View Full Version : Dumb neighbor scenario
October 14, 2005, 21:21
Maybe dumb is not the most accurate word to use and it is judgemental but suffice it to say, he's "special".
Now, this is a new neighbor of 10 months and my closest at only half mile as the crow flies. I've been very nice to the guy and his family as well as helping them on a regular basis. Recently though, I have discovered that his "hard times" is really him being a professional mooch.
Anyway, this guy loses his job a couple of weeks ago and was telling me that he needs to "harvest" some meat for his family. I tell him where to go, where to walk, where to look, and exactly how to put meat in his freezer. Planty of game around and hog meat is easy to come by.
He tells me "I think I'm gonna shoot that big buck by your house when season opens". This is where I lose my cool just a wee bit.
I explain to him that the buck in question is the alpha of my land and is protected by me. Meaning, when archery season starts, he finds safe haven at my property until the end of rifle season. The buck is a real dominant fella that plays no games with the young ones. One scrap and the younger bucks find another herd. Has been going on this way for years. He stays out of my way and I stay out of his, if you get my meaning. Mutual respect if you will. The old fella sports a decent rack every year and I consider myself lucky to be graced by his visits. I'll also mention that this same buck also finds refuge on other peoples land who also "keeps him safe". He's a well known fella for those of us who have lived here a while.
So, this isn't a "my buck to kill and you can't have him" type of a situation. I see the continuing results of this bucks genes and they are exceptional. I'd hate to see a stud like him be taken by a chump when other game can be found for food and other bucks can be had for a mount.
In my heart of hearts, if I find this buck is killed, I'll know it was my neighbor that did it. I've explained to him where to harvest many types of game for food but I get the feeling that he has an "eye out" for my buck. No high fences and the buck comes and goes as he pleases but I do believe the rack on this buck is what the neighbor is after. I've even offered to take him hunting but he brushes it off.
Really, I know there is nothing I can do if the buck is taken legally away from my land but.........this guy really steams me with his attitude. I'd almost rather my dad or son or a first time hunter take this buck if he has to be taken at all. At least I'd know that there would be respect and honor for the kill, not just a bragging post.
Am I that far out there with my belief? I really don't see this as a "dumb animal, just kill it" situation.
October 14, 2005, 22:31
If I'm not mistaken, if you post "No Hunting - Private Land" signs, there are real penalties. Of course he sounds like the kind of guy that would poach in a heartbeat. Then there is trespassing. Other than that, I don't know
October 14, 2005, 22:35
I believe your instincts about this guy are dead on. He's certainly no sportsman.
Anyone with a brain knows that an old buck is not what you go after for eatin' - this guy's just after the rack.
Dont really have any advice to offer - maybe you and the other neighbors could pay him a visit to encourage him to seek other opportunities. Though it sounds like you've given him plenty of hints. Unforturnately, I've known people like him and he may just not care - too bad, I'd hate for the "granddaddy" buck to end up as sausage ('bout all the meat would be good for)- he deserves better.
October 14, 2005, 23:37
Sounds like this moron will do just what ever he wants.
Be prepared for the worst. Maybe remind him about old tough bucks not being good eats. Its hard living next to an A**HOLE
I had a neighbor cut down a perfectly healthy 100 year old Walnut tree that was growing right smack on the center of our property line. A beautiful tree.
As a matter of fact that tree was a reference point on the original survey!
It provided much wanted shade for my back yard and helped keep A/C costs down in summer by guarding the house from the sun.
So one time my wife and I went off to Mexico for a nice 2 week vacation and come home to no tree, all kinds of debris all over our property and a fence about 8 feet off the wrong side of the property line!
Needless to say we were infuriated!
I wanted to set fire to their house with them in it as they slept!
With a chain saw in hand the fence was quickly removed and scattered into their driveway. I'm no sneak the whole neighborhood came out to watch.
God help them if anyone came near me.
I could see the husband cowering behind a curtain as I chopped the fence down
When the cops showed up there was nothing they could do to me,
I was on my own property, the neighbor took out the tree and put up a fence without a permit for either thing.
On the other hand I filed a tresspassing complaint on them and they had to pick up garbage off the highway for a few weeks as community service was their punishment.
Their excuse was they got a boat (we live in the high desert of Idaho!) and didn't want sap dripping on it so the tree had to go and we weren't home to discuss it. They knew we would have said NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As for the fence being 8 feet off they said the boat wouldn't fit where they wanted to put it otherwise, the stump & roots were in the way of the posts too
They told the judge they didn't think we would mind!
