Did Argentina make their own FAL's?

[t1eyer]

Did Argentina make their own FAL's or did they get them from another country Brazil/Imbel)?

[Tango 1Zero]

Hey I was just asking something to that effect.
Maybe my question was early in the program when they were trying to tool up or?

Claim? (http://www.l1a1.com/cgi-bin/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=010709)

[xcpd69]

Yes, Argentina produced FALs under license at the DGFM arms factory, Fabrica de Armas Portatiles Domingo F. Matheu, located at Rosario in the province of Santa Fe, starting in 1958 or so(the year the license was granted).

[Arby]

The Argies did make their own. Their reputation as FAL smiths is a good one. Their employment of FALS did not serve them very well against the Brits in the Falklands, though!

Fascinating, dirty little war.

[Bruce Allen]

I have a friend that has a preban Argie FAL. It is quite nice.
The handguard is a really nice, a heavy plastic.
They were much better than the DSA first series ones.
I have not seen it in over a year but I believe it has a black finish.

[Story]

Something for the Argentine collectors, from two years back -

Saturday, July 21st 2007 - 2:00 pm UTC
Argentine Defence Minister backtracks on FAL rifle ignorance

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://mercopress.com/images/uploads/Nilda%2520Garre.jpg&imgrefurl=http://en.mercopress.com/2007/07/21/argentine-defence-minister-backtracks-on-fal-rifle-ignorance&usg=__IdKcJV3B3diwBJcziGf8Nsc7gd0=&h=620&w=456&sz=38&hl=en&start=18&um=1&tbnid=DsSqDxLZLXyabM:&tbnh=136&tbnw=100&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcuban%2BFAL%2Brifle%26hl%3Den%26sa%3D G%26um%3D1

While leading government figures continued their onslaught on a judge who has summoned Defence Minister Nilda Garré in a gunrunning case, the minister backtracked yesterday on her previous claims to ignorance as to what a FAL (light automatic rifle) is.

*

Tiscornia summoned Garré on the eve of the launch of first lady Senator Cristina Fernández de Kirchner’s presidential bid but the defence minister found another reason to be suspicious about the timing of the judge’s move, pointing out that it was also on the eve of a scheduled appearance before the Council of Magistrates.

On the subject of the “stupid debate” in the media about her admitted ignorance of FAL light automatic rifles, she commented: “I know what a FAL is ... but technically ... I haven’t the slightest idea of the parts making it up and I don’t think I need to know that to be a defence minister.“ She added that some journalists annoyed her more than Tiscornia.

But both Garré and Tiscornia coincided in seeking to clarify aspects of exactly where the legal responsibility for the underinvoicing of 6,379 kilos of rifle parts shipped to the United States lay. Garré was at pains to explain that the Customs were not at fault for not controlling the shipment since its export price (2,600 dollars) was clearly the responsibility of the Fabricaciones Militares (FM) state munitions plant. And Tiscornia explained that he was holding Garré responsible even though FM is within Federal Planning not Defence Ministry jurisdiction because as soon as the munitions were exported, the Defence Ministry became responsible. Buenos Aires Herald

[Dean P]

I bet Sarco got all of the shipment.

[Pluribus]

Originally posted by Dean P
I bet Sarco got all of the shipment.

I bet they did too.

http://www.sarcoinc.com/fnfal.html

Believe it or not, we have had these in our warehouse for 5 years now. We received all but a few of the parts for the kits at that time as the few parts got stuck in a customs glitch in Argentina. We have now obtained the needed parts and are delighted to offer these kits to our valued customers.

These kits are from original semi-auto FALs that were made for export & then dissembled when the Argentine government would not allow their export (as we are told) as guns.

These guns were made at DGDM (Direccion General Defabricaciones Militarias in Rosario), the Argentine Government Arsenal under license from FN (Fabrique National) in Belgium so these are genuine metric FAL – not clones. Suggest you take advantage now as these have never been on the market before and will sell fast.

Items not included in kit: Receiver with ejector block assembly & locking shoulder (these are normally in the semi auto receiver), flash hider (gun had no flash hider), magazine.

