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adam762
July 28, 2015, 14:13
Not a drama thread. A sincere apology, as much of an explanation as I can muster, and an offer to make it right. HBR posted this in another now-closed thread.

"I got screwed by Adam762 and he has yet to acknowledge or correct it. I bought one of his F A L barrels and what I received was unusable junk. And he never actually sent the barrel. After a little over a month of waiting for it to arrive after having been paid for via debit card, he suddenly closes his shop and claims some sort of problem with his business partners. It was one of his partners that contacted me to get my shipping info and sent the barrel.
The barrel that I received had a gas block journal so small that a gas block would spin like a top. Additionally, the gas block shoulder was set back about the thickness of a nickel. The bore was not concentric with the outside of the barrel. Even if a gas block could be fitted, there is no way that the sights could ever be regulated.
So it turns out that Warbird is the second member of this board to screw me over a gun barrel. "

First, I just became aware of that thread. NWOBM sent me a message two weeks ago informing me of it, but I have logged in to the files maybe 4 times since March. I am just not here much anymore, and in fact stay away from the computer as much as is possible. It frustrates me and chews up loads of time, and I am busy. That being said I DO try my best to answer the telephone and list my number at every opportunity for folks to call.

I'll go backwards on this issue by starting out with offering recourse. HBR, WHATEVER I can do to make you feel like it has been made right, please let me know. (And by that I mean please CALL me and let me know...:tongue:) I was only vaguely aware that this was a problem, and frankly that awareness was two years ago and was at a rather turbulent time, and unfortunately was overshadowed by other things and forgotten.

The circumstances are unfortunate. In early 2013 I was developing BGS barrels at the Norvells. We had a batch that were complete from the breech to the flare for the gasblock journal if I recall. These were all CNC run and were validated. HBR and I worked a deal where I'd finish one out on a manual lathe and send it to him. Payment was made and I started work. That was May of 2013.

At the end of May I got locked out of the Norvells. HBRs project was unfinished and in fact I did not know of it's whereabouts, but I suspected it was in the office of an adjacent machine shop where we did a lot of our CNC stuff. Being as that I no longer had ANY influence over what happened there, I was unable to help members with projects. When I say I was locked out, I mean just that- I got an email telling me that the locks had been changed, and a week later I had to go to the building with a deputy to pick up what THEY had decided to set outside and allow me to have back. I had ZERO chance to take anything so I could not take customer projects with me.

The following months were a difficult time of simply trying to readjust to life with a family and a real bed to sleep in, and re establishing some kind of functioning shop. I largely shut out the world and just tried to recover. I was aware that HBR had issues with his barrel but given that I never really got to finish it, and wasn't responsible for it, I let it go for the Norvells to handle, since they finished it and shipped it to him. They collected the money that's for sure. And spent it. :mad:

I test everything new that I make. I don't deliver junk. Had I been in control of this project to it's completion this problem would not exist. As it stands HBR wants me to be accountable for it, and frankly, I am willing to do that. Regardless of what company I worked for at the time, I feel like he made the deal with ME, and even though someone ELSE shafted him, I'll stand up for myself. Believe me when I say I took a lot of 'lost parts' and incomplete service claims on the chin following the Norvell separation for this reason. I am just sorry that this issue wasn't something I addressed two years ago, but that has not been intentional, believe me. I don't get EVERYTHING right and am often overwhelmed, hence my turning into somewhat of a recluse and being hard to contact.

That whole Norvell implosion was a bad scene for everyone. It wasn't my fault. It wasn't any customers fault. The Norvells didn't care. But I do. The buck stops here. How can I fix this?

Drop me a line.
740-562-3070

Edited to correct the fact that I proof read everything but the title. :redface:

L Haney
July 28, 2015, 16:59
Sorry about the train wreck. You just 'stood up'. I have to admire that.

Invictus77
July 28, 2015, 17:31
Sorry about the train wreck. You just 'stood up'. I have to admire that.

^^^^ This.