HELLO!!!!!!!!!! YOU JUST DON'T TAKE PEOPLE'S LAND AWAY AND NOT EXPECT THEM TO GET PISSED OFF AT YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Then to put the icing on the cake they move away,
they didn't even own the place. They were renters!!!!!!!!
They didn't ever pay the tree man either. When he showed up on my doorstep
looking to be paid I told him if he ever set foot on my property again I would shoot him dead and feed him to my dogs.
I was so upset over my tree I moved to the other side of town outside city limits to just plain old county jurisdiction.
Keep an eye on that fool!
October 15, 2005, 04:28
Tude, this may seem extreme but its worth looking into.
Try calling the state wildlife management / biology people and see if they can live capture the buck and saw off his antlers.....no more trophy. Once they know what a superior specimen he is maybe they will take action. You probably would forever destroy your relationship with the buck if you attempt it yourself.
Maybe if you and some like-minded neighbors confront your "neighbor" up close and personal like, he will see the light. Ya know, explain the concept of CONSEQUENCES.
If it were me, I would value the the relationship with the buck over the neighbor....f**k him.
October 15, 2005, 05:52
I once told a potential suitor of my younger sister "I have a shotgun and a shovel, and ain't afraid to use them". He knew I was full of s%$t, but he got the point.
But I would talk to the other neighbors and the DNR first. Maybe if someone brought him a hog, he wouldn't have freezer room for the deer.....:devil:
October 15, 2005, 09:04
As many venomous snakes that you know you can find, especially them rattlers down the way from you, why not do a round up and release program near his house.
The Puss will move within 6 months.
The sad part is if this clown gets a shot at that buck and is lucky enough to hit it it will be an ass shot or gut shot.. you know something stupid like that.
Also this clown would be too damned lazy to track a blood trail (if he could even do it to begin with) and that buck will die a miserable death.
I think there is alot of wisdom in your decision not to harvest this buck.
A cattle rancher wouldn't butcher his prize stud bull for steaks..would he.
Maybe you and your neighbors should pay him a friendly visit, take him a case of beer and explain how strongly you feel about this situation.
Also tell him that if he can't read between the lines then he is living in the wrong part of the country.
A perceived threat is not a litigatable threat especially when you bring him gifts with your neighbors (read witnesses). Hey he took something out of abstract context, enough said!
October 15, 2005, 09:08
Of course if he has small kids the snake thing would be off.
October 15, 2005, 09:11
Try calling the state wildlife management / biology people and see if they can live capture the buck and saw off his antlers.....
That sounds kinda harsh...The buck would have no defense then and would be driven off by younger bucks.....Antlers arn't there for decoration.
October 15, 2005, 11:16
Tudes neighbor is likely up to his ears in copperheads like tude is anyway. Let him know bluntly that it is a neighborhood pet, and that the neighbors will not be happy with him if he takes it. Other than that there is not alot you can do about it. You could all try to make sure it stays in your yards with salt licks, corn, etc, that might help. I'd definately stop helping this guy out with things, let him get off his butt and help himself to a hog or a doe or something.
October 15, 2005, 11:30
Originally posted by Windustsearch
Tudes neighbor is likely up to his ears in copperheads like tude is anyway.
Yeah but having more than your share is...well more!
October 15, 2005, 12:00
In all seriousness, a given hectare of a given type will only support so many copperheads. From 'Tudes past posts, I'd bet that it cannot support too many more than it already does. Also, relocated snakes usually just trapse right on back to where they were captured, or they just perish. More typical that if an identifyable copperhead were relocated that short of a distance, you could go find it at the original capture site a week later. Not to mention, it is probably illegal to do so without a permit (it is in most states).
The story erks me though. This bum is within his legal rights to take that critter if he wants to, and I doubt he really gives a rats ass (sorry ratas) what the neighbors think.
October 15, 2005, 12:08
I stewed on the subject during the night and woke up early this morning to do some scouting in another area. Saw a few nice bucks but they were not as mature or refined as the one I mention above. That in itself reminded me that I can't leave this alone.
I started out feeling sorry for the guy and his family. We've helped them meet people, get into church, urged my kids to befriend thiers, and my wife now takes the guys wife to and from school (it's on her way anyway). When it got to the point that money was involved, groceries were being bought, and now a new found mooching operation from the community, I've had second thoughts about "handing out" anymore. Another talk to him is in order. He aint country folk and just never had a chance to grasp a sense of community. He's a transplant from the big city and wants to become "country" overnight I guess.
We all get buck fever but a little more talking to this fella might persuade him to look elsewhere for a kill. I know he wants a rack but at this point, he can't afford a box of shells, let alone having a head mounted.
