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Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 07:51
My rifle runs like a champ. No issues. Something bugs me about the receiver, and I'm sure you guys know the answer.

Anyway,....the mutt was put together by CAI, on Imbel imported receiver (and properly marked as such). Now comes the interesting part,.....I've read several times on this (and other boards), that this is a "metric" receiver, and the inch kit slapped together.

The receiver is cut for metric mags no doubt (they fit well with no issues), but,.....it also has folding charging handle cut, and cuts for tabs of the dust cover.

The only part that is "metric" on this receiver is the mag dimple, as far as I can tell. I'm glad because metric mags are easier (and cheaper) to find.

So if someone has the knowledge (and time) to explain what OTHER differences are there between metric and inch receivers, I'd be grateful.

nwobhm
June 07, 2017, 08:10
Sounds like you have a good one.

Inch has different lightening cuts that are visually appealing. Your Type III Imbel is otherwise a spectacular receiver. Yours having the inch CH cut and tab cut give you the best of both worlds IMHO. Chances are you will never wear out that receiver.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 09:05
Thank you. I am aware of the external lightening cuts on Commonwealth receivers, and I agree they are aesthetically appealing. I am interested to know if there are some dimensional differences (inside, or out) between them.

The rest of the rifle is B60 kit (in excellent condition), with original barrel. Lower is unmarked (dark park, which I believe to be Canadian). All internal parts are Brit marked. Rifle was purchased by original owner in the late 80s, or early 90s, and shot four mags up to date (two by me). It has original Brit Maranyl, pebbled furniture in MINT condittion, which the original owner put on (it came with crappy plastic made by who knows who). The plastic that came on it, ended up in trash almost 30 years ago. He doesn't remember which distributor he purchased the rifle from, but it was not straight from CAI.

It was a safe queen (one of many) up until last year. My friend has a pacemaker, and he is a lefty (even mild recoil of the gas operated rifles, upsets his "machine" that's under his skin on the left side), so he doesn't shoot anything over .223 any more. He has the identical rifle (he purchased two at the same time) that he dressed in Canadian wood furniture, and scoped it. That one has ONE mag through it since he bought it!

W.E.G.
June 07, 2017, 09:20
Most "true" inch receivers will be cut for the auto-sear.
Rare, and regulated, in the US.

Yours sounds like a Type 3 IMBEL receiver configured for inch parts and metric mags.

MAINER
June 07, 2017, 09:39
Quote;
"Thank you. I am aware of the external lightening cuts on Commonwealth receivers, and I agree they are aesthetically appealing. I am interested to know if there are some dimensional differences (inside, or out) between them."

Except for the cuts to the Charge Handle rails and FAL mag cut, there are no dimensional differences that I have found. The Imbel re'cvr accommodates the L1A1 Bolt/Carrier, Hold Open, Mag Release and Top Cover, so any difference would be minor.

It occurs to me that the Imbel doesn't have the tab cuts to allow usage of an unmodified L1A1 Top Cover.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 09:46
Most "true" inch receivers will be cut for the auto-sear.
Rare, and regulated, in the US.



Correct me if I'm wrong, but original Brit L1A1 was NOT cut for auto (safety) sear, and was never capable of select fire (safety lever can't go in FA position, although my Canadian lower has that position clearly marked)?

If you know,.....when did "Imbel Type 3" receivers appear on the market (I assume after Type1 and 2?)?

My quest is twofold,......I am trying to determine if IMBEL produced true inch receivers with metric mag dimples (otherwise why having folding CH cut, and dust cover tabs?), or the importer (in this case CAI) cut that on the only receiver pattern IMBEL ever made (and I know it's the third in line) which is metric? Does anyone know if IMBEL shipped their receivers to CAI in white (there is no evidence of any post production cuts, or variation in finish on this receiver)?

Completely irrelevant, I know, but I am very curious cat, and I keep searching, asking, begging.....until my curiosity is satisfied.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 09:51
Quote;


It occurs to me that the Imbel doesn't have the tab cuts to allow usage of an unmodified L1A1 Top Cover.

Well my friend, this one does! I have Brit dust cover (with tabs) on it. I tried to join the Photobucket yesterday to post pics, but it's giving me shit.

You can take my word for it,.....this IMBEL has the dust cove tabs cuts.

I've spent considerable time last winter reading EVERYTHING available on the net about these rifles (all patterns). This part of Idaho had unusually harsh winter this year, and I had nothing better to do, but read, and educate myself. And this little detail was bugging me.

W.E.G.
June 07, 2017, 10:00
I owned an IMBEL cut for metric mags, and with cuts for inch charging handle and inch top cover.

