NEW Member Wants To Build A FAL

[TheFabulousFink]

Hi, I am new here. Some fellows over at thehighroad.org said that this was the place to go if I was interested in FN FALs.

So here is my situation, I love projects that I can build myself and I reall like the FAL rifle so I thought building one would be a fun challenge. I have no gunsmithing experience and this would be my first build of any kind (not counting blackpowder guns). I have been doing some digging and it looks to be fairly straight forward to put together a FAL from a reciever and parts kit.

That being said, I have some questions: Is this too much for a beginer to take on? Is mating the barrel and receiver difficult, should I have a gunsmith do it? What counts as US compliance parts?

I found this walkthrough online but it is rather dated, are there any other good guides for building a FAL?
http://www.cruffler.com/trivia-April01-background.html

Thanks for your help and I plan to spend a lot of time on this board in the next couple months.

-TheFabulousFink

[bykerhd]

There are a few compilations of answers to questions and experiences accumulated over the years to be found here.
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=58777
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=19

But, the short answer is that the FAL is not really all that difficult to assemble with proper tools. It can also be done with makeshift or more primitive tools, but generally you are better off with better tools and you will likely have an easier time of it.

[TheFabulousFink]

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction. As I said, I am new here and it is taking me a little while to find my way around.

I am looking at picking up one of the parts kits that they have for sale at Akron Armory here in the next week (once I get paid and settle some bills)

Also, what do I have to do to make a FAL that can feed both 7.62 and .308? From what I can tell, If I keep the headspace tight enough I shouldn't have a problem is this true?

[bykerhd]

Happy to get you started. The Imbel parts kits that Akron Armory and the other vendors have are usually in pretty decent shape. Built for a border war that apparently didn't happen and then carried a lot and shot not very much, mostly. A good basis for a decent FAL, but you should plan on refinishing the whole thing as your new receiver won't match the rest. Nor, would you want it to as most of these have a lot of finish worn off.

The Austrian STG kits which still turn up, mostly in the Marketplace Forum, generally sell for more money, but were made to closer tolerances for fit & finish, used mostly for training and maneuvers and are usually found closer to a condition that could be assembled and used without refinishing. Often are. The Austrian STGs were considered very high quality.

The German G-1 kits were originally built to about the same standard as the STGs. The difference is that after West Germany used them for many years, most then went to be used and abused in Turkey. And then back here to be cut up into kits. Really decent condition kits are harder to find.

The above listed FALs represent only a few of the Metric versions produced. The Austrian kits are generally considered the most desirable, by some of us anyway.

The Inch versions produced in Great Britain and Australia are also considered very desirable. Many, but not all, parts interchange with their Metric cousins. Condition of the kits found, when found, varies tremendously. Many of these rifles were used and used hard in climate extremes in actual combat. Prices for a decent kit are right up with the STGs.

That's a few anyway. The Marketplace Forum is a good place to shop around and see and price what is available.

[USMC 0341]

Hello F. Fink,

I have built a number of other guns (black powder too) and find that building a FAL is more like automotive work than gun building. You need access to the right tools and the head space check is important but there is usually little to no fitting work like some guns need.

As for the difference between the .308 and the 7.62X51mm - it is a small enough difference to not have to think about. As you seem to be aware - there is a small dimensional difference between the two but this usually only matters for ultra high accuracy requirements. For anything around 2 MOA out to 500 meters should not make any difference at all. Trying to go significantly under that you wouldn't want to try with standard military ball ammo anyway so the point is moot.

[Hebrew Battle Rifle]

FabFink:
Tell us where you live. (city/state)

[Abominog]

Start by buying the ARS "how to" video www.arizonaresponsesystems.com

Watch that. Then you'll know how everything fits.

A few specialty tools make the job much easier. While many are no longer generally available, you could post a "want to rent" in the marketplace.

Good luck- it's fun!

[TRANSAM 79]

by your statement that you need to pay some bills before purchasing a kit(I assume you are not rich).you will need a second income. Welcome to the assylum.

[fry]

first obtain a receiver. save up for a dsa or try for an imbel that has been built on before. new imbels can run up to 450 these days, you might get a dsa for 325-375 new. then look for one of the premo stg 58 kits numbers matching. if your only going to do it once, might as well have one of the better ones. someone near you will more than likely help you put it together. enjoy.

