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Tgeorgi2002
February 02, 2015, 16:40
So, my friend and I were out yesterday shooting on a mutual friends farm. He asked if he could use my G20 to try some hard cast ammo he had left over in his bag. Fired one round, fine. Second round, this happened.... Blew out the magazine and broke it. Cracked the trigger. Frame is cracked in half, held together by internals.

http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8491_zps387becb2.jpg
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8490_zps2833ee77.jpg
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8495_zps26a3233a.jpg
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8494_zpsaf946f7d.jpg

W.E.G.
February 02, 2015, 18:00
Other peoples' reloads. :?

Hope you and your friend are both physically OK.

Tgeorgi2002
February 02, 2015, 18:04
Other peoples' reloads. :?

Hope you and your friend are both physically OK.

He's fine, though the seat of his pants looked heavier afterwards. I suspect that the loose ammo he used might have been his handloads. I don't mess with that stuff. I have an email in to Glock to see if there is to be any warranty help, but I suspect he may be on the hook for replacing my pistol.

SPEEDGUNNER
February 02, 2015, 18:11
That had to hurt!! Your thread title is a misnomer...the G20 didn't blow up, your buddy's crappy ammo blew up your Glock! It's a shame.

Tgeorgi2002
February 02, 2015, 18:15
That had to hurt!! Your thread title is a misnomer...the G21 didn't blow up, your buddy's crappy ammo blew up your Glock! It's a shame.

Yeah, one led to the other. He said his hand was numb for a while, and he a powder burn in the shape of the crack in the frame. You hope it never happens, which is why I don't mess with unknown ammo.

SAFN49
February 02, 2015, 18:19
From Glocks FAQ page

Can I use lead bullets?
No, we recommend the use of jacketed ammunition only.

I have never shot lead boolits out of any of my Glocks. I have heard that they can increase the pressure due to the polygonal rifling. So if you have some that are max in a normal bbl, they may have excess pressure is a polygonal rifled bbl.

Tgeorgi2002
February 02, 2015, 18:24
From Glocks FAQ page

Can I use lead bullets?
No, we recommend the use of jacketed ammunition only.

I have never shot lead boolits out of any of my Glocks. I have heard that they can increase the pressure due to the polygonal rifling. So if you have some that are max in a normal bbl, they may have excess pressure is a polygonal rifled bbl.

I have heard of people using hard cast in factory Glock barrels, but after seeing that happen, I wouldn't try it. I like my hands.

0302
February 02, 2015, 19:19
blew the primer out, dammnnn...

VALMET
February 02, 2015, 19:38
From Glocks FAQ page

Can I use lead bullets?
No, we recommend the use of jacketed ammunition only.

I have never shot lead boolits out of any of my Glocks. I have heard that they can increase the pressure due to the polygonal rifling. So if you have some that are max in a normal bbl, they may have excess pressure is a polygonal rifled bbl.

Yes- def stay away from cast bullets in your Glock barrels although I find it difficult to believe that the leading would've led to that catastrophe on the 2nd round. If your friends handloads were anything like the original 10mm Norma loads that is likely the culprit. Glad all is ok.

Wecsogery
February 02, 2015, 21:53
The case blew in the unsupported area. You might ask your friend how many times the brass had been reloaded. If more that a couple of times, that could be at least part of the problem.

wanneroo
February 02, 2015, 22:12
"Hey man can I try out my new reloads in your pistol?"

No.

Almost undoubtedly this is a reman or reload. Reloading in one sense is easy, as long as you do your math, pay attention to what you are loading, double check your math and do quality control. Unfortunately talking to others and seeing their results, a lot of people play fast and loose with reloading and pay the price. I saw one guy last year with rusty steel cases he had reloaded. He was like "ah man they shoot just fine". Mmmkay. Let me stand back about 20 feet here.

spider991
February 02, 2015, 22:30
10mm is not really the round you want to accidentally double charge...the g20 can handle a steady diet of full power 10mm loads easily but the 10 is stout out of the gate without an oopsie on the reloader...glad you guys got your didgets safe!:facepalm: knew a guy that blew a cylinder on a 357 from a nice ole batch of gun show reloads.....if it's not MY reloads, it don't go in my gun..probably a general rule for most reloaders

notfrommt
February 02, 2015, 22:38
Holy shit that was a hot load!

For that to be the Glock smile after multiple firings, the case would have had to be lined up the same way to the feed ramp twice. Not likely. Probably double load with the wrong powder.

Throw the rest of those loads in the fire.

