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Invictus77
November 27, 2017, 19:59
A guy who works in my shop asked me about AR10s which I know pretty much zero about and I have never owned one. He want's one to deer hunt with and plink, and he is on a relatively small budget. I assume the pricing is near bottom now like AR15s?

For an AR15 I would personally recommend an entry level "name brand" like a S&W MP15 sport. What would be something along that line in an AR in 308 rifle?

Also, he asked about a 308 upper to mix & match with a 556 upper on the same lower. I would assume they would need a different buffer spring, but again, I have no knowledge or experience on this 308 AR topic???

TIA!

SAFN49
November 27, 2017, 20:11
AR10 lowers and uppers are pretty proprietary. There is no standardization. You have to use a AR10 lower a AR10 upper, and usually from the same manufacturer. I've got 2 Armalite AR10's and they seem to be pretty decent quality. You can pick them up for $1000.

gentlemanjoe
November 27, 2017, 20:34
Palmetto State Armory has specials on them pretty regular. Can get them cheap as an AR15. I and a few friends have them. No complaints. I have an Armalite AR10 but tend to grab the PSA PA10 more often. They can be had for around $600

fnogger
November 27, 2017, 21:00
Certainly go with a complete rifle.

I'd look at the Savage and Ruger offerings, and then run down the list of the usual suspects for everything else. The Ruger is/was offered in a piston drive design, think the Savage is too.

Tuscan Raider
November 27, 2017, 21:19
Check out DPMS G2.

concretus
November 28, 2017, 06:54
A good entry level AR10 would be the Oracle from DPMS. There are a lot of aftermarket parts compatible with DPMS rifles. Just like AR-15's the sky's the limit onto what you can do to an AR-10 depending what purpose you want it to serve. Another is the Diamondback DB-10; for what you pay, you get good value. I picked up an Alex Pro Fab rifle and it runs flawlessly. I think the prices went up on them.

lew
November 28, 2017, 12:20
I've been very pleased with the fit and finish on my Aero Precision receivers.

twodog
November 28, 2017, 18:37
Palmetto State Armory has specials on them pretty regular. Can get them cheap as an AR15. I and a few friends have them. No complaints. I have an Armalite AR10 but tend to grab the PSA PA10 more often. They can be had for around $600

Cheaper than $600. They just had a sale on both the PSAGen2 PA10 complete upper and PSAGen2 PA10 complete lower and with two mags added w/free shipping it was $550. They get good reviews on most gun forums.

hellfish
November 28, 2017, 20:02
MP 10, light weight, sub moa out of the box, 18" 5R barrel.
More pricey than the PA10, but imo worth the money.

bfoosh006
November 28, 2017, 21:20
PSA PA10 GenII's are a good firearm... but if you have a problem, CS is per nil non-existent.... seriously. You will be promised all sorts of things that will never happen.

So you better hope the PSA is GTG from the get go... with the correct parts

I would suggest a DPMS at this point in time.

Falfan2017
November 29, 2017, 00:47
Savage has a new line of ar10 that is pretty good. I think there was a Black Friday deal for 800$ or so. Also the sw mp10 is good.

raubvogel
November 29, 2017, 06:28
To the OP, the modern AR10 receivers look like AR15 ones scaled up, so they will not fit as your friend hoped. There is 300 blackout (which always feels like an American answer to the 7.62x39) uppers which should deal with deers just fine. Hell, what's wrong with .223?

I was told a DPMS upper will fit a PSA lower and/or vice versa, but never tried.

TenTea
November 29, 2017, 06:41
Also, he asked about a 308 upper to mix & match with a 556 upper on the same lower. I would assume they would need a different buffer spring, but again, I have no knowledge or experience on this 308 AR topic???

TIA!

One AR type rifle I know of fits this description...Colt CM901

Don't hear much about this 5.56/7.62 Colt anymore.
Expensive, but interesting and likely defunct as a design.

https://www.colt.com/Catalog/Military/Products/Colt-Modular-Carbine-CM901

86772

wanneroo
November 29, 2017, 11:40
The S&W MP10 seems pretty solid.

I like my SIG 716.

SPEEDGUNNER
November 29, 2017, 12:51
I have a RRA, using FAL mags...

scottyb
November 29, 2017, 14:57
.308 is one of my most favorite rounds.

There are many choices for this caliber and for me none of them involve the AR10.

I have always viewed AR10 platform as the fat gurl at the dance that is all gussied up and still can not get a dance.