Well done Adam

Aeroscout
July 28, 2015, 20:40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeroscout View Post
I have never delt with Adam762 on any business agreement, only over the phone concerning a "possible" future need.....having only one phone conversation with him I was nothing but impressed.

I find it difficult to believe that this individual bent you over.

That being said.....Adam762......what do you have to say about this?

Is HBR butthurt or does he have legitimate beef?

I find it difficult to believe Adam762 would not make things right if he was in the wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jugrunner View Post
you've been here 3 yrs ... never had any work done by him ... you have the nerve to question HBR ... ??? ... you send him your money ... see if you get what you paid for and see how looooong it takes for you to get your fukin ... !!!
__________________
... ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ ...

No jugrunner......its not so much that I question HBR (and yes if you haven't noticed by now......I do have the nerve.....to question anyone on anything at anytime) so much as I found it hard to believe Adam762 would put the screwing to anyone....particularly on this board.

My post was to the content of Adam762's character....not a disparagement of HBR....sorry if you were confused.

This post....is what I would have expected....and what I was talking about...3 years here or not.

adam762
July 30, 2015, 21:02
I'm not trying to have a pity party for myself and I'm not trying to make myself look like a saint either. I screw up more than I'd like no matter how hard I try to stay organized. This is a case where I can put myself in the other guy's shoes, and while I don't think it's my FAULT, per se, it's obvious the people who took the money don't care. I do. I just didn't realize it was still an issue.

You can't make everyone happy and some it's not worth trying. Don't know why jugrunner doesn't like me. Had one nice call with him two years ago while I was stuck in the middle of a 4 day engine change in the boonies with someone who swore they knew what they were doing. :rolleyes:

I probably have irritated people along the way. In fact I KNOW that my very limited use of the computer frustrates folks and causes problems. I'm sorry. This thing would consume my soul if it could. I use it for what needs to be done but really just CALL me. I put my number in every thread I post. If it's important call me a couple times till I answer- ask around, I usually do. Really.

Anyway, the offer to HBR will stand for as long as he feels he was wronged. I could not control the way THAT turned out but I can offer to make it right anyway. I THINK there was one other member who was upset but I don't know how his ordeal turned out either. DASHAUS I think... There were a lot of people that got caught in the middle at the end and lots that came up missing parts or services, which I made good even though the Norvells collected on it all. Its possible some folks didn't get things set right. I handled what I could but may have missed some.

Adam
740-562-3070

adam762
July 30, 2015, 21:10
To answer aeroscout - I imagine he has a legitimate complaint. He has always struck me as a knowledgeable person and I cannot imagine why he would invent something like he claims. Additionally I know very well what kind of clowns were left running the circus after I was locked out and I wouldn't put anything past them. His claim fits a much bigger picture of similar claims, it's just I put everything to bed two years ago. I thought.

Sure it'd be easy to ignore after two years but these things never really go away. This place has a LONG memory. George Gouger was meeting his final doom when I first joined. I swore to never ever wind up like him.

adam762
August 05, 2015, 08:38
HBR- I have a BGS conversion on one of the Gunthings barrels. I can send that your way. Or I can install it and refinish the barreled upper for you.

I don't know what you actually received back then because I never saw the 'finished' product. Maybe it's useable for a pistol project or something. I know the back half of the barrel is good.

Honestly, call me, and let me get this sorted. I thought it already was.




Folks, this can't be the only thing I'm managed to lose track of. If there's something I did wrong or if you've got beef, BRING IT TO ME. If I've made an error I'll fix it. And sometimes even if I didn't.

saigamantx
August 05, 2015, 09:18
^^^^ This.

Well done Adam

+1

oleblu72
August 05, 2015, 12:37
I've only dealt with Adam once I bought a short pistol barrel off him and the post office lost it. Adam took care of it he told me he could send me another barrel ( which he did ) or take a credit for some future work. So although I've only had one transaction with Adam it was a good one and I wouldn't be afraid to deal with him again. As a matter of fact I have a barrel that needs the BGS treatment done to it that I need to send him.

Mark

TOWS220
August 05, 2015, 18:39
Adam, you did a great job a few years back on a short gas inch build for me. Thanks for being honest here, with everything going on shit can happen, it is what you do to rectify mistakes that matters after the fact.

