The commander in chief?

[longhair51]

This is someone that I would want to serve under....NOT

September 22, 2010
Associated Press

WASHINGTON -- President Obama's top advisers spent much of the past 20 months arguing about policy and turf, according to a new book, with some top members of his national security team doubting the president's strategy in Afghanistan will work.

Read the rest, it ain't pertty.

article (http://www.military.com/news/article/book-aides-doubt-obama-afghan-strategy.html?col=1186032320397)

[martin35]

Proof that politics are more important than the well being of the country, recently a member asked what lies has Obama told?
There are some profile defining remarks made by this article.
I am reminded Woodruf interviewed CIA directer Casey while he was in a coma days before he died.

[longhair51]

Precisely! To hell with the country and our troops, I can't lose the democrats.

[V guy]

I am supporting General Stanley McCrystal for Vice President in 2012.

[martin35]

I am supporting General Stanley McCrystal for Vice President in 2012
And who for President?

[torquemada055]

The first two issues I look at in a political whore is their stance on abortion and gun control, if they favor either they are a "progressive" and not the correct choice.

That's a purely pragmatic view as each baby murdered in the womb is a future taxpayer who doesnt get to contribute to society and you just never know what they may have accomplished for the greater good.

You all know why anti gun is a hot issue.:whiskey:

[juanni]

Afghanistan was lost before we attacked it.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.



.................juanni

[D P Six]

Afghanistan was lost before we attacked it.

Bet the Russians are laughing their asses off every time the words US and Afganistan come up in the same sentence.

[Beckman]

At the very least, Obama does not seem committed to victory in Afghanistan. This, despite his campaign rhetoric regarding the strategic importance of Afghanistan, and how Bush had focused on the "wrong war" in Iraq, not the "right war" in Afghanistan.

Perhaps one of the most cutting indictments of Obama is the claim that his "right war" slogans actually were empty campaign talk, reflecting nothing ther than Obama's desire to sound tough, by supporting one war (Afghanistan), while still criticizing "Bush's war" in Iraq. From a campaign strategy perspective, if Obama had NOT claimed to support the "right war," and instead opposed both wars, then he may have appeared weak on national defence and antiterrorism.

At one point, Obama even stated that the US should simply go into Pakistan and get bin Laden.

Unfortunately, after the election, Obama had to walk the walk. It's always easy to talk about how to win a war. Even if Obama did half-heartedly believe that Afghanistan was the "right war" he obviously learned that winning a war isn't always so simple.

[longhair51]

Originally posted by juanni
Afghanistan was lost before we attacked it.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
.................juanni
That's old news comming from you, and doesn't have any real bearing on the discussion. It was about the cluster fu(k that is called decision making at the White House.

martin35 wrote: There are some profile defining remarks made by this article.

I agree!

As to being sorry at being the bearer of bad news, no you're not. You were smiling, clear to the last period of the sentence. You are getting to be a legend.....in your own mind.

[TheJokker]

afghanistan initially was a great victory. the low footprint plan to wait like a cat for a mouse hiding in a cave was working as well. liberal anti-war types and an obama victory gave new hope to our enemies. a mismanaged defeat was not the only possible conclusion but the blame can be shared by democrats and kooks like juanni.

[Skilter]

I have come to the belief that Obama wants the US to fail at all things that would allow the US to maintain it's superpower status.

[juanni]

Originally posted by TheJokker
afghanistan initially was a great victory. the low footprint plan to wait like a cat for a mouse hiding in a cave was working as well. liberal anti-war types and an obama victory gave new hope to our enemies. a mismanaged defeat was not the only possible conclusion but the blame can be shared by democrats and kooks like juanni.

Right....... Bush had them right were we wanted them... after 7 years. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Booting out a Turd World Military, Govt and destroying their infrastructure is easy, rooting them out of the hills, caves, jungles and getting them to submit to the foriegn invaders no so.

No OBL, No Mullah Omar, No nothing but lost US lives and piles of US debt.
You call that "victory". :(



..............juanni

[juanni]

Originally posted by longhair51

That's old news comming from you, and doesn't have any real bearing on the discussion. It was about the cluster fu(k that is called decision making at the White House.


