NATO ammo: Cruffler's take

[Viking Warrior]

http://www.cruffler.com/trivia-June01.html

check this out. It might explain why the M1A has lots of problems. :eek:

[ August 10, 2001: Message edited by: EMDII ]

[garand1944]

What "lots of problems" due you refer to. There is nothing new and revealing in that post. Every rifleman knows when you switch ammo there is a requirement of rezeroing your weapon. Even the same brand ammo of the same lot can act differently. Hence the need to know how to do more with your rifle than shoot off a benchrest half a day to zero it.

[Viking Warrior]

On the Gun and Knife M1A forum there seems to be a lot of extraction feedramp problems with the Loaded Stainless version, It seems that that rifle was made for new .308 winchester ammo and doesnt feed the Nato 7.62x51 stuff very well. Not to offend any M1A owners, I have 2 of 'em.
Just thought it was interesting info, Agreed? :D

[EMDII]

Lessee, the standard carbon chamber M1A will feed, fire, and extract just fine. They have SAMMI-spec chambers.

The Stainless variant has SAMMI-spec chambers, but has a problem? The 'NEW" Winchester ammo is built to SAMMI specs. So, sounds to me like the problem is a typical metallurgical one.

Stainless is subject to galling and drag. Ask any SS Colt .45 ACP owner (especially the original AMT). We continue to repeat history, because we fail to learn from it. SS chambers will have a bit more drag. A SS everything is an invitation to disaster. It takes VERY careful engineering, and can be done. But I wonder just how much torture testign SA did on this beast.

I am illiterate about the M1A, especially the loaded SS variant. I've shot plenty if M-14 rifles, and a few 'old' carbon-based M1A rifles. NEVER had a problem. Something is rotten in Denmark. I claim no expertise on the system, however.

As to the ammunition being the problem: I seriously doubt it.

BTW- What is an extraction feedramp problem? There are failures to feed, failures to extract, but those two states are on opposite ends of the operating cycle. If G&K is discussing such a problem, perhaps a concise link would help?

Like Garand 1944 sez- takes more to be a marksman than laying down and shooting the beast. You have to live w/ it, whether it's a M14, FAL, AK, or M16. Failure to practice, thereby discovering and eliminating problems, is NOT the gun's fault.

FWIW: 7.62x51 is essentially identical in external appearance and dimensions to .308. The principal difference lays in the headspace allowances. NATO chambers are allowed to exceed SAMMI specs for NO-GO.

SLIGHTLY.

[garand1944]

Agreed. I guess I don't have the problems of the stainless "elite". I must be lucky. Every firearm I own is capable of feeding any ammo put thru it and extracting properly. I sometimes wonder what some of these malfunctions attributed to rifle/ammo types is really caused by. From what I have seen a lot of problems are due to shitty cleaning practice and the need to fine tune a weapon by doing things with Dremel tools, files, etc. when the person doing the work knows not how a firearm functions.