Would your friend be ok with a National Match M1A?

That is wot ScottyB recommends.

Invictus77
November 29, 2017, 15:01
.308 is one of my most favorite rounds.

There are many choices for this caliber and for me none of them involve the AR10.

We are "birds of a feather" on this topic Scott, but no he wants an AR10.

gentlemanjoe
November 29, 2017, 15:33
PSA PA10 GenII's are a good firearm... but if you have a problem, CS is per nil non-existent.... seriously. You will be promised all sorts of things that ill never happen.

So you better hope the PSA is GTG from the get go... with the correct parts

I would suggest a DPMS at this point in time.

That's how a few friends and myself got ours. I have never had a single issue with mine and actually get better groups with it than an Armalite that I have.

CTW
November 30, 2017, 08:12
I built an Aero M5 I used all Aero parts except the barrel(Rainier Match 18”) and trigger group(Geissilee) and Jp adjustable gas block. It runs great and very accurate. I put a Leupold VX-2 3-9x40 with the custom dial system on it and it’s a damn good shooting rifle.

bfoosh006
November 30, 2017, 19:17
I was told a DPMS upper will fit a PSA lower and/or vice versa, but never tried.


DPMS uppers will NOT fit the PSA PA10 GenII and function properly. ( not trying to "shout" the NOT, just being clear )

However... Aero precision uppers will fit ... and function, but do not match the cosmetic contours of the PSA lower.

I WILL ADD.... who knows if the PSA Upper would work on the Aero lower.....


The PSA lower has fatter side walls on top, while the Aero has lightening cut side walls.

As long as you can live with that... it will work properly.


Photos from backpacker21 on AR15.com

If the photos do not work... here is the link...https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Will-the-Aero-precision-upper-and-handguard-fit-the-PSA-lower-/121-720544/&page=1&anc=7560549#i7560549

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/171545/IMG_5927-375994.jpg

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/171545/IMG_5928-375995.jpg

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/171545/IMG_5929-375996.jpg

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/171545/IMG_5933-375997.jpg

lockjaw
December 01, 2017, 05:45
The second generation DPMS rifles are superb platforms. They are not "just another" AR-10 (simply an oversized AR). They were reengineered from the ground up. They are lighter weight, reliable and accurate…. and affordable.

GunOwner2011
December 01, 2017, 17:58
OP, you wrote relatively small budget, without mentioning how small.

AR-308s are not all standardized interchangeable parts like AR-15s. Upper and Lower Receivers, barrels, BCG, buffer tubes, and some LPK parts are different. If you are going to piece a AR-308 together, it is highly recommended that the Upper, Lower, Barrel, and BCG come from the same manufacturer.

PSA currently has the best prices on complete, and kit AR-308s. Believe it or not, you can order a completely assembled Upper with BCG for $300, and a complete, assembled Lower for $150. You will also have fees due at the LGS where you choose to have the Lower shipped to, but the Upper can go straight to you.

55bird
December 01, 2017, 18:59
I love the platform and built one one with a pro fab lower and upper, dpms pattern, accuracy great, but still have a few bugs to work out on lockup. Marks the brass on the ejector rod side of the bolt. And after a few dozen rounds does not go into battery reliably.

lockjaw
December 01, 2017, 21:49
In regard to DMPS Gen II platforms, my favorite is the AP4.

It is the cheapest in the line up, but it is also the lightest, and the most fun IMHO. I also like the lighter weight profile barrel compared the upper end variations. In my opinion, the trivial increase in accuracy of the heavier profile barrel doesn't weight the portability and handiling of the lighter weight rifle. Plus, I don't like the floated handguard offered with the higher end versions... I would rather pick my own. I also prefer a fixed FSB (which the AP4 has).

Later, if you decide to float or go "tacti-cool," you can install any floating handguard, as the GEN II rifles use a standard 5.56 barrel nut. Your options are endless.

raubvogel
December 03, 2017, 09:50
If you need flames:

https://www.classicfirearms.com/dpms-308-panther-oracle-optic-ready-rifle-model-60560

$600-something

Invictus77
December 03, 2017, 10:01
Thank you all gents, I have passed on your tips!