FAC sold them as stripped new receivers.

OLDMANPBK
June 07, 2017, 10:01
The original Brit L1A1 was cut for the safety sear but was not full auto. Imgur is way better than Photobucket IMHO.

W.E.G.
June 07, 2017, 10:02
My understanding is that the British guns were cut for the autosear but the part was not present on the rifles.

I think the Australians may have omitted the cut altogether.

SAFN49
June 07, 2017, 10:28
All inch guns were cut for the safety sear. The selectors were semi only.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 11:51
Thank you gentlemen. So it seems that I have Imbel produced receiver (imported by CAI), but the rifle not necessarily assembled by CAI (maybe that explains why the rifle is perfect, and trouble free)!

W.E.G.

Did your receiver have CAI import marks as well?

I guess I am trying to find out if Imbel produced these SPECIFICALLY for US market (marked with different importers' marks in US), because AFAIK, Imbel rifles had auto cut in them (and ejection block, and all select fire capable).

This receiver puzzles me now for a year, and I'd really like to know how it came to be (being "best of both worlds").

Thanks to you, I learned that Brit rifles WERE cut for select fire, and just lacked the parts. And now I wonder why! Making the cut in the receiver seems like unnecessary step in manufacture (with added cost) when the weapon was intended to be semi only, from the get go.

I'll try with Imgur (never heard of them!) later today.

OLDMANPBK
June 07, 2017, 16:53
http://falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=367462

BUFF
June 07, 2017, 19:09
The cut allows for the use of a safety sear, which helps prevent the rifle from firing without the bolt locked properly. It's not just for full auto.

I bought an IMBEL built by Century with a British inch kit pretty much like yours. The 922 compliance parts Century used included cheap-looking plastic furniture, their own hammer, trigger and sear and muzzle brake.

Mine had the cuts for the British top cover and folding cocking handle but is cut for metric magazines. I had it worked over by one of the gunsmiths on the board.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 21:04
http://falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=367462

Thank you for the link. I knew the "auto" sear is also a "safety sear".

Basically it's the same story as Yugoslavian M76 (DMR which some uninitiated people call "sniper"!). It had the sear (and the "third hole in the receiver", ...oh horror!!) when it was first exported to this country. Then,....ATF realized that one can simply add few other FG parts, and BINGO, rock'n'roll! Never mind that the rifle NEVER had select fire capability as designed (and having 10 round magazine,......why fire it full auto at all?). Few (quite a few!) were sold in original configuration, and the owners got a letter from the gang (few months later), to turn them in WITHOUT any compensation! They were cut. And all of the subsequent imports. So now we have unsafe M76s (7.92mm Mauser caliber) out there, that CAN fire out of battery if not properly maintained. Dangerous. There is a workaround that though. Spring loaded firing pin. However, the rifle originally came with inertia FP (and if dirty/rusty/obstructed ,.......slam fire, and/or blown magazine, "peppered" shooter, and the like).

So now I understand why Brit rifles had the receiver cut. Thank you all.

I still don't understand why Imbel cut the CH rail, and the tabs for the dust cover on their metric receiver.

Danielsand
June 07, 2017, 21:21
The cut allows for the use of a safety sear, which helps prevent the rifle from firing without the bolt locked properly. It's not just for full auto.

I bought an IMBEL built by Century with a British inch kit pretty much like yours. The 922 compliance parts Century used included cheap-looking plastic furniture, their own hammer, trigger and sear and muzzle brake.

Mine had the cuts for the British top cover and folding cocking handle but is cut for metric magazines. I had it worked over by one of the gunsmiths on the board.

The rifle in my possession, predates 922r rules, and probably the "Clinton ban" I believe. This one has all Brit parts inside, original barrel and flash hider with bayo lug.

Another part of this puzzle. Although the receiver is marked same as many I saw on this board (L1A1 Sporter, .308 cal Receiver made by Imbel - Brazil imported by CAI St. Albans Vt)........there is NO letter prefix before the SN (I read on this board that there should be letter prefix).

So why would IMBEL cut CH rail, and dust cover tabs on their metric receiver? Did they do this just for CAI (and some other US importers), only because we had tons of cut up Brit rifles on these shores, so they wanted to help out?

And how about "gear" logo Imbels? Are they cut for folding handle, and dust cover tabs (I've never seen receiver with gear logo in person, only pics on this board).

Sorry about all these questions, but I am a FAL newb after all!

Danielsand
June 09, 2017, 08:11
This is the one I've been asking so many questions about.

