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View Full Version : AR Scopes: I'm a simple perspective


ByronF
January 08, 2017, 20:02
I'm a simple man who doesnt want to learn and remember more than I must. That's not to say I'm a man incapable of learning. After 24 yrs absence I can probably still execute most reactor plant casualty drills for a 688-class submarine. But I am practical enough to realize that I have a lot of other stuff to handle in my day-to-day that gets in the way of practicing with mil dots, turret knobs, etc.

I have decided that I am better served by simple equipment. Aimpoints sighted for 200 yd, and duplex-reticule 2-7x hunting scopes for "long range" work (Pennsylvania long ranges) are my current preference for non-thinking man's optics. Out to 250 yd one has mason-jar precision. If 90% of engagements are within 100yd then the outliers of my scheme can be handled by memorizing hold-overs for 300yd and 400yd, then pasting those figures under my flip up lense covers for good measure.

For a flat-shooting cartridge like the 5.56 my opinion is that eye-chart reticules (especially with windage hash marks) are not necessary. Killed a LOT of woodchucks from 50-400yd without touching a turret, looking through a simple crosshair. Even with a 40XB 22-250 wearing a Unertl having micrometer rear mount I never clicked a knob. Too often I've hunted with guys who failed to return their knobs to target zero after applying clicks and missed a shot.

I must say I have been drawn to bullet drop range-finding reticules and tacticool target knobs but have fortunately come to a different conclusion before buying into sexy looking optics. It is my opinion that many shooter will be well served by either simple red dots (Aimpoints are my fave) or something similar to a Leupold 2-7 VXR Firedot dialed in for a 200 yd zero. Memorize drops beyond that and paste to your lens cap or buttstock.

Another topic I see often is people lamenting that their 1-4x scope is not a true 1x. Remember that the first red dot optics were occluded eye gunsights. Same as having the objective lens cap closed with the dot turned on with a Leupold 2-7 Firedot.

What you guys think of this approach? Not meaning to belittle other choices. And there are some who can wring the advantages out of mil-dot reticules and target knobs. But a man's gotta know his limitations. I dont think I gain any advantage from more complicated optics.

Invictus77
January 08, 2017, 20:20
Agreed out to 250 yards ;)


http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d38/mlcasson/Capture2_zpsfth2idqy.jpg

kotengu
January 08, 2017, 20:28
Knowing what works for you is way more important than buying what the cool kids say you "need". If this is what works for you - great!

Jaxxas
January 08, 2017, 20:34
If I could only have one it would be the ACOG with the width of man's shoulders BDC. About as easy as it gets IMO.

rowjimmy
January 08, 2017, 22:25
I'm a simple man who doesnt want to learn and remember more than I must. That's not to say I'm a man incapable of learning. After 24 yrs absence I can probably still execute most reactor plant casualty drills for a 688-class submarine. But I am practical enough to realize that I have a lot of other stuff to handle in my day-to-day that gets in the way of practicing with mil dots, turret knobs, etc.

I have decided that I am better served by simple equipment. Aimpoints sighted for 200 yd, and duplex-reticule 2-7x hunting scopes for "long range" work (Pennsylvania long ranges) are my current preference for non-thinking man's optics. Out to 250 yd one has mason-jar precision. If 90% of engagements are within 100yd then the outliers of my scheme can be handled by memorizing hold-overs for 300yd and 400yd, then pasting those figures under my flip up lense covers for good measure.

For a flat-shooting cartridge like the 5.56 my opinion is that eye-chart reticules (especially with windage hash marks) are not necessary. Killed a LOT of woodchucks from 50-400yd without touching a turret, looking through a simple crosshair. Even with a 40XB 22-250 wearing a Unertl having micrometer rear mount I never clicked a knob. Too often I've hunted with guys who failed to return their knobs to target zero after applying clicks and missed a shot.

I must say I have been drawn to bullet drop range-finding reticules and tacticool target knobs but have fortunately come to a different conclusion before buying into sexy looking optics. It is my opinion that many shooter will be well served by either simple red dots (Aimpoints are my fave) or something similar to a Leupold 2-7 VXR Firedot dialed in for a 200 yd zero. Memorize drops beyond that and paste to your lens cap or buttstock.

Another topic I see often is people lamenting that their 1-4x scope is not a true 1x. Remember that the first red dot optics were occluded eye gunsights. Same as having the objective lens cap closed with the dot turned on with a Leupold 2-7 Firedot.

What you guys think of this approach? Not meaning to belittle other choices. And there are some who can wring the advantages out of mil-dot reticules and target knobs. But a man's gotta know his limitations. I dont think I gain any advantage from more complicated optics.

I shoot a fair amount of three gun with a Nikon 1x4 without a BDC reticle. Using a 50/200 yd zero, your drop at 300 yards is 8" or so, and at 400 is 24" or so (just hold at the head to hit com.) I have done this countless times at matches without adjusting windage/elevation knobs. YMMV

I don't even know if I answered your question, but I seem to remember it was a good one. BTW, the Nikon is a true 1x, my Bushnell 1x4 AR optic, not so much.

hueyville
January 09, 2017, 01:26
One of my favorite set ups is a Leupold 2x-7x Firedot with a Burris Fastfire in PEPR mount on mid grade 18" AR's. Can either dope the longer shots in my head or have ballistic apps in phone and tablet for the occasional complicated shot on a varmint at far end of a long field. My top grade AR's with 20" barrels usually get a Leupold 4x-12x with a Burris Fastfire in PEPR mount.

Had a chance to power purchase a pile of Vortex Strike Eagle 1x-6x scopes which more I use, the more I like. All go in solid one piece mount and tend to go on my mid grade 16" rifles. AR building got so cheap, optics are now my biggest challenge and have been forced to step outside my narrow Leupold or Burris mindset. 14.7" and under bids usually get a 1x red dot and currently using C Mores, Burris Fastfire III's, Burris XTS-135's (got a dozen dirt cheap and easy to cowitness with irons) along with a few others. Occasionally find Fastfire II's cheap lurking about.

Today my rifle of choice for duty was a 14.7" 6.8 spc II with Burris XTS-135 cowitnessed to Magpul MBUS sights. Since long drive through country, travelling slow due to icy roads and all pastures covered in 3" glaze of crusty snow took an 18" Wylde with Leupold 4x-12x in case any coyote were seen out in the countryside. Each rifle complete opposite ends of spectrum, one a fast action hard hitting fighting rifle with optic set for ~75 yards. 18" was a top line match barrel loaded with Tubbs 69 gr SMK match loads with 250 yard sight in point. A hammer for indoor medium targets and a laser for outdoor small targets.