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K. Funk
January 01, 2017, 22:07
Just when I thought I was over my bolt action mid-life crisis addiction of buying hunting guns I know I will never use, a Ruger M77R tang safety, dual marked .280/7mm Rem Express LNIB was dangled in front of me. I realized immediately that my addition was not cured and I succumbed. All I can say is that it is a beautiful rifle with a B&L Elite 4200 riding on top. I will try to get some pics up, but it's calling for ice/rain for the next couple of days. So, I'm trying to figure out the .270/.280 thing. Aren't they just about identical? No creature is going to know the difference between .277" and .284". Does one actually have a performance advantage over the other? They come from the same case. I'm hoping my addition is quelled for a while.

krf

Genetically Swiss
January 01, 2017, 22:14
.284 (7mm) has a much better choice of bullets for reloading.

GS

MAINER
January 02, 2017, 10:13
Not to worry, you got the right one. For some unknown reason, I would have grabbed that .280 Ruger just as fast as you, but couldn't care less about all the .270's I push aside in search of one. I am quite fond of a 30-06 also.
Kind of funny too, as I used to read Jack O'Connor's scriblings every month in Outdoor Life. :)

No less than Col. Towney Whelen thought the .280 to be just a bit better than the .270 or 30-06.

Congrats on the new fix to your addiction. :D:

yovinny
January 02, 2017, 12:31
No less than Col. Towney Whelen thought the .280 to be just a bit better than the .270 or 30-06.


WOW,,,Thats too funny...
I actually just reread that article while going through some old books over the holidays...From the late 50's IIRC...
K. If you want, I can make ya photo copy's...

HighRatMaster
January 02, 2017, 14:53
If you reload the .280 is an outstanding cartridge. Factory loads were held to lower pressures than the .270 for the Remington 740 semi-auto it was originally chambered for. The original factory loads were limited, one was even a round nose bullet but if you have a modern bolt gun there's no reason not to load to .270 pressures. The 280 will do a good job with bullets up to 175grs but I prefer 160gr for animals bigger than large deer because the combination of velocity and bc are optimum.

I have several 280s but my favorite is a custom Sako AV, I've taken over 100 big game animals with it including a caribou, 10 elk and an Alaska/Yukon moose of nearly 1500lbs.

As always, bullet placement is the most important detail in killing big game. An animal shot in the leg with a 375 H&H or a 280 Rem is just a wounded animal.

Oh, and I seem to remember Jack O'Connor admitted the 280 was a little better than the 270.:uhoh:

MAINER
January 02, 2017, 19:58
WOW,,,Thats too funny...
I actually just reread that article while going through some old books over the holidays...From the late 50's IIRC...
K. If you want, I can make ya photo copy's...

Ya mean I ain't got THE only copy of Guns & Ammo Oct. 1959? :uhoh:

Damn lying Bookseller! :redface:

Actually, I have a bunch ( 2 -16 gal. totes and a cardboard box worth) of 50's and 60's gun mags that my son picked up for me. Those old mags are a heck of a lot more interesting reading than today's crop that I don't buy.
Have a few huge old Shooting Times that measure 9 1/4 by 12 1/4" and contain articles scribbled by some dude named Charles A Skelton. :D

Looking for a home for a bunch of "Grey's Sporting Journals". Nice magazine, but they were too expensive for me back in the day.

HighRat;
I'm sure you know that Jack O liked to hunt sheep in Sonoma Az. I would not argue with anyone that thought the .270 Win was the ideal caliber for such game in that country.
I do remember him stating that he felt the .270 adequate for all game in the lower 48 in the right hands. Don't remember his thoughts on the .280, but have a couple of his books so could look it up after blowing the dust off of them. :D




The article is titled "A Better Hunting Rifle" and I have the magazine so no copy required. I do appreciate your offer howsomever.

SPEEDGUNNER
January 02, 2017, 20:05
Karl,

You aren't the only one guilty of falling for the siren's call of a pretty looking bolt gun. A while ago I was at my LGS picking up a gun I had shipped in and there sitting in his consignment rack was a tang safety Ruger 77 in .338 Win Mag. Rifle was as new, scoped, and had a threaded barrel with custom muzzle break. It called to me for some reason and now sits in the rack next to its .308 M77 siblings. Ammo is darn near $2 a round, but man is it fun to light one off every now and again. At least I don't have to worry about being undergunned for that African safari I will never go on!!

randy762ak
January 02, 2017, 22:37
Karl,

You aren't the only one guilty of falling for the siren's call of a pretty looking bolt gun. A while ago I was at my LGS picking up a gun I had shipped in and there sitting in his consignment rack was a tang safety Ruger 77 in .338 Win Mag. Rifle was as new, scoped, and had a threaded barrel with custom muzzle break. It called to me for some reason and now sits in the rack next to its .308 M77 siblings. Ammo is darn near $2 a round, but man is it fun to light one off every now and again. At least I don't have to worry about being undergunned for that African safari I will never go on!!