This is the bearing......
I have been consistant in stating that we won't "win" anything in Afghanistan or Iraq from the start and that eventually we would be giving up, broke and be pulling out.

Now that you are seeing that, you start looking for a scapegoat.
:rolleyes:

You see, it really doesn't matter what Obama does or doesn't do.
Latest article on the subject.
why the war was lost from the start (http://www.infowars.com/why-america-cannot-win-in-afghanistan/)


................juanni

[the gman]

Originally posted by TheJokker
afghanistan initially was a great victory. the low footprint plan to wait like a cat for a mouse hiding in a cave was working as well. liberal anti-war types and an obama victory gave new hope to our enemies. a mismanaged defeat was not the only possible conclusion but the blame can be shared by democrats and kooks like juanni.

Bollocks. Afghanistan was lost by micro managing every aspect of the conduct of the campaign by tools in DC more concerned about political point scoring than anything else & commanders far removed from the battlefield who were inexperienced in COIN operations.

Tora Bora is a classic example of meddling from higher command & the politicians of the REPUBLICAN party. To add insult to injury, the Bush morons then turn to Iraq BEFORE they even wrap up Afghanistan so don't try to sell it as a great victory for it never was but could have been if Bush hadn't gone out of his way to please his buddies in the oil industry.

I am no Democrat or lover of Obama but Afghanistan failed under the leadership of Bush. Obama couldn't organize his way out of a wet paper bag & is it any wonder? Only 8% yes, 8% :rolleyes: of his staffers have ever been involved in private companies. The other 92% are all from academia, non profits or the media & heaven knows, not many of them are known for working well.......:eek:

Obama gets a big "FAIL" for every issue his loser administration has touched not just Afghanistan.

McCrystal is no brilliant mind either; his comments, however accurate, were disloyal, ill advised, contrary to good military discipline & unbecoming an officer of his rank & experience. All of which disqualifies him for any form of office in my book. His JOB was to prosecute the war not to pass judgment on his Commander in Chief. His responsibility was to his men & if he couldn't stomach what he saw or the tying of his hands then he had the option to resign his commission & make his comments then. Allowing his staff to speak openly to a Rolling Stone (a massively liberal rag if ever there was one) in disrespectful terms about the CIC & his staff was a massive failure in judgment & certainly not the kind of guy I want to see in power.

Romney/Palin or Palin/?? someone who can change things in DC is the match up I'd like to see. YMMV.

[101ABN327]

Originally posted by juanni
Afghanistan was lost before we attacked it.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.



.................juanni

Have another toke, Juanita...:rolleyes: You and Harry Reid agree on this as well. I'm sure the military is hanging on your every word.

[juanni]

Originally posted by 101ABN327


Have another toke, Juanita...:rolleyes: You and Harry Reid agree on this as well. I'm sure the military is hanging on your every word.

No the military is doing their talking to the Taliban and every Afghani opposed to foreign invaders, with every year, every stalled objective every US casuality, every US $ billion spent, every new story about our puppet's corruption they are getting the message. :uhoh:

You will only figure it out when we have packed up and left.
Heck, maybe not even then. :tongue:



...............juanni

[longhair51]

Originally posted by juanni
This is the bearing......
I have been consistent in stating that we won't "win" anything in Afghanistan or Iraq from the start and that eventually we would be giving up, broke and be pulling out.
That may be your bearing, however that was not what I was referencing when I started the thread.

I was not very happy when we started the war in Iraq, before accomplishing the task in Afghanistan(if that is indeed possible). What I think about this however, is not germane to the thread. Kinda like your post...

[bykerhd]

The mistake we made in Afghanistan was staying beyond the initial victory over the Taliban. We should have gone in more like Attila the Hun and destroyed absolutely anything and everything that we didn't like the look of. And, then left with a warning that we would return at the first hint of anything we might deem unpleasant and destroy MUCH more. If it suited us.
Forget all this "Nation Building", "Winning Hearts and Minds" and Uncle Sam the "nice guy" crap. It hasn't worked anyway and we are more hated, less feared and probably weaker for all our efforts, lives and money spent than we were before we ousted the Taliban. Imagine how much respect our friends and enemies will have for us when we lose in Afghanistan.

