hen-pecking--and that thread illustrates it perfectly.

I have no idea regarding elasticity...

IRONWORKER February 13, 2011 20:51

Quote:

Originally posted by gunplumber
Oh, by "ready to spray" I thought you meant no catalyst mixing.
You don't mix anything, shake it up real good, pour it your airbrush & spray away!

hkshooter February 13, 2011 20:57

I had an FAL coated with Norrels over park by a friend. Going by what he told me he said that Norrels was a bit harder to work with. As a result a couple of years later when I built my own AK and FALs I tried gunkote. I've used it over park and over k-phos with excellent results. Like Mark said, for home application it's the best. Easy to work with, just do it while the missus is away unless you build a purpose made oven to cure it in.

gunplumber February 13, 2011 21:43

Quote:

Originally posted by IRONWORKER


You don't mix anything, shake it up real good, pour it your airbrush & spray away!


From the description "Hardener and paint chemically bond into an ultra-thin coating."

So you didn't add the hardener (catalyst)? Or you have a different version with no hardener?

IRONWORKER February 13, 2011 21:52

Quote:

Originally posted by gunplumber



From the description "Hardener and paint chemically bond into an ultra-thin coating.

So you didn't add the hardener (catalyst)?

No, it comes ready mixed - From the Brownells Cerakote page - "Premixed and includes 4 fl. oz Cerakote, (4) funnel filters & instructions Finishes up to 6 handguns or 2 long guns" - The only thing you add is a airbrush & some air!

Celticjedi February 14, 2011 02:40

Duracote is bleh and a huge pain to mix right. I did one AR with it and it came out real nice, only because I was very careful in the prep stages.

I will say this about Duracote however. It is FANTASTIC on plastics and resin, finish is better and adheres perfectly. I did several resin FN 5.7s pistols for Battlestar Galactica with Duracote and they were spot on and held up really well during production.

General Dissaray February 14, 2011 03:22

Nobody's mentioned Aluma-hyde here as a viable option; isn't that stuff pretty good? I've never used it; is it just a glorified spray paint?

TerryN February 14, 2011 03:43

Quote:

Originally posted by General Dissaray
Nobody's mentioned Aluma-hyde here as a viable option; isn't that stuff pretty good? I've never used it; is it just a glorified spray paint?
It's an epoxy paint; I have no idea how durable it is.


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