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View Full Version : Inaccuracy problem, any gunsmith available?


prpete
September 19, 2015, 21:52
I bought a new FAL from DSarms, an STG 58 a couple of years ago.The accuracy was okay, as l was able to zero the rifle after a few rounds.I always liked chrome lined barrels for their ease of cleaning, and rust/corrosion resistance, too, so when l found a new Argentine barrel to replace the factory American made barrel, it seemed like a good thing, so l got DSarms to do the swap.However, now, after the swap the rifle cannot be zeroed, as it is so inaccurate (a 7" spread at 25 yards).The spent rounds are very damaged, also.This all leads me to suspect that the headspace was not properly adjusted when DSarms installed the new Argy barrel.In any case, can any one help me?:facepalm:

yellowhand
September 19, 2015, 23:44
Gunplumber here on FF ARS on web drop Mark an email or PM

kotengu
September 20, 2015, 08:39
Most gunsmiths will not guarantee an accurate FAL - there are just too many variables (and worn parts!) involved!

However, 7" at 25yds sounds like something is majorly wrong, so hopefully a gunsmith can fix this. If it is just a bad barrel the only thing you can do is change the barrel.

What do you mean by "the spent rounds are very damaged"? Got any pics of this?

rowjimmy
September 20, 2015, 09:20
Was the Argy barrel cut or recrowned? A bad crown can cause serious accuracy issues.

I had an ar upper that shot around 16 moa. 8 inch groups at 50 yards.

W.E.G.
September 20, 2015, 09:41
A smoothbore would shoot better than 28 MOA at 25 yards.

I'm sure there is more to this story than reported.

gunplumber
September 20, 2015, 10:48
Yeah - Even a bent barrel will shoot consistently off. I've gotten nice groupings on the next target over with bent and non-concentric Argy barrels. This sounds to me like a significant constriction at the muzzle, or impacting the side of the muzzle device. Not a headspace issue.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 11:01
Most gunsmiths will not guarantee an accurate FAL - there are just too many variables (and worn parts!) involved!

However, 7" at 25yds sounds like something is majorly wrong, so hopefully a gunsmith can fix this. If it is just a bad barrel the only thing you can do is change the barrel.

What do you mean by "the spent rounds are very damaged"? Got any pics of this?

I was too disgusted to take pics of the empties.I will simply say that they were dented, many of them, and many had a significant gouge on the side of them, rendering them useless.All of the parts on the rifle are excellent, to like new.The Argy barrel was new, in the white.

gunplumber
September 20, 2015, 11:03
I have a strong suspicion that the "new" Argy barrels that SARCO was selling were rejects.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 11:05
Yeah - Even a bent barrel will shoot consistently off. I've gotten nice groupings on the next target over with bent and non-concentric Argy barrels. This sounds to me like a significant constriction at the muzzle, or impacting the side of the muzzle device. Not a headspace issue.

Do you think I can just send it back to DSarms to put the original factory barrel back on it?I still have it in my safe.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 11:09
I have a strong suspicion that the "new" Argy barrels that SARCO was selling were rejects.

Me, too.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 11:14
Was the Argy barrel cut or recrowned? A bad crown can cause serious accuracy issues.

I had an ar upper that shot around 16 moa. 8 inch groups at 50 yards.

From what l know, the barrel was new from the factory, in the white.At least that was how they were advertised by Sarco.DSarms attached a new short muzzle device on it

prpete
September 20, 2015, 11:23
Thank you.I will just send it back to DSarms to have them reinstall the factory barrel.:beer:

gunplumber
September 20, 2015, 11:28
I'd have reservations using any company that would put a new barrel a FAL and not testfire it.

W.E.G.
September 20, 2015, 13:19
The dented brass is a separate issue from the accuracy issue.

FAL's are well known to abuse brass during the ejection cycle.
Even ones that shoot accurately.
You can dick with the extractor and the ejector to change the ejection pattern.

yellowhand
September 20, 2015, 13:25
The dented brass is a separate issue from the accuracy issue.

FAL's are well known to abuse brass during the ejection cycle.
Even ones that shoot accurately.
You can dick with the extractor and the ejector to change the ejection pattern.

:biggrin:
Weidners 500 cases for 50 or so is our friend, for those of us that shoot fals!
As I sit here processing, trimming brass to length.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 15:51
I'd have reservations using any company that would put a new barrel a FAL and not testfire it.

