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View Full Version : AK Woodland Paint-scheme [UPDATED - With Pics Finally!]


Kyrottimus
July 11, 2007, 15:52
I havn't implimented this yet, but this is how I plan on doing it in woodland (priming included):

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_paint_progression.jpg


Here is the Animated step-by-step (Priming included):

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_woodland_Paint_scheme_H.gif


And Final Product:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/FinishedPaintScheme.jpg


What do you guys think? :?

gunplumber
July 11, 2007, 17:34
i think you need to reduce the black by 75%.

use it only in little "Y" fingers to demarcate the juncture of the other two colors.

I also don't care for the splot tan, but consider doing the splot in black than offsetting the same splot in the tan, therby leaving a shadow under the tan.

The green you are using is more of a sage color. typical of arid deserts - I'd recommend either going with a darker forest green or losing the black entirely and calling it arid desert camo.

works well to do the base coat in green

then the tan in diagnals going one way 15%


than the brown along the same angle as the tan, on either side of the tan. 35%

then the green again but going opposite direction from the tan and brown (and I prefer Y fingers over stripess over // stripes total of 35% coverage, much will just be darkening your base

then the black in little fingers 9final 15%)

35 green
35 brown
15 tan
15 blk


http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/finish/m3cwak.jpg


http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/smith/rifle/smithrifle02.jpg

Kyrottimus
July 11, 2007, 19:15
Thanks for your infinately insightful input gunplumber; again your advice has been extremely helpful!

:whiskey:


I'll make up another of my mock-ups using your instructions (I have a template for my rifle) and probably repost later. Thanks again!


-Kyro

[Edit - the green looks OD to me, but then again this is a crummy monitor; I'm going to do a color diagnostic and try again]

[Edit again - also, the only reason I did black as the base coat on top of the primer is the can of black I have has little bits of "texture" medium in it; I think ground up walnut shells. Would make it good at least for the handguard and pistol grip, would also keep glare down]

Kyrottimus
July 11, 2007, 20:42
Ok, here goes my next attempt using Gunplumber's reccomendations:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_paint_progression_2.jpg


The process:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_woodland_Paint_scheme2_H.gif



The End result (without the animated .gif dithering):

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/FinishedPaintScheme_2.jpg


Better?

Azrial
July 11, 2007, 21:37
Interestingly meticulous planning Kyrottimus.

I look forward to seeing the final product.

Kyrottimus
July 11, 2007, 21:40
Originally posted by Azrial
Interestingly meticulous planning Kyrottimus.

I look forward to seeing the final product.

Ounce of prevention... you know the rest :]


I'm probably going to hit this when I have the spare time this weekend; if the weather cooperates.

I'll definately post the finished results when I get there.


:beer:

gunplumber
July 12, 2007, 10:12
its a matter of opinion when it comes to color, but I think it looks a lot better. Really would fine as is, but you know me, I always want to refine something to the nth degree.

While I think the color is great and the ratio of colors is great, my personal opinion is that the tan and brown look too regular in their diagnal lines. I think they need to be a little less of a repeating diagnal

If you change the angle of a few diagnals 15 degrees offset from each other and make a few interrupted and maybe one or two into chevrons or Y shapes???

I'd also keep the black where it is but shrink it by 50%. Remember there will be odds and ends not painted on the rifle that will have the black (or dark gray ) color as well.

While some people like to coat their guns assembled so the pattern runs from end to end, I like to do major parts seperately in the same style so the the pattern does not look too regular - it also makes it alot easier to paint.

On the big parts, like the barreled action, stock, handguards, I try to keep the places where they will connect transition to each other, Kindof like some of the artsy tile. Even though the pattern is irregular, when you connect them together, the pattern crosses over from one to the next. but aside from those major componants, I do all the small parts seperately just trying to keep the ration of color the same on them.

but like dog food, most camo is designed to appeal to the consumer (the dog don't care what color or shape his chow is).

Now how do I do those animated gifs. That is the coolest thing and perfect for demoing my camos.

editied to add - the reason I do the tan first over the green base is I think the army desert tan is a little too light for many applications. The slight misting from the brown overspray on the tan mutes it a bit.

mnhornet
July 12, 2007, 11:27
Nice work, I just completed a dura coat finish on the front and lower of my Fal. Once I get the receiver and test fire I'll finish that and some mags.

Kyrottimus
July 12, 2007, 13:34
Originally posted by gunplumber
its a matter of opinion when it comes to color, but I think it looks a lot better. Really would fine as is, but you know me, I always want to refine something to the nth degree.