[TheFabulousFink]

Wow, thanks for all the responses. I live in Spokane, WA and yes, I am not rich:( . I was planning on building the rifle over the course of the summer to help spread out the cost. I had been looking at an Enterprise receiver (type 1) because it is a US made part and it will save me some money over the DSA. Is there any reason that I should avoid Enterprise?

I figured that I would get the parts kit first, that way I have some thing to work on while I save up for the receiver. As far as tools go, I think the hardest things for me to get my hands on are the receiver wrench and the pin gauges for headspacing.

If there are any builders up here in Spokane, WA it would be nice to have someone to take my mistakes to.

[fry]

you may have to trip to the "Couve" for a barreling and headspacing beer drinking hammer hitting wheel of death extravaganZa.

[TheFabulousFink]

fry, I assume you mean Vancouver, WA. When is the barreling and headspacing beer drinking hammer hitting wheel of death extravaganZa going to take place? I might be tempted into making the trip out to the wet side of the state.:biggrin:

[mhg]

Deltta will be in town friday prior to Sunday's fal shoot (24th)

Mr Fink why not build/test fire sat and shoot the match sunday?


Matt

[the gman]

Originally posted by owlcreekok


Dozens of scathing reports on Entreprise receivers on this board were enough to keep me away from them. Of the cheaper (nowadays the term is relative) upers, I have had good luck with Century-late models. YMMV depending on how patient and deft with tools you are.

If someone offers up a new run Century, I would say go for it. But then, I ain't skeered. It is just metal, and I will file and grind till I am in utter ecstasy. :rofl:

Owl, ya don't say much that I really disagree with but this time boy, ya really are fulla shit!:uhoh: :uhoh:

Ya won't do an Entreprise but ya will a Century? Boy, are your talons all screwed up....:p :p

Most of those who critize Entreprise have never seen a one in the flesh, 'least a new production one, they are only mouthing the same ol' BS that they read here. Now, I ain't sayin' that there haven't been wrong Entreprise receivers but their track record on customer service is pretty darn good, usually a complete refund or an exchange, ya sure as shit ain't getting THAT from no Century receiver.......:uhoh: :?

I have a buncha Entreprise receivers, just no time to assemble them but I hope to make some time when ol' English Mike rolls into town before FAL Fest & we'll screw together a nice Inch gun....Proof of the puddin' willbe in the eatin' then boys & girls....:biggrin:

Now I expect the usual Entreprise trolls to roll out of their beds & show up.......:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[TheFabulousFink]

I would love to come out, build, and shoot my fal with you, however I do not have the parts yet.:sad: Now that my bills are paid I will be ordering an Imbel parts kit from Akron Armory when I get my next pay check (20th). DCI sent me an email saying that they will be producing more upper receivers soon, so I'll think I will wait for them rather than buy an Enterprise (prices seem about even).

[Hebrew Battle Rifle]

Originally posted by TheFabulousFink
I would love to come out, build, and shoot my fal with you, however I do not have the parts yet.:sad: Now that my bills are paid I will be ordering an Imbel parts kit from Akron Armory when I get my next pay check (20th). DCI sent me an email saying that they will be producing more upper receivers soon, so I'll think I will wait for them rather than buy an Enterprise (prices seem about even).

You had better get DCI to give you a definition of "soon." They have been saying "soon" for close to 2 years now.

[mhg]

mr Fink

dsa has been shipping

Pm me for details/price

I can also hook you up with a kit

Matt

[MAG58]

You want to have the first FAL build put a bad taste in your mouth? Build on a Entreprise.

If your a tinkerer or just like to cut/machine stuff, than go for it. But if you want something that times right and looks the part, than I'd go for the DSA or Imbel.

Buy Gunplumber's book, read it memorize it. Quote it.

[fry]

Originally posted by TheFabulousFink
fry, I assume you mean Vancouver, WA. When is the going to take place? I might be tempted into making the trip out to the wet side of the state.:biggrin:

bring any service rifle to the fal match at clark rifles inc on the 23rd of this month. deltta will be in rare form. barreling up and headspacing a fal will only take a half hour and then we can get down to whats important. bagging on gpg.