[J. Armstrong]

The Argentine FALs are excellent rifles. I own two prebans and have owned several post bans, and while the quality varied a bit from lot to lot, they were all VG to excellent in fit and finish and great shooters as well, accurate and reliable. They were all as good or generally better than the type 3 Belgians I have owned and use a forged reciever to boot. I also think they are nicer than the Imbels, but I have only briefly owned two factory Imbels for comparison, so that is a qualified observation.

Bruce is correct, they are finished in a black stoving. On commercial imoprts with FHs, the FHs ( which are unique in having no BFA threads or serrations ) are blued, not parked. I don't recall if any of the other small parts are blued but could easily check if someone's good nights' sleep depends on it :)

[gobbler]

Originally posted by Dean P
I bet Sarco got all of the shipment.

Boy I am glad they did, my 2 kits are the s_ _t!

[jwv3]

Am I reading this correctly? 6,379 kilograms or about 14,000 pounds of rifle parts sold for 2,600 dollars??? Is that Argentina dollars and if so, what is that equal to in US dollars?

Figure about ten lbs per rifle if shipped complete (to be cut up here in the states), that is about 1400 kits. If it is Sarco, at $550 per kit x 1400 and that's about $770,000!

Originally posted by Story


But both Garré and Tiscornia coincided in seeking to clarify aspects of exactly where the legal responsibility for the underinvoicing of 6,379 kilos of rifle parts shipped to the United States lay. Garré was at pains to explain that the Customs were not at fault for not controlling the shipment since its export price (2,600 dollars) was clearly the responsibility of the Fabricaciones Militares (FM) state munitions plant. And Tiscornia explained that he was holding Garré responsible even though FM is within Federal Planning not Defence Ministry jurisdiction because as soon as the munitions were exported, the Defence Ministry became responsible. Buenos Aires Herald

[Dean P]

They were shipped as parts only.

[SPEEDGUNNER]

I must be reading the SARCO Ad incorrectly....what is the difference between the kit for $185, the one for $285 and the $549 one?

[IRONWORKER]

The 549 dollar kit is all new parts, that's the difference!

[gobbler]

Originally posted by IRONWORKER
The 549 dollar kit is all new parts, that's the difference!

Brand new in oil & cosmo & never put together. all that was missing from my two kits was the front sight springs

[Ricketts]

That 2600 figure is VERY misleading. I was involved with something with the late FWRA and the project he was working on was held up not due to the import price, but the sufficiency of the bribes to the officials that were supposed to release the goods. There is a bunch of money no one knows about trading hands before the things get into a container.

[Lee Carpentieri]

A lot of people were bidding on the Argentine fals down in Argentina. Most were coming from the Argentine national police armories. I had seen 2600 Argentine Fals in the foam boxs that included Standard 50.00 rifles, Para,s and Heavy Barrel configurations. Plus all the parts that were at the old DGFM Arsenal laying in oil drums with no lids filled with rain water rusting away. It was due to the Argentine politics of joining the UN initiative NOT to sell military style weapons to Civilian companies around the world, But to only sell to western alliance countries of the UN. With that policy in place it all but killed the deal to anybody in the USA. JLD, The person that started the Scorpion PTR 91 series of rifles was the broker on that deal between Argentine government officals and himself. DSA was to get the bulk of the kits along with some smaller companies and investors like FWRA and such. What blew this deal wide open in Argentina was JLD's shipment was just about ready to be loaded on an aircraft, Not a shipping container when one of the Argentine customs officers went and opened one of the crates and noticed that the parts had serial numbers on them which is one of the forbidden things of the UN Initiative that declares them weapons, Go figure. Plus like Ricketts said, With all the palm greasing that goes on, It adds up in the cost of the whole shipment. This whole thing started a little over 5 years ago and the Argentine Government officals were told if they didn't release the parts for sale with our barrel and receiver import laws changing fast that the whole deal could be called off, Which it was after the new restrictions implied by the Department of State which rumour has it the Brady bunch or old Handgun Control Inc. people had dug up this law that hasn't been enforced since 1968.