New to files, new to FAL

[ojohnsten]

bought this piece of iron the other day.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd253/ojohnsten/falfront.jpg
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd253/ojohnsten/falside.jpg
Century R1A1 Sporter receiver. Lower unknown. Realize not the best reviewed but the price was right.

Wondering about a 5 round mag for this inch pattern gun. Metric ones are abundant. Will they not work at all, can they be modified?

Any help appreciated. Thanx

[Ron Walker]

You have a Type III upper receiver which rules out DSA. Most likely a CIA or IMBEL. The mounted hardware looks to be DSA, though. You are right that the lower is Inch pattern. The barrel is metric, however. Some Inch Cut receivers do just fine with metric mags, others do not. The only way to tell is to try them. Congratulations, you have a fine Custom Rifle, or as others on the board call them, a FrankenFal. Welcome to the Files and to FALing. Warning..It can be addictive. Ron

[ojohnsten]

Ron,

I have seen the black part on the top of this receiver called a dust cover I think. It also mounts the scope. Is that right or is it the receiver top? It is defiantly marked DSA SA58. Looks to have ten screws holding it on. It is above the channels that the bolt and carrier ride in.

The rail system is stamped DSA. Of all the on line manuals I have found I have not seen a gas plug like this one. It has a bent piece of steel around it with the A stamped on it rather than on the plug itself. Pressing the pin is really simple, not requiring a bullet tip or anything.

FrankenFAL huh? So this is a puzzle made up of what ever fits together?

What the heck for $550 I'll shoot the heck out of it till the feds come to take it away.

[brownknees]

You seem to have a DSA dust cover/rail mount. Thats a seperate piece from the "upper" (a reciever on a FAL) The reciever may, or may not be Imbel, or Century, kind of hard to tell from the pics.
I guess you could say the reciever is the "middle bit" between the dust cover & lower.
The gas plug is called an Stg type. They were fitted to the StG598 rifles to make them easier to remove than the button on other types.
If you post the markings on the reciever we can probably tell you what exactly it is.

[Ron Walker]

You got a very good deal. The DSA Hardware is worth about $150 or so, and the receiver $300-500 depending on make.If that is a an STG58 barrel in good shape, you have one of the best. Enjoy. Ron

[nwobhm]

Originally posted by Ron Walker
You have a Type III upper receiver which rules out DSA.

Ron, DSA did make type III's.

[ojohnsten]

OK I am confused
after looking around at the CIA site, the what I called lower receiver is just the receiver I guess. The part with the mag well is marked Century Arms Inc, R1A1 Sporter 308 caliber Made in USA Serial no beginning with NC0

The lower then, I am guessing is the trigger housing and part attached to stock?

only markings on it are a number beginning with AD. The fire selector side has three positions but will only select S or R. Selector won't swing around to the A, front tab hits receiver body and stops it.

The hold open device does not have the pin that rides in the magazine so the bolt does not stay open after last shot.

How do I ID the barrel? Are there markings under the rails?

Am I still to assume it is inch pattern?

Thanks for all your guy's patience and help.

Orin

[brownknees]

Ok, don't get mad, I'm trying to help out here with some very, very basic stuff.
If you break the rifle open then the lower hinged part with the buttstock, & trigger "gubbins" in it is the "lower" in FALspeak.
The part where the bolt & carrier runs is the reciever.
The bolted on thing on top of this is the dust cover (also known as the scope mount if there is a rail attached).
Now the magazine goes into the reciever, so the type of reciever determines wether you need an inch, or metric magazine.
The "lower" determines the type of trigger mechanism, PG butt & so on.
Metric complete uppers (recievers) will fit & work fine with inch(complete) lowers, but the sub assemblies making up these 2 main setions are only partly interchangable.
If you have original sheet metal topcovers then there is a difference in inch & metric parts...but just to confuse you utterly the bolt on covers will fit either.

I think you have all metric parts.
Look up inside the mag well at the front part. Is the cutout for the magazine tab a big rectangle, or a small "D" shape? The bog rectangle means inch, the "D" means metric. (don't look at the mag itself, these are swapped & mean almost nothing)
The gas block & front sight are metric (no big 'oles in the ears).
Looking at the lower it seems to be metric as well.
Take a look at the way the pistol grip is attached to the "lower". Is there a stud dropping down & a nut inside the PG or is there a thin strip of wood at the front of the PG?

[ojohnsten]

Brownknees

No way am I mad, I thank you for the help. I bought this thing not really knowing ANYTHING about them. My friend is moving and is trying to raise some cash so he is unloading a bunch of stuff, including most of his weaponry. The hard case he bought this in still had the mark of $945 written on the end of it so I thought the $550 price tag was too good to pass up.

The notch, inside front, of mag well is a big rectangle and as for the pistol grip there is a piece of steel that comes from the trigger guard runs down the front of the pg ends with a screw. No bolt through the handle with a nut.

So I take it the receiver is inch according to the rectangular recess. And with the strip down the front of the PG I assume then that the lower is inch as well, if I read your post right. right?

Is there a way for sure to tell if the 4 mags I have are inch or metric. One looks quite a bit older than the others. no markings I can find, but they all look the same otherwise. If I have metric mags that are working then that will hopefully mean that one of these five round metric DSA mags will work also.

Thanks again for your help and patience with a newbee to the FAL world.

[brownknees]

It definately sounds that way to me.
BUT, just to confuse the issue the front sight & it's protective "ears" are metric:confused:

I'd guess it was built on some (mostly) inch, and some metric parts.
The height of the front (metric) sight needs to match the corresponding height of the rear sight, if you ever want to use iron sights though. Does the rear sight blade fold down, or is it fixed? (Mostly inch fold, metric are fixed.)

As for your mags that's easy to tell, but as you've discovered, not a good indication of the rifle type.

Inch have a welded-on rectangular metal "tab" at the front. It's designed to match with the cutout in the magwell.

Metric have a triangular "tit" made by punching a bit of the sheet metal out from inside the magazine body.

Some metric mags will, purely by coincidence, fit & function in an inch reciever, but not all. That was why I was saying not to use the mags to check for the reciever as you may have some of each.

The 5-round metric is a crap shoot BTW:uhoh: maybe, maybe not. You could easily flatten, or grind off the existing tit & make a new lug & weld it on if you could figure out the exact allignment.

[Ron Walker]

Ron, DSA did make type III's

Thanks. I thought I remembered that, but that was a while back, and I figured the odds were very slim that he had one. His description in the latter post confirms a CIA. Ron

[ojohnsten]

Thank you to all you guys. Like I said, I got into the FAL with absolutely no idea.

Thanx again.