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FN FNG
September 24, 2017, 14:59
Hey guys i'm having issues trying to charge my FAL. The bcg seems to hang up 1" into the charging stroke and I have to mortar it to get it to go all the way back. This is happening on an empty gun btw
What makes it worse is that, when seperated from the lower the BCG slides back in forth in the upper without issue (the same goes for the charging handle).

Could it be that the rat tail is slightly bent and is interacting with the buffer tube?

ETA: where can I buy a new rat tail?

meltblown
September 24, 2017, 15:07
Make sure the T nut that is pinned in the charging handle doesn't protrude too far. If a tad long it will bind the carrier

1911Ron
September 24, 2017, 15:12
A few questions for you, who made your rifle? Is it new or an older factory built or kit? If unknown or unsure post some pictures of the rifle.

The rat tail is riveted in so if it is bent you would need to get another bolt.
Look for any unusual rub marks like on top of the hammer.

I've reread your post and it sounds like your recoil spring maybe dirty or the tube is either bent or there isn't a bevel for the rat tail to pass smoothly.
Look at the recoil plate and look at the bottom of the recoil tube and look for a bevel for the rat tail to pass, if you could take a picture of this area and post it please?

tdb59
September 24, 2017, 15:15
Disassemble the recoil spring and tube, check the tube for straightness and verify that the springs are clean and properly lubed.




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FN FNG
September 24, 2017, 15:19
A few questions for you, who made your rifle? Is it new or an older factory built or kit? If unknown or unsure post some pictures of the rifle.

The rat tail is riveted in so if it is bent you would need to get another bolt.
Look for any unusual rub marks like on top of the hammer.

Rifles is a home build on a coonan. I think its argy or belgian parts. The rat tail on this one is only pinned so i can swap it easily

I took the hammer out and the issue was still present.

1911Ron
September 24, 2017, 15:28
Rifles is a home build on a coonan. I think its argy or belgian parts. The rat tail on this one is only pinned so i can swap it easily

I took the hammer out and the issue was still present.

Ok well try that then if that doesn't fix it try some of the others ideas, good luck!

FN FNG
September 24, 2017, 15:59
Disassemble the recoil spring and tube, check the tube for straightness and verify that the springs are clean and properly lubed.


Took it apart (not pointing at my face) and degreased and re-lubed it with remoil. Pushes in and out fine with a screw driver. I can push the bolt back a little with the CH and them cock it with my hands


Look at the recoil plate and look at the bottom of the recoil tube and look for a bevel for the rat tail to pass, if you could take a picture of this area and post it please?

It looks like this one with the little tangental radius by the recoil buffer hole.

http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/images/products/detail/fal210lowrecstripped3.jpg

1911Ron
September 24, 2017, 16:06
If it looks smooth at the bottom than you should be good to go.

meltblown
September 24, 2017, 16:25
You are doing your checks without the cover attached?

pl521
September 24, 2017, 16:54
I had a similar problem recently; top of bolt was hanging on carrier as it closed on empty magazine. I replaced the carrier and it closed fine. Give it a try if you have access to extra carrier. Hope this helps, good luck.

lew
September 25, 2017, 11:56
The rat tail is riveted in so if it is bent you would need to get another bolt.

The rat tail rivet is super easy to drill out. Replacing it with a new one and riveting that in place is just as simple.

J. Armstrong
September 25, 2017, 12:14
Open the upper/lower or seperate the two. Remove the top cover.
The bolt should slide freely in the rails. If it doesn't, check the rails for straightness, burrs or damage. If okay, then cycle the bolt with the charging handle to check for interference with the handle.
Replace top cover and manually cycle bolt to check for top cover interference.
Check rat tail for straightness and/or shiny marks indicating any rubbing.
If all the above check out, the problem is in the lower. Disassemblig and cleaning and lubing the recoil spring assembly is advisable. Check for any wear or shiny marks on the bolt or carrier which would indicate interference with a lower receiver component.

johnnybourbon
September 25, 2017, 13:42
I built a para recently that did this exact thing. Using the stock imbel charging handle there was no issue but when I replaced it with the DSA charging handle the fit was tight enough to cause binding under pressure. With no spring resistance it would slide forward and back no problem but if you put a little pressure dragging it as you slowly charged (no spring still) you could feel where it was binding against rough spots. Solution was to take a hand file and gently clean up the channel where it was binding (mostly the last couple of inches).

FN FNG
September 26, 2017, 15:33
I built a para recently that did this exact thing. Using the stock imbel charging handle there was no issue but when I replaced it with the DSA charging handle the fit was tight enough to cause binding under pressure. With no spring resistance it would slide forward and back no problem but if you put a little pressure dragging it as you slowly charged (no spring still) you could feel where it was binding against rough spots. Solution was to take a hand file and gently clean up the channel where it was binding (mostly the last couple of inches).

Is literally everything they make junk?

Top cover was the first suspect. It binds with or without it. I've shot the rifle before this so its a new issue. I'm going to mess with it a little more. Also where would be a good place to buy a bolt rat tail?

lew
September 27, 2017, 11:55
Is literally everything they make junk?


On the contrary, most of what they make is very good. And, to be fair, a couple of their CS reps are tops. The problem is that, when issues are pointed out, they- management and their rep here on the forum- attack those pointing out the problem areas and do nothing to correct them. This applies mainly to their receivers, some para top covers- known shitty welds- and, if I recall correctly, an older batch of barrels. There may be more that I am missing, but, most of their equipment is solid, and, they're basically the only name in the new receiver game since Dan Coonan told his customers that what they buy is what they get. Got a problem with a Coonan receiver? Tough shit.

gunplumber
September 27, 2017, 13:44
I have run into several recent Coonan and DSA where the charging handle would move smoothly, until the lug was installed AND it was under load. I do not think your lug is too long. I think there is a lack of parallel in the channel the lug rides in. I usually chase this with a thin file when prepping a receiver. The front left corner is usually the area most in need of attention.