[308bolt]

In theory we went to Afghanistan to capture ole slimey bin laden and destroy the Al Queda training camps.
The Taliban refused to cooperate with our efforts so we went after them too.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe we've been their eight years now.

I have no idea why.

Does anyone else?

[jeffrey]

Originally posted by bykerhd
The mistake we made in Afghanistan was staying beyond the initial victory over the Taliban. We should have gone in more like Attila the Hun and destroyed absolutely anything and everything that we didn't like the look of. And, then left with a warning that we would return at the first hint of anything we might deem unpleasant and destroy MUCH more. If it suited us.
Forget all this "Nation Building", "Winning Hearts and Minds" and Uncle Sam the "nice guy" crap. It hasn't worked anyway and we are more hated, less feared and probably weaker for all our efforts, lives and money spent than we were before we ousted the Taliban. Imagine how much respect our friends and enemies will have for us when we lose in Afghanistan.

You are 100% correct.

[cpd109]

Originally posted by torquemada055
The first two issues I look at in a political whore is their stance on abortion and gun control, if they favor either they are a "progressive" and not the correct choice.
:whiskey:

Pretty cut & dried way to look at it and I can't fault it. Funny thing about it is that the dimmicraps are the ones who usually favor abortion, wiping out the crop of new dimmicraps before their time.

[StarPD]

Several flights of B-52s dropping entire sticks of fuel-air bombs over most of Afghanistan would have solved the problem with no loss of American life. Too bad OHHHH Bama (and Bush too) has never heard of them.

[JasonB]

Originally posted by TheJokker
afghanistan initially was a great victory. the low footprint plan to wait like a cat for a mouse hiding in a cave was working as well. liberal anti-war types and an obama victory gave new hope to our enemies. a mismanaged defeat was not the only possible conclusion but the blame can be shared by democrats and kooks like juanni.


Never heard that one. Please indicate the date on which hostilities ceased in that theatre.

[101ABN327]

Originally posted by juanni


No the military is doing their talking to the Taliban and every Afghani opposed to foreign invaders, with every year, every stalled objective every US casuality, every US $ billion spent, every new story about our puppet's corruption they are getting the message. :uhoh:

You will only figure it out when we have packed up and left.
Heck, maybe not even then. :tongue:



...............juanni

Well, cotton pony, as least I speak from first hand knowledge. You speak through bong water...

[JasonB]

Originally posted by cpd109


Pretty cut & dried way to look at it and I can't fault it. Funny thing about it is that the dimmicraps are the ones who usually favor abortion, wiping out the crop of new dimmicraps before their time.


I missed the over throw of Roe vs. Wade during the Glory Years (01/01 to 11/06.) Apparently it got reinstalled sometime after that, but exactly when was it stopped for a Glorious time?

[JasonB]

Originally posted by bykerhd
The mistake we made in Afghanistan was staying beyond the initial victory over the Taliban. We should have gone in more like Attila the Hun and destroyed absolutely anything and everything that we didn't like the look of. And, then left with a warning that we would return at the first hint of anything we might deem unpleasant and destroy MUCH more. If it suited us.
Forget all this "Nation Building", "Winning Hearts and Minds" and Uncle Sam the "nice guy" crap. It hasn't worked anyway and we are more hated, less feared and probably weaker for all our efforts, lives and money spent than we were before we ousted the Taliban. Imagine how much respect our friends and enemies will have for us when we lose in Afghanistan.

How about we maybe shouldn't have been funding them during the 1980's?

[Stoney]

I thought it was commander in grief

[juanni]

Originally posted by 101ABN327


Well, cotton pony, as least I speak from first hand knowledge.

Oh? You are handling the conditions for our withdrawl I take it. ;)



...............juanni

[bykerhd]

from JasonBHow about we maybe shouldn't have been funding them during the 1980's?
How about if Klinton had been doing his job and taken care of Bin Laden back in the 90s when he had several opportunities ?
Then The Afghans could have been left to themselves to wreak their holy havoc on each other and grow their damn poppies with 99.9% of the world not giving a crap what they were doing.