I love this place :cheers:

lockjaw
December 03, 2017, 19:39
If you need flames:

https://www.classicfirearms.com/dpms-308-panther-oracle-optic-ready-rifle-model-60560

$600-something

That is a Gen I....just another cookie-cutter porky AR-10. The Gen II rifles are completely different (and lighter) beasts.

hellfish
December 17, 2017, 10:42
If your friend is still looking, I think these STAG ARs are quality rifles and they're on sale now:

https://www.stagarms.com/stag-10-rifles/

I don't own one and I am not associated with them.

hueyville
December 18, 2017, 04:04
Got an email from buddy who purchased this for his new AR 10. Needed recommendations on bushings to put 30 mm scope in its 34mm rings. I buy right size rings or right size scope, don't like bushings. He also wants advice on a night vision device, leaning toward thermal imaging. His last request was for where to get a bipod to mount on his oddball forearm.

http://i64.tinypic.com/25iaptj.jpg

Asked what he intended to shoot with 20 MOA elevation built into mount? Was rifle accurate enough for 600 yard shooting. He didn't know what the 20 MOA markings meant. Told him it was going to point his optics in manner might not have enough internal adjustment in scope to set at 100 yards. Might bottom out turret and still not be on target. Then asked how much budget he had for his thermal since 20 MOA mount I would assume he has a long range weapon and wants high magnification. He said needed a good night vision device in the "few hundred dollar range".

When ran down his laundry list from bushings slip buy 34mm scope (has to use 3-12x 30mm scope paid for), max budget for night vision would be an ATN X Sight, then he wants a light on it as well to blind an opponent and the bipod asked him who is going to carry rifle for him. He is messed up worse than me, can hardly walk and he intends to use to patrol his property as a single rifle fit all roles. Told him rifle is going to exceed 20 pounds loaded with 20 rounds, can he fire a 22ish pound weapon off hand if needs to? Answer, that's what bipod is for thus he has to do a belly flop, open bipod and acquire target before firing.

My guess is he will either be to embarrassed to tell me didn't work out rather than sell mount to me when it doesn't. Offered to buy if has trouble with it as have a rifle that needs a 20 MOA rise on optic point of aim and could use two optics at same time. It's so heavy already would only be shot off a table from an armored hide and bullet doesn't even settle into flight path till reaches 500 yards and is said to be minute of man at 1,250 yards but not shot it that far yet. It will only be fired off bags or burly rifle rest.

I see this crap all the time. Just yesterday saw an AR with folding stock (has to be opened to fire so buffer works), big scope, red dot, visible laser, I.R. laser, flashlight, bipod and short tactical bayonet fixed on barrel to top off one of the muzzle devices that has all the sharp points so looks like food processor blades to rip interior of vehicle all to shreds. Some people look at too many ads over at barfcom.

15 pound AR 15 and buddy with AR 10 said has a beta mag purchased at SHOT show so should not have to carry a spare. Bet when he gets done it's a 30 pound rifle. He also has the highest capacity X-Rail on his tactical shotgun.

GALILAR308
December 20, 2017, 16:59
I have a Rock River Lr10,2 Ruger Ar762 and 2 palmetto generation 2 ar10’s. One of the palmettos was 460 dollars. I have no complaints about the palmettos.

aquaman
December 20, 2017, 17:20
I recently put together a PSA PA-10. I first purchased the lower with the A2 Stock http://palmettostatearmory.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/thumbnail/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/a/2/a2stock.jpg

I later purchased a 20" upper (including BCG and charging handle) with rifle length gas.

My research prior to purchase showed feedback reporting the PSA 18" mid-length gas rifles as sort of "over gassed". They work better/smoother with adjustable gas system.

I've not decided if I will go with adjustable gas or not. My rifle has reasonable accuracy and the rifle length gas system does not seem to be over-gassed. Although any 308 direct impingement probably system would likely benefit from adjustable gas...

I would say that the Palmetto represents a considerable value.

bfoosh006
December 21, 2017, 20:31
Just to clarify, the PSA PA10 GenII is a GTG .308 AR.

I am quite happy with mine, and can find my "review and fixes" over here..

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Industry/PA10-Nitrated-18-Gen-2-observations-fixes-Criterion-barrel-results-10-Sept-17-/301-284190/?page=1

But I do stand by the parts comments.

Here is a 20rd group of sanitized DAG, 100yds benched , scoped bagged., rapid fired..

https://forum.308ar.com/uploads/monthly_2017_09/IMG_2475.thumb.jpg.711861fafb2654239279af7afabd4f7 8.jpg


Certainly acceptable for cheap surplus.

hueyville
December 23, 2017, 10:19
Owner of goofy mount I posted above to go on his Palmetto AR 10 called and wanted to know if I had a set of 34mm to 1" bushings. Said turns out he has a 1" scope and can't find bushings to install his scope in mount. Told him had never seen bushings that size and why not buy the right size mount/rings or scope? Said wants to put both day scope and night vision on his new Palmetto AR 10 along with other accessories.