And yes, I just might kill a hog for him and drop it off. He has a buddy who lives down the road that can process it for him and talk to him about this buck as well.
October 15, 2005, 12:28
If a friendly talking to doesn't work,
The Old Testament has a nice chapter about stoning and why it happens to some folks, read it to him at church one day.
October 15, 2005, 12:33
I definately know where you are coming from on this. Where I grew up we had the same thing, some deer, ducks, quail (and various other birds), raccoons, a 5 foot bullsnake, and a moose were all regular visitors. There is always that one retard in the neighborhood that has to ruin it for everyone. Said retard called F&G and had the moose removed. Another was trapping the coons like they were some huge problem or something. I read about a few cases like this involving big old well known alligators in Florida.
October 15, 2005, 12:40
Originally posted by Faltitude
He aint country folk and just never had a chance to grasp a sense of community. He's a transplant from the big city and wants to become "country" overnight I guess.
Lotsa Yankees take kindness, courtesy and hospitality for weakness...I've found that lots of people just don't get it, and they never will.:sad: My best wishes to your olde buck, Fal...
Dr. X :fal:
October 15, 2005, 12:54
Finished with lunch and heading back out into the woods. Taking the camera this time and maybe I'll get a pic of the ole buck for y'all to gander at.
Blood of Tyrants
October 15, 2005, 16:05
My dad has had a professional bum move in down the road from him. The house is 80 years old if it's a day and it looks it. The dude is from NYC and was telling my dad how it was "so much nicer than the place they left". WTF? The place is falling down and ought to be condemned.
Hell, anyone that has ever hundted deer knows that doe meat is better tasting. Besides, last time I checked, those horns wern't edible.
October 15, 2005, 16:06
Often clueless jerks like him forget to wear orange, and have hunting accidents... very sad... remember to say nice things at his funeral.
October 15, 2005, 16:56
That sounds kinda harsh...The buck would have no defense then and would be driven off by younger bucks.....Antlers arn't there for decoration. [/B][/QUOTE]
But they wouldnt kill him or drive him off.........he'd be back to continue his line next year. Deer rarely if ever fight to the death. And oh yeah, they are there mostly for decoration (to attract females).
October 16, 2005, 00:01
I think there were some good suggestions. Drop off some "extra" meat, some tough stinky stuff from an old road kill. Make sure you rub it down with the metatarsal glands first. Tell him it's from an older buck and thats how all older bucks taste. Hopefully this won't encourage his mooching. The neighborhood visit explaining how everyone feels about the buck is good. If he hears it from more than one person he might take it more seriously especially if he thinks it might cut into his freeloading by giving him a bad rep. Very adamantly invite him along on a hunt with the boys. Don't take no for an answer. But if he's that lazy, even if he agrees to go he'll probably "hurt his back" at the last minute or come up with some other lame excuse. Good luck to you and your fine buck.
October 16, 2005, 01:18
You might tell him the story about the jerk neighbor that just "disappeared" about 10 years ago.:)
October 18, 2005, 17:52
Tude, anything new to tell us?...........your post really piqued my curiosity. How's the 'ol boy doin? best of luck to the both of you.
October 18, 2005, 18:08
Well, thankfully the fella got himself a job and started Monday. Meanwhile, Saturday night his wife shows up to the door with a casserole pan in hand. A whole thick, multi layered lasagna. Well, the wife and I were kidless all weekend and just "snacked" our way along since Friday night. Seeing that big ole pan of lasagna mended a few fences over the buck issue but I would have prefered that he delivered the thing himself instead of sending his old lady.
Still, I'm keeping an eye out for him. The fence that borders the dirt road that seperates me and him is now lined with several hog capes/heads on my side in hopes that the buck won't be willing to cross over on that side, thus keeping him away from the neighbors land. The skins/heads came from another neighbor who cleaned them over the weekend and wanted to "bait" the coyotes as well as thwart the buck from crossing that fence. We'll see what happens. I haven't seen the buck in a few days though but did spot a few of his fresh tracks.
Oh, and the lasagna was gosh aweful. I mean baaaaad. The poor gal tried her best at cooking but it was the thought that counts I guess. But I'm hear to tell ya, that stuff was so narly, my weiner dogs were covering it up by pushing leaves up on it with thier noses. It's still sitting outside. If it remains there until the weekend, I'll be patching holes in my driveway with it.
October 18, 2005, 20:01
FALTITUDE, I understand where you're at. About 15 years ago my sis built her house in the middle of my Grandmother's 80 acres. 5 kids that played everywhere til dark made it unsafe to hunt there anymore, so everyone declared it off limits. My cousins and I and several neighbors had hunted this land forever, but everyone respected the decision, didn't like it, but respected it.