Hebrew Battle Rifle
August 17, 2015, 15:58
This is NOT a criticism. I have called 3 times and received the "box is full" message.

If we can trade barrels, I would consider that a worthwhile solution. A serviceable Austrian StG barrel for the one that I have. There isn't any need for you to provide a barrel that you have put work into.

adam762
August 24, 2015, 20:32
The voicemail is frustrating. Apparantly my Icloud is full, and I don't know how to access or empty it. I haven't messed with it in two and a half years I don't think. So the phone shows no voicemails (newer phone, had to replace it) but I can't get any either. No internet at home; use the phone as a wifi hotspot for what little I do. Choosing not to be 'plugged in' is causing me more headaches that being plugged in I think. I don't know. I'm about to get a landline with a tape recorder for an answering machine, straight outta 1987.

Thank you for the call today. Barrel is boxed up and labeled. Please remember, that while I processed your payment and started work on your barrel two and a half years ago, I did not collect any of that money, and was not responsible for what you were shipped. This is an outright loss for me, but I'd rather it be a loss for me than a loss for you the way it was.

I'm sorry for the whole thing.

SPEEDGUNNER
August 24, 2015, 21:42
What, or who, is "the Norvells"? This sounds like an interesting story in itself.

adam762
August 25, 2015, 19:55
What, or who, is "the Norvells"? This sounds like an interesting story in itself.



http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=353808

I may post a bunch of pics of the inside of that place here soon. So very few people really knew what it was like trying to get that running. Enough time has gone by and things are different enough now that I can go back and look at it without too much difficulty.

Hebrew Battle Rifle
August 27, 2015, 10:59
The voicemail is frustrating. Apparantly my Icloud is full, and I don't know how to access or empty it. I haven't messed with it in two and a half years I don't think. So the phone shows no voicemails (newer phone, had to replace it) but I can't get any either. No internet at home; use the phone as a wifi hotspot for what little I do. Choosing not to be 'plugged in' is causing me more headaches that being plugged in I think. I don't know. I'm about to get a landline with a tape recorder for an answering machine, straight outta 1987.

Thank you for the call today. Barrel is boxed up and labeled. Please remember, that while I processed your payment and started work on your barrel two and a half years ago, I did not collect any of that money, and was not responsible for what you were shipped. This is an outright loss for me, but I'd rather it be a loss for me than a loss for you the way it was.

I'm sorry for the whole thing.

Let us also remember that I had waited about 6 weeks for you to ship the original barrel and you had assured me on two separate occasions over the phone that you would ship it "today" but didn't. I paid $200 for the original barrel and the stripped barrel that you have promised to ship is worth much less than that. I was willing to let the matter be settled in full with the loss just to keep the peace. Perhaps you should consider doing that as well.

adam762
August 27, 2015, 19:08
Let us also remember that I had waited about 6 weeks for you to ship the original barrel and you had assured me on two separate occasions over the phone that you would ship it "today" but didn't. I paid $200 for the original barrel and the stripped barrel that you have promised to ship is worth much less than that. I was willing to let the matter be settled in full with the lose just to keep the peace. Perhaps you should consider doing that as well.

I was guilty of making promises I couldn't keep, that's true. At that stage so much was out of my control, I was desperately trying to keep things together. That attempt to regain some control is what got me tossed. The stripped barrel that I sent you is not what I offered you. I offered you a complete converted barrel, which is what you claim you paid for. You declined, and asked for an STG barrel instead. All I HAD was one stripped STG barrel. Do not act like what I am sending you is some attempt to victimize you a second time. I am bending over backwards to try to see to it that you do not get victimized at all. The barrel I offered you initially was almost double the value of what you claim to have lost.

Bottom line – I did not screw you. The Norvells did. You really should have taken your beef up with them, because truly thats who took advantage of you. My effort to make you happy was not out of a sense of obligation because I don't owe you a damn thing.