[mhg]

Originally posted by fry


bring any service rifle to the fal match at clark rifles inc on the 23rd of this month. deltta will be in rare form. barreling up and headspacing a fal will only take a half hour and then we can get down to whats important. bagging on gpg.

Fry, the fink is cool. I spoke to him tonight.

Fink-san,

you can shoot my supermatch if you want

Matt

[the gman]

Originally posted by MAG58
You want to have the first FAL build put a bad taste in your mouth? Build on a Entreprise.

If your a tinkerer or just like to cut/machine stuff, than go for it. But if you want something that times right and looks the part, than I'd go for the DSA or Imbel.

Buy Gunplumber's book, read it memorize it. Quote it.

And you are what, 16 or 17? WTF do you PERSONALLY know about the FAL? Other than what you have read here? For that matter, GP is a self taught guru & whilst he has a volume of experience in building FAL's & rifles in general, it's not that long ago he was selling medical kits & ghillie suits.

How many FAL's have YOU built young Sir? One, two or more? How many Entreprise receivers do you own or have you tried to build upon? In fact, just how many FAL receivers of ANY kind have you built upon or tried to build on?

Unlike you, I was a military weapons tech who trained & worked on the L1A1/FAL. Unlike you, I have over 20 receivers from Entreprise, DSA, Imbel & others so I am able to make an informed, concise & technical evaluation of the qualities or lack thereof of each receiver based on experience, training & building the damn things. Unlike you, I've built I don't know how many FAL rifles.

Until you reach some level of competence in these matters & quit repeating other folk's often BS remarks, get back over to AR15.com with the rest of the high school crowd.....:rolleyes:

Sheesh, sprog newbies......:uhoh: :uhoh:

[mhg]

Hey gman

kinda harsh don't you think?

It is clear to me that is his opinion..... I know you have yours.


Also, it is clear to most of us how many FAL kits/ Rec'rs etc you have. It's just that every time you post of it you look more and more like a c*nt.

how does it feel?

Matt

edited the magic word, for those of you who don't know it's a term of endearment

[fry]

yikers the gman,
have you been hanging out with gun parts guy?
i thought the brits always try to understate things? or is that the aussies?

[mhg]

Shit fry

he's gotta be Kiwi

Matt


(gman were just takin the piss)

[the gman]

Ah boys, my aim here is give unbiased advice based on experience, not just repeat the usual BS. Harsh maybe, but this is how internet myths start.

Sure I have a few kits & I've been called a c*nt on more than a few occasions, :biggrin: usually by miscreants who were intent on doing harm to others....

I take your point but like I say, if ya wanna give advice, have some experience to back it up.:biggrin:

Hey fry, where can I find the pics of you & this cat? Gotta say I'd have done the same thing, I've lost count of how many cats I've slotted in my life, damn things ain't nuthin' but a PITA, crappin' & snappin' at the lifestock, others MMV....:cool:

[TheFabulousFink]

Well, mhg is getting me a great deal on a DSA receiver (although I have yet to see any problem with Enterprise). The only problem is that I can't order it until I get paid on the 20th and I don't think that even DSA could get there receiver there by the 23rd. I should be allright, I am going to order gunplumers video or book (or both). I have been reading up a lot on headspacing and I think that once I get the proper gauges and pin gauges I should be fine as long as I double check all the figures.

I want to thank everyone for all the help, especially mhg. As the parts start to come in I will keep you all updated on my progess.

Thanks,

TheFabulousFink

[mortgun]

Buy the Gunplumber's videos and watch them and take notes. This is the best way to determine if building a FAL is for you. He tells how to do it and what tools you'll need.

I found this video most informing.

[MAG58]

Originally posted by the gman


And you are what, 16 or 17? WTF do you PERSONALLY know about the FAL? Other than what you have read here? For that matter, GP is a self taught guru & whilst he has a volume of experience in building FAL's & rifles in general, it's not that long ago he was selling medical kits & ghillie suits.

How many FAL's have YOU built young Sir? One, two or more? How many Entreprise receivers do you own or have you tried to build upon? In fact, just how many FAL receivers of ANY kind have you built upon or tried to build on?