My question was how much internal adjustment did his scope have and he asked what did it matter. Turns out he is going to mount a scope with only 60 MOA adjustment in 20 MOA rise mount which will give him 50 clicks up and 10 clicks down of vertical adjustment at 100 yards. Plan is now to put a set of 34mm to 30mm bushings then 30mm to 1" bushings in the bigger bushings so scope fits. Would anyone else consider putting two sets of plastic bushings in set of 34mm rings to make a 1" scope fit?

He still doesn't understand what the 20 MOA "rise" really means. All that matters is ability to put a Gen 1 I.R. illuminated night vision and his fixed power scope on top of same rifle. What do you do when someone doesn't seem to understand? With any luck it will be too heavy to carry and he will back up and do something different. Has ordered a bipod, laser, tactical light and vertical grip to go on said rifle as well. Think he is looking for this in an AR 10.

https://www.lurkmore.com/w/images/b/bd/Tacticool.jpg

hueyville
January 24, 2018, 16:34
Enough AR 10 threads so recycling this. Walked in LGS and had DPMS AR 10's on shelf marked $599. Ask what my out the door price was and told $550 so said wrap me up two. One is all they had left but I am on top of list for next batch. have enough AR 10 parts including lowers and uppers to build three minus barrels and had finally broken down and purchased my first NATO caliber barrel to build one 7.62x51.

Have two in 338 Federal and two in 6XC with plans to build a pair in 7mm-08 for a long time but figured with the number of FN FAL's, L1a1's, M1a's, H&K's plus CETME's really didn't need any other 308 battle rifle formats to support. Then caught the really good dealer price on Franklin Binary triggers right before price went up and decided an AR 10 in 308 with binary trigger and a couple of drum mags might be a good idea.

At $550 each, with magazine new in box with factory warranty I can't build a lead hose that cheap. So going to put binary triggers in both and if world goes totally to cr@p can just swap between the two AR 10's in binary mode so they get a rest to cool between big mag dumps and can use all these parts for my 7mm-08 or any other odd cartridge selection. To me the AR 10 has been the ultimate experimenters rifle, not another battle rifle to support but easy to build into cartridge of the month and if don't like it a barrel swap gives another cartridge to try.

Going to be fun to put a full auto rated can on the end of this thing with a binary trigger. Figure a decent red dot optic that will cowitness with iron sites like a Vortex StrikeFire and a 50 round drum will be fun once shake any bugs that may crop up out. Be super easy to change it to adjustable gas if need way its put together. After that its barrel smoking time. At price was able to buy could not pass them up and who knows, may be the next $499 bargain rifle if prices keep dropping. Do not think the liberal gun grabbers will ever recover from the current market and number of rifles that were once out of reach of average gun buyers is now the most inexpensive rifle in the store. AR's are definitely "buy now" priced.

Dirt1042
January 25, 2018, 02:35
Snith and wesson mp 10 slap some mag pul on it free float it with an MI hanguard and change out the flash hider. I put a seekins adjustable gas block on it as well. Sub moa rifle with factory ammo. Its lightweight too.

steveTA1983
January 25, 2018, 19:05
PA10 gen 2. Love mine

http://i.imgur.com/8SNbmIvl.jpg

hueyville
January 26, 2018, 00:22
The DPMS is specifically a price point item. Can buy two complete rifles built and ready to run for not much more than a nice quality 6XC barrel. Know they won't mix parts well with my other AR 10's but don't care. Will get adjustible gas, free float the barrel and square front of upper receiver while barrel is off. Drop in binary triggers, add a couple of drum mags per rifle and done,

If world falls apart and had a hoard charging the fence 200 rounds of 7.62 NATO running the fence line in 30 seconds to a minute would be a game changer. Especially loaded with black tip pull downs. House across street wouldn't fare well but a large group of people attempting to breach fence will need fast solution. Odds are both will be sorted out, placed in vault and stay till I go to the other side or an actual SHTF situation happened. Magdumping 7.62×51 indescriminately would be total waste of money other than initial testing to ensure each rifle works with each drum.

