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View Full Version : NON - NFA Supressors from silencerco


JonathanW
September 21, 2017, 11:30
Anyone going to buy one of those Maxim 50 suppressored muzzle loader?

Look pretty cool and ships straight to your door

TenTea
September 21, 2017, 12:01
w00t!

https://silencerco.com/maxim50/

https://www.store.silencerco.com/products/maxim-50?variant=37950952529

https://www.ammoland.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/SilencerCo-Maxim-50-Suppressed-Muzzleloader-600x370.jpg?129ec6

NFADLR
September 21, 2017, 12:40
These politicians could **** up a wet dream.


https://i.imgur.com/GkJM6MG.png

hueyville
September 21, 2017, 18:18
It may be time for me to get back into black powder.

meltblown
September 21, 2017, 21:32
[QUOTE=hueyville;4481095]It may be time for me to get back into black powder

I thought once you went black you didn't go back. Or did I miss something:wink:

fnogger
September 21, 2017, 21:51
Credit goes to to Boston John Doucette.


I'd been looking at a pretty, brass-framed BP revolver in the case at Shattuck's Hardware for a couple of months, and boy! Was I ever proud the day I went in and plunked down the money for it! Eleven dollars in one dollar bills... and eighteen dollars in quarter and dimes. Old Man Shattuck was a great old guy, whose eyesight, thankfully, had gotten really bad over the years... he didn't recognize me as he sold me the .36 caliber pistol... he even threw in a box of pure lead balls with the pistol and percussion caps when I bought the pound of black powder.

I told Mr. Shattuck that I was anxious to shoot it and was heading straight for the dump, and asked him to show me how to load the gun. "It's pretty simple," I recall his telling me. "You measure your powder into the cylinder chamber, put a bullet over it, ram it down in with the hinged thing under the barrel, put your cap over a nipple, and you're set to shoot." I thanked him for his help and headed for the door.

"One last thing!" he called to me as I was running out the door, "Don't forget to put grease over your balls! Crisco works fine!" I didn't understand the need for the last part, but I stopped at Tony's Grocery and bought a little blue can of Crisco grease. And now... to the dump! Where bottles and cans, rats and crows were just waiting for this ol' cowboy to do 'em in!

I replayed Mr. Shattuck's instructions in my head as I laid out all my gear on the smothed-out, brown paper bag at my feet. The first thing I realized was that I didn't have anything to measure the powder with... UNTIL I remembered my knife! I carried one of those folding stag handled camper's knives- you know, the ones with a fork on one side and a spoon on the other? The spoon was perfect for what I needed! Very carefully (thank heaven there wasn't any wind blowing) I poured a spoonful of powder from the can into the spoon, then tipped the spoon up and tapped the powder into the cylinder. Sure, I spilled a bunch over because the spoon held so much more, but what the heck! Powder was cheap, back then... and I had plenty to spare...

Being a methodical kind of kid, I filled all six chambers with the powder, managing to spill as much around my feet, I suppose, as I was getting into the cylinder. I can laugh now, but when I bent over to get the bullets all the powder fell out of the cylinders onto my boots... so I had to fill them all over again! I managed to get all the chambers filled with powder and then stuck a bullet into the first cylinder... I had to really tap it in with my knife to get it started... then shoved it in as far as it would go with the rammer thing. I lost a little powder in the process, but eventually I had all six chambers loaded and ready to go. Then I put percussion caps over the things sticking out the ends of the cylinders... Oops! I forgot a couple of things!

Now, I'll admit my ignorance about a lot of things... but why I was supposed to smear Crisco on my balls is still a mystery to me. But I figured Old Man Shattuck knew what he was about, so I looked around to make sure I was alone, then dropped my pants to my knees, opened the can of Crisco and began to smear it over Lefty and Righty. Standing there in the hot summer sun, slowly massaging soft, silky grease into my scrotum... gee WHIZ! I guess the old man knew what he was talking about after all ! Welcome to the joys of shooting!

I had to force myself out of my reverie...

One last thing and then I'd be ready to shoot... I took my baseball cap off and stuffed it inside my shirt over my left nipple. Okay... I guessed I was ready (except, of course, that in my haste I'd forgotten to pull up my pants...)

Well sir, I crooked my left am out in front of my face, rested the trigger guard of the pistol in my right hand on it, drew a tight bead on an old Four Roses bottle, and squeezed the trigger. I remember a bright flash, a burning sensation on my arm and face, then something hit me square in the forehead and the lights went out.

