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Campbe978
November 20, 2017, 20:24
I'm having some trouble with a DS Arms barrel and Belgian-style flash hider that I ordered from their website a few months ago. I hand-tightened it onto the barrel, and I found that it is about 1/12 overtimed. I found some barrel device washers online, but I'm not sure if they would fit with the way the flash hider slides over the barrel. Any suggestions? :confused:

308/223shooter
November 20, 2017, 23:43
I'm having some trouble with a DS Arms barrel and Belgian-style flash hider that I ordered from their website a few months ago. I hand-tightened it onto the barrel, and I found that it is about 1/12 overtimed. I found some barrel device washers online, but I'm not sure if they would fit with the way the flash hider slides over the barrel. Any suggestions? :confused:

If a timing washer won't work, you could resort to a piece of solid copper wire.

bigstick61
November 21, 2017, 06:00
From what I understand, timing was done by reaming the combo device, removing enough material from the inside where it contacts the muzzle so that it will time correctly.

I've got a different problem in that I recently realized that my muzzle device wasn't quite timed directly when I got it back from Terry a while back. It's not obvious, but now that I've noticed it it's rather glaring, but it used to be timed correctly. I can't get the damn thing to budge and I think it has some sort of threadlocker. Heating it with a torch did nothing, although some sort of fluid dripped down a tad below the combo device. Wouldn't budge even with a ton of leverage, not in either direction. I suspect that heating it may have affected the metal, as it is discolored (it got dark where the flash vents are down to the flats; below that it acquired a rust-coloured patina with a dark ring in the middle). I heated it for about as long as you're supposed to for red Loctite. Not sure what the deal with this thing is. It's on there good, though.

308/223shooter
November 21, 2017, 13:42
From what I understand, timing was done by reaming the combo device, removing enough material from the inside where it contacts the muzzle so that it will time correctly.

I've got a different problem in that I recently realized that my muzzle device wasn't quite timed directly when I got it back from Terry a while back. It's not obvious, but now that I've noticed it it's rather glaring, but it used to be timed correctly. I can't get the damn thing to budge and I think it has some sort of threadlocker. Heating it with a torch did nothing, although some sort of fluid dripped down a tad below the combo device. Wouldn't budge even with a ton of leverage, not in either direction. I suspect that heating it may have affected the metal, as it is discolored (it got dark where the flash vents are down to the flats; below that it acquired a rust-coloured patina with a dark ring in the middle). I heated it for about as long as you're supposed to for red Loctite. Not sure what the deal with this thing is. It's on there good, though.

Now we're into a whole new area. Can you post a pic of the hider? I ask, as too much heat can really bugger things up. By chance do you have a barrel vise and receiver wrench on hand?

bigstick61
November 21, 2017, 15:55
Now we're into a whole new area. Can you post a pic of the hider? I ask, as too much heat can really bugger things up. By chance do you have a barrel vise and receiver wrench on hand?

I do not have those tools on hand.

I heated it up for about two minutes with a propane torch. About a minute in I saw a couple of wisps of smoke come out the muzzle end and at two minutes I saw a little something dribble out from under the flash suppressor, which at the time seemed to confirm to me that there was threadlocker. It would not budge at all. At some point after it was safe to touch I decided to try one more time and give it another minute of heat, but no more. Still wouldn't move.

Terry has since confirmed that he applied no threadlocker (and I never applied any before I sent it out to him). So I have no idea why this thing will not turn, especially since it was timed correctly in the past and nothing was done to change this. I was able to get it to rotate by hand to the 12 o'clock position before. Whatever dribbled out of the combo device resembles hardened cosmoline and is about as tough to get off.

Anyhow, pics below:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4577/37680175905_762f3cb7b7_b.jpg

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4562/37680175985_d12a8e5914_b.jpg

lew
November 21, 2017, 17:00
Let's get back to the basic and obvious: in what direction do the the threads lie?

308/223shooter
November 21, 2017, 17:03
Fnc hider, threads should be left hand.

bigstick61
November 21, 2017, 17:13
Yep, same as my FAL combo devices. I used to able to remove it without need for a wrench.