AHhh--Cast Boolits My friend ==cast is the way of the force !!





karl--So, I'm trying to figure out the .270/.280 thing. Aren't they just about identical? No creature is going to know the difference between .277" and .284". Does one actually have a performance advantage over the other? They come from the same case. I'm hoping my addition is quelled for a while.


Spot on Ol Chap==Nothing different at all --Enjoy!


In fact if you have a 25-06 =through = 3006 You will be served well as nothing in between can do any better than the one before it or after it --Its said That if you have a 6.5-06 you dont need any of the others !! I have a Tack driver 25-06 and a super classic 06,,, Id like a 6.5 -06 But hey--cant have em all !:bow:

my addiction is not quelled ==Even though My wife says thin the heard !:uhoh:

HighRatMaster
January 02, 2017, 23:44
270 = Winchester, 280 = Remington. It was a industry competition thing, the green boys wanted a piece of the yellow gravy train. It was never followed up properly, there is and always has been a plethora of .284 bullet types and weights out there, .277 not so much. It's better .277 wise now then ever but in the old days the only .277 around was the 270 Winchester plus a few oddballs.

Bwana John
January 05, 2017, 19:47
I'm sure you know that Jack O liked to hunt sheep in Sonoma Az.


Sonora, Mexico?


HiRat Master, aNY bighorn near Sonora Pass, California, or did the Mt lion get them all?

I think Tioga Pass still has a few, and farther south around Shepards and Baxter Pass they are doing OK.

My 7mm Mauser keeps the 280 bug away, but a Rem 700 Mt rifle in 280 would infect me bad!

HighRatMaster
January 05, 2017, 23:43
Sonoma, Mexico?

HiRat Master, any Bighorn around Sonoma Pass, California, or did the Mt lion get them all?
I think Tioga Pass still has a few, and farther south around Shepards and Baxter Pass they are doing OK

My 7mm Mauser keeps the 280 bug away, but a Rem 700 Mt rifle in 280 would infect me bad!

Sheep recovery areas are to the south of Sonora Pass, some maybe as far north as Yosemite.

Now you've pushed a button and triggered a rant, specifically wild sheep and their demise, or as .gov calls it "recovery".

California, Nevada and Oregon were home to various sub-species of wild sheep including desert, Sierra Nevada (formerly California), Nelsons etc. but populations were greatly reduced first by the huge influx of immigrants who needed a food source then still further reduced and kept low by the introduction of domestic sheep who carried devastating diseases and consumed the same food as the wild sheep. Then sheep hunting was put on a pedestal in the prewar era by noted and respected hunters like Bill Foster and Jack O'Connor who brought a lot of attention to the disappearing sheep herds and that led to conservation programs and most notably the Foundation for North American Wild Sheep, FNAWS or The Wild Sheep Foundation.

Things were looking up and herds were doing well until the current misguided "wild" horse and burro craze. First off, these ******* things are not wild, they are feral. The stock running the hills now are not descended from Chief Winnemucca and Red Clouds horses, they are unwanted nags dumped in the desert to run free when the owners figure out there's a lot of work and huge financial burden to keeping horses and donkeys. These nags and their decedents are very aggressive and completely dominate water holes and guzzlers built specifically for wild sheep (but also greatly benefit deer, elk, antelope and small game) and chase the sheep and other wild game away. You'd think these vermin were endangered natural species of some sort not invasive foreign parasitic feral livestock. By 2020 the .gov will have spent 1 billion (1,000,000,000) dollars of your money on feral horses and burros, over 75 million in just 2015 alone. To what end? To ensure the demise of wild sheep? This is a boondoggle even worse than introducing 180lb canadian grey wolves to replace the 80lb American prairie and timber wolves.

Anyway, the 280 makes an awesome sheep rifle. With over a dozen sheep hunts on my 280 she lost all her finish and the gel coat on the stock is worn through so that you can see the fiberglass strands. I hope to get one more dall hunt on her. :)

My brother and I with his B&C bighorn, Castle Reef, Sun River Montana 1993:

http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac214/kclark4895/009-3.jpg (http://s901.photobucket.com/user/kclark4895/media/009-3.jpg.html)

He used a M-70 featherweight 280 with 140gr Hornadys.

:beer:

MAINER
January 06, 2017, 10:46
Sonoma, Mexico?

HiRat Master, any Bighorn around Sonoma Pass, California, or did the Mt lion get them all?
I think Tioga Pass still has a few, and farther south around Shepards and Baxter Pass they are doing OK

My 7mm Mauser keeps the 280 bug away, but a Rem 700 Mt rifle in 280 would infect me bad!

I believe I should have said Sonoma Desert, would that make more sense?

Bwana John
January 06, 2017, 19:26
I believe I should have said Sonoma Desert, would that make more sense?
Sonoma is a Californian town and county, Indian for Valley of the Moon. Think wine.

Sonora is a Mexican State, and town and pass in California's Sierra Nevada.

The Sonoran Desert is in southern Arizona, and north-wesr Mexico.

Autocorrect changed Sonora to Sonoma in my first post:cry: