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View Full Version : Tell me about a 6.5 grendel


splattermatic
May 11, 2017, 23:05
I've started another assembly....
I'm thinking I wanna go grendel this time.
Tell me about it.
What bolt do I need? Mags ?
What other cartridge is it compared to, 243 ?
18" barrel long enough for good ballistics ?
Bullets, distance shooter ?
Thanks.

Falfan2017
May 12, 2017, 00:08
The 6.5 Grendel at close range is in between .223 and.308 in power. However at long range as in more than 500m the 6.5 Grendel is more powerful than the .308 due to the ballistic coeficient. You'll need a 6.5 Grendel barrel and bolt. Same upper same lower. Some say you need a 6.5 mag some say the 5.56 works fine. You'll have to test that out yourself.

One bonus if you're in to deer hunting the 6.5 Grendel is legal in most states and has more appropriate stopping power for a clean kill than .223

hueyville
May 12, 2017, 08:03
Probably the most efficient all around poodle shooter cartridge commonly available. That said I recently sold my last 6.5 upper and have standardized on 5.56 Wylde and 6.8 spc II for most of my AR shooting. 6.8 for defensive work and 5.56 with 69 or 77 grain bullets for sniping varmints. Now have two 22 Noslers finished and proper scope on one of them, a Burris 4.5x14 as a placeholder and a Leupold 6-18x on the other. Both 18" barrels and they will send 69 and 77 grain bullets out in the 400 to 600 yard zone in a manner that kills a coyote or ground hog like lightning.

Can't say anything bad about the 6.5 Grendel but love the way a 6.8 hits with same energy as a 5.56 and a 45 acp at same time, it's impressive on hard targets to 250 yards which is limit of needing to fight in a non SHTF breakdown of society. Now when going somewhere long shots are possible with an AR take a 22 Nosler or AR 10 in 6XC. If really concerned about accuracy a bolt action is the spare rifle of the day, usually in 22-250 Ackley Improved or quarter bore like 25-06 or the old 257 Roberts Improved.

tdb59
May 12, 2017, 09:54
However at long range as in more than 500m the 6.5 Grendel is more powerful than the .308 due to the ballistic coeficient.

Amazing.

A lighter bullet at lower velocity is more powerful.


Alert the media. The laws of physics have been repealed.



............

Falfan2017
May 12, 2017, 12:40
Amazing.

A lighter bullet at lower velocity is more powerful.


Alert the media. The laws of physics have been repealed.



............

Grendel starts out slower than the 308 but can be going faster depending on loading at 800+ yards.

2barearms
May 12, 2017, 13:41
Grendel starts out slower than the 308 but can be going faster depending on loading at 800+ yards.

Arne Brennan developed the round to compete with the 6MMPPC. He also developed the 45 Raptor and the 375 Raptor.

hueyville
May 12, 2017, 16:08
From an article about cost per round to shoot the most popular long distance competitive cartridges, 6.5 Grendel didn't even make the list but 5.56 is only poodle shooter that did. Notice how they took in average barrel life into account. How many rounds before having to lap the throat and know barrel has just entered it final phase of usable accuracy is what will be the death knoll of the 22 Nosler. Talked to "the man" at W.O.A. and said will get 1,000 rounds, lap throat and then somewhere close to 2,000 rounds it becomes a bullet flinger for heavy tactical bullets and will no longer be fit for varmints or paper. Why built two and as soon as get proper glass on the second one will be very careful on round count with each. Basically sight in as needed for load and season changes then only shoot when you have something that warrants taking one round of life out of a short lifespan overbore cartridge.


5.56x45mm: $0.46/round (barrel life 6,000 rounds)*
6mmBR: $0.81/round (barrel life 2800 rounds)
6XC: $0.97/round (barrel life 2200 rounds)
.308 Win: $0.80/round (barrel life 4500 rounds)
6.5-284: $1.24/round (barrel life 1100 rounds)


http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/tag/6xc/

Look at the barrel life for a target grade 5.56 and a 7.62x51. If look at the asterisk in article for the 5.56 it mentions that last couple thousand rounds are 100 to 200 yard practice rounds just to get trigger time likely for guys like WEG. I count on my nice 5.56 and 7.62x51 barrels to give me 3,000 rounds of tack driving accuracy. Then they become fighting rifles until unable to hit a man size target at an appropriate distance. Have some 5.56 CHF melonite barrels expect 10,000 minimum battlefield accurate rounds and maybe more.

The 6.5 Grendel is great at what it does, approximate the ballistics of a 308 in a poodle shooter. Check below linked chart.

http://abesguncave.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/6.5-Grendel-vs-308-Trajectory-Chart.jpg

If want to practice for competitive shooting in the many sports that center around the 308 the 6.5 Grendel is almost the exact same dope for distance. If look at the bench rest crowd nobody is using it though. It takes the guys who record every group and how quickly a barrel loses its inherent accuracy to get a good handle on that but for a low pressure round that should show good barrel life have heard more people complain about short lifespan than not. I have rifles can count accuracy fall of in the triple digits with big overbore 7mm's. I just didn't get anything out of the 6.5 couldn't get with something else so shuffled both my uppers off before they had any real age.