Keep both barrels. Now you won't be a victim at all and you won't have anything else to cry about. You say you were prepared to just take a loss and move on, but 2 1/2 years later, you have done anything but. There. You win. You get everything. However, I have a feeling you still won't be happy. If you don't have something to complain about, you just won't know what to do with your self. Now you aren't a victim, so what will you be?

I tried to help you. I tried to do more than what's right for you. I owed you nothing. Whatever. I'm done.

jugrunner
August 28, 2015, 07:01
you posted "somewhere" earlier, that I didn't like you .... ????

This post .... ^^^^^^^^^^ .... is the reason why .... always an excuse .... always someone else's fault .... you're always the victim .... you're always going out of your way to please .... poor little me .... !!!!! .... BUT .. Never my fault .... really .. ??????????

not long ago, you posted about buying a new airplane and taking a trip to Italy .... it's really hard for us "common" folks to feel sorry for you when you seem to be doing quite well for yourself .... ???? .... especially when you have peoples money and parts and the work NOT getting done ....

when I first joined here, you had been AWOL for months with peoples money and parts .... finally (once again) you showed up and attempted to make it right .... ????

How many times has it happened ..... ???? .... it's been an ongoing saga for yrs. ....

and it's NOT the fact that "I don't like you" .... I don't trust you .... !!!!

you have many skills Adam .... good business is NOT one of them .... you need someone to "ride herd" on your ass .... keep you in the shop and off the "broken promise" line ....

I actually do like you .... admire your skillz as a machinist .... you can do a lot of things I wish I could do .... all except one .... pass the blame .... !!!!!!!!!!

I've wished you luck in the past and continue to do so .... I would drop what I'm doing and come to help you, if called to do so .... anytime of the day or night .... broke down, stranded, crashed plane .. :wink: .. anything .... you name it ....

One thing I will not do .... send you parts to work on, OR money ....

Good Luck .... !


ETA: busting on HBR really makes you look bad .... >3

ftierson
August 28, 2015, 11:36
ETA: busting on HBR really makes you look bad .... >3

Yup...

Forrest

adam762
August 30, 2015, 07:13
Wow. That's amazing. I have posted about WORKING on a friends airplane, and I posted a rifle for sale to buy a TICKET to Italy. Your reading comprehension is about as good as your verbal skills. Maybe you should sell a rifle and take a remedial English class.

I take responsibility for everything I should and then some that I shouldn't. Anyone who had anything at the Norvells at the end of that disaster had a hard time. Much of my stuff was outright stolen. But you want that to be my fault? So it doesn't look good on me to get irritated, or want to defend myself? That, and the fact that I need to withdraw to handle business sometimes makes me human. I absolutely agree, I have not done well with this business at all. I've raised a kid by myself for the last 14 years and THAT has been where my focus was. You're full of criticism but you couldn't do what I do as a parent, mechanic, machinist, or anything else. I'm normally uninterested in your stupid comments about me but this crap about buying an airplane and going to Italy was too outrageous to skip.

Like any other builder, the majority of the projects people get back don't get posted when they get home. You have no idea what I'm getting done and there's plenty of evidence here in this forum that plenty gets done. I could do more but work will never come before family. Way it is.

You make me out to be some fat cat who rolls around in other people's money while deciding to work in between vacations and/or tragedies. Let me set you straight- I'm a 39 year old single parent with a 15 year old boy. I left a career in aviation to do THIS ten years ago and have struggled my ass off since. I have no health insurance, no retirement, and don't own my home. I have two FALs, since I sold that third one to go visit my BROTHER. My newest car is from 2004, and the next newest is from 1987. That's my wood hauler.

I have always done the best I can by people (including you with that STG barrel you bought two years ago) and have always wished I had the resources to do better. Most people understand but there are some who just can't.

Some folks just like to attack people in the public eye. Maybe it makes them feel good. The world is full of a$$holes. The fact that a few people don't like me while most are very happy with my work leads me to believe that it's probably not me so much.

I'm not perfect but I'm damn good. There may be drama here sometimes but I never take advantage of anyone and NO ONE has ever gotten screwed.

Honestly Dale, other than being a mediocre muse, what do you really bring to the community here?