Glad you guys are ok. Scary stuff, that.

Tgeorgi2002
February 02, 2015, 22:45
10mm is not really the round you want to accidentally double charge...the g20 can handle a steady diet of full power 10mm loads easily but the 10 is stout out of the gate without an oopsie on the reloader...glad you guys got your didgets safe!:facepalm: knew a guy that blew a cylinder on a 357 from a nice ole batch of gun show reloads.....if it's not MY reloads, it don't go in my gun..probably a general rule for most reloaders



True. I don't reload, and I'm damn sure not testing out someone else's potential mistake. However, as long as one is prepared to replace the gun, they're welcome to use mine. I would say he got off cheap this time. Very lucky.

hagar
February 03, 2015, 11:02
For some reason, Glocks and lead bullets are a recipe for disaster. Don't mix them.:facepalm:

spider991
February 03, 2015, 12:04
For some reason, Glocks and lead bullets are a recipe for disaster. Don't mix them.:facepalm:

I imagine it had a lot to do with what was stuffed under the bullet..the whole lead bullet is somewhat of a misguided liability statement made by glock as they are not the only ones who use polygonal rifling (HK, CZ and magnum research)...lots of folks buy the wolf barrels to shoot lead. I know of guys who shoot tons of lead (g22 to be specific) and they just make sure to clean the barrel after each session. Many say hard cast bullets will be OK with good cleaning afterwards, please avoid softer lead bulllets..I have shot hard cast though my g21 a few times and make sure to clean any leading left over, although not a big problem with hardcast...common sense rules the day as usual...if I shot a ton of lead bullets in my glock, would I buy a wolf barrel? Probably. If sig keeps screwing the pooch and doesn't bring a10mm, I will get the g20 and for sure get a wolf barrel for the big leads going through that one.:tinfoilhat:

4x401
February 03, 2015, 13:20
'Tis but a scratch.. :D Read what happened to my G-21..

http://thegunzone.com/glock/bullseye-v-21.html

hagar
February 03, 2015, 14:11
My personal theory is that lead does not grip the Glock barrels well, and then they try and slide down the barrel without rotating. That can lead to dangerous pressures real quick, and it only has to happen once.:eek:

hagar
February 03, 2015, 14:13
'Tis but a scratch.. :D Read what happened to my G-21..

http://thegunzone.com/glock/bullseye-v-21.html

There are old reloaders, bold reloaders and reloaders using progressive presses.

There are no old bold reloaders or old reloaders using progressive presses..:skull:

4x401
February 03, 2015, 14:34
There are old reloaders, bold reloaders and reloaders using progressive presses.

There are no old bold reloaders or old reloaders using progressive presses..:skull:

Meh.
I've used a 550B for practically all my reloading the last 20 years. :p

hagar
February 03, 2015, 14:53
Meh.
I've used a 550B for practically all my reloading the last 20 years. :p

I just personally don't trust them. I like to check my loads visually after I pour the powder. Also been reloading since 1977, and I have made a few mistakes, but none that ever made it to being fired, except maybe a few cases where they were not sized correctly, and fit in one rifle, but not another.

Last kaboom I had was with factory loads, I noticed my handloads were not chambering totally, tried a factory load and it blew the bolt of my AR up. Only thing I could think what happened is that I got a blade of grass, piece of brass or something in the chamber, just enough so it did not lock up securely.

Right Side Up
February 03, 2015, 15:28
Sorry to see this happen but glad no one was hurt too bad.

Out of curiosity, how well does the barrel support the case? Do you have a pic of that?

Tgeorgi2002
February 03, 2015, 17:41
Sorry to see this happen but glad no one was hurt too bad.

Out of curiosity, how well does the barrel support the case? Do you have a pic of that?


I believe that the second picture highlights the barrel's complicity in this event.

http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8497_zpsfcadb8c6.jpg
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j425/tgeorgi2002/DSC_8501_zps1ceca42f.jpg

Topbanana
February 03, 2015, 17:51
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/pistol%20pics/Glock/glockkaboomwhathappen.jpg

Right Side Up
February 03, 2015, 18:00
The barrel could support the chamber better in my opinion, especially for a high pressure round like 10mm.

W.E.G.
February 03, 2015, 18:20
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/pistol%20pics/Glock/glockkaboomwhathappen.jpg


Uh-hunNNNnnnuh... what happen?!!!!

SAFN49
February 03, 2015, 18:53
OP pick up a frame off Gun Broker.

Tgeorgi2002
February 03, 2015, 18:58
OP pick up a frame off Gun Broker.