Interestingly, on some DSA L1A1 receivers, there was no binding on the lug until I drove the retaining pin in. I speculate there was a bit of wiggle and without the pin, it could find it's happy spot.

Anyway, on the FAL, I just reduce the width of the lug a few thousandths. I use a grinding wheel in the mill, but have previously done it with a file.

On the L1A1, I do the same but also increase the length of the flat toward the head, by .005-.010". Not sure why it has friction there, but a newly refinished part, the friction at that spot was readily apparent.

1911Ron
September 27, 2017, 16:47
The rat tail rivet is super easy to drill out. Replacing it with a new one and riveting that in place is just as simple.

Yeah I didn't think about that. :facepalm:

FN FNG
October 04, 2017, 08:50
Rat tail is bent and has a rub mark. I'm not sure what caused this

FN FNG
March 06, 2018, 00:45
ohkay, installed new rat tail. rifle is still bear to charge.

-lower spring compresses without issue
- bolt and carrier cycles when disconnected from the lower

The charging handle is a folding inch pattern, and i'm fairly certain that its binding the carrier when i attempt to charge the rifle

mountainman
March 06, 2018, 19:48
take off top cover. If you can charge it off the BC with your finger where the piston strikes it, then its the Charging handle lug. Compare the length that lug protrudes from the bottom of CH with another known working CH. Folder, fixed, or forward assist, all CH's should have the same amount of protrusion on the lug I Used to know the number by heart, but have since forgotten it . Maybe it was .195". I'm not sure anymore. I hope that is clearer than my last post.

Henry-Bowman
March 06, 2018, 20:08
I went to look at a FAL, and it struck me as being built in the dark...then dragged behind a truck...and who knows what else.

Fore and aft movement was very very tight. Originally I thought it was a charging handle (slide) issue too, as, if I moved the handle just right it would work in the charging direction IIRC. BUT, the prob was NOT the handle. I might be new to FALs but my Dad taught me mechanics well. For at least this FAL, the prob was the hammer. It was dragging in both directions on the bottom of the bolt. I could push the hammer down manually, and it would click and stay lower, where it worked fine, but normal cycling left the hammer too high. I suspected, though I never said anything to the owner, that someone monkey'd with the hammer/sear for unknown reasons, or, someone didn't put it together correctly...who knows.

Take the bolt out or move it so you can push the hammer down and it may click again and stay lower. Then the charging/extraction (fore and aft) may work fine.

That was the deal with this FAL I looked at at least. Needless to say, that FAL stayed where it was.

meltblown
March 06, 2018, 21:51
take off top cover iof you can charge it off the BC with your finger then its the Charging handle lug. Compare the length it protrudes from the bottom of CH with other know working set up. Used to know the number by heard and forgot it . Maybe it was .195". not sure anymore.

Yep I have 2 that required to knock a little off the edge of the lug. What happens is the knob pushes the t nut in too far because it directly rides on it when extended

Stagg
May 18, 2018, 23:22
I had a similar problem on my FAL with folding charging handle.

It started out as:
Coonan receiver (2012 era manufacture, 400 prefix)
Mutt of a gun, perfectly built and functional. (no thanks to the receiver)
Normal charging handle/knob.
Great weapon!

Then, I got my hands on a L1A1 folding charging handle.
We cut the receiver so it everything could fold up properly. Which worked like a charm.

What did NOT work was the fit between the charging handle "rail" and the long slot in which it was supposed to ride.
The old and worn milsurplus metric charging handle fit nicely.
The NOS British folder did fit, but was very tight, under limited circumstances. Boiled down to tolerance issues.


The solution was twofold. Go and "fix" the sharp edges on the receiver, which helped a little.
There was not a really good way to enlarge the receiver (despite working in a machinist shop) so for the second part solution, we reduced the cheaper part, by removing some material from the charging handle rail-portion.

Note, we tried several folding chargers (had 6 to play with) and they all fit tight in the coonan receiver. Almost all of the surplus metric charging handle rails fit fine. We had chalked this up to a tolerance difference between the inch and metric rifles..... or Coonan being sloppy.


Your mileage may vary, my gripe with the outcome is that with any part of the equation missing the darned thing works great.
But with a loaded mag, and an assembled rifle occasionally the charging handle has a little binding action. Nothing that the operator doesn't just pull through, but noticeable.
I may have to go back and look at the other pieces of the puzzle based on what I am reading here. It would be nice to have a smoother action.


Don't know if that helps or just muddies the water more.

Mako72
May 19, 2018, 14:24
Definitely what Stagg said. I recently got a CAI L1A1 from my Father, older Imbel Made in Canada marked. I ordered a FSE L1A1 charging handle from ARS to help with parts count so I can put on a muzzle device. Handle would not slide in except for first 1/2”. Slowly reduced the bottom and railed corners and it now slides in fine, but minds with t nut. Kept reducing and have it almost there, just needs a little more stoning.

FN FNG
June 10, 2018, 20:57
Finally got it sorted.

Tl;dr
the bolt rail slots on the reciever were cut so wide that the bolt would angle and cock and the charging lug would try and slide up incline on the bolt rail and jam inside the receiver.

The inch folding charging handles are too thick to fit inside the rails on the charging handle slot. I reduced the thickness a little and it alieviated the binding.
I had my friend add some weld to the lug which prevented the lug from trying to move up the incline on the bolt rail by where the lug indexes. The gun charges smoothly now.

The inside of the coonan reciever also looks like it has some bad machining. I'll add pics when i get a chance