308/223shooter
November 21, 2017, 17:19
If you have a heat gun, it works fairly well to soften the cosmoline without over heating the metal. I've had good success with mine. Secure the barrel somehow, then heat the hider evenly till the cosmo begins to smoke. Quickly stick your wrench on the flats and tap it with a small hammer to break the combo loose. I've removed many in this manner, hasn't failed me yet.

bigstick61
November 21, 2017, 17:24
If you have a heat gun, it works fairly well to soften the cosmoline without over heating the metal. I've had good success with mine. Secure the barrel somehow, then heat the hider evenly till the cosmo begins to smoke. Quickly stick your wrench on the flats and tap it with a small hammer to break the combo loose. I've removed many in this manner, hasn't failed me yet.

I'm not sure that it is cosmoline, or what it might be. The combo device didn't seem to have any grease or preservatives on it when I bought it, and I didn't apply any. I have no idea what the stuff is.

I did use the method that you describe after heating it with the torch. Didn't budge even slightly. Now that I know that there's no threadlocker, the whole thing is bizarre to me.

As for the combo device and muzzle, any possibility based on appearance that there might be a safety issue?

308/223shooter
November 21, 2017, 17:30
Not safety, maybe accuracy. Maybe nothing at all, just depends on how hot it got. If Terry didn't silver solder it in place, and it was easy to remove before, if the barrel was refinished it may just have a bit of rust on the threads. Here again, heat is your friend. Just don't get it hot enough to turn 50 shades of red, or you'll need a barrel.

bigstick61
November 21, 2017, 21:14
Not safety, maybe accuracy. Maybe nothing at all, just depends on how hot it got. If Terry didn't silver solder it in place, and it was easy to remove before, if the barrel was refinished it may just have a bit of rust on the threads. Here again, heat is your friend. Just don't get it hot enough to turn 50 shades of red, or you'll need a barrel.

Both parts were Parkerized before being sent to Terry. Terry said that all he did was take it off and put it back on. Nothing permanent.

Regarding how hot it got, I heated it for 2 minutes around the wrench flats, rotating it. After enough time to where it was just barely safe to touch, I did another three minutes. Just before I was about to take off the torch a small patch where the vent holes are started to glow dull red and I took the torch off immediately. The glow disappeared immediately. Glowed for maybe a second and a half total, just on that one spot. The barrel just underneath the combo device at the rear has almost a singed look to it (you can sort-of see it in the picture).

Given that I tried to use as much leverage as I could short of putting it in a vise, and also hammered the wrench, both while it was hot, with not even the slightest results, I wonder what also I can try. Soak it in an ATF/acetone mix, maybe, and then heat it up a bit and try again?

J. Armstrong
November 21, 2017, 21:51
Soak it in Kroil for a three-four days, then try again. Heat gun couldn't hurt. You might try heating the FH while wrapping the barrel with a cold water soaked towel. Don't know how much good it would do, but it can't hurt.

hkshooter
November 21, 2017, 22:32
Your propane torch won't generate enough heat to damage your barrel. These things got installed with silver solder to the tune of 1100 deg back in the ban days and they all worked fine. Some even shot abnormally well. Many of us have removed those same devices, also to the tune of 1100 deg with no consequences.

As to why your device won't come off, that's a mystery that needs figured out. All I have are silly sounding questions like, are you turning it LH looking at the muzzle or from the shooter's point of view?

Your torch is plenty hot for Loctite, not hot enough for silver solder. A heat gun would be akin to shaking your dick at it.

bigstick61
November 22, 2017, 01:03
Your propane torch won't generate enough heat to damage your barrel. These things got installed with silver solder to the tune of 1100 deg back in the ban days and they all worked fine. Some even shot abnormally well. Many of us have removed those same devices, also to the tune of 1100 deg with no consequences.

As to why your device won't come off, that's a mystery that needs figured out. All I have are silly sounding questions like, are you turning it LH looking at the muzzle or from the shooter's point of view?

Your torch is plenty hot for Loctite, not hot enough for silver solder. A heat gun would be akin to shaking your dick at it.

Good to hear about the barrel.

I am turning it the correct way for timing, but it won't turn for removal, either. It absolutely will not budge in either direction. I'll soak it for a few days and heat it up a bit and try again.