If I wanted to do something "special" with a poodle shooter then I would try 6mm FatRat. Its becoming common enough can get everything you need, its reputed to be easy to load for and has long barrel life. 6mm seems to be where all the distance is found these days, if were to build a 6.5 would do a Creedmore but wont fit in an AR 15. Actually had 6.5 Creed bolt action built for a friend of mine with a varmint problem and only time he could put eyeballs on them he had 400 yards of pond for the bullet to cross then 200 yards of distance to treeline. He's not a great shooter but the Creedmore has taken him from almost zero hits to a 40% chance of hitting the coyote that are trying to get into his chicken houses at 400 to 600 yards. I go when I can but can't move in to keep his yotes at bay. People either love the 6.5 Grendel or are ambivalent. I am one of the ambivalent crowd. Will get by with 5.56 and 6.8 then take the odd long shot with a Nosler and try not to smoke the throats.

grumpy1
May 12, 2017, 20:58
Well, I've been following the 6.5 Grendel since about 2004. For the first 10 years or so it live under the radar and not many people had gotten much range time with one as the price of the Alexander Arms uppers and ammo kept people away from it. Once others started to copy the round and change their round slightly like Les Bear, it forced AA to let go of the round and let others make parts for the round. I think this is were quality control got lost as AA couldn't control everything. Kind of like Apple versus windows, windows pc's are cheaper than Apple but there are fewer problems with Apple products.

This is a good web site that another member on here turned me on to, www.AR15Performance.com. They have some good parts to make a 6.5 Grendel. I haven't yet built a Grendel simply because I haven't had the money to build what I want.

I would agree that people either love it or they hate the round. I haven't heard to much of it burning barrels out, which it shouldn't based on case capacity and velocity. I think people how have short barrel life/ poor accuracy after a short period of time had poor quality parts.

I think Les Bear wouldn't have made his version if he didn't see something in the round. With the right bullet it will shoot with the 308. I think it's interesting that the 6mmBR is on the barrel life chart but then Grendel isn't because they are very similar cases.

hueyville
May 13, 2017, 00:00
#1:
I would agree that people either love it or they hate the round. I haven't heard to much of it burning barrels out, which it shouldn't based on case capacity and velocity.
#2.
I think Les Bear wouldn't have made his version if he didn't see something in the round. With the right bullet it will shoot with the 308. I think it's interesting that the 6mmBR is on the barrel life chart but then Grendel isn't because they are very similar cases.

#1:
I agree that based on case capacity and average/max pressure should not be a barrel burner. Doesn't quite fall into the over bore catagory but have heard quite a few people complain about barrel life but who knows, they may have been the type that cleaned their rifles every time they fired a few rounds of every day and killed them with a brush and improper use of cleaning rod but feel it's more to it. The barrel life chart came from a benchrest, prone, service rifle, etc competative rifle site. The 6.5 was not up for consideration because it's seldom used in shooting events.

If building a mid caliber AR right now would look at 6mm FatRat, 277 Wolverine, 25 WSSM (throat burner for sure but a suckered for quarter bores and puts 25-06 exterior ballistics in little rifle) and 30 Remington. Not saying the 6.5 Grendel is a poor choice. I just found it didn't fill a niche I needed. Had found myself with 20 Tactical, 204 Rugers, 5.56, 5.728, 6.5 Grendel, 6.8 spc II, 300 B.O. and others. Each new cartridge chased more confusing things got. Chose what was best for me, 5.56 and 6.8 spc II. Wife still has pair of 5.728's though she saw one of the single stamp 5.56 suppressed AR's, asked questions and confiscated one today.

If had plenty of 5.56 rifles and needed a toy, if lived in desert or south Georgia (anywhere with long medium game shots) the 6.5 might be better choice than the 6.8. I didn't mean to fall in the 22 Nosler trap but got a pair of barrels dirt cheap and when varmint accuracy falls off can't wait to load some of the M855A1 pull downs have in the hot Nosler. Add another 300 fps to 5.56 M855A1 and might become a can opener.

grumpy1
May 13, 2017, 08:43
If had plenty of 5.56 rifles and needed a toy, if lived in desert or south Georgia (anywhere with long medium game shots) the 6.5 might be better choice than the 6.8.

I would agree with you that the 6.5 is better where it can get out and stretch its legs ( I live in a desert). I've never been excited about the 6.8 SPC in either form, I just didn't see the need for it but it does have some advantages to it.

I'm not sure why the 6.5 Grendel hasn't caught on with the distance shooters more as others 6.5mm have. It seems more are going t the 6mm now.

As for barrel burners, one of the guys on my sniper team used to brag about his 300 RUM and how flat it would shoot. I would argue with him the extra fps isn't worth the cost of the barrels it will burn through and the added recoil. His barrels would only last about 1000 rounds before they would go from a half MOA to some where around 2-3 MOA. They crazy thing is it would open up in a hurry. Yes, 2-3 MOA isn't bad but when your use to shooting very small groups, it's horrible.

splattermatic
May 13, 2017, 09:24
Since I live in wide open spaces, and can shoot to miles away if I wanted, something other than a 5.56/223 appealed to me.
I drew a coues deer tag again this year, and even tho a .22 is legal, I'm thinking of an ar in something small than a 308 sized one, to maybe launch an accubond or a bt , that has some ass behind it.
Wssm's were a thought, but brass is crazy expensive.
We ride to glassing spots, and stalk from there, or ride to another spot, and go from there.
A spotter directs.
I'm thinking an 18" barrel, tho g man says he'd go 20.
Trying to keep it light enough for an ad.
The barrel at classic is a gen 2, so a x39 bolt won't work.
I'm in no hurry to assemble, just buying a piece here and there.
Minus some of this add on stuff, and a new grip, here's my starting point.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v631/splattermatic/20170509_204219_001_zps9mg8b5wj.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/splattermatic/media/20170509_204219_001_zps9mg8b5wj.jpg.html)
I think an 18" barrel won't be too front heavy, and should still give good velocity, based on case capacity.

splattermatic
May 16, 2017, 08:08
Got an email from Classic.
Barrels are 20% off.
I'm going to order an 18", stainless, fluted, 1:8, 5R, gen 2.