Who can I send it to?

meltblown
September 20, 2015, 15:57
Gunplumber. Come on dude, he may cut you some slack since you're already in a little deep. How much did DSA charge BTW? I wouldn't let them screw on a barrel for a mod.

rowjimmy
September 20, 2015, 16:13
I'd have reservations using any company that would put a new barrel a FAL and not testfire it.

i think they told me once they only have a 25 yard testing range. (Which should have been sufficient to note this problem from what the OP said.)

Maybe they just function tested and didn't bother to look here the bullet impacted?

prpete
September 20, 2015, 16:14
Gunplumber. Come on dude, he may cut you some slack since you're already in a little deep. How much did DSA charge BTW? I wouldn't let them screw on a barrel for a mod.
Yeah, I was just looking into that idea (I was on his website).I thought I remembered seeing somewhere that he was a reputable, skilled gunsmith.I think it was $160 that DSarms charges.

meltblown
September 20, 2015, 17:00
Yeah, I was just looking into that idea (I was on his website).I thought I remembered seeing somewhere that he was a reputable, skilled gunsmith.I think it was $160 that DSarms charges.

He's decent,and he will make sure. Did you give them the barrel, or did they send it back? Why did you want an Argy barrel on the build anywho?

gunplumber
September 20, 2015, 17:02
Well, if the barrel moves, I charge the same as for a new build - $350, $35 ship.

And I'd need the whole gun, since I actually testfire them. And 25 yards is all I need to prove my work. Why would anyone want a longer distance?

prpete
September 20, 2015, 17:21
Well, if the barrel moves, I charge the same as for a new build - $350, $35 ship.

And I'd need the whole gun, since I actually testfire them. And 25 yards is all I need to prove my work. Why would anyone want a longer distance?

I sent you a PM at your business email address.I do not know if you got it yet. I will have to send you my CC info, too, as I haven't yet.I will send you the barrel, too, with the whole rifle.

meltblown
September 20, 2015, 17:24
Well, if the barrel moves, I charge the same as for a new build - $350, $35 ship.

And I'd need the whole gun, since I actually testfire them. And 25 yards is all I need to prove my work. Why would anyone want a longer distance?

Yeah, the detailing is worth it. I'd send the entire FAL for a few bucks more so Mark can check the lower etc. I'd just tell him send a certificate and not stamp the upper.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 17:33
Well, if the barrel moves, I charge the same as for a new build - $350, $35 ship.

And I'd need the whole gun, since I actually testfire them. And 25 yards is all I need to prove my work. Why would anyone want a longer distance?

The barrel has everything on it already (gas block, gas tube) except the sight post assembly.The rifle itself has all of that on it already.

prpete
September 20, 2015, 17:50
Yeah, the detailing is worth it. I'd send the entire FAL for a few bucks more so Mark can check the lower etc. I'd just tell him send a certificate and not stamp the upper.

Well, honestly, he is charging more than twice of what DSarms charges ($160).But, I will concede your point, that his quality of service will be far better.So, l will have to do the right thing, and send it to him.

yellowhand
September 20, 2015, 18:15
Well, honestly, he is charging more than twice of what DSarms charges ($160).But, I will concede your point, that his quality of service will be far better.So, l will have to do the right thing, and send it to him.

We all get what we pay for.
FAL's are never cheap to get, keep, own, and having one that does what it's supposed to do each and every time is worth a lot!:wink:
Mark has built four for me, so far, and each is about perfect.

meltblown
September 20, 2015, 18:29
Well, honestly, he is charging more than twice of what DSarms charges ($160).But, I will concede your point, that his quality of service will be far better.So, l will have to do the right thing, and send it to him.

Yeah, I forgot how happy you are having to deal with DSA. You buy parts from DSA sometimes. You don't buy guns from them most times. FALS are not cheap. It's not an AK or poodle shooter. Enjoy and learn for the next one

nearmisses
September 23, 2015, 14:07
A couple questions. Does the barrel have a muzzle device on it of any type? Do you have access to a hole gauge? Have you bothered to try and slug the Barrel? I have had barrels that were loose at the muzzle that wouldn't shoot worth a damn. What that means is, the diameter of the barrel was bigger in diameter than at the chamber or inconsistent throughout the length of the barrel. A hole gage will tell you a little but best solution is to slug the barrel. Look it up online or write and I will detail the method I used. Could be the barrel was bad from the get go like the others have stated above. Before I would send it to anyone I would slug the barrel and find out if that is the problem or as Gunplumber said it might be the muzzel devices or crown. Always slug any barrel you get before paying the cost and expense of doing it twice. I learned the hard way. We all do.