Unlike you, I was a military weapons tech who trained & worked on the L1A1/FAL. Unlike you, I have over 20 receivers from Entreprise, DSA, Imbel & others so I am able to make an informed, concise & technical evaluation of the qualities or lack thereof of each receiver based on experience, training & building the damn things. Unlike you, I've built I don't know how many FAL rifles.

Until you reach some level of competence in these matters & quit repeating other folk's often BS remarks, get back over to AR15.com with the rest of the high school crowd.....:rolleyes:

Sheesh, sprog newbies......:uhoh: :uhoh:

Four sir.

I built three on a DS and one one a Entreprise.
It was my third build. On a Imbel set from Dan's.
I had the barrel turned quite a bit. I'm thinkin .020

The lug on the lower had to be worked considerably. And yes, I tried many lower lugs.

I also thought that there were more pronounced machining marks one the Entreprise than on the DS.

This is my opinion, and I'm sure yours is very different.
Enough so, that my age is grounds for being a selfish engulged ass.

I just got a para lower, and will soon be working on the parts for my Fifth project.


I have read GP's book and like it very much, It was well suited to my (in your assesment) very low learning ability and IQ.

Unlike many teens out there trying to tinker with guns, I paid for it all 100% with my own earned money, save for my first receiver which was a Christmas present.

Anyother sterotypical statements you would like to make about me? Because ofcourse. I am just like every other 16yr. old in the nation, spend my days stoned in a dark corner with enough alchohol in my veins to kill a horse.

[muttman]

this is cool.
building a gun with attude. can we get back on the topic of witch reciver is good for the $$$$. this "feed them raw fish heads and carits" thing needs to go I get all that I need of the attude at work. just my $.02 thanks muttman

[mhg]

Originally posted by MAG58


Four sir.

I built three on a DS and one one a Entreprise.
It was my third build. On a Imbel set from Dan's.
I had the barrel turned quite a bit. I'm thinkin .020

The lug on the lower had to be worked considerably. And yes, I tried many lower lugs.

I also thought that there were more pronounced machining marks one the Entreprise than on the DS.

This is my opinion, and I'm sure yours is very different.
Enough so, that my age is grounds for being a selfish engulged ass.

I just got a para lower, and will soon be working on the parts for my Fifth project.


I have read GP's book and like it very much, It was well suited to my (in your assesment) very low learning ability and IQ.

Unlike many teens out there trying to tinker with guns, I paid for it all 100% with my own earned money, save for my first receiver which was a Christmas present.

Anyother sterotypical statements you would like to make about me? Because ofcourse. I am just like every other 16yr. old in the nation, spend my days stoned in a dark corner with enough alchohol in my veins to kill a horse.



well said

this is DELTTA

Matt

[the gman]

Originally posted by MAG58


Four sir.

I built three on a DS and one one a Entreprise.
It was my third build. On a Imbel set from Dan's.
I had the barrel turned quite a bit. I'm thinkin .020

The lug on the lower had to be worked considerably. And yes, I tried many lower lugs.

I also thought that there were more pronounced machining marks one the Entreprise than on the DS.

This is my opinion, and I'm sure yours is very different.
Enough so, that my age is grounds for being a selfish engulged ass.

I just got a para lower, and will soon be working on the parts for my Fifth project.


I have read GP's book and like it very much, It was well suited to my (in your assesment) very low learning ability and IQ.

Unlike many teens out there trying to tinker with guns, I paid for it all 100% with my own earned money, save for my first receiver which was a Christmas present.

Anyother sterotypical statements you would like to make about me? Because ofcourse. I am just like every other 16yr. old in the nation, spend my days stoned in a dark corner with enough alchohol in my veins to kill a horse.