While I think the color is great and the ratio of colors is great, my personal opinion is that the tan and brown look too regular in their diagnal lines. I think they need to be a little less of a repeating diagnal

If you change the angle of a few diagnals 15 degrees offset from each other and make a few interrupted and maybe one or two into chevrons or Y shapes???

While I think the color is great and the ratio of colors is great, my personal opinion is that the tan and brown look too regular in their diagnal lines. I think they need to be a little less of a repeating diagnal

I'd also keep the black where it is but shrink it by 50%. Remember there will be odds and ends not painted on the rifle that will have the black (or dark gray ) color as well.

While some people like to coat their guns assembled so the pattern runs from end to end, I like to do major parts seperately in the same style so the the pattern does not look to regular.

but like dog food, most camo is designed to appeal to the consumer (the dog don't care what color or shape his chow is).

Now how do I do those animated gifs. That is the coolest thing and perfect for demoing my camos.


Thanks again for the input; you're a pro and it would be foolish for a noobie camo-painter like me to ignore your advice.

While I used to paint WWII model airplanes a lot when I was in my adolescence, most were two-tone camo patterns on Spitfires, Typhoons, non-accurate Mustangs (3-tone 109-Gs at most).

As for the .gif's, here is what I use:

http://www.gamani.com/gmgdown.htm

It is a TRIAL version; send me a PM...

It's pretty straightforward. You make your individual .jpgs or .gifs (I usually just number them in their own folder), then import them into the program.

It automatically sticks them in an animation timing window, and then you select the milisecond offset of each frame. Green arrow is universal timing delay, and you can go frame by frame to make it pause longer or shorter on any given frame.


The program also lets you set color accuracy, compression rates and actual image size. All you need to get animated gifs working.


I'll rework my design based on your advice and come back again. Thanks

:whiskey:

Kyrottimus
July 12, 2007, 14:09
Next Try:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_paint_progression_3.jpg

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/AK_woodland_Paint_scheme3.gif

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/FinishedPaintScheme_3.jpg


Yeah and I plan on taking the guts out of the rifle when I paint it (BCA, FCG, and Selector Switch; I'll paint the switch seperately).

Getting there? 3rd time is a charm? I'm sure I still have some tweaking to do.

:beer:

[BTW, I could give two craps about what any consumer wants; I want this thing to be effective in blending in a woodland environment. It's my beater so I figured it'll be good practice to get the patten right]

gunplumber
July 12, 2007, 14:30
yes, except . . .

I was unclear on the black. The width of the previous "y" shapes was good, the length of them I think was too long. On this one you made them thinner but the same length. I'm thinking 1-1/2 to 2" circle covering them on the real ak, adjusted for scale on your model.

the black isn't so much a color by itself, but to make the other colors appear to have depth and shadow.

http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/webpictures/m3cwfal05.jpg

Kyrottimus
July 12, 2007, 14:42
Originally posted by gunplumber
yes, except . . .

I was unclear on the black. The width of the previous "y" shapes was good, the length of them I think was too long. On this one you made them thinner but the same length. I'm thinking 1-1/2 to 2" circle covering them on the real ak, adjusted for scale on your model.

the black isn't so much a color by itself, but to make the other colors appear to have depth and shadow.

http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/webpictures/m3cwfal05.jpg


Understood now. Lima Charlie - In the pipe, 5 by 5.

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/FinishedPaintScheme_4.jpg

...something like that?

gunplumber
July 12, 2007, 14:46
well, I said before, its highly subjective, but I think you've got it perfect.

One other tip I can give you, and maybe you can work into your model.

Do the pattern on a rectangle shape that will cover the rifle. Then cut out the rifle stencil and lay it over your rifle. That way the camo doeen't get "crowded" to fit your image.

Right now, for example, all of the black is kindof centered on the rifle componants.

If you do the pattern without regard for the rifle, then lay the rifle over it, I think it will look better.

Kyrottimus
July 12, 2007, 14:49
Originally posted by gunplumber
well, I said before, its highly subjective, but I think you've got it perfect.

I know, but I'm of the opinion people who have gone through an extensive learning process with wisdom on the subject have the best place to start. Though, more often then not I wind up going through that learning process myself. In this case I knew there was a wealth of knowledge on this board about this topic, so I'm glad I posted this thread.


Thanks again for all your help! I'll do this up as my first rifle and drag it around my back yard (woods) and see how she blends in. I may adapt different colors or patterns depending on it, but I'm using your input as a baseline.

I doubt I'll be changing much, it looks like it'll break up the outline nicely.


Thanks again! :beer:

Kyrottimus
July 16, 2007, 03:15
Update:

Finished it yesterday and today. Turned out quite well if I do say so myself.

