View Full Version : Slurry bombers for 2003

February 11, 2003, 01:17
Anyone have any good info on what can still be used. Many rumors including the loss of all C-130's...not just the A models.
It's going to be a really bad year in SW Colorado.

Any of you youngsters want an adventure???? Get red carded and travel the west! From what I've seen lately, it's a dirty, but fairly pampered, challenge.

John Culver
February 11, 2003, 02:16
I'll be flying remote drones for the BLM/FS this summer. Building them right now. 100" wingspan, full GPS, IR detection, remote imaging. Gonna be fun

February 11, 2003, 10:26
Wow, that is wild. What are their thoughts on a drone vrs Cessna? Are they going to be insured? Do they satellite link or store their IR info? Is this a wildfire program or more of the 'war on drugs'?

February 11, 2003, 11:50
Just in case other poeple don't know what a red card is:

"Question - I have been told that I must have a current red card to be hired for firefighting. What is a red card and how do I get one?

ANSWER: The National Wildfire Coordinating Group sets minimum training and physical fitness standards for wildland firefighters. Individuals who have the necessary experience and have successfully completed training and the associated physical fitness (work capacity) test are issued a “red card” that lists the individual’s qualifications to work as a firefighter or as support personnel. Red Cards are issued by the various firefighting agencies that are members of the National Wildfire Coordinating Group. "

February 11, 2003, 17:38
Originally posted by lutefisk
Anyone have any good info on what can still be used.

Yep. Firehogs. (http://www.firehogs.com/)

The problem is, the Forest Service got caught with their hands in the cookie jar, with abuses from the last baled C130 A and B sale program resulting in sale of some of the contractor C130s, spooky EC130 ELINT models being sheepdipped through the Forest Service program, and a couple of Forest Service Supervisors getting caught when Hercs from the program were being used for ferrying narcotics in South America while firefighters died from lack of aerial support that those aircraft were supposed to have provided.

Reagan and Fuchs should have been charged with negligent homicide as well. But they got their slap on the wrist, and can serve their time, then collect their retitement checks. (http://www.spectrumwd.com/c130/articles/cia.htm) But the whistle got blown on their crooked aircraft deals, and with it, the first leaks that the Firehog program was more of the same. (http://www.dcia.com/evergree.html)

Well, what the heck.

It was only 14 firefighters died, right? And you know how those federal supervisors need their little *retirement programs...* (http://www.wildfirenews.com/fireonthemountain/images/)

They can always train a few more *hotshit* firemen and smokejumpers to replace the ones that get killed. Business as usual.

http://www.wildfirenews.com/fireonthemountain/images/donmom.jpg http://www.wildfirenews.com/fireonthemountain/images/crosses.jpg http://www.wildfirenews.com/fireonthemountain/images/mackey.jpg

Major Tom
February 11, 2003, 19:44
I think the C130 airframes you can get on the civilian market are probably at the end of their useful service life. I certainly wouldn't want to fly them with any sort of heavy G-loading, that C130 that crashed last year was barely being stressed at all when it pulled out of the boming run when the wings just folded up and came off. I've heard the load factor at max couldn't have been more than 2.3.

Fighting forest fires has been an incredibly stupid strategy anyway. Every 20 years we get so much fuel on the forest floor that we get a fire that is practically unstopable, hundreds of homes are destroyed and a bunch of nice smokejumpers get burned.

We ought to be thinning the forest to a point where the fires can't really do much damage even if they do start up.

All the A-10s in the world probably can't stop the big ones and if they could, I wouldn't want to be around the potentially even larger fires that we'd have if we stamped the big ones out regularly.

I live in Northern Arizona, you can't do jack in the forest 9/12 months of the year, my house nearly burned down last year, it's insane.

February 11, 2003, 23:37
What Major Tom said. Archy references Roy Reagan, not Ronald Reagan.

February 12, 2003, 00:11
I volunteer, I'd fly em for free, but then, my kids are grown and gone.

Thank you all , I lived up in the places that the fuel load went big time dangerous, Thank You Green persons, and one , count that one asshole from BLM lites a "controlled burn". It was dry , and late PM when up canyon gusts overcome inversion effect, It must have been on purpose, a kid from any eastern shithole cesspool city would have known better.

Cerro grande Fire, I now live in a 9'x9" room in my Mom's house in the NY, Thank You well meaning Green Dickheads Kumbaya!

John Culver
February 12, 2003, 00:43
Drones are a new thing for them. So far they have funded all of our R&D and prototypes. Drones will be insured but are not very expensive. Our company will run them for the FS/BLM via contract. They can be readily adapted for many uses. Drugs? yah they would work for that, we would switch them over to electric power so they would be quieter. They also can be used for finding hot spots in power lines

John Culver
February 12, 2003, 00:49
Realized I missed a couple questions. As to comparing to a Cessna. They are much less expensive and have bo pilot on board. So if peraps you lose one you are out several grand. Not a life and a hundred thousand or more dollars. Currently the forest service uses several Citations, and King Airs for IR Recon. These are EXTREMELY soendy to fly.

Video is downloaded via RF. waypoints can also be uploaded/downloaded via RF. This does limit comm range but we are working on a Com plane that will function as a repeater.

Trader Joe
February 12, 2003, 00:57
Those drones would be cool!!
I must check them out soon as it seems thay may be under construction near-by (just sent you a PM about that John Culver)

I've been doing some very cool 'other' Helicopter stuff for the past tew years but I miss the big girls and will get back into heavy helicopter firefighting here again pretty soon.

February 12, 2003, 14:30
Actually, the rumors we hear are that the load will be picked up by Type 1's. Those aren't exactly youngsters either.

I think we should load up the bombers with ten dollar bills that you got to pick up as you built line. Bet the cost would be about the same. PS This is somewhat of a joke, no disrespect intended for those flight crews. One crew's last successful fire was with us, now they are no more(PB4Y).