Roger that Sir, please acept my apologies.:bigangel:

Pain killing meds for a recent wreck & extended biz trips are making me kinda cranky lately, maybe it's the onset of a mid life crisis.........:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

Hmmm, maybe I need to divorce the wife, find me another younger hot chick or two & buy a red sports car, whaddya think?;)

I'm glad to see at least one young fella doing sumpthin' right wid his life, just stay away from the wimmin folk in all but recreation or you're toast & all them nice toys you're building go out the door....AMHIK!!!:uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:

You need any extra parts for this build coming up, you just gimme a holler & they're yours, my way of saying I took my big ass boot & stuck it half way down my throat....:uhoh: Hey, I'm big enuff to say I'm an asshole......:rofl: :rofl: Be glad to share one or two of these :beer: :beer: wif ya when you're old enough.......:bigangel: Goodwill to ya & I'll make a mental note not to jump on folks so hard in future....unless of course it's 411man or that dipshit swampfox....:rofl:

[fry]

swampfox.... that guy is a dilrod:rofl:

[kyabrams66]

As for the DCI FAL Type 1 receivers, here is the response I got from Harlan yesterday:

We have no way to know when to expect availability of the DCI FAL receivers.

When available, we expect the price to be about $250, plus shipping.

Thanks.



Harlan

NoDak Spud LLC

I guess it could be a while.

[MAG58]

Originally posted by the gman


Roger that Sir, please acept my apologies.:bigangel:

Pain killing meds for a recent wreck & extended biz trips are making me kinda cranky lately, maybe it's the onset of a mid life crisis.........:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

Hmmm, maybe I need to divorce the wife, find me another younger hot chick or two & buy a red sports car, whaddya think?;)

I'm glad to see at least one young fella doing sumpthin' right wid his life, just stay away from the wimmin folk in all but recreation or you're toast & all them nice toys you're building go out the door....AMHIK!!!:uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:

You need any extra parts for this build coming up, you just gimme a holler & they're yours, my way of saying I took my big ass boot & stuck it half way down my throat....:uhoh: Hey, I'm big enuff to say I'm an asshole......:rofl: :rofl: Be glad to share one or two of these :beer: :beer: wif ya when you're old enough.......:bigangel: Goodwill to ya & I'll make a mental note not to jump on folks so hard in future....unless of course it's 411man or that dipshit swampfox....:rofl:


No worries.

With the current state of today's teens, I almost expect someone to call BS.
It's good that you make me defend my opinion, or else, I'd just look like a Smart-Assed punk kid who thinks he knows the world.

For this reason, you won't ever see me comment on Inch guns, AKs H&Ks or many of the current rifles on the market, as my knowedge and first hand experience is little to none.

However, I do think that if the rumors are true, and Entreprise is going to produce more Type IIIs for a cheaper rate, than I don't think that I could afford not to buy one...or two.

[muttman]

All,
nice to see that the kiss and make up phase is over now lets get back to the art form of gun making. muttman

[chrsdwns]

Ahhh yesss another of the infamous Entreprise receiver threads. I can't resist chipping in.

Entreprise makes mostly very nice receivers but they, from time to time, can have some relativly simple problems like tight BHO bores or such that can make home building a PIA if you don't have the right tools. Once it's built and running right an Entreprise is as good as any.

Entreprise is tooling up for the production of low cost Type III receivers. Good for them.

On the other hand I have an Inch Enterprise from the Batch from Hell a few years back. The rifle was built by ARS and it runs great and has typical outstanding ARS quality and outstanding finish but the receiver machining was so fugly Mark would not put his name on it. Can't blame him - he did it as a humanitarian service for another FAL Filer and I wouldn't want my name on it either.


I am surprised Entreprise would let their name float around attached to a chunk of metal that ugly.

[Erik the Red]

Hi,

Welcome to the FAL Files!

I strongly recommend that you stay clear of Entreprise Receivers.
Read what happened to my brother and I:
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=160747

I found a very helpful gun dealer here in the Portland area that ordered a DSA type 2 receiver for me. I ended up getting dealer price ($325 + $11 shipping) and am VERY pleased with my purchase!
I would recommend doing the same thing I did, or wait for the Coonans.

Thanks,
Erik

[TheFabulousFink]

Wow, I stumbled into a hornets' nest without even looking! This is almost as bad as some of the AK vs AR or .45 vs 9mm threads that I've read.:eek:

It seems that as far as Enterprise goes it is a crap shoot, some really good receivers have come out of there and some real lemons. Either way, I have decided to go with DSA because there is less chance of having a major problem on my first build....at least as far as part quality goes.

Thanks for all the imput everyone.

TheFabulousFink.