I have to get some other items, so i'll probably get one from Glockmeister.

richbug
February 03, 2015, 20:06
I know of guys who shoot tons of lead (g22 to be specific) and they just make sure to clean the barrel after each session. Many say hard cast bullets will be OK with good cleaning afterwards, please avoid softer lead bulllets..


Tis not about hard or soft, but making them big enough. An under sized lead bullet will allow gas past, this is what causes the bulk of leading in a Glock.



That said, the 10mm is an unforgiving mistress. I have shot an obscene amount of handgun ammo. Virtually all my reloads, much of it cast. The only gun I ever blew up was a 10mm S&W. I did it twice... A pair of grips and my pride was all that was hurt both times. 2 different starting loads, right out of the book. At the time I blamed it on the brass, but I don't really know.

Tgeorgi2002
February 03, 2015, 20:16
I use Underwood Ammo factory loads, which are pretty hot loads. Never had an issue before this. When I replace it, I'll go with a Storm lake barrel which will have full case support, and a better track record with hard cast.

d762nato
February 05, 2015, 07:03
Yep probably some bad/thin brass in the blowout area. Look around 10mmfirearms website and you'll see the same. Good luck and glad to hear you didn't get injured.

K.O.A.M.
February 05, 2015, 10:52
I switch my Glocks over to fully supported barrels-either Wilsons or Bar-Sto's. Other folks have been really happy with KKM's.

Rather than buying a new frame from Glockmeister, you can exchange it with Glock for $107 shipped. Details are on the website under service.

d762nato
February 05, 2015, 18:44
I have heard a lot of good on the KKM's also. That's the way I'll probably go eventually with my 29.

Broncowilly
February 05, 2015, 20:20
The case support on the 22, 23 and 35 is worse.

Cast bullets in a polygonal rifled barrel is a huge no-no. The lead transfer even with hard cast bullets is bad. I've shot lots of reloads out of my 22 but probably less than a magazine full of cast bullets. The result was a grip of time cleaning lead out of the barrel. I had better performance even with plated bullets but jacketed is the only way to go. Replacement aftermarket barrels work quite well with cast bullets.

That said, as others have stated, you buddy's crappy reloads blew your Glock up. I'm so happy no one was hurt. Lesson learned I hope ;)

notfrommt
February 05, 2015, 20:33
Kind of disagree with a lot of hand wringing over hard cast bullet use in Glocks. Buffalo Bore has been offering a hard cast option for a long time. See link https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=59. In this case, there was not enough rounds fired to cause a bore/bullet interface issue.

This is not a casing problem either. The image clearly shows a blown primer with a sidewall rupture. No gas leakage on the head. Excess chamber pressure blew the primer out, caused the case failure, and ultimately destroyed the frame.

Broncowilly
February 06, 2015, 02:03
Kind of disagree with a lot of hand wringing over hard cast bullet use in Glocks. Buffalo Bore has been offering a hard cast option for a long time. See link https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=59. In this case, there was not enough rounds fired to cause a bore/bullet interface issue.

This is not a casing problem either. The image clearly shows a blown primer with a sidewall rupture. No gas leakage on the head. Excess chamber pressure blew the primer out, caused the case failure, and ultimately destroyed the frame.

I don't buy that article 100%. "Hard cast" bullets are lead, tin and antimony to make a harder than lead swaged bullet. Don't think for one minute that hard cast bullets don't/wont lead fowl a polygonal barrel because they will. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.

Once again, this is not nor was it the problem with this Glock model 20. Crappy over pressured reloads were.

johndoe
February 06, 2015, 14:57
That was not from cast bullets but you shouldn't shoot cast bullets through a factory glock barrels. Quick fix, lone wolf frame. or sell all the parts to off set the price of a new one, I maybe interested in it if you go that rout.

Wecsogery
February 07, 2015, 12:12
I switch my Glocks over to fully supported barrels-either Wilsons or Bar-Sto's. Other folks have been really happy with KKM's.

Rather than buying a new frame from Glockmeister, you can exchange it with Glock for $107 shipped. Details are on the website under service.

Where do you see that? I searched Glock's website and couldn't find anything like that.

Tgeorgi2002
February 07, 2015, 13:49
Where do you see that? I searched Glock's website and couldn't find anything like that.

It I under the warranty form. It doesn't specifically mention the price, but if you call them, they will tell you. I spoke to someone at Glock, an they said they would replace my frame for $107, an would be a 2-4 week turn around.