Needless to say it didn't take the big boys long to figure out they were safe there during hunting season. The biggest sported one of the nicest 14pt racks I've ever seen, even in magazines.
On the other side of the section was a young man whose family and mine had rode the river with each other for longer than I've been alive. He made the comment to his cousin, who's a really good friend of mine, that he didn't care if it was off-limits or not he was killing that buck come bow season and there was nothing I could do about it.
Cousin made a phone call and about an hour later I was at his house explaining the facts of life to him. When I left he knew without a doubt our land was not to be hunted on.
Three days later I caught him stalking thru our creek bottom. He only thought he was sneaky, he liked to have peed his pants when I stepped out from behing a tree almost right beside him.
As I escorted him back to the property line I deposited his $800, at least that's what he said it cost, Oneida bow and attached gear off the dam of a 5 acre pond that's about 18 feet deep. Told him if I caught him fishin in my pond he'd follow the bow. The pond's completely in sight of my sis's house.
I then explained to him if he wanted to call the law about the loss of his bow he would be arrested for criminal trespass and hunting without written permission.
Both of these carry a $500 plus fine and up to 10 days in jail. The presiding district court judge and my Dad are lifetime friends and the judge was already aware of the situation. This was also explained to him.
I also explained that people hunting alone have terrible accidents with no one around to help him. If I caught him hunting on my property again he better pick a warm day because he would be assured of at least one night in the woods with both legs broken before I found him.
He still lives in the area and looks mean at me every time we pass. He gave up cussing me to anyone that would listen years ago after everyone he told the story agreed with me. No one else in his family has ever mentioned the incident.
We have never been bothered by local poachers on our property again. Road hunters yes, poachers no. Word gets around.
October 19, 2005, 10:44
Hey, lets simmer down about the Yankee talk!
All Yanks aren't a'holes anymore than all southerners are terracotta tile tooth havin', cousin marryin', snuff spittin', squirrel eatin' rednecks.
Sometimes being kind and generous will satisfy a poor soul like your neighbor, but greed is never satisfied. Just because someone is poor doesn't mean they can't be a greedy asshole who doesn't know where the line has been drawn. It is quite common for some of the lesser among us to make a career out of the kindness and welfare provided by others. It seems like you have done the Christian thing by showing him how to feed himself. Now its up to him to help himself.
October 19, 2005, 23:32
I think some honest and DIRECT straight talk is in order before he helps himself to this buck. A few neighbors should deliver the message in a unified manner. Then, he'll either be with y'all or agin ya.
Some of my son's friends got real excited to shoot the fine bear that frequents our place from time to time. They got the message once it was spelled out real plainly.
October 23, 2005, 04:52
The Whitetail deer lives only an average of 5 years, so if he has been "around for years" , as you say, then he probably is not fighting off all the other bucks. If you have seen him around for 5 years or more then you should go ahead and take him yourself. If you kill him and mount him then he will see some sort of immortality! If he dies and rots then nobody will see him and get to hear your fond stories about him.
They can live up to 10 years in the wild and 20 years in captivity. I guess if you really love him, then you should catch him and put him in a pin. I have a tranquilizer rifle if you need it!:tongue:
Besides.....I do not think the Buck that you see all the time is the Alpha. Alpha Bucks are smarter than that around here. They stay out of sight for the most part. When bucks get older then they get stupid and go for easy food and an easy life, which is usually what gets them killed.
October 23, 2005, 09:39
It's good that they at least are trying to reciprocate...that shows good intentions at the least.
As far as your ol' buck....Use the direct approach...simply explain it with no threats or meaness...something along the lines of.... " I know you want to take that buck, but, here is something you should know first. That ol boy has been around here awhile and myself and the surrounding neighbors have grown attached to him. Killing him would really tick a lot of folks off and I thought you should know this in advance." then explain the reasons why he's important to y'all. It doesn't matter what those reasons are.
Now the ball is 100% in his court....there are no threats and he has no reason to misinterpret or not understand anything. he will do what he will but now has no reason to not expect repercussions.
Giving hints then expecting behavior to follow according to expectations is risky and seldom works as expected. People interpret things different ways.
I'd go the direct route, but then again I am not the type to beat around the bush. FWIW
October 23, 2005, 19:12
But they wouldnt kill him or drive him off.........he'd be back to continue his line next year. Deer rarely if ever fight to the death. And oh yeah, they are there mostly for decoration (to attract females).
I stand corrected. Thanks.
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