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Xrayist
February 27, 2009, 23:06
I am confused about something..well more somethings than I care to admit, but one of them hopefully can be unconfused on this forum.
I have seen ads on Gunbroker and GunsAmerica for AWO shotguns, apparently new manufacture that only require the $5 tax stamp. There have been many Mossbergs and a few 870's. I am assuming that they were all built on a newly mnaufactured receiver, "virgin receiver" if you will.
Now comes the confusion. If I go to Auto Ordnance and want to buy one of the SBR Thompsons, it is listed as needing a $200 transfer tax. What I don't get is that if a shotgun is apparenly built on a virgin receiver and has a 12" or so barrel than it is an AOW. If they build the semi-auto Thompson on a virgin receiver, than it is a SBR with the higher tax stamp cost.
I can't imagine that it is because one is a rifle and the other is a shotgun..wait..U.S. government rules and regulations...maybe I can after all!


Remember, an elephant is a cow built following government rules and regs!:D

USMC 0341
February 27, 2009, 23:41
The Treasury department, in their infinite wisdom (ie: they need a monocle in their navel to see where they're going) decided that Machine guns, Destructive devices, Silencers, Short Barrel Rifles/Shotguns require a $200 transfer tax while AOW's only need a $5 transfer tax.

You want a reason? How about "just because"?

Deltaten
February 28, 2009, 08:42
Hmmm.. I believe it's a one-time making tax on AOWs.. then on it's a $5 transfer. I also believe that a SBS and SBR are AOWs, since they are not classed with machine gunz or DDs.
I could be wrong or simply assuming improperly that SBRs are classed with SBSs ; but why? Not semi-SBRs at least.

IF the PTBs start clamping down via AWB etc.. I'll simply whack all the bbls down on my gear and register with the feds. A $200 making tax is cheaper in the long run than all the hoopsand eventual confiscation. ;)

USMC 0341
February 28, 2009, 10:24
Originally posted by Deltaten

I could be wrong or simply assuming improperly that SBRs are classed with SBSs

Yes, you would be wrong.

You can look up the law on the NFA. You will find that there are 6 classifications :

1) Machine Guns (multiple shots per pull of the trigger)
2) Destructive Devices (firearms which are not shotguns and have a bore over 0.5")
3) Silencers (designed to muffle a firearm's report)
4) Short Barrel Rifles (barrel under 16" or OAL under 26")
5) Short Barrel Shotguns (barrel under 18" or OAL under 26")
6) Any Other Weapon (originally to cover stuff like pen guns, cane guns, and firearms outside both the other NFA and non-NFA firearm classifications)

An AOW "shotgun" cannot have a buttstock (I am positive on that). In fact, an AOW receiver can never have been affixed to a buttstock - this is why most people make them from "virgin" receivers.

Deltaten
February 28, 2009, 14:06
Thanks for sorting me out on that. It's only the short, no butt-stock shotty that is AOW.

Got it :D

rocko
March 02, 2009, 11:52
Originally posted by USMC 0341
The Treasury department, in their infinite wisdom (ie: they need a monocle in their navel to see where they're going) decided that Machine guns, Destructive devices, Silencers, Short Barrel Rifles/Shotguns require a $200 transfer tax while AOW's only need a $5 transfer tax.

You want a reason? How about "just because"?

Actually, IIRC, it was originally written such that any pistol was going to be classified as an AOW, but that was struck out of the bill. The $200 tax in 1934 was clearly to, in effect, make them unobtainable without making them illegal (at that time, they still at least paid cursory attention to the commerce clause). I guess they thought that pistols shouldn't be completely unattainable, hence the lower transfer tax. Pistols was removed from the AOW classification, but the low transfer tax remained.

MACV
March 02, 2009, 17:55
Short barreled shotguns require a $5 transfer fee or stamp. Unless they've changed the law in the past year.

USMC 0341
March 02, 2009, 19:08
That was most probably a shotgun with a short barrel which was registered as an Any Other Weapon.

Here is an excerpt from the law as it is written :
(link : http://www.keepandbeararms.com/laws/nfa34.htm)


Title 26, United States Code

INTERNAL REVENUE CODE

CHAPTER 53 -- MACHINE GUNS, DESTRUCTIVE DEVICES, AND CERTAIN OTHER

Part II -- Tax on Transferring Firearms

5811. Transfer tax

(a) Rate. -- There shall be levied, collected, and paid on firearms transferred a tax at the rate of $200 for each firearm transferred, except, the transfer tax on any firearm classified as any other weapon under section 5845(e) shall be at the rate of $5 for each such firearm transferred.

ds762
March 02, 2009, 20:51
Originally posted by MACV
Short barreled shotguns require a $5 transfer fee or stamp. Unless they've changed the law in the past year.

SBS's have ALWAYS required a $200 tax to transfer or mfg.

ds762
March 02, 2009, 20:53
Originally posted by Deltaten
Thanks for sorting me out on that. It's only the short, no butt-stock shotty that is AOW.

Got it :D

it can also be a rifled design that is not a handgun or a rifle or designed to be fired from the shoulder
ie: AR15 pistol with VFG, Glock with VFG.

then there is the oddball AOW like the Marble's Game Getter that is allowed to have a buttstock.

MACV
March 06, 2009, 14:42
Originally posted by Deltaten
Thanks for sorting me out on that. It's only the short, no butt-stock shotty that is AOW.

Got it :D

Yeah my dealer straightend me out. AOW can never have a buttstock and they cost less because of that. You can do whatever you want with a SBS. AOW tax stamp is $5, SBS $200. My dealer has AOW's for $450 and SBS shotguns start at $550. 5 weeks wait on a C&R and another 3 months for the stamp.

Deltaten
March 06, 2009, 23:01
Yep! Sounds sorta backwards; but that's the rulz. :wtf?:

Chop a bbl and it;s a $200 stamp every time.
Produce a concealable, no-buttstock weapon with the same bbl length and it's a $5.00 transfer once the FET (?) is paid.

.gov logic at its finest !!

ds762
March 06, 2009, 23:15
Originally posted by Deltaten
Yep! Sounds sorta backwards; but that's the rulz. :wtf?:

Chop a bbl and it;s a $200 stamp every time.
Produce a concealable, no-buttstock weapon with the same bbl length and it's a $5.00 transfer once the FET (?) is paid.

.gov logic at its finest !!

its a $200 tax to manufacture anything (short of a MG)
its a $200 tax to transfer everything but an AOW .. they are $5.

think about it .. in 1934 how many guns really fell into the AOW catagory? prolly very few.