Had a thought of dropping a binary in one of the 338 Federals but just can't forsee a wild herd of elephants, grizzly bear or similar making a desperate charge on the Ponderosa. Also think my shoulder and broken neck would appreciate a Leadsled for running then that hard and quickly. Shouldn't be worse than an M14 but past point of enjoying extenced shoulder fired rapid fire/binary/full auto for extended session. About time get them sorted the H&K binary trigger packs will begin shipping which will be a hoot.

spider991
January 27, 2018, 14:27
Cheaper than $600. They just had a sale on both the PSAGen2 PA10 complete upper and PSAGen2 PA10 complete lower and with two mags added w/free shipping it was $550. They get good reviews on most gun forums.


I bought this combo, gun locks up tight, runs everything from SA and brit surplus to 168 fed match.got a few hex mags, gonna grab a few magpul too....it's accurate with magpul mbus(working on an optic now)....very pleased for 559.00 can't beat it

hellfish
January 27, 2018, 21:57
Snith and wesson mp 10 slap some mag pul on it free float it with an MI hanguard and change out the flash hider. I put a seekins adjustable gas block on it as well. Sub moa rifle with factory ammo. Its lightweight too.

How difficult is it to remove the flash hider? The damn thing adds 3 inches to the barrel length, and weighs like 1/2 lb, I think a simple A2 flash hider would be much better.

gunshooter
January 28, 2018, 14:47
I bought a Palmetto Armory AR 10 lower for $179 and a $399 upper. It looks like a darn nice 18" barreled .308 rifle.

It's got a flat top upper for scope mounting and I have an backup rear USGI rear sight.

I will look for an appropriate front sight to go with the rear sight and I will have nice setup.

I don't know where one can get a rifle cheaper than that!

:fal:

Tactical Baron
January 31, 2018, 16:29
I get a lot of folks transferring the PA10 from PSA into the shop, but I have yet to fire one or hear any reports.

However I have shot the shit out of one of my customers M&P-10, and it shoots well, and it isn't cost prohibitive. My boss has a Bushmaster I forget the model number that shoots well, and last I checked the street price was just a bit over one thousand dollars.

I would say that it depends on your budget, lots of options out there for not a terribly large amount of money.

hueyville
February 03, 2018, 17:52
Since we have too many AR 10 theads most of the time and my post doesn't warrant a new thread sticking this in here. This morning was looking through deals for a low profile and Midway had the "ERGO Adjustable Low Profile Gas Block AR-15, LR-308 Standard Barrel .750" Inside Diameter Steel Melonite" for $35.50 each. Want to do both the DPMS Oracle AR 10's exactly the same so tapped them for three and checked out.

Decided a little later might ought to buy a few more at that price, clicked on them and put in cart with some other items, hit the free shipping tab and as checking out while entered my credit card number a window popped up saying price on the gas block had just changed and my total went up $30 bucks as was buying three more. Apparently I tripped an algorithm that told the computer too many were going out the door at that price and they ran the price up. Cancelled entire transaction and went to the item, saw it was $45.50 on gas block page. Rebuilt order with only one as the additional three initially on order were just going in parts box. At $45.50 it's still a good deal for a decent adjustible gas block. Time saved converting a gas block from standard to adjustible myself is worth the price.

So tomorrow after church if don't get any emergency orders like I did today plan is to put the binary triggers in both of the DPMS AR 10's along with getting scope plus red dot on the second. Then plan to test for accuracy and rapid fire as shipped. When the gas blocks and my free float handguards come in going to remove barrels, square upper receivers, install the low profile adjustible gas blocks and free float handguards. Found a pair that are specifically made for the DPMS short or low, whichever term is correct, upper receiver so picatinny rail mates exactly with upper. Then going to retest and see how much squaring the uppers, floating the barrels and adjusting the gas help them.

Have some more Tubbs Flatwire springs on the way and another dozen Tubbs AR 10 magazine springs. Plan is get the rifles totally tweaked, running 100% in slow fire or binary mag dump with 50 round drums and stash them in strategic locations around the house so have two battle rifles handy with plenty of ammo and ability to lay down rapid area fire or precise aimed slow fire. $550 in each rifle, $290 in each binary trigger, $35 in adjustible gas block plus $50 each for the free float tubes, $50 for the suppressor mounts and $20 for the buffer springs. Will have exactly $1,000 each per rifle with aluminum BUIS sights reasy to snap on a can. $199 for the Leupold VX2 3-9x, $39 in the red dots and $60 in the mounts. $1,300 total in fully featured name brand binary battle rifles. Not a bad deal.