Thank you OLDMANPBK for telling me about Imgur (first time I've heard of it).

http://imgur.com/a/tK8xN

jam762
June 09, 2017, 08:28
The rifle in my possession, predates 922r rules, and probably the "Clinton ban" I believe. This one has all Brit parts inside, original barrel and flash hider with bayo lug.

Another part of this puzzle. Although the receiver is marked same as many I saw on this board (L1A1 Sporter, .308 cal Receiver made by Imbel - Brazil imported by CAI St. Albans Vt)........there is NO letter prefix before the SN (I read on this board that there should be letter prefix).

So why would IMBEL cut CH rail, and dust cover tabs on their metric receiver? Did they do this just for CAI (and some other US importers), only because we had tons of cut up Brit rifles on these shores, so they wanted to help out?

And how about "gear" logo Imbels? Are they cut for folding handle, and dust cover tabs (I've never seen receiver with gear logo in person, only pics on this board).

Sorry about all these questions, but I am a FAL newb after all!

The C prefix was only on the Argy imports by CAI as far as I know.
I believe that all the Imbel GL receivers have no "inch" characteristics.

base704
June 09, 2017, 08:28
That's great...

One pic of your rifle on a piano...?

That's it? :facepalm:

Other than the others?...whatever the others are considered...??

Great collection of...memes.

You obviously aren't trying very hard, if you are indeed looking for info. :?

Danielsand
June 09, 2017, 09:06
That's great...

One pic of your rifle on a piano...?

That's it? :facepalm:

Other than the others?...whatever the others are considered...??

Great collection of...memes.

You obviously aren't trying very hard, if you are indeed looking for info. :?


Don't understand about "others"........"others" what?

I was asking about the rifle in picture, nothing else. I am not a photographer, and I hate taking pictures. I am not here to brag, try to impress people I don't know (and never will), or show "others" (whatever the "others" might be!).

If piano is offending you, I apologize. I am not about to take pictures of my toes, cigars, or beer. In one of my posts, I said that the noise from my neighbor's training facility is "music for my ears". Taking the picture on the piano, was a continuation of that thought (in my head). My sincere apologies (again), if you personally thought of this as inappropriate.

Just trying to understand how this rifle came to be, because some things about it don't make sense (like metric Imbel cut for inch parts, for example) to me. I was told by MANY that this forum is considered "treasure chest" of FAL knowledge on the web, and I am looking for knowledge.

If someone has the answers for my questions, I would be extremely grateful (and thank everyone for them, as I did for every post that was useful to me since I joined this board). I never asked for snide remarks, and I have better things to do with my day, than entering "pissing contests" with people on the other side of this screen.

If my questions are annoying you in some way, feel free to put me on your ignore list.

Danielsand
June 09, 2017, 09:09
The C prefix was only on the Argy imports by CAI as far as I know.
I believe that all the Imbel GL receivers have no "inch" characteristics.


Thank you.

GLs were never produced with inch cuts,...got it.

I would still like to know WHO cut my receiver for inch parts,......IMBEL themselves, or was it CAI (it looks too good to be CAI "workmanship", but you never know).

MAINER
June 09, 2017, 09:52
Quote;
"I would still like to know WHO cut my receiver for inch parts,......IMBEL themselves, or was it CAI (it looks too good to be CAI "workmanship", but you never know). "

That would be my guess too. The Angry Beavers were not known for their finesse and the CH rails would have likely been hacked off with a hammer and cold chisel.
With the amount of Receivers ordered, I'd think that Imbel would be happy to make any modifications the customer wanted to suit his needs.

Your CAI seems to be an earlier production than mine when they had Brit parts to build on. Later, they got their grubby mitts on a bunch of Aussie stuff and assembled some of them marked R1A1 as is mine. I consider it as my FAL/L1A1 Troubleshooting Training kit. I learned a lot from that rifle. :facepalm:

I do appreciate CAI for having put a ton of half-ass rifles with L1A1 parts and Imbel receivers on the market, cheap.

Only thing I know about Gear Logo Imbels is that I'd like to buy one. Don't know why I missed that last group buy.

OLDMANPBK
June 09, 2017, 10:08
Pretty good pic for a newbie. Some guys here are artists when it comes to gun photography, but there is a learning curve.

4markk
June 09, 2017, 11:45
Prefixes on Century (CAI or CIA) receivers are references to Century contract produced receivers. The different job shops that Century used through the years would prefix their serial numbers. Century did post that information at one time, but has not in some time (i.e. NC = North Country Engineering). Nor are they helpful in recreating it. This doesn't apply to the IMBEL produced one.