Jus' sayin'. Right Forrest? ;)

Bought an airplane to fly to Italy..... Wow

Flypaper
August 30, 2015, 09:13
Adam,
I commend you on your efforts... Being a single parent and trying to run a business is a tough one.
When I was 39, my drug-induced ex-wife left me for a meth dealer. I kept my bed, my pension and my clothes.... And my daughter. The rest fell in the hands of bankruptcy. It was a tough road but I got through it.
Now 11 years later, she is a he and I am back on my feet.

It sounds to me like you are trying to make things right. I haven't heard about the issues until recently with this post.

I sure as heck wouldn't be butt hurt over a barrel deal two years ago.... But then again I'm not one to hold a grudge.... Life is too short for that.

The future is right around the corner. :cheers:

ftierson
August 30, 2015, 12:58
Jus' sayin'. Right Forrest? ;)



My comment was about what I quoted...

Just sayin'...

Forrest

Hebrew Battle Rifle
August 30, 2015, 18:18
I sure as heck wouldn't be butt hurt over a barrel deal two years ago....

Let us test that statement. You send me $200 and I will repeatedly promise to send you whatever, but not keep those promises. I will eventually send you something unusable. In two years we will revisit the deal and see if you are "butt hurt."

Flypaper
August 30, 2015, 19:02
Let us test that statement. You send me $200 and I will repeatedly promise to send you whatever, but not keep those promises. I will eventually send you something unusable. In two years we will revisit the deal and see if you are "butt hurt."

HBR
After I wrote my original statement I hesitated if I should edit it or not. I try not to because that is generally what I am thinking of the time..... Although I don't always think things through.... So I shouldn't have spoken. I didn't mean to offend you or tell you how to feel. I obviously wouldn't give you $200 in the first place knowing it would be tied up for two years, which I'm sure you never would have if you had known.
I have been led on before over a sum larger than that, and was cheated out of it.....I found it easier to let it go.
All I can say now is, after two years, you are down the road as far as you can go. Maybe it will be easier for you to.

Hebrew Battle Rifle
August 30, 2015, 22:38
HBR
After I wrote my original statement I hesitated if I should edit it or not. I try not to because that is generally what I am thinking of the time..... Although I don't always think things through.... So I shouldn't have spoken. I didn't mean to offend you or tell you how to feel. I obviously wouldn't give you $200 in the first place knowing it would be tied up for two years, which I'm sure you never would have if you had known.
I have been led on before over a sum larger than that, and was cheated out of it.....I found it easier to let it go.
All I can say now is, after two years, you are down the road as far as you can go. Maybe it will be easier for you to.

Cool!

I went to the shop this evening and found the barrel from Adam762 as promised. I have packaged the original barrel for return and it will ship this week as my employment duties allow.

I consider the matter settled honorably.

jugrunner
August 31, 2015, 13:36
What a joke u r Adam .... :facepalm: .... those that swing from your nut sack haven't been here long enough to know .... so sorry for them !

trash me all you want .... means nothing .... your reputation will follow you the rest of your life ....

maybe you'll grow up one day and stop blaming others for your shortcomings ....

Clyde the Pointer
August 31, 2015, 14:07
All my dealings with Adam have worked out well. Always got what I paid for, many times a little more. He has a decent work ethic and a lot of responsibility to look after with regard to his personal life.

The work that he creates is second to none I have seen, and I've been around a few FAL's and smiths during my interest in the hobby, and my tenure on the files.

I am glad that HBR and Adam got together to straighten things out. And I am sorry for the many good people who have abandoned the files because of the various pissing contests, and poor typing choices that have occurred, publicly, over the years.

fireplug
August 31, 2015, 17:59
Wow,I was burned here by a long time high post count member who sent me a stg kit that he said was was in excellent shape,upon receiving the kit the barrel was a sewer pipe,and when I complained on this site everyone called me a liar,or posted prove it type garbage saying maybe I switched the barrel or E.T.C.
Needless to say there are a LOT of crook's on this site including long time member's.I however never had a problem at all with Adam.