It must have been quite sometime later when I awoke. I was laid out across the back seat of Sheriff Miller's car (I knew this from the plexi-glass partition and a previous ride when I'd been sixteen), the rider's side door was open and my feet and lower legs were hanging out. As I raised my head to look for the source of the voices I heard I felt like someone had hit me in the head with a sledgehammer. I could see two men in the dim, evening light, just outside the door and within my range of vision. At least, I thought they were two men... I could hear two speaking but they were sorta spinning around and they looked like six. From the voices I knew they were Sheriff Miller and my Dad... "... busy on another call so the volunteer fire department was the first out here," I heard the Sheriff explaining to my dad. "Mabel Krutchner called it in... said she saw smoke comin' from the dump and had heard an awful explosion over this way."

"Near as I can tell from what the firemen say, when they got here they found your boy lying over there. At first they thought he was dead. The dump was on fire all around him, his left arm and face were all black, his boots were scorched pretty badly, he had a HUGE knot on his forehead where somebody'd cold-cocked him... And... well, we think the boy's been... well, taken advantage of."

"What do you mean 'Taken advantage of?'" I heard my dad ask.

"Well, Al, it's like this," the Sheriff said. "The first men to get to your boy said he was unconscious; they found part of a gun by his body; his pants were down around his ankles, his crotch was smeared with Crisco and he was sportin' a big boner..."

Then I heard Mr. Shattuck's voice. "I always knew there was something wrong with that boy...This will probably keep him out of the army..."

And THAT'S why I don't shoot black powder...

notfrommt
September 21, 2017, 22:12
:lolsign:

Thorack
September 22, 2017, 10:09
Well,

Its awesome that companies are using every loophole possible to make the NFA looks as worthless and dumb as possible. I hope they keep pushing the envelope.

Thorack

Riversidesports
September 22, 2017, 15:37
I dunno' I am beginning to wonder whether there is something going on inside ATFE.

Remember like a day after Trump was in office a senior ATFE regulator released a "White Paper" calling for major surgery to the NFA removing Short barreled rifles, shotguns and suppressors. Now we have seen ATFE approvals on all manner of slippery things.
This one though takes the cake and for a number of reasons.

Before anyone orders up, you best check your State laws
If they define muzzle loaders as firearms well this will be regulated
Pretty sure it won't fly in MN, probably not WI either

Other issues
How do you clean it ?
It has to be a sealed can, not only is it permanent on the gun, you cant take the suppressor apart. Pyrodex pellets foul pretty badly, black powder even worse.

This opens up a gaping hole by the way.
Okay they are allowing a modern muzzleloader with a suppressor.
What this means is one should be able to build a direct clone of a .45 Delise Comaando carbine on a pre 1899 Lee Enfield pattern action and it will be outside the NFA :uhoh:
Suppressed 1896 .30-40 Krag anyone ?

This is upside down world
I have an actual letter from the 90s where FTB stated no way to an unregulated suppressed Knights inline as they knew the Pandora's Box it would open.

Up through GWs admin the Bureau was actively prosecuting air gun suppressors. DOJ finally lost a big case in the 1st Circuit Court of Appeals around 2009 ? which opened up those floodgates

My own read is ATFE is actively undermining the NFA.
They could stop all the new developments but for the most part they have been rubber stamping most everything as approved.

Also guys, don't think you can build something up yourselves
ATFE regards any parts to suppressors as regulated items. A SOT can build these and sell them unregulated, a non licensee can not.
Of course a serious argument can be made that since it's not a firearms suppressor the internals are exempt from regulation too

Some strange times in which we live

hueyville
September 23, 2017, 13:20
I thought once you went black you didn't go back. Or did I miss something:wink:

Still have a black powder rifle somewhere and most important a matched set of 44 wheel guns since in Georgia they are not guns until you carry it in a courtroom and cap a judge. Might as well keep them around in case have to go back to making powder when one of the last survivors and Mad Max has last box of shotgun shells on the planet. Like learning to reload rimfire (difficult, never been 100% reliable for me) and even repacking primers after tapping out the dent, some skills that will likely never be needed are worth learning as still "paper patch" cast bullets into centerfire cartridges.

Figure the best black powder rifle is a stainless 45-70 lever action. Again, Mad Max has last box of loaded cartridges can make own black powder, repack primers and have rapid fire/loading capability. If have a misfire/hang-fire and zombies are mad, take a chance and cycle it without waiting to see if round intends to cook off. An inline muzzle loader using Pyrodex pellets, saboted bullets, suppressor that reduces large amount of the smoke and sound signature plus doesn't require a tax stamp is just sly. Now if a competitor offers similar at lower price it becomes really attractive. Can we build our own welding a home-brew can to muzzle? That could be tricky as assume to stay legal would have to build onto the rifle piece by piece or would have a moment of unregistered suppressor before the welder started its arc.