As for the Inch cut IMBELs, it was reported years ago that the cuts were done by IMBEL at the factory by the terms of the contract with Century. Again, good luck finding the evidence. Those things have fallen into FAL lore.

Interesting, IMBEL did varying degrees of Inch cuts (probably by request of Century). Although most of the inch cuts include the Charging Handle and dust cover cuts, not all include the inch mag cut.

Although a metric CH will fit the inch cut IMBEL, you lose a lot of supporting rails around it when pulling it back to charge the weapon. So it is not recommended.

Danielsand
June 09, 2017, 14:04
Thank you Gentlemen.

I think we can close this thread now. My curiosity was satisfied. Due to the large order from CAI, IMBEL cut the CH rail, and made room for Brit tabs on the dust cover (while the receiver was still in white). I am glad they opted for metric mag dimple (probably also requested from CAI).

As I said in another thread,........I am also grateful to CAI for bringing tons of budget milsurp on the market. This rifle runs like a Swiss watch, and I can't complain.

About 15 years ago I purchased CETME from a private party in AZ, and it had ground bolt (to adjust the gap), but I bought it for a song, and didn't mind buying a new bolt, rollers.....etc. I put green G3 furniture on, and it's a sweet shooter.

Danielsand
June 09, 2017, 14:12
Pretty good pic for a newbie. Some guys here are artists when it comes to gun photography, but there is a learning curve.


Thank you. Guys on watch forum were on my ass for years to post pics of my collection, and I did,..... ONE time. It was an awful picture. I am not a photographer, it doesn't interest me, and I don't even like to BE in the pictures (family, events, etc.).

People that photograph watches (example), have special cameras, "light boxes",....different stuff. I have way too many interests as it is (RIDING - motorcycles/horses, shooting, and working on my ranch all by myself). No time to take on another hobby (photography).

Now that I learned how this receiver happened, I will probably not post much (no more questions!). I'll stick around, and read interesting stuff though.

pistolero1911
June 09, 2017, 16:58
I have an GL IMBEL Type III receiver with inch folding charging handle cut, inch dust cover cuts and inch magazine cuts. Externally it is visually a IMBEL Type III, but it will load both metric and inch mags (although inch fit better). Plans are to eventually make a 50.63 clone. It is a fine running receiver that has given no trouble.

base704
June 09, 2017, 19:00
Don't understand about "others"........"others" what?

I was asking about the rifle in picture, nothing else. I am not a photographer, and I hate taking pictures. I am not here to brag, try to impress people I don't know (and never will), or show "others" (whatever the "others" might be!).


I was referring to the other pics at that link...
If they were not yours, I apologize.
I assumed that there would be more than one pic of the rifle.

base704
June 09, 2017, 19:04
Don't understand about "others"........"others" what?

I was asking about the rifle in picture, nothing else. I am not a photographer, and I hate taking pictures. I am not here to brag, try to impress people I don't know (and never will), or show "others" (whatever the "others" might be!).


I was referring to the other pics at that link...
If they were not yours, I apologize.
I assumed that there would be more than one pic of the rifle.

I see now that it was just a "hosting site", and not your "folder" so to speak.
My apologies...

Andy the Aussie
June 09, 2017, 19:17
Some points from all above... ;) There was a time Imbel made a Type 3 with folding carry handle cut and milled for a "tabbed" Commonwealth body cover.

As to safety sears, all British/Aussie and Canadian L1/C1 rifles were cut for and fitted with the safety sear, as noted this is a pathway to FA fire but was not the sole purpose of the sear, it was to preclude out of battery discharges. The only real exception to this were the "L1A1A" rifles/receivers made specifically for the US market to adhere to the guidance given by the ATF on approving the rifle for import (thank Onyx for all the hard work on this). Among some other mods the sear and sear cut were deleted.

As issued the difference between FA and Semi only was the selector and trigger plunger. In Australia and Canada the L2/C2 rifles were issued. The British did not issue a FA version of the L1A1.

Danielsand
June 10, 2017, 09:37
I was referring to the other pics at that link...
If they were not yours, I apologize.
I assumed that there would be more than one pic of the rifle.

I see now that it was just a "hosting site", and not your "folder" so to speak.
My apologies...

Thank you. No harm done. I thought you are trying to provoke me. I am TOTALLY new to posting pictures (and I'll probably never post another one). I knew that something like "Photobucket" is out there, signed up, and it didn't work. Then another member here mentioned "Imgur" (I've never heard of it!), and that worked. I have ONE picture posted on the entire Internet, and you've seen it.