I would post pics but my sister, off from a recent visit here, had swiped my digital camera and took it home with her.


So I'm looking for a new camera. For the time being, no pictures :(

Randall
July 19, 2007, 19:24
So, for those of you who've done this, How does the paint hold up to cleaning solvents? I'd be concerned about running any kind of copper cleaner down the barrel for fear of messing up the paint job. Or, are my concerns without merit?
Thanks in advance.
Randy

gunplumber
July 19, 2007, 19:51
depends on what kind of paint.

I use thermally cured moly which is pretty much impervious to solvents.

Krylon is good paint for some things - I do some of my paintball gear with it - but it does dissolve with oil and stuff.

Kyrottimus
July 21, 2007, 01:34
I didn't use Krylon, I used Rust-o-leum "Camo" Drab colors. Designed for metals and auto and what not...

I doubt this paint will hold up to solvents, but hey, it's an AK. It's my beater AK. I don't plan on cleaning it that rigorously.

I used Dupli-Color High Heat (1200 degrees F) matte black enamel poly-ceramic paint (ya bake it in the oven) on my others. It holds up perfectly to both lube/inhibitors and hoppes.

I don't own an air-brush or sprayer so I just use the disposable cans. So far so good with the high-heat.

daschnoz
July 27, 2007, 09:14
Good looking plans. I understand that there is a science to camouflage, but I think that any camouflage would be better than none at all. Has anyone ever seen the History Channel things on the "Dazzle Camouflage"?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage

Now that's a fkd up idea that seemed worked, although just how well, no one exactly knows.

Beauty being in the eye of the beer holder, :beer: personally, I think a UBR should be just that -- ugly and black -- but that's me.

gunplumber
July 27, 2007, 10:23
in the WWII submarine boof "Clear the Bridge" they had their sub conning tower painted with black and white camo. The captain swore by it, claiming it disrupted the shape

I notice even modern subs have the periscope painted in black and white.

Camoflage has several forms.

BLENDING so the color matches the surrounding are - like a chameleon.

DISRUPTING the outline of the item - like a jaquar or leapards spots

disguising - making one object look like something else (walking stick)

the camo I did on my go-cart is of the blending pattern. eventually, i will use the same colors in a disrupting pattern.

Kyrottimus
August 01, 2007, 01:17
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/Camo_AK1.jpg

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i127/Kyrottimus/Firearms/Camo_AK2.jpg


Just got a new Sanyo S600 6.0 Megapixel camera. Pretty nifty; both pics are without flash and using just all auto adjustments.


The 2nd one is obviously in a brighter spot than the 1st one.


Either way, I think it's not bad for my first time, and also considering I used el-cheapo Spray-paint cans of Rust-O-Leum "CAMO" colors you see everywhere.

Dirt1042
August 01, 2007, 09:11
As soon as I get my AKs finished and running, they are headed your way for a paint job! :bow:


Good job

:beer:

Azrial
August 01, 2007, 14:07
Nice job!

Kyrottimus
August 01, 2007, 14:27
Thanks guys.


I had to use 2 shades of green because the first color I used was too light, so I blended some of the darker forest green into it in certain areas.


I tried to follow my layout as best as I could, but the Black and Brown nozzles were crappy, difficult to push the nozzles down correctly (they had to be pushed down hard, then forward), and they spattered paint and did not have the nice cone-of-spray as the other colors. So basically I improvised the black and brown patterns as best I could.


It would have been a lot easier with an airbrush, but I think it turned out well enough.


Also, I like this paint since it is truly matte, and it also does not react to oils and lubricants (other than soaking them up). It holds up pretty well.


http://images.orgill.com/200x200/1933225.jpg
Here is the paint I used in the colors of "Army Green", "Forest Green", "Khaki", "Earth Brown", and "Matte Black".

I used a regular can of grey Rustoleum primer as a basecoat after thoroughly wiping down all areas to be painted in Naphthalene and letting it evaporate (while outside since that stuff is nasty).



We'll see about how it handles solvents after I shoot it and have to clean it.

IronSkegge
August 09, 2007, 16:55
I will be painting a few rifles camo as well.

I already have the rifle parked, with a gunkote finish over it. Do you think I need to put a layer of primer down before applying the camo paint?

fastprofessor
August 09, 2007, 20:54
Nice Job!

Kyrottimus
August 10, 2007, 02:18
Originally posted by IronSkegge
I will be painting a few rifles camo as well.

I already have the rifle parked, with a gunkote finish over it. Do you think I need to put a layer of primer down before applying the camo paint?

I had mine Dupli-Color high-heat coated.

I used primer anyway; probably just to ensure the bond between the Dupli-color and the end result is more "complete".