As to cleaning, stick the nozzle of the parts washer in the big hole and let it run a couple hours. Then pull the nipple and blast it out with some gun blaster from the back end, sit muzzle down and let drain/dry. They have a cleaning video have not watched but appears to be stainless which with Pyrodex will go a long way toward it not being a total pain. Already have half a dozen good ideas from as simple as attaching an adapter to faucet in shower and piping hot water through it with a piece of rubber hose. Again leave and come back later. Let dry and lubricate. the thousand dollar bill is the biggest deal breaker staring at me right now. with any luck will be seeing some trade ins at the LGS eventually.

Riversidesports
September 23, 2017, 15:01
Still have a black powder rifle somewhere and most important a matched set of 44 wheel guns since in Georgia they are not guns until you carry it in a courtroom and cap a judge. Might as well keep them around in case have to go back to making powder when one of the last survivors and Mad Max has last box of shotgun shells on the planet. Like learning to reload rimfire (difficult, never been 100% reliable for me) and even repacking primers after tapping out the dent, some skills that will likely never be needed are worth learning as still "paper patch" cast bullets into centerfire cartridges.

Figure the best black powder rifle is a stainless 45-70 lever action. Again, Mad Max has last box of loaded cartridges can make own black powder, repack primers and have rapid fire/loading capability. If have a misfire/hang-fire and zombies are mad, take a chance and cycle it without waiting to see if round intends to cook off. An inline muzzle loader using Pyrodex pellets, saboted bullets, suppressor that reduces large amount of the smoke and sound signature plus doesn't require a tax stamp is just sly. Now if a competitor offers similar at lower price it becomes really attractive. Can we build our own welding a home-brew can to muzzle? That could be tricky as assume to stay legal would have to build onto the rifle piece by piece or would have a moment of unregistered suppressor before the welder started its arc.

As to cleaning, stick the nozzle of the parts washer in the big hole and let it run a couple hours. Then pull the nipple and blast it out with some gun blaster from the back end, sit muzzle down and let drain/dry. They have a cleaning video have not watched but appears to be stainless which with Pyrodex will go a long way toward it not being a total pain. Already have half a dozen good ideas from as simple as attaching an adapter to faucet in shower and piping hot water through it with a piece of rubber hose. Again leave and come back later. Let dry and lubricate. the thousand dollar bill is the biggest deal breaker staring at me right now. with any luck will be seeing some trade ins at the LGS eventually.

I wouldn't advise homebrew on this
like I said ATFE regards even a single baffle as the same as a suppressor
your out is claiming aw shit it's for my cap and ball or big bore airgun.
ergo it's not a regulated component..

See, thing is the Can really doesnt have to be a sealed unit nor does it have to be a permanent attachment. It just can not be readily adaptable to a modern firearm. Even a unique thread pitch is enough.
The Bureau isn't even going after alloy and steel airgun cans in .22 threaded 1/2x20 even though its the common Euro pitch for .22 rimfire cans and has been featured as the stock muzzle threading on the TEC 22 as well as many of their .22 handguns.

Wanna see how crazy this is ?

http://petersoncorner.com/clague/products.htm

Real decent grade suppressors cash & carry
thing is they are sold for high power airguns so they are legal
ATFE just kicked the barn door wide open in a crazy fashion.

Standard used to be Antiques were under the NFA unless exempted by ATFE, the bureau would NEVER exempt certain things
For example you have a good number of pre 1899 Colt 1895 browning belt feds.
Used to know a family that had a 6mm USN marine corps 1895. Had a brass plaque fastened to it, was presented to a USMC Major by Pershing himself during the Insurrection

ATF is actually some what cool in these situations but there was no way, no how it was ever going to become an unregulated antique.

As stated, strange times...

hueyville
September 23, 2017, 16:47
Was spit balling on a home brew as realize there is almost no way at some point to have an unregistered suppressor in the process and would likely have to send it in for approval letter and if doesn't pass then may have mailed a felony alert to BATFE. Will be interesting to see if people do try home brew as them black powder guys are big on doing everything themselves if possible. Heard a guy that still makes a living as trapper say recently that the black powder crowd has made him a fine living as they will happily pay whatever asked for a period correct tanned hide. With the recent ruling on spare wipes am even hesitant to stock my rubber washer bins here at work anymore. Been buying as need at Lowes rather than in bulk from my industrial fastener supplier. Am not losing all my toys, paying a huge fine and going to jail over a muffler, fuel filter, oil filter or a rubber washer. I order service parts for our trucks as need instead of stocking in bulk now. Too old to fool with trouble but am keen on the idea of a non NFA black powder rifle just like binary triggers. The happy switch on them has abut all the grin